If he gets your daughter pregnant, I'm blaming her. And you. Not him. He looks like he would get your daugther pregnant.
I was out for lunch one day with a friend of mine who has many hilarious and actually spot on opinions about dating and relationships. I always joke with him that if he’d let me put him on camera that we’d make millions because of the outlandish things he says. We’d get more hate mail, but more press than a little bit. He’d effectively become the most hated Black man in America in under ten minutes. Flat.
Mind you, I don’t ever actually think he’s wrong.
Anyway, one particular day last week, he asked me if I’d ever read the article where (much like everybody else – it’s from December 2009 so forgive my late pass) Attorney General Eric Holder called on Black fathers to take more responsibility for their children. It’s the same message Obama preached some months before and slightly rings true to what Bill Cosby said some years ago when he pissed off all of Black America and a few Samoans.
To wit:
“Too many men in the black community have created children and left them to be raised by caring mothers. These women do a wonderful job, but we ask too much of them and too little of our men,” Holder told the congregation, which included members of his family, according to Newsday. “It should simply be unacceptable for a man to have a child and then not play an integral part in the raising and nurturing of the child.” – Eric Holder
Of course, as Black men, we hate hearing these statements over and over again. Mostly because it paints a very one sided picture. And of course, men and women ALWAYS applaud at these statements like its the first they’ve ever heard them. Keep in mind, neither of us disagree with the spirit of it, but its more about why Black men are constantly the punching bag for all of the problems in the Black community. Then my boy made an observation (I’m paraphrasing):
“How come you never hear anybody say, ‘Too many of our women in the Black community are letting any and every man get them pregnant. We have too many women sleeping with men recklessly and getting pregnant by men who have no business being fathers or boyfriends. We need to hold some of our women more responsible for their decisions.’”
Of course my response was, “well, you just can’t do that. It’s not women’s fault that these men leave them alone and without help after they get pregnant.”
But then I started thinking…why can’t you ever hold women accountable for the demise of the community the same way we continuously hold men accountable. It’s pretty much the party line that (many) men aren’t living up to their ends of the bargain. They get these women pregnant and roll out leaving another fatherless child to fend for his or herself through life with only a mother who can’t teach a boy how to be a man or a girl how to be loved by a man.
The truth is though, aside from the snide comments made about the baby mama with seven children on welfare, nobody ever does lay any blame on the women involved in those situations, almost as if its taboo. At least not publicly. Sure, behind closed doors we all think the women with all those children probably needed to be locked up in a room with a copy of O Magazine and Chicken Soup for The Soul, but pretty quickly we start talking about the fact that their daddy’s probably aren’t any good. It’s so easy we do it by default. From churches to public podiums, if there’s a conversation about the community and its problems, its pretty much starting with the lack of fathers in the home. Or the lack of a father presence, etc. Nobody EVER says, publicly, “While the fathers aren’t there somebody needs to figure out how to stop these women from sleeping around with all these men too. Lord almighty, we might not have a father problem if we didn’t have some of these girls giving it up without protection.”
The assumption is that evil men dupe all of these women into becoming mothers and are the reason every cat in hood doesn’t have a yacht. But how come the accountability doesn’t go both ways?
Riddle me that one Batman…should women be held accountable…at all? Public Blackness seems to indicate no. But I’m not sure that’s right.
Are women really always victims in these situation? Or do all the talking heads have it right?
-VSB P aka THE ARSONIST aka VITAMIN P aka 40 P aka TANGLE JIG P aka GO KING BEEF aka GIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRL HE A 3
I completely agree.
um…with what?
Lol, my bad. It was quite a long day.
I concur that, on some cases, the women need to be held more accountable for their role in the fatherless children epidemic. Now, I say in SOME cases ’cause I’ve personally been with a dude who had me thinking he was the right type of guy to be Pdealing with, up until he wasn’t. I’ve never had a child to show from any of those incidents, but if we can only make decisions based on the facts at hand, and a dude was distorting those facts, then the resulting difficult circumstances were not avoidable on the woman’s part.
And for the record, not only men misrepresent themselves.
Why not just get on birth control and subtract that risk from the many others that occur when you have sex with a person (even if you know them or think you know them or not).
I definitely agree with that, as that’s the main reason children never resulted from any of my misjudgements, but there are accidents, etc.
See, I don’t see this issue the way that some folks may. When people discuss the issue absentee black men and fathers, they assume that those issues most greatly (or solely) affect black boys. They disreagard the fact that a young woman choosing a man like the one Plies in representing in the above picture can also be the result of what made that man who he is…lack a father figure, lack of an example of positive, strong and protective men, and lack of a father (like mine) with a shotgun he’s willing to pull out on any plies looking ninja bold enough to breath in his beloved daughters direction. This is coupled with a lot of mothers who grew up in the same situation, no men consistenly and lovingly around, so they also can’t steer her right. Hell, they chose her deadbeat asentee father….
So, to me, when the question is “are absentee fathers to blame” or “should women take some of the blame”, my first answer is we do take plenty of it. No nobody’s demonized in America like the “African American” woman (I say African American and not black because we get a harder rap than non-american black women, IMO). My second answer is no because we aslo suffer the affects of black men’s absence from our homes and communities. Women aren’t always the victims but we’re victims too.
Also, I’m aware that this isn’t always the case and many Black women raise wonderful sistas without a man and many women with a daddy choose poorly.
Don’t i agree with the no father in a household effects all children. My brother had a fatjher who let him when he was 2 an instead of following his steps he decided to step up when it was his turn to be a father… and oddly enough the baby wasn’t even his. And the mother of that child still doesn’t know who the father is. My brother moved to a bigger place, sold his 2 door car and got a second job only to find out the child wasn’t his. And this responsible young man grew up without a father.
INDEED FRAT!
I completely agree. One other thing that irks me though: why do some men say that they are babysitting their kids? If you are the father, then it’s not called babysitting. It’s called parenting.
Hmmm, my response to this is still in moderation. That’s right, y’all. I’m controversial.
Agreed. Many of these women dont seem to get that just because you can have a baby doesnt mean you should, and you ceartinly shouldnt have a baby with any old negro you bone. And we have CHOICES…plenty of them BEFORE we have sex you can choose to use a condom, the pill , IUD’s, hell you can choose to keep your damn legs closed! Obviously the chicks on Maury didnt get the memo.
Also just your black and female doesnt mean youre going to be an awesome mother….and theres always enough blame to go around when children arent being raised well.
Exactly both are taking a chance.
Tiffany
Peace, Love and Chocolate
I may differ with most people on here when I say this, but women ARE the victims in most cases. At the point of conception, it takes two, and both parties have to take FULL responsibility for his/her actions; However, after this point when the baby is brought into this world, the mother is left alone to raise him/her. This is the point where the woman becomes the victim. You can’t point the finger at the woman OR the man when considering the baby being here, but you CAN point the finger at the man when the baby is left to be raised by a single mother. That is what angers me about the situation.
I am upset at ignorant men who leave the baby and blame the mother for the entire problem. He says things like “she should’ve been on birth control,” or “she should have gotten an abortion.” Then they have the audacity to bad mouth her to others.
I don’t think society is bashing the man for the woman getting pregnant. Society is bashing the man for leaving the woman to take on that priority ALONE. That’s why men get such a bad name in cases like those.
I agree with you. You actually explained how both are as fault thoroughly. Women and men are both as fault, from the moment they went without protection (fyi both can protect themselves) to concieving and raising the child. There is a saying, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice same on me. If anything, I will be more hardest on the female who go around having babies with different fathers because obviously they didn’t get memo they become fooled more than once.
People DO blame the women, it just depends on the forum.
Another website I visit (when I forget how annoying it is) places the blame squarely on Black woman’s shoulders when it comes to this issue.
Or American woman at least…
(don’t get me started)
yeah, that just seems wrong. there’s no way you can place the blame squarely on women at all.
Unless you are raped and have the baby, I’m willing to put 50.4% of the blame on women. I don’t really get it. Irresponsible, broke, ambition-less men removed all the ‘moisture’ from me. That shyt just isn’t sexxxy. We need to start telling our daughters boys who are loud in class can’t read (cus a lot of the times they can’t). Boys who can’t read have cooties.
This is the first time in a long time I’ve been over here earlier enough to comment and it’s a hot button issue!
Curious. . .where does that extra 0.4% come from??
I made it up. If it’s less than even it’s only by a fraction of a percentage point.
_
I’d place 60.427% of the blame of the women. This figured was developed from objective observations gathered at the Lyfe Jennings Institute for Socialogical Studies. Women have more opportunity to prevent pregancy than men do outside of the heat of the moment.(You should not wait until the heat of of the momemnt as your last option to prevent getting knocked up because anyone who is sexing cannot front like they have never let the first couple of strokes go au natural)
Women have the initial power to influence men’s behavior with their happy box. It’s the way of the world. Every single act of man is done out of the motivation to impress women and every single act of women is done out of the perplexing motivation to impress their women friends. Also, women have so many opportunities outside of the bedroom to prevent deadbeat dads such as taking the pill or avoiding retail stores like Man Alive. If men had the opportunity to take a pill to shoot blanks, unwanted pregnancy would diminish by 72% and the clap and hpv would rise by 217%.
“Lyfe Jennings Institute for Socialogical Studies”
See! This is why we won’t ever rise as a people! You gonna mess around and get me fired. I slid clean the hell out of my chair at reading this.
Uh, just where can I sign up for your “Stat Research 200″ class?
lol @ any reference to “the Clap” or “VD” (in a “this-ish-is-serious, Son” way, of course)
birth control is not solely on the responsibility of the woman. men can take preventative steps too. and in this way is where women take the blame, because inadequate or no birth control is completely our fault, and it shouldn’t be.
Well, I can say there are always exceptions Bc I know my daughters father was motivated to succeed and was in college, had a good job, in the army, etc…..and then I got pregnant. I was no slouch myself, I had alot going for me, I could go to any college I wanted, so with our child in mind I moved with him out of my home state to go to his college (don’t get me wrong, I loved
the college too, but I prolly would not have made a move that far away from home without his request) ….it seemed like we were on the fast track to success. He said all the right things at first, we even talked about marriage. Then This dude did a total 360 and turned out not to be the man I thought I knew at all. He was
manipulative and a pathological liar. Got us into all types of debt
and then when my daughter turned two he up and left me and his
daughter to go back to school in our home state, which was 12 hrs
away. I guess it got too hard for him and his pride didn’t help
(especially since I was makin more money than him, a big no no in his view). Until my daughter was six he barely saw or helped with anything. He’s a little more in the picture now but I surely expected him to play a bigger role in his childs life than he does. I feel sooo lucky that I had a girl. I know I can handle a
girl by myself if I have to. But I think a boy needs the constant presence of a father in his life…….so after rambling about my life, I conclude that it’s not always 50%, sometimes men wait until they have u believing in them to show their true colors (not all men of course). I’m just sayin what looks and sounds
and feels like the right thing, might not be so.
This may be unpopular, but what are the odds that his true colors were there all along and you focused on what you wanted to see—the representative he was offering? I speak from experience. The only difference is that I didn’t make a child with anyone but now, I can honestly look back and see while some men are wining and dining me, they weren’t paying bills on time, while it took forever for them to get a car, it wasn’t because they couldn’t make a choice, it was because the credit was jacked. Or while one dude was begging and expecting me to follow him across the country it wasn’t because he wanted to be with me, he just wanted the security a relationship with me provided. BTW, I didn’t move. AND, the number one thing was that while he said he loved me, he wasn’t making moves to make his love legally binging.
This I can say I speak from personal experience on as well…except I did move. He bought the ring, we proceeded to move forward as though we were going to be married and he CHANGED HIS MIND. I stayed on a bit longer because of love and I just moved cross country for him, but in the long run…no kids. Why? Because he already had one that he was taking care of solely (‘nother story for another day) but he was irresponsible in many respects.
So, there are times when women ignore the signs, but then there are times when we see them and keep rocking with him in HOPES that he will be who he SAID he was instead of who that ninja IS.
So glad I didn’t have kids with him….beyond glad!
Lady, the only comment I have is why have a baby with a man who is not your husband? If he wants you to have his child, let him prepare a home and some security for that child first. I’ve been reading these post, some good some not so good, bottom line is never have a child for a man that can’t provide for that child, and if he can provide for the child, demonstrate by putting a ring on my finger, committing to me before God, family and friends, providing a home for us to live in. Exercise common sense before bringing the child into the world.
And that is why I rock with you…
Bond.
I’m willing to put 50.4% of the blame on women
Dead at how random that number is… Lol.
But I agree… I’ll even go as far as saying 70%. But that’s because it was ingrained in me that the fault is squarely 99% on my shoulders if I ever do get pregnant with a _______. I managed to get it down to 70%….
*Certainly
I’d posit that we “go easy” on black women for the same reason that not-so-black people (I’d say whites, but that feels more militant than the occasion calls for) “go easy” on black people in general. Sure, there are those (Harvard Law Review) girls and guys who feel that black people are just as responsible for our plight (exactly what that plight is, idk. as i said, i’m going for objective, less black panther reject)… but because of the “things” “we” have “been through” (each of those is in separate finger quotes because i’d argue about them in greater detail in person), not-so-black people feel that it’s best to leave that subject alone.
Similarly, you need not have read Jacqueline Jones’s _Labor of Love, Labor of Sorrow_ to feel like black women deal with more than a little bit on a daily basis. Regardless of the reason– poor decisions or flighty sperm donors– they ARE bolstering our society with one hand while working at least one job with the other, hopefully. Regardless of the reason– broke-ass moral compass, or adolescent lives devoid of guidance– they ARE objects of booty-boppin’ BET UnCut misogyny. Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera (no Yul Brinner).
Thus, we tend to feel that a ‘hey b*tch– close your damn legs,” though necessary, might merely add insight to (inevitable) injury.
Brynner*
@Penelope
“Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera (no Yul Brynner)”
I heart you so much for this!!! The King and I is my absolute favorite!!
“Thus, we tend to feel that a ‘hey b*tch– close your damn legs,” though necessary, might merely add insight to (inevitable) injury.”
Well put! This (for me) rings absolute truth.
you get a cool point for “The King and I”
cherish this day…
@Penelope –
“you need not have read Jacqueline Jones’s _Labor of Love, Labor of Sorrow_ to feel like black women deal with more than a little bit on a daily basis. “
How has it been determined that black women deal with more on a daily basis than black men?
I’m not sure how one could conclude that black women are bolstering our society, while not simultaneously acknowldeging the counterproductivity of their actions which ultimately produces the very same toxic environment in which they exist. It seems like the only thing being bostered is an ignorant society, so I’m not sure that is praise worthy.
“How has it been determined that black women deal with more on a daily basis than black men?”
If you consider “black men” to be a synonym for “a little bit,” then sure, that’s what I said. Otherwise…well, you know, the opposite– that’s not what I said.
In response to the really long second sentence, okay– I’m not going to agree with you. The point is that someone is bolstering it (i.e., providing it structural support). You may not like the way it’s being done, but somebody’s doing it. Again, this is the whole me-not-agreeing-with-you thing, because I think that there are plenty women doing a damn good job at it. Those more whorish among us just garner more attention than the business-handling majority; you don’t make it onto the nightly news or theYBF for working a straight job and raising your family.
(Re: your last 7 words) I agree. No one deserves praise for accepting responsibility.
@Penelope
My long sentence was my way of paying homage to your saturated parenthetical overuse.
I am actually trying to extract some sense out of your condescending writings, but I’m getting lost in all your frugal attempts at clever wit. In the interest of time and ‘unfunnyism’, please refrain.
It would appear that we will disagree on the point of ‘bolstering’. I cannot lend credence to the idea of bolstering(i.e. providing structural support – since redundancy is your repertoire), when it is in the form of creating and sustaining a society that is self destructive. Your position seems to be focused on the act of providing support rather than the cyclical destructive environment such support perpetuates. There are plenty of women out there who are doing “a damn good job”. Needless to say, there are plenty of women out there who are not doing “a damn good job”.
Please provide me the source of “the business-handling majority“. I’m surprised you didnt cite your reference somewhere in one of your many parenthesis for such a statement.
Good mothers/wives, fathers/husbands and do gooders in general don’t make the nightly news, so does that mean bad mothers/fathers should be left off the radar? Last time I checked, ‘good’ mothers and fathers weren’t a threat or problem to subgroups or society at large.
Really, what I want to know is, what exactly is your point? And please, no more unclever and unfunny pretentious wordplay. And don’t forget to dumb it down for me since evidently my intelligence level peaks where yours begins.
The initial post asked why women aren’t blamed more often. And while not suggesting that they shouldn’t be, it’s possible that it’s explained by the fact that people “feel sorry” for black women already. They don’t want to layer that type of blame on what they think are the other issues that black women deal with.
If you’d like my more elaborate response to your other colorful assertions, you may contact me personally. (PenelopeSanchez23@gmail.com)
@Penelope
Ahhh..and finally, there is the treasure I was searchin for: A clear cut answer. It’s like looking at a glistening diamond in a coal mine. I knew it was buried somewhere in all that fanciful jargon.
“If you’d like my more elaborate response to your other colorful assertions, you may contact me personally.”
I’d rather not. Something tells me I may have a few colorful words to go along with those assertions if things were to continue. Thank you, however.
Ciao.
O-M-Freakin’-G!!! I heart you, Penelope for this and you have officially become a friend in my head (no weirdo)!!!
no weirdo; insta-friends, indeed!
Touché. Your boy has a point. As women, we spread our legs and participate in the act, but act all victim like when we come up pregnant with the dude we knew was an a$$hole from jump.
Ive bucked up on too many good men who’ve slept with the wrong woman who simply did not deserve to bear their seed. Now they’re all bitter and can’t even get they love they want because their BMs can’t stand to see them not with them.
Thou speaketh the truth!
You better SAY THAT ONE MO’ TIME!!! I’ont think they hear you though!
*passes plate*
“As women, we spread our legs and participate in the act, but act all victim like when we come up pregnant with the dude we knew was an a$$hole from jump.”
Thank you!! I can’t stand this. Dang, protect yourself!
However, like someone else said, depending on the emotional environment you were raised in, some women just may not have the insight to make better choices. But then you have the women that end up making the same mistake again! I have no sympathy for women who refuse to learn. None whatsoever.
HALLELUJAH!!!!!
The church has said AMEN.
Also, it’s crazy to me that when involved with said women, and other (read: sane) women point out that maybe, just maybe this chick is not the one to be laid up with sans condom, men turn all “she’s a hater” on you….until you’re proven right and he’s ducking BM for life.
My mother and father told me this: “ANY man you sleep with is a potential father to your unborn kid. So choose wisely.” Thus, I do.
Women need to stop entertaining the “thug” mentality in men and then being mad when he exhibits said thug mentality on them with the issue of pregnancy and child rearing.
So yeah, blame does fall on women and we need to be mindful that men are not the enemy. We all have choices in life and if you make the wrong ones with the wrong people, then you deal with the consequences. Period.
This is only the 3d time I’ve EVER commented (and have been blog-stalking for like a year)…oops! Anywho…my $.03…
The “blame” is not mutually exclusive. It’s neither the fault of women or men…it’s BOTH! BOTH parties lay down and sleep together and create a child. Where the blame tends to shift is AFTER the creation of the child. DURING and PRIOR to the creation of said child(ren), the “strapping lad” was MORE than happy to come over [at unGodly hours] to smash…but AFTER the child comes, more times than not, they are nowhere to be found [absent a court order].
As a woman, I find it VERY hard to believe that any woman who sleeps w/ a man does so w/ the intent that the man is DEFINITIVELY gonna jet should a child be created.
While many [not all *I'm looking at you Reggie Bush and Kanye West*] men got the “can’t turn a ho into a housewife” memo a lot of women haven’t taken heed to the “can’t turn a thug into a Cosby dad” email.
That said…I think the “blame” should be allocated equally to both parties. Women should be blamed for letting Pookie and/or Raytrondre smash knowing fully that he lives w/ him mom and already has 4 kids he doesn’t take care of. And men should take the heat for jetting as soon as Shonquaneesha gets pregnant…i mean…C’MON son! She already had 5 kids…u KNOW her ass is fertile…
“can’t turn a thug into a Cosby dad”
nuff said…………
Mannn…women tend to think they can “change” men! Drives me INSANE!! If that ninja was TRIFE when u met him…I HIGHLY doubt ur goodies are SO good that he’ll magically change! STOP!
Funny thing is, I think most if not all women think they can change men it just seems to be a question of how much.
Lorena Bobbitt changed a man…
Flag on the play. Personal foul. Unnecessary roughness. 15 yard penalty, 1st down. (no diva dude)
Raytrondre and Shonquaneesha
I’ve been siting her a good two minutes trying to sound out those ‘creative’ names.
LOL…while those names are not true and accurate samples of some of the names I encountered while working at a daycare landlocked by the projects…the alliteration is the same.
Ray-tron-dre and Shon-qua-neesha. <– It is my belief that this is what happens when you're not QUITE sure who is the father of the child, and you don't want to offend the father or his family.
@LegallyBrown
Thank You….I totally agree with this statement. I have seen and heard people go back and forth on whose fault it is and the truth of the matter is that it doesn’t rest on one genders’ shoulders, both share the blame. I know women that are poppin out babies all willy nilly and men that don’t have a problem spreading their seed around.
Shoot, I know a chick that will sleep with a dude she just met in a heartbeat, like within a half hour of meeting said person. There was a time she did that and ended up getting pregnant by the dude who happened to be married. I’ont know the dude but I’m lthinking u were willing to risk your marriage by having sex with someone u just met without protection.SMH
And the whole “can’t turn a thug into a Cosby dad” so true.
“BOTH parties lay down and sleep together and create a child. Where the blame tends to shift is AFTER the creation of the child.”
And this is why men get most/all of the blame. The emphasis is on AFTER the creation. At this point, the man still has a choice to stay and raise the child or leave the mother by herself. Other than abortion or adoption, which aren’t usually seen as respectable options, women don’t have the option to leave. These men choose to leave, while the women are seen as stuck. We forget about prevention and focus on blame.
This is the mindset that the Black community hasn’t gotten past. Yeah, we “come together” when some quasi-racial outburst from some local weatherman occurs, but we still haven’t stopped with this “blame each other” mess. We can’t build ourselves up if we continually draw lines to separate each other. A community shares the blame and works together to fix the problem.
You get hotter when you talk all smart and stuff. Like, I can see our bright future together just from your thumbnail pic now. LOL.
and so the child was born… lol
Bwahahahahaha~
Classic!
We forget about prevention and focus on blame.
THIS!
Please let’s focus on preventing young girls to equate love with s3x…
wow.. great post! This indeed is a problem… women do need to be called out more… sex edu toward young girls jus needs to be better… like when my friend got knocked up by some dude she was just fooling around with my first thought was “eww so u really f**k’d him?” .. second thought “eww, you f**k’d him without protection??” … and now of course he’s a deadbeat and we has been called all types of b**ches within our circle of friends… i cant judge, i guess when you’re in the situation you dont see what others see from the outside. .. i jus think its a matter of having higher standards as well as higher self esteem… the more you love/value yourself, the more you expect from others when they interact with you–there’s no way i would even give my number to a guy like my friend’s baby daddy and im sure now she wouldnt either, but back then she truly jus wanted to be loved and laid down (without protection) with the first person to show her what she thought love was… anyway, i think it starts with better education and more self esteem on the woman’s part.. cuz guys guna f*ck no matter wat
“i jus think its a matter of having higher standards as well as higher self esteem… the more you love/value yourself, the more you expect from others when they interact with you–”
This very statement shows how unfortunate and perpetual the cycle is. While I don’t know your friend’s particular situation, often-times the source of low self-value and low expectations of others stems from not receiving that love at home. Obviously that’s not ALWAYS the case, but as discussed during the “I’ll Be Your Pappy: The Silence of the Daddy Issues” post on January 11, 2010, many times this condition of low self-value, low self-worth, and general willingness to equate receiving any form of attention with being loved stems from growing up with an absentee father. That attention is not received at home because poppa was a rolling stone and momma was working 9 – 5 (then an 11 – 7 shift). Tyrone gives her some attention, she gets pregnant, and the cycle repeats. The bigger question is what can we do consistently to break the cycle? Can it be done or are we too far gone?
Thank you. The children are the victims. The cycle puts folks in this situation generation after generation. Not sure if there is one big fix, but education and culture are a start.
Not sure if there is one big fix, but education and culture are a start
Agreed.
“Obviously that’s not ALWAYS the case, but as discussed during the “I’ll Be Your Pappy: The Silence of the Daddy Issues” post on January 11, 2010, many times this condition of low self-value, low self-worth, and general willingness to equate receiving any form of attention with being loved stems from growing up with an absentee father. That attention is not received at home because poppa was a rolling stone and momma was working 9 – 5 (then an 11 – 7 shift).”
this is actually the story of my life… BUT because my mother put the fear of God and an even bigger fear of her backhand in me I am determined to break this cycle… I refuse to go through this and I not only got this attitude from that fear but also from watching and learning from the mistakes of others… so i will add another necessity to the list: the passion to want better for yourself… i see girls in my “hood” that continue in this vicious cycle because they don’t feel as though they can get (or deserve) better
First, women don’t get so much blame because we’re carrying the blame for the decline of marriage in our community. We’re also fat, and sucking at the government teet that is the welfare system. Men get to be blamed for being absent fathers and criminals. I thought this was agreed upon at the last community meeting we had right before Brenda had her baby!
Second, I’ve been saying this shyt for years. And every time I say it on my blog, a gang of unwed mommas (whose children don’t get financial or emotional support from their fathers) lash out and flick cold the hell out. Why? Because those women don’t want to admit that they were NOT raped. They laid down, unprotected, willingly. When I ask these women if the men every did ANYTHING that would make them think he’d be a good father, I’m met with such anger and venom, it’s sad.
Where multi-generational fatherlessness is present, I wonder:
1) How can a woman who didn’t choose a better father for her own children teach her daughter to make better choices?
2) How can this mother really be expected to give her son the life-lessons that would make him a better man (which is different than making him a good person), than his father if she didn’t know which life skills to look for in a mate?
‘Second, I’ve been saying this shyt for years. And every time I say it on my blog, a gang of unwed mommas (whose children don’t get financial or emotional support from their fathers) lash out and flick cold the hell out. Why? Because those women don’t want to admit that they were NOT raped. They laid down, unprotected, willingly. When I ask these women if the men every did ANYTHING that would make them think he’d be a good father, I’m met with such anger and venom, it’s sad’
you dun took the words right outta my mout.
i’ve said the same shaaat myself ,only to be driven away by death threats and flying pans.
in my opinion people want to sign away responsibility for every little thing (esp when stuff goes wrong) ,especially and even important matters like this one.
THIS!! i co-sign the hell outta this whole comment. well said, Ms. Smart!
Oh very well said! Say it again!
three-peat
“1) How can a woman who didn’t choose a better father for her own children teach her daughter to make better choices?”
Number one ain’t rocket science, just deal with responsible men and since that won’t work because women think they know everything about men, they can try waiting for a significant amount of time, maybe a year or so, before letting him go raw. Or just use birth control until you are married. This may have to be one of those do as I say not as I do moments, just sayin’…
“2) How can this mother really be expected to give her son the life-lessons that would make him a better man (which is different than making him a good person), than his father if she didn’t know which life skills to look for in a mate?”
The obvious way is to have other men around one way to do this is to learn how to cook then invite me your male relatives over to eat regularly so he can interact with them. If all your male relatives suck, find young dude a mentor.
1) It seems to be rocket science. I buy a lemon car, but keep it, having to fix it and refusing to admit I should have done my due diligence, can you really expect me to give you good advice on buying a car? In order for me to teach you how to choose a car, I have to admit I didn’t do what I needed to do (have a mechanic check it out, read the fine print, etc.). Then I also have to figure our what it was that I should have done. That’s a whole lot of paper work people are too lazy to do. It’s easier to just play the vic and talk bad about the daddy.
2) So these women are expected to know which men are worthy to be around her child when she did such a ‘wonderful’ job at choosing the men they made the kids with? I’ont know. Also, how many times have you been around single women and a grown man tries to check their child and give em some ‘brought-up-see’ and the woman jump to defend the child?
You’re on a roll today. I see why you’re “Ms. Smart”…
1) Everything I know about cars comes from buying effed-up cars people can learn from their mistakes. The same way I can tell you not to buy a car with high mileage from experience without being an expert on cars a woman can tell her daughter some basic things about men from her own experiences. I guess birth control would be like insurance, and the morning after pill is like AAA.
2) Honestly without sex as a distraction the learning curve changes a lot and a man being around to show young boy basic man stuff from time to time is a whole lot easier than raising and providing for a child. It’s not the raising it’s the providing that sends deadbeat dudes running for the hills. Besides family and guys that women put in the friend zone are often more reliable than the men she would be dating.
“Also, how many times have you been around single women and a grown man tries to check their child and give em some ‘brought-up-see’ and the woman jump to defend the child?”
I’ve seen it and this is why she needs to leave the room and why it helps if it’s a family member.
@ Omar
To learn from your mistakes you have to see them as mistakes and see a need for an adjustment in behavior.
As an aside, I think those of us who know how to act need to stop even being friends and casual acquaintances with people who don’t. I knew dudes who, upon careful observation, I realized didn’t like women. Not to say that they’re gay but they just detest women as human beings. As a result, the consistently treat them like crap. I don’t roll with those dudes anymore. Why should I provide them with my friendship when they are depositing their toxic behavior in oir communities?
@Ms. Smart
You are certainly on a roll, biscuit, english muffin, toast, bagel, and anything that requires your buttery smooth rational intellect, insight and life observations. If you made any more sense, you would have to come with a side of grape jelly.
What Caribbean island does your mind hail from?
Island? that island would be DETROIT. My ‘people’ are from Alabama. I got that term from my brother who has a lot of West Indian friends.
ONLY a west indian uses the word brought-up-see.
DEAD!
Fist pump, elbow thump, high-five, oh hell yeah!
See…this is why I rock with you. I love you for this, sincerely.
When you ready, I got at least 3 blogs, 2 “feminists” posters, and one website I want you to visit and ask this question. I figure, since you’re a woman, they can’t call you a misogynist and throw illogical and uninformed circular answers your way to deviate from the facts…(laughs)
Bond.
I would but most women who are IN the situation can’t remove the emotion and think logically. A dude wants me to do something that has a larger impact on my life than his? That doesn’t make sense. It would be like me having two strikes and deciding to rob a likka-stoe with my 12 year old neighbor. Pure logic says I have more to lose. His ass will end up in juvie and I’ll end up in a metal box without and good moisturizer! Naw bruh. Keep it moving.
I get kinda pissed when I meet people who are shocked that I don’t have kids and have found men over 30 who also don’t have kids. We’ve done nothing special except use pre or post conception methods to make sure no kids are born.
I was just having a convo yesterday. People speak of uplifting the Black/African-American people, but blame 2520′s for all of the problems.
The upliftment of any race is the FAMILY! A strong bond between parents and involved parenting (emotional/economic) is what makes a people unified and strong. We as women need to stop letting lonlieness/hormones have us lay down with any dude that blinks at us twice. Men need to have some self-control before they lay down with any woman that blinks at them twice
EVERYONE needs to use BIRTH CONTROL until they enter a real relationship based on honesty; trust and maturity from both parties. Dont sleep with a knucklehead that you wouldnt want to know for the rest of your life. Its one thing to break up with a knucklehead & not have to see him/her ever again but what about the kid/kids you had with the knucklehead. Youre the one who has to deal with the emotional mess your “co-parent” left you to clean up
<—really needs a clever name
“EVERYONE needs to use BIRTH CONTROL until they enter a real relationship based on honesty; trust and maturity from both parties”
Hell, I’m in a relationship based on honesty, etc yeah but birth control and condoms are still utilized. We simply have no desire to be parents right now because it’s not in our plans at the moment.
The upliftment of any race is the FAMILY! A strong bond between parents and involved parenting (emotional/economic) is what makes a people unified and strong.
And the award goes to “Cris until I find a clever name”. If I wasn’t at work, I would stand up and applaud for that statement. This my friend is golden. This is what the black community needs to work on in order to break this detrimental cycle. If you’re on twitter, please tweet this…
“But how come the accountability doesn’t go both ways?”
It shole should. Both parties made a choice. Baddabing.
You know what’s interesting? That while I agree men have it way more difficult when it comes to “taking responsibility”, on the other side of the coin, men sort of benefit from it as well. How many times have you seen a “special episode” of the “single father”? Glorified up the ying yang as if he wasn’t doing something he wasn’t already supposed to effing do. And while you’re counting those, count how many tv specials/movies/Maury Povich “sad panda faces” have been made about the single mother? Yeah, way less…if any. Because more times than not, a single father is treated as something extra special. Because it’s not seen as the norm. So, while you may get extra-berated for not being there, you’re also extra-glorified when you do.
It’s the nature of the double standard, methinks. Like how women are seen as weak (and don’t like it), yet we sort of benefit from it when it comes to chivalry/protection (and do like it)?
(I’m kinda mad I won’t be around much for today’s post…effing dentist not allowing me to be great. #VSBGroupieFail)
good point, cheeks!
have fun at the dentist! i had a dental appt today. apparently, i have a nice mouth *wink*
Cheekie took her some extra “Poignancy” Flintstone Vitamins.
The black male has dropped the proverbial “ball” in fulfilling his role within the black family. When a woman lays with a man to engage in unprotected sex, she assents to all that follows (i.e. pregnancy, being rejected the next day, herpes, matted hair weave the morning after, you name it) and so must the black man. Yet, brothas often flee from a responsibility the black woman either cannot or will not.
And, because no comment on VSB is complete without at least one cross-racial comparison..
If life serves me correctly, white women open their legs with far more frequency than black women, and wayyyyyyy earlier in the dating/courting process. What is it that keeps white men from engaging in mass flight from the lives, and often homes, of their children? When I’m in Family Court representing clients, why are the benches of the courtroom filled with black and brown people, and hardly any whites (and I’m talking about a courthouse in predominately-white Manhattan!) Huh, bruh?
How does abortion fit into your model of dual responsibility? Should his responsiblity be abdicated from that point on, if he decides he doesn’t want to carry the child to term and she refuses? Just askin. . .
Great point you brought up.
What is happening is that you have a group of women who don’t want to include the men they sleep with in decisions that affect these men (i.e. abortion); yet, they expect these guys to support them once the child (that he doesn’t want) is born. Which is ideally what a man should do, but when you sleeping with no-good men, all bets are off.
Hell, these guys (in alot of cases) don’t even support the women/girls when it’s just the two of them, moreless when a child is brought into the picture.
So, what happens is these guys just ‘bounce’ because the short story is this: they didn’t want these women, they don’t want these children either.
It just becomes a vicous cycle that repeats itself.
What did they want? Sex. Unrequited sex. Unfortunately, you have women/girls out there giving it away to anybody for any show of attention and/or affection.
Which is why I wonder, why so-called ‘champions of women’ and ‘feminists’ don’t try to empower these girls and women to know their value and worth, this way they will be less susceptible to this type of conduct from predatory men/boys.
But they don’t hear me doe.
Bond.
naw kid, they don’t hear u.
I mean, what about even the halfway decent bruhs who make some change, and are court-ordered to pay a percent of it on a child that they would’ve been happy aborting?
Well, then money becomes the motive. Weeze. Am I saying to terminate a child’s life because you don’t want to be financially responsible for it?
*sigh* Questions like this push me further and further towards pro-life.
i don’t know the stats, but as for before a baby is conceived could it be that TO A CERTAIN EXTENT more white women use birth control (and adhere to it faithfully) than black women? and as for after a baby is born could it be that more white men hold each other accountable for being present in that child’s life?
“If life serves me correctly, white women open their legs with far more frequency than black women, and wayyyyyyy earlier in the dating/courting process”
WHOA.
i presume this is based on YOUR personal experiences because that’s one HELLUVA statment there my friend…
i think it’s a socio-economic thing as opposed to a colour thing.
not saying that colour isnt a factor (think a black octomom or punjabi kate would have gotten TLC shows and endorsements from companies?). but even within that example, octomom was BLASTED simply because she didn’t have a partner. people also judge the 19 and counting, but they are given a bly (pass) because they are married. and live in middle of nowhere utah if im not mistaken?
*bbm question mark face here.
Octomom was blasted b/c she had 8 children in addition to the 6 she already had at home. That’s too many dayum children.
Umm, go to Kentucky or any other area with a great proportion of poor white people and I believe your point of view would change. This is not really a racial thing as much as it is a class thing. Though, maybe even not. Peter Orszag got his girl on the side preggers and split before the baby was born and married some other chick. And he’s white. And RICH. Not sure what the point of that was, other than that white people do this nonsense too.
yeah, i was going to make mention of the “location” thing. where my mother lives in the midwest i cant tell you how many single white mothers there are with dead beat daddies as the parents of their children. i only know this b/c my mother lives in what i presumed to be the whitest locale in history and many of her coworkers shared similar stories (while we were supposed to be sleeping during those summers we’d visit) about Bob this and Jeff this…blah blah blah. ironic that only the woman for whom her children’s father was Black had another responsible party to lean on.
@Ready, Willing, But Unable
“What is it that keeps white men from engaging in mass flight from the lives, and often homes, of their children?”
***WARNING: SHOTS WILL BE FIRED AT MY PEOPLE***
Because “our” people would rather point fingers about who should be responsible. 2520s are not blogging about whose fault it is ….why are we? Not to say that they set the standard, however I do believe that whatever they are doing is not shedding as much negative light, nor is it placing a divide between their men and women. You know….I think we do ourselves (black and brown people) a GREAT disservice by always playing the blame game/who’s right and wrong when it comes to the issues within our culture. This entire post pisses me off because we don’t seem to be interested in resolving our family issues; instead we would rather ration the blame to satisfy sensitive ninjas! GTFOH! We are truly detached from what is truly important.
thanks for the shots fired. and how do you know white people dont blog about this stuff? how many of us really sit around and read the plight of the white woman? how many of us would give a sh*t? the only reason this is even an issue is b/c we PUBLICLY go hard on black men. it happens all the time. it happens in church, it happens in printed word, its part of campaign speeches. hell i wouldn’t be surprised if it became part of the elementary school curriculum at some point to have a day dedicated to “why yo’ daddy is a deadbeat and why your mother is Queen of the Nile”. once again, i aint trying to take any shine from single mothers who raise their children by themselves and financially support and basically do everything they have to do to ensure their kids have a chance b/c the father rolled out. i hate them ninjas too. mostly b/c i cant EVER imagine rolling out on my own child. ever.
and while i understand your pissedoffedness that this post is more worried about the problem than the solution, you still need to know the problems to come up with accurate solutions, which is my point to begin with. how can we properly fix a problem when one group always gets publicly railed as the demise of the Black community? we’ve heard numerous people here speak to the myriad other issues that come along with and stem from the decisions we all make…but i find it kind of hokey that most people would NEVER ever say that women are to blame publicly. we cant fix family issues unless both sides of the family realize that there’s work to be done.
@PJ
“how do you know white people dont blog about this stuff?”
Stuff Deez!! Nah, seriously. As I posted below, I’m sure they do…but it is not made into an elephant-sized issue that will make it true in the minds of the masses.
“how can we properly fix a problem when one group always gets publicly railed as the demise of the Black community?”
Respect. But, I disagree that black men are solely charged with the “demise of the Black community”. Sistas are painted as either black girl lost/money hungry or too successful/independent to marry. Tomato/Tomaato
“we cant fix family issues unless both sides of the family realize that there’s work to be done.”
Agreed.
hell i wouldn’t be surprised if it became part of the elementary school curriculum at some point to have a day dedicated to “why yo’ daddy is a deadbeat and why your mother is Queen of the Nile”
Ok, I know this is a serious subject and I shouldn’t be laughing… but boy, you’re a straight fool for that one…. Hilarity.
“2520s are not blogging about whose fault it is ….why are we?”
yea they are.
i see your point, but if you take away the hair issues and the occasional post about piles, white people write about the same sh*t we do.
@The Champ
“yea they are.”
But not to the point where it is becomes a cultural humiliation for them. The majority of what is decided about us comes from our own mouths first. That is what is irritating. Take the whole “Successful Black Women Are Less Likely To Marry” discussion for instance. Mainstream media did not get wind of this until we stimatized ourselves.
oops! I meant “stigmatized”
a cultural humiliation for them.
While I certainly understand where you are coming from, I don’t even think white people as a whole think of themselves as a “culture”… unless we are talking about the “American” culture in general… so they don’t necessarily identify with said “culture”… The cultural aspect comes from having a shared history and an Irish-American from Boston certainly has a very different history than a German American whose ancestors settled in Texas…
And the different ethnic groups? Yes, they do talk about their specific issues… Heck, we all laughed at My Big Fat Greek Wedding…
@Sula
“I don’t even think white people as a whole think of themselves as a “culture”… unless we are talking about the “American” culture in general”
American culture in the general sense is what I was alluding. However, you are correct if we are delving deeper into the specific makeup of American Culture. But my primary point is that our negative issues are magnified and beat into the ground by us and everyone else. (Counterproductivity at its finest)
“What is it that keeps white men from engaging in mass flight from the lives, and often homes, of their children?”
I’m am NOT against personal accountability at all but…Hmmm, I think some thought needs to be given to what family structure in the US is (the whole nuclear family thing), where the concept comes from, how Black people came to make an attempt to adapt to it or adopt it, what forces were, and still are, in place to thwart that assimilation and where the destruction of the previously existing ideas of family went (the village, communal, family model) and what went into destoying them. We are sometimes too quick “fire shots” at ourselves without realizing we are a different, I mean fundamentally different, type of folks and what’s good for the goose ain’t always good for the gander. I feel the same way about education and how it’s administered, but that’s a whole different can of worms. There are too many pervasive issues in the Black community at large for me to get on board with strictly “bad judgement” argument and I certainly ain’t about to compare bothas (or sistas) to white folk in this way.
I agree. We need to stop following in the footsteps of our Baby Boomer predessesors and actually do something about the problem. Showboating and yapping about who’s to blame never solves anything.
I feel like you’re oversimplifying things. It’s not just blame either the Black men or Black women. As another commenter said, the blame is often leveled on both parties, depending on who the speaker is and the picture he/she is trying to paint.
It’s easy to point out a dude like Plies or worse and say a woman should know better. I know the Plies thing is sort of for laughs, but there are times when you think you can spot a loser a mile away so why couldn’t the woman who had his 3 kids? In most situations, women aren’t aware that the dude they’re with is a loser and a future deadbeat dad. I’m thinking of a particular situation right now where a guy who is pretty famous for being an absentee dad had a baby with a woman who by any account is smart and successful. Guess what… dude was slick. It happens.
There’s also the matter that even if a woman made a shi**y choice, she’s often the one dealing with it and picking up the pieces. The message to Black men to be responsible includes sticking around to “clean up the mess” they’ve made. We all make mistakes, some more than others (which is not limited to gender) but in my opinion, what defines us as a “real man” or “real woman” is our ability to step up. Unfortunately, many Black men haven’t stepped up for various reasons.
We all need to make better choices but what happens once those choices are made?
We all need to make better choices but what happens once those choices are made?
Somebody better take care of the crumb snatchers before they end up like the one I just passed on Georgia Ave. It’s 12:30 little man, take your a*s to bed.
12.30. . . I always want to ask where their mama at Smdh* shyt like that makes my stomach churn, my husband is always saying that they need ve bring back days when it was ok to discipline a child even the he/she/it, example those kids on the train that curse way too danm much yet they simple calculations. . .
@ Kia, JD
‘In most situations, women aren’t aware that the dude they’re with is a loser and a future deadbeat dad. I’m thinking of a particular situation right now where a guy who is pretty famous for being an absentee dad had a baby with a woman who by any account is smart and successful. Guess what… dude was slick. It happens.’
sorry , i’m a bit curious about this. how long was she with him? how long before they started sleeping together? and how long after-wards did she get pregnant?was she using birth control, FAITHFULLY?
I mean if you have to have 3 kids before you realize someone is no good, then yeah, we have more than a little problem yo.
Sorry, I’m not going to get into that specific situation because I don’t want to unintentionally divulge any identifying details. Suffice it to say that what one person thought was a committed, monogamous, long-lasting relationship, the other did not.
@Kia, JD
“There’s also the matter that even if a woman made a shi**y choice, she’s often the one dealing with it and picking up the pieces. The message to Black men to be responsible includes sticking around to “clean up the mess” they’ve made. We all make mistakes, some more than others (which is not limited to gender) but in my opinion, what defines us as a “real man” or “real woman” is our ability to step up. Unfortunately, many Black men haven’t stepped up for various reasons.”
Preach!
While I do believe a lot of the problem is that neither men (nor women) are taking responsibility for their actions, it’s not as simple as “all these girls were just fuckin random dudes with no condom”.
There’s a lack of expectation when it comes to men in the Black community. No one expects Black boys to do anything. The only thing they get instant recognition for is making money, because we value money. So, instead of looking for the guy who has good character traits, girls go for the guys who know how to get money. Of course, taking care of a family takes time away from making money, and god forbid a guy marries his girl so she can take 1/2 of his hard earned cash in a nasty divorce. So, he cuts his loses and leaves her with the baby.
On one hand, had she been looking for a man who showed he had the right character traits, she wouldn’t be a single mom. On the other, we value money over everything in this country. In the hood, where the majority of Black Americans live, finding a dude who doesn’t put his grind first is probably like looking for a needle in a haystack. And, it’s our own fault because those same single moms then raise there boys to grind and make money, not settling down to start a family (or be responsible for the family they’ve already started) until they have “enough”.
Eh. . . It’s a theory.
*nods* I think the lack of expectation theory is viable
Is it just Black? Seems sometimes like women in general are made out to be these mindless, clueless damsels in distress that don’t think for themselves and are incapable of being pushed to any real limits. And most all societies teach our women that all men are potential predators that are going to exploit and defile them somehow, it’s just a matter of time.
Things happen. But women are not these completely helpless, hopeless, weak lemmings…unfortunately too many of them decide to be (or at least play that card) when it’s convenient, and it works.
How I look at it though, these baggage-ridden adults are f*cked (no pun intended). We just have to teach our daughters and sons to be the strongest, brightest, most righteous people they can be. Women aren’t born to have babies at 15-1/2 just like men aren’t born to be ignorant thugs. Raise them right and chances are they make the right decisions and prosper.
technically, women are born to have children at 15. hell, we can bare children as early as 11. thanks to a little event known as menstruation. we (women) are doomed by our biology.
just thought id throw that out there.
Yeah, I kinda figured one would come after me for that one.
Lemme substitute the word “doomed” for “born”
The world’s youngest mother was a 5 yrs old. Yes. I also get the heebie jeebies when I think about this.
ThuggieLuvvie,
Just read the story…my co-worker walked by and asked me to close my mouth…girl in shock!
- AD
We just have to teach our daughters and sons to be the strongest, brightest, most righteous people they can be
Gospel.
Is anyone else observing our generation starting to procreate; and seeing a positive trend? A lot of us men who grew up in fatherless households are taking a stand and refusing to have our children grow up the same way. No? Or is the lack of fathers making us ignorant on how to be men/fathers ourselves, perpetuating the ratchetry? What are ya’ll seeing? I’m seeing both cases, but if I would guess, I would guess ehh. . .53.64% of our generation’s budding fathers are the former.
can you write this comment again, but with different words this time? i think i understand what you’re trying to say, and i think i dont
It was late, I was trying to study and be a good VSB, I digress. . .#excuses
Anywhoo, I was asking if our generation was reversing the trend. We grew up without fathers, and so I see a lot of my friends avowing not to have their children raised without a paternal influence. So my question was is this a trend, or am I being too optimistic.
I’m tired and I have to be up in about 5 hours, so I’ll simply let J. Cole say it.
I’m a provide for my seed I’m the soil
I teach ‘em ’bout loyalty
I teach ‘em that his skin black like oil that’s for royalty
I show ‘em all the things that my pops was neva showin’ me
Treat em’ like a growin’ tree with this poetry
I get up
And show the sons how to lead not to follow
The present is our gift but our seeds got tomorrow
So please ninjas raise your kids
And help ‘em overcome that bullsh*t they daze us with
I blaze the sh*t
Your life is simply no longer yours when you have brought forth a crumb snatcher into this world. It belongs, at the very least, to the two of you. Too many people don’t realize that.
Nice
@Shay
“Your life is simply no longer yours when you have brought forth a crumb snatcher into this world. It belongs, at the very least, to the two of you. Too many people don’t realize that.”
At that, my friend…is the bottom line.
As rob base pointed out.. It takes two so there is fault on both sides.
Women should be just as accountable for their choices
As men should be in the child rearing/parenting part of it all.
However the reason its not as talked about is because she pays for her bad decision for 18+ yrs
While the guy who walks away most often doesn’t.
let’s also not act like this is strictly a “lower class kayshondra and dontrayvious” issue
Its a lot of people in this here forum raised by hardworking middle class single women
They made a bad choice as well.
its not a lower class issue and I think a lot of what ails black america has to do with our quickness
To make things about class and therefore not address it as a valid concern. “Well if keyshayshay nem get off welfare and stop having babies..”
That aint what its all about all the time.
Cosign, somebody needs to say that.
—->Its a lot of people in this here forum raised by hardworking middle class single women<—-
Word!
And stop fronting like a lot of y'all ain't sexing potential deadbeat.
@Malia
ain’t nobody stoppin people from chexing deadbeats, it ain’t advisable but if you want to do it then do so, jus don’t get pregnant and then complain when said deadbeat doesn’t suddenly turn into a dad of the year candidate…
My step-mother always said, “If you ain’t ready for tots, keep ur jack in the box..”
OK, not quite as colorful, but somethin like that..
The complaints ain’t the problem.. the deeds are.. unless u legitimately want to raise a child by yourself, keep these deceased instrumentals outta you..
THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I know someone who has 6 kids…she’s not even 30 yet. And 5 of them have different dads. Now, her first kid she had in high school. We were friends then. I saw the handwriting on the wall. Dude she got pregnant by was 19, HS dropout with 2 kids he didn’t take care of at that time. WHY she thought he would “man up” and do for hers…beyond me?
Fast forward 5 kids and 4 fathers later, she’s on facebook hollaring about her kids’ fathers being deadbeats. In cases like this, the woman is COMPLETELY to blame. Sure, dude should have stuck around, but if the last 2,3,4 didn’t, then why would any new guy? He sees that she’s the type to take that type of treatment.
When women (and men) get some standards about themselves and stop allowing the same dude/female, different day to come into their lives and run the same tired games, then we’ll all be better off.
Church and Tabernacle.
One of the issues that gets overlooked is when you try to bring up the fact that alot of women ARE sleeping with potential dead-beat dads, they will argue you until your ears bleed that they are ‘sexually liberated’ or ‘unconfined by societies definition of chastity’, etc.
Can’t see the forest because that tree keep slamming into that cave and….it feels good!(raphael saadiq voice)
LOL!
Bond. BlkBond.
Well said
Its a lot of people in this here forum raised by hardworking middle class single women
They made a bad choice as well
my father died with i was 18 months old. so my mom because a hardworking backbreaking middle class single parent by God. not by choice.
desertion and divorce isnt the only way to become a single mother.
To make things about class and therefore not address it as a valid concern. “Well if keyshayshay nem get off welfare and stop having babies..”
That aint what its all about all the time.
this is a good point. and, to be honest, i think it’s disingenuous to bring them up when we (the “educated” folk) do much of the same thing.
Can we delve into the middle-class, black female, baby momma epidemic. I reside in Atlanta and practically every one I know is “middle-class” and educated. However, I cannot count how many invitations I’ve received from black females walking around here having baby-showers at high-end restaurants in Buckhead and are not married! Only in the Black (American) community and White Hollywood is having a child out-of-wedlock perfectly acceptable and a viable option.
***** This $hit is not acceptable****** It should not be an option********
Just because you can afford a baby does not mean you should have one without a husband.
This sounds very judgemental of you, and quite possibly evil. So because a baby is on the way, one should live life as if it doesn’t exist? Are you from the 1950s as well?
I think single mothers are deserving of baby showers because they definitely NEED emotional support, as well as things to help care for the baby.
The point I was making had to do with Middle Class, black women having babies without being married, not a dam Baby Shower! geesh.
Obviously, I’m not from the 50′s but Black folks could stand to return to some of the morals and values that the 50′s held. 70% percenf of black children were not born out-of-wedlock in the 50′s.
About being judgemental…. uh yeah…. this entire blog is about stating our individual opinions on situations that affect our community. I stand by my assessment that ALL black females, regardless of class, need to elevate our thinking and then our behavior when it comes to birthing children out-of-wedlock and stop contributing to a negative statistic.
I’ll ride with you on that.
I’m one of the villains on these here webs, so, it doesn’t matter if my ‘e-friendship’ numbers decline, but someone needs to say it.
Kudos.
Bond. BlkBond.
I think Frog was focusing on the fact that these young, educated and successful black women are getting caught up just as much as Shashaneequa from round the way. It’s quite shocking, as you would think being successful and educated would motivate you to make pregnancy preventative choices.
I live in Atl as well and see a lot of my teacher friends popping up preggers and it bothers me. Not bothered that she’s having a baby, but that she’s finding it acceptable to have a baby without a husband (esp when she’s grown up in a two-parent middle-class household herself). And, then there’s the fact that she’s parading her preggo belly in front of impressionable 2nd graders, perpetuating the idea to them that daddies aren’t needed in the black family.
Note: There’s absolutely nothing wrong with being a single mom. At all. But I’m sure most of us don’t see it as an ideal situation for us or our children. So, yes I’m gonna go to the baby shower, gonna bring a gift and I’m gonna be happy about this new life you’re bringing into the world. I will NOT, however, find it ok that you’re smart and successful and young and couldn’t make a better life decision to wait until you had a family unit in which to bring this child.
“educated and successful black women are getting caught up just as much as Shashaneequa from round the way.”
If they are truly educated and successful (here-in-after, E&S) then I’m going to choose to give them the benefit of the doubt. Most of us realize that while it is ideal to have two parents in the household, it is not a requirement for producing a well-rounded child. I’ve got more respect for E&S women making a “choice” to become a single parent than for a non-E&S lady who says “oh shet, I’m pregnant, how’d that happen…(again)?”
The unfortunate reality is that many E&S ladies have either become jaded and don’t expect to find a do-right kind of guy, or they have lost hope for it happening on her schedule. Her desire to procreate is not hindered by this realization and she is able to rationalize, conceptualize, and strategize to provide an environment for raising a socially well adjusted child…and she’s probably read books on that and picked out a great sperm donor who would help produce her designer kid -i.e. tall, dark, and intelligent.
If you feel that this perspective represents a decline in moral values, then you are probably using Life version 1950 which probably does not recognize Fornication version 1960s, or 50% Divorce Rate 2000. I’m sure it works well with Stoned to Death 1800 and Scarlett Letter 1776. Install the upgrade to Life 2010 and re-boot, or just recognize that you’re using an antiquated idealogy.
I co-sign this ENTIRE statement to the nth power.
While I’m lazy and will rather have a kid inside a family unit, I can not blame/judge a responsible woman for making the choice to do it alone….
If they are truly educated and successful (here-in-after, E&S) then I’m going to choose to give them the benefit of the doubt. Most of us realize that while it is ideal to have two parents in the household, it is not a requirement for producing a well-rounded child. .
I agree with this too!
I also don’t think they’re the ones screaming “My baby daddy aint sh*t. I wish the gas and electric company hunted down deadbeat daddies the same way they do me about a gas bill” (real life FB status update)
In theory, I’d agree with you. Especially if these women were over 35 and perpetually single. But these are 22-27 year old women who still have time to work towards that family unit before their reproductive organs begin shutting down.
These aren’t planned pregnancies. They’re accidents. The initial reaction from these women is shock and fear because they weren’t prepared for the responsibilities…The daddies aren’t present and generally dip at the word, “pregnant.”
Now once the baby arrives, these women are equipped to handle it than the less educated and successful, but it still ain’t easy!
I think the e&s women, especially ones in their 30s probably gave up on trying to find a husband and then have babies.
I was born in ghana and live in toronto. I’m one of 4 sisters. I was raised in a 2 parent household. I’m also the only one not married. My mom who got married and had all 4 of us by the time she was 33 is begging me to at least have a child. I no longer have to be married as she had begged me to do 4 yes ago. She just wants me to know who the father is so if my kids ever want to follow up they can.
So I don’t think that those women laid down hoping they wouldn’t get pregnant. I think they just got pregnant before it was too late/to get it done and over with. Because truth be told…I’m starting to feel the same way…
I’m going to guess that educated Black women make the same mistakes when looking for men that un-educated Black women make, because the first thing we look for is a man who can make money.
It doesn’t matter if she never graduated from high school, or graduated summa cum laude from Harvard. The one thing women are taught to look for in men is whether or not they know how to get money, because we value money over everything in this country.
Some women think that because a man shares his money, he cares about them. Some women think if they spend enough time, eventually, he will care about them. And, some women don’t even get to the caring part, they just get caught up in the nice gifts and vacations.
Add to that the fact that, by the time you hit 33 years old with 3 degrees it goes from being “I wish I had a man” to something more like “why the fuck don’t I have a man now!?” As if someone owes them. Because if anyone deserves a husband, wouldn’t it be the sistah who’s 33, with 3 degrees, and a stable job?
It’s not really their fault, though. Society has taught women to expect to go to school, get a job, get married, and have children. Hell, we even tell women to go for men they’re not attracted to just so they can fulfill the “get married, and have children” part, because we get nervous if they haven’t done so by a certain age.
Add to it, the stereotype, that all these dudes who abandon their children are ghetto dudes, is wrong. The nerd who works for a pharmaceutical company winds up being a deadbeat dad just as bad as the guy who spends whole chunks of his day smoking weed, but educated Black women don’t know to look for the character traits because he fulfilled criteria #1: he has a good job.
I completely agree with the author. I always complain about women who get pregnant and can’t take care of their kids. If you don’t want to get pregnant then use birth control pills or a condom or both. But don’t act all surprised when you don’t use these methods and end up pregnant and expect the government to support you. If you are not ready for the responsibility then you should be trying your hardest not to get pregnant.
THIS!!
“A mother who can’t teach a boy how to be a man or a girl how to be loved by a man.”
The problem is in that sentence right there. Placing blame is like asking whether the chicken or the egg came first. If no one was there to teach the mother, how can she teach someone else? And if she can’t teach her son, and the father is MIA, then he’s more than likely going to do what his father did to him to another girl. It’s all a part of the cycle.
Thank you, this is why its so rampant today (or seems more rampant to me than ever before). As the Black family continues to disintegrate, more of us are out there trying to make our way through this ish & doing it wrong, therefore raising more fools who’ll continue to perpetuate the cycle.
I was wondering when someone was ever gonna touch on this bull. Am tired of women who choose bad men over and over have kids with someone who wont takecare of his other children, refuse to take responsibility for their shyt and go running their mouths ‘ninjas aint shit. . . .’ No betch, you the one messing irresponsible idiotic ninjas next time look for a better man not pookie or his pal rayray. Your kids are bad not because their lack a father but because you aint shyt either. In short they had no chance, with a runaway father and stupid mum their pretty much screwed.
Its time everybody took responsibility for their actions. . . . . I needed to rant.
I’ll tell you from my point of view. From forums I am a part of, the man is always the victim. Black women are getting the blame for everything. I’m just waiting for unemployment to be blamed on us as well. It is almost like there is an all out war against back women.
What most people neglect to pay attention to is that both parties are to blame, but as usual in these cases it’s the woman who is left to do damage control while the man happily skips away, washing his hands of the situation.
The reason why women aren’t allocated some portion of the blame (at least publicly), is because the narrative and diatribe you’ve described above, of tired dialogues that have been trot out…conservatively…for the last 30-50 years, only work if the women in these scenarios are “victims”.
If we allow for the possibility that maybe, just maybe, young women have some sort of role and responsibility in their own sexuality and the partners that they choose then we would then have to 1) educate said young women (and men) about the realities of sex from a reasonably young age in order to combat the nonsense being thrown at them from all angles and sources 2) provide an open forum in which young women (and men) could discuss their sexuality freely and without shame, stigma, and the ridiculously stupid and unjustifiable double standards that are passed down from generations onwards and 3) actually admit and acknowledge that these young women are just as empowered in the choices they make regarding their sex lives and the roles they play as the young men they consort with…that they are not just passive bodies to be “hit” or “tapped” or “gamed”.
At the risk of sounding a bit cynical, I think most folks (men and women, mind you) are just more comfortable with casting the young Black male (who, in many ways, is *just* as much a “victim”) as the boogie man or the social predator. Because, as usual, it’s easier to talk about the problem than possible solutions. Solutions are boring, and involve changing entire ideologies and collective cultural ideals/beliefs. If *anyone* was really even remotely interested in a solution, we would see far more examples of positive male and female figures of a certain persuasion floating about. And if not that, we’d at least be complaining about the lack thereof…and it’s been so quiet I can hear an echo.
The end result? We’re all victims really, once again playing as understudies in a patriarchal system which wasn’t designed in our favor or even regard, for that matter.
Hey, I like what you said. +1
Agreed.. and then I hit my dougie..
facebook thumbs up likes this.
Well stated.
Changing mentalities is a whole lot harder than complacently sitting in a heap of received ideas. We don’t want to challenge the “establishment” and will rather perpetuate crazy behaviors.
The common stance of placing blame on women, namely black women, is one that is rooted in sexism and imperialism.
I recently finished reading Ain’t I A Woman: black women and feminism by bell hooks. After reading her book, and in addition to being a black woman myself, I am profoundly tired of the widespread acceptance of blame that is routinely placed on the the shoulders of black women. It is not merely an issue of accountability, yet, it is a tradition of making women the scapegoats.
No matter what side people like to take, it takes TWO individuals to conceive a child. Unless there has been a biological and scientific breakthrough where a woman is now able to climb on top of and impregnate herself, I refuse to believe that it is solely the woman’s fault.
Rather than focus on why the woman doesn’t receive as much blame or criticism as the man, why not travel to the true root of causation and figure out what has happened in our community to make absentee fathers and single mothers the norm? If we are going to ask questions, at least ask the correct ones.
Thank you.
“why not travel to the true root of causation and figure out what has happened in our community to make absentee fathers and single mothers the norm?”
Let us take this trip then. What is your theory for explaining the phenomenon of absentee fathers and single mothers? t
One word
Slavery
So slavery makes modern men NOT want to be involved with their children and makes modern women choose to NOT protect themselves from unwanted pregnancies.
I think I got it now.
Thanks
If you’re looking for the true root like Pe. riche says, then slavery is the root. And yes modern men and women are still affected by slavery because it caused psychological and emotional damage that has been passed down through generations and that’s why it’s called a cycle…
cause and effect
Absolutely myopic but if that’s what you want to attribute it to…have at it
Exactly. While physical we have been liberated, as in we are no longer in shackles, chains, or considered to be someone else’s property, we have yet to actually encounter a mental, emotional, and intellectual revolution. The same mentality that was forced upon us for survival during slavery, is the very mentality that we are voluntarily defending and taking to the grave today.
Exactly. While physically we have been liberated, as in we are no longer in shackles, chains, or considered to be someone else’s property, we have yet to actually encounter a mental, emotional, and intellectual revolution. The same mentality that was forced upon us for survival during slavery, is the very mentality that we are voluntarily defending and taking to the grave today.
T is absolutely correct.
Again, if you would read Ain’t I A Woman by bell hooks, you could take your own trip and read about the phenomenon of absentee fathers and single mothers.
I heart bell hooks. Have you read Salvation yet?
No, I haven’t read Salvation yet, but that is the book that I want to read next. And after reading her first book, I am making it my goal to read all of her books!
It’s a big tangled web that honestly would take volumes to completely catalogue and explain, but the situation is that this entire society is a bingo board of class, sex, race, gender, and anything else that one can “classify” and they’re all interlinked. It’s easier to blame black men because society has made poor, black (and brown) men (the absolute opposite of hitting a bingo in this analogy) everyone’s boogie man, for everything in society instead of blaming their own stupidity and greed. Women in general are seen as innocuous and therefore as brownivyx detailed above are not “responsible for their own actions”. I’ve thought about it and in being honest with myself have decided that to attempt to remedy the situation would take a lot more than I’m willing to give. Maybe my feelings will change in the future.
oooh wee… AMEN…yes sir! I believe it TAKES 2 TO TANGO,,it’s men and women who need to get their ISH together…I know I’m not the only one that watches MAURY Show, and it’s always that one chick that’s been on their 50leven times, and every ninja,2520,other,etc. she slept with ..in the case of 15month old KeysE’and (pronounced keith) you are NOT the father, the chick Runs of the stage embarASSED once again, and the guy that thought he was the father cranks that Soulja Boy and Supaman that HoEEE cheers dougies jerks Happy as hell…so back to main subject: It’s partially a women’s fault, hell stop spreading your legs to any and errybody!!!..SMH…everyone slammed Bill Cosby but he was telling the TRUTH, yes he’s a lil’ out of touch with some things, but he had Valid points, in the world with blended families on the regular, it’s rare to meet people who have the SAME mom and SAME dad, everybody is either step this or half that, I can’t relate to growing up that way, but I’m like DAYUM I know one chick 25 with 5 children first 2 same dad and the last 3 all have different daddies…smh..MENACE2SouthCentral LA moments “ARE U MY DADDY”..lmbosmh…sad even to the Lauren Londons and Katt Stacks etc AIDS/HIV/HERPES will NEVER go AWAY…Lyfe Jennings Statistics…
When the blame is 110% the woman’s fault:
She slept with Antonio Cromartie (really my ninja? Not ghetto twins, ghetto QUADRUPLETS? i.e. he has 4 3 year olds )
She slept with Travis Henry (who L believe now has a WNBA starting line up plus a MLB squad)
She
is a non-white woman andslept with Karl Malone. People keep forgetting about those random assed children he doesn’t acknowledge, all while donating money to children’s charities. Those aren’t your kids, pay child support, ninjawho I believe now has a …
Aight, here comes Captain Breakdown..
If baby momma is a known slut (a Kat Stacks) she gets blame.. if she slutted around once or twice and got pregnant, her long lost daddy gets the blame. All this happens before baby daddy is even considered. If baby daddy is either a) paying child support or b) sticking around and taking care of his kid, he gets no blame. As soon as he utters, “That baby ain’t mine” without a Maury present, he gets the “dead beat dad” award.. stamp.. whateverTF u wanna call it. If it is confirmed that he is the father, after baby momma hits her dougie, if baby daddy doesn’t do a) or b) above he gets full blame for what that child becomes because he should have taken responsibility. Baby daddy can then blame his own father for being a rolling stone or his mom for being the freak of the decade.
I blame it all on slavery and Jim Crow.. Everything seems to lead back there somehow..
@Rem The Mulatto
“after baby momma hits her dougie”
LMAO!!! And you know this!
Ouch! *rubbing the toes that u just stepped on*
I am a single mother and I agree with you. I made some un-wise decisions in my early 20s and now that I’m nearing the end of my 20s I’m trying and striving to do better. I think thats all that we can ask of each other. And I got the memo. I’ve been celibate for a little over a year now and I’m good with that decision. Luv this blog!!!
Thank you. We all made unwise decision in our twenties, some of which are lasting. A child is a visable reminder of said decisions, but that isn’t the only issue at hand. It’s how to learn from those decisions and not repeat them.
Sounds like you did and that’s what more folks need to strive for.
Like Moses’ older sister, Cicely Tyson said in “Madea’s Family Reunion” at the picnic after ringing the bell.. “BLACK MEN, TAKE YO’ PLACE!”
But really, I’m of the “place blame squarely on both shoulders” party. I definitely feel that women who keep their legs open like the doors of the local 24-hr WalMart deserve a lot of the blame. Get some discernment about yourself. However, that seems too simple. The things that cause these women to lay down (history of psychological damage from *insert reason here* or something equally deep and poignant) are also necessary to examine.
But still. Pookie is an “Ain’t Sh*t” dude and hasn’t proved himself otherwise. Yet you still do the southside slippery slide with him.
It’s like who’s to blame? The friend who dared you to go rollerblading or YOU for agreeing to go even though you can’t skate. And WHY did you feel like you HAD to take the dare, instead of walking away?
Wait… what??
“Like Moses’ older sister, Cicely Tyson said…”
Thank you for this Thuggie Luvvie! I heart Cicely Tyson jokes for some reason.
are you kidding me??? are you seriously trying to shift the blame on women?? we’re already oppressed by society, we don’t need you to add to it. let’s talk about this patriarchal society and the discrimination against women. the lack of access to an education for women still affect us today and combine that with racism and where does that leave us? and why are we blaming the victims?? can’t you see they got us pitting men and women of color against each other??? why aren’t you asking why THE SYSTEM has failed to provide adequate education and economic opportunities to minorities?? “When you educate a girl, she has significantly fewer kids.” come on folks, just because panama or champ writes something doesn’t automatically mean you should 100% cosign it. please think for yourself. these posts are meant to stimulate dialogue and discussion.
just because panama or champ writes something doesn’t automatically mean you should 100% cosign it. please think for yourself. these posts are meant to stimulate dialogue and discussion.
i don’t see any of that going on here. some people agree, some disagree. also, you’re implying that since women are oppressed, they can do no wrong…which is the exact point p’s bringing up. it’s not necessarily about who should get the most blame, but he’s arguing that men take the blame for men’s bad decisions (which we should) and men also take the blame for women’s bad decisions (which we probably shouldn’t)
and, if you want to start/stimulate dialogue and discussion about this…
“let’s talk about this patriarchal society and the discrimination against women. the lack of access to an education for women still affect us today and combine that with racism and where does that leave u”
…go right ahead. no one is stopping you
“let’s talk about this patriarchal society and the discrimination against women.”
There is discrimination against women of color but Bull Conner is not standing in front of the doors of Planned Parenthood, so this is a little different.
“When you educate a girl, she has significantly fewer kids.”
True but in our community in a lot of cases that ends up with an educated women with one child out of wedlock rather than three so even with education there is still an issue.
I’m with the majority on this. Two people lay down, so two people should stand up and take responsibility.
People also need to ask themselves if they’re willing to spend the rest of their lives with someone before they get down with the laying down. In effect, that’s what happens – or at least ‘should’ happen – if a child is born. A little “do you want her/him to be around for the rest of your life” could be a really quick solution.
A little “do you want her/him to be around for the rest of your life” could be a really quick solution. .
Exactly! Kids are forever. Everything else is negotiable…..including marriage.
Women tend to never want to hear this. I went on a mini-rant on twitter about this on Father’s Day because of all the bitterness from the single mother’s who were trying to rain on everyone’s day and co-opt the day…I lost 150+ followers. Pointing out their role in the creation of deadbeat dads left me branded a misogynist.
I have always found the underutilization of birth control by African-American women to be appalling. Pregnancies are generally preventable if proper birth control regimens are followed. I always tell my woman friends that they have to be the ones to protect themselves when it comes to sex. In addition to having a basket for of Magnums on their night stand, they should also be on some sort anti-baby prescription.
I have a friend with five children. It takes less than five minutes of being in his presence to figure out that he is a no good bum, yet he has 5 children and two on the way that I know of. His baby mama’s are always griping, but they were the ones that let an obvious bum, who only utilizes catcalling game mind you, hit it raw. The snot-nosed children of these women get sympathy from me…the women do not.
My perspective on this topic is colored by the experiences of my mother who allowed getting caught up in the moment, and past obvious dog signs in men to leave her raising four kids alone.
Agreed, and I especially have a problem with women thinking that because they are single mothers that they get Father’s Day too. It’s not the same thing.
–I have always found the underutilization of birth control by African-American women to be appalling.–
Just as appalling as the underutilization of condoms by black men.
No glove should equal no love. If a man is allowed to hit raw there are consequences. I can’t be bothered to pity women for making the same mistake over and over again.
Equal responsibility. As a woman I just wish/pray/hope women would think twice about the fool they are laying down with. If you have been up, down, and around the bend in the “relationship” ( which really means yall are working each other nerves while just dating) , what really makes you think he is going to be down for the “commitment?”
If the two of you got into a major argument about going to a bar-b -que that required all kinds of apologizing.
Marriage is commitment but fluck that. Think about his no-count behind now and you wake up one day pregnant dealing with his no count behind.
Pregnant is commitment on a hundred thousand trillion. The woman should be scared-to-death do you hear me. I think sometimes we just dont get it. That kid is not gonna keep him. He is more likely to sign up to go to Afghanistan. I had a fool one day tell me since Im gainfully employed I should buy him some rims AND that I could contribute so much more to our vacation. Shit like that immediately makes you and idiot and shuts the sexual attraction down. We gotta do better at some point.
i look forward to hearing from other VSS’s who are single moms who probably faced the same blame and scrutiny that you speak of. (paging my fem-boo SFG…)
Why aren’t women more to blame? There are myriad of reasons, and there will still never be a satisfactory answer.
It’s easy to blame and speak of Shaniqua on Maury, but Halle is a single mom and there have been 2 ‘mainstream’ movies released in which the lead ‘star’ (JLO and Jen ‘getanewhairstyle’ Aniston) decide to forgo a relationship and inseminate. Trust me, there was backlash. Tons of it.
Women are supposed to want love. then a ring. then a wedding. then a baby. in. that. order. Anytime we deviate from it, there may not be marches on Capitol Hill, but trust me the ‘blame’ is there.
Maybe we dont blame the woman, because she has enough to deal with like..raising another human being. while the dude is free to impregnate others, go clubbing, pursue his dream of being a doctor/rapper/twitter expert and not lose part of themselves, their youth, their family, their churches as a result.
A tree does still make a sound if it falls in the forest, even if there is no one around to hear it.
Keisha I love you!!! For reals. This elove we have may make others sick but it’s so right. lol I cosign your entire comment. All I’m reading is people talking about Pookies, Ray Rays, and Shaniquas. Are people ignorant enough to think that all bad parents are ghetto with obvious red flags when you meet them? Like Andre Smith, the executive, can’t up and leave a pregnant woman? Their are TONS of single mothers out there…some from divorce, etc. Sometimes love post baby doesn’t work out and the parents split. So the mother should be blamed for not knowing better? GTFOH!! Plain ignorance. If you are having sex before marriage, then you might just have a baby before marriage…and getting an abortion doesn’t make you smarter.
This elove we have may make others sick but it’s so right.
*sings off-key: if loving you is wronnnnnng…i dont wanna be riiiiiiiiiiiiiiite…
I think it is embarrassing to how some black folks sense of responsibility has declined! It’s funny how in this day and age men talk so much about being “hard” or “real men” and I have never heard men complain more about what being a man means and what is expected of men. I have had endless conversations with guys and read endless blog posts filled with me whining. “Why do I have to pay for the first date, I didn’t want a kid, who says I need to volunteer in the hood, why do I need to open her door, nobody every talked to me when I was a young dude why I gotta talk to young boys, why do I have to call 1st and ask her out, I ain’t no simp, I gave her abortion $, how come she’s entitled to my $ if we get divorced (even though she quit her job to stay home and take care of the children). It’s E-M-B-A-R-R-S-S-I-N-G!
I don’t like the blame game because it doesn’t accomplish anything. But, I will say anytime a man and a woman lay down they should BOTH be willing to accept the consequences, repercussions, and ramifications of their actions. Be it pregnancy, STDs, broken heart etc… For those men that wine “i wanted her to have an abortion” or “I don’t want anymore kids” exactly what did you do to ensure this wouldn’t happen? So what if she said she’s on BC. If you were man enough to have sex be man enough to deal with the fact that “banana cream pie” might have your baby!
The “baby mamas” definitely are blamed. From the moment she decides to keep the kid. Someone in neighborhood is talking aboutshe brought it on herself and the fact that she shoulda kept her legs closed, the dude blames her with his “how’d this happen” or “this is your problem”, if she’s getting help from her state it’s “where’s the child’s father” why didn’t you take precautions, if the kid misbehaves, doesn’t look put together, or anything else “where’s his mama?”
Ok I’ve ranted long enough. Both men, and women need to take responsibility for their actions!
@Satya
I don’t even need to make a post. Everything you just said is exactly how I feel…. EVERYTHING!
*nods*
Hi CNotes
yes, women should be held accountable too…
my ex-wife (thank god shes my ex) has two sisters, who between them have 6 kids, and all have different fathers…6 different men!
christmas and summer vacation was always interesting…
now did all these men just up and leave? no, they didnt. the truth of the matter is they were never there in the first place, beyond the half-hour or so it took to get these women pregnant. i refuse to believe that all of these children are being born out of legitimate relationships, and the man just chunks the deuce, and leaves.
these children are being born out of non-relationships, where there was never any form of commitment to begin with, and the women should bear blame too. its their body, and they are the ones being left with all these rug-rats to raise on their own.
I know a woman who has 2 babies by a man serving a life sentence…and yes she conceived while he was in prison. SMH
This post rings ridiculously true. I currently have a friend who is pregnant by a dude who has a girlfriend (not her) and who has impregnated and aborted several children by several women in the past few months. He’s driving a stolen rental car and everything about him says “Go the opposite way!” and yet, my friend is preggers by him. Again! (the first time it ended sadly in a miscarriage). Yes, the dude is a total douche and a half. He’s running around all willy nilly, getting women pregnant and not willing to claim any of them. But, she is downright mentally ill for signing up to be the mother of his child!
Also, while the women make the mistake, including this one, the reason they get less of a tough rep is because at the end of the day, they bear the brunt of the punishment. They know they effed up! They figure it out when they can’t go out anymore, buy what they wanna buy, and etc. The punishment of carrying the burden alone is punishment enough and people believe that wagging the finger at them is only adding insult to injury.
He’s driving a stolen rental car .
He wouldn’t happen to be Beanie Sigle would he? LOL
? I can feel it in the air ?
Based on this post, I think we should all put our collective thoughts into how to prevent young girls like your friend from making those mistakes.
It’s so sad. Le Sigh.
You need to K-Slay your friend. Seriously.
Bond. BlkBond.
Panama! You hit this! I think this question is RARELY asked! We, and I say we because no one can look at me and tell if I have a child or not, which I don’t. However, to attempt to answer your question, I shall go biblical. You have to understand that men have been the head the since the beginning. Have you ever read the bible and realized that EVE never got blamed for sin, although she started it. After her punishment, The Lord never mentioned her again, it was always “when Adam sinned”, never when Adam and Eve sinned. So, you see, God ordained this thing for men ALWAYS to be the head. Some might say this is unfair, and I might agree in situations like these, buttttttt, what can we do?!?
GREAT Post.
(**Sarcasm button on**)
Well, that may be true, but since these women don’t believe in your God, Bible, Qu’ran, etc. (‘Dey SPIIIRITUAL doe’!) That story doesn’t matter. Oh yeah, but it’s still Adam’s fault.
Libations?
-_-
Bond.
“But then I started thinking…why can’t you ever hold women accountable for the demise of the community the same way we continuously hold men accountable. It’s pretty much the party line that (many) men aren’t living up to their ends of the bargain”
What effing bargain? It’s not as though the guy and the girl had a serious conversation while she was taking her panties off! Women have got to be more responsible for the choices that they make. No, it’s not the man’s fault. She is culpable. No one held a gun to her friggin’ head. Okay, after the deed is done, common decency should dictate his actions but she shouldn’t go into the situation beliving that it will. Be smart(er) ladies. Stop believing that what’s between your legs is going to make a man stay with you.
Just sayin’
I don’t believe in victims & villains. I believe you attract who & what you are at the time. An irresponsible woman will attract an irresponsible man. It’s inevitable.
An irresponsible woman will attract an irresponsible man.
too long for a hooded sweatshirt?
Nope & we can always post it on billboards & the side of buses.
So people who get raped robed assaulted shot attracted it to them selves?
i almost hate to even write this but it is my sister’s and my bro’s baby mama’s fault. period. we even tried to have a min intervention with my bro’s baby mom’s…she’s got 4 kids by this dude and our taxes support all of them.
My first VBS comment *smiles* I usually only read but I couldn’t just sit on this. I have never been a part of the women’s club that believes women are always the victim….in fact I often believe women don’t take enough responsibility for their actions and blame it on men, society, the alcohol, the music…whatever just seems convenient at the time. But at the same time its not 100% their fault just as it isn’t the men’s 100% fault. Yes a home lacking a male figure could lead to a stray child but as a women you knew well before they got of age that the ninja wasn’t going to be there so you should have made provisions. When you get pregnant you have options. You signed up for it, don’t blame anyone else because you didn’t read the contract. Whether male or female, if you aren’t in a monogamous relationship, don’t have kids you aren’t prepared to PROPERLY take care of by yourself. But I also realize its a mindset that causes this whole cycle where men leave, and bitter women raise broken kids….so the same help the dead beat dad needs is the same help the mother with 7 kids on welfare needs.
Welcome n all that!
It’s 50/50. People make choices. Unfortunately, they’re not necessarily mature enough to consciously decide upon what they’re doing. To every action there is a reaction. Now live with the consequences of your actions. I just hate it when folks start complaning over shit they made happen. *sucks teeth* It could also be related to cosmic payback.
On another note, Panama, I gotta major e-crush on you : )
You should check out this Sociology book that attempts to tackle this issue/problem: “Promises I Can Keep: Why Poor Women Put Motherhoob Before Marriage” by Kefales and Edin.
I don’t think its easy to apportion blame, however, I do think there is something fundamentally broken in the (poor) black community that allows the cycle of broke homes to continue needlessly. The lack of stigma associated with being a single mother or a deadbeat father speaks volumes to this sense of brokenness.
In my eyes, the only “victim” is the child. Point blank period.
All of this pointing of the fingers and he said/she said is useless and unneccessary distractions.
Besides, we all know there are unfit mamas and daddys. I’m seriously considering proposing that people take some kind of Aptitude parenting test before having babies.
COSIGN
In my eyes, the only “victim” is the child. Point blank period.
Tabernacle.
And you know I am all for the “are you ready to be a parent test” and Id Card to go with it. Heck, we ask people to have a card/education before they drive… how much more important is a kid!
I could not agree more. Not only should women share AT LEAST half of the blame but since we are the ones who have to bear the children and can’t get away from raising them, we should be more aware and more responsible than men! I have never understood how a woman can blame a man for getting her pregnant and leaving. HE has that option. YOU don’t. So how is it that you’re not taking 100% ownership over YOUR body??
Women, especially black women, really are the victims of a multitude of injustices and often suffer from fates that are out of their control. However, 99% of the time, pregnancy is not one of those things. Pregnancy is preventable. Anyone who has ever seen a Trojan commercial during episodes of Teenage Mothers on MTV knows how. And every little girl with a Cabbage Patch doll knows that women are the ones who have the babies. We’re not stupid. In fact, most women would agree that we are infinitely more intelligent than men.
So how is it that we can blame them for what we do to ourselves?
Thanks Panama J, I think you should set your friend up with a podcast.
I agree. I bet you don’t have many female friends.
I have never heard a woman blame a man for getting her pregnant. Never. I have heard women blame men for abandoning their children. We all are not psychic. Some men actually do change and say they aren’t ready when they discover the woman is pregnant. Most women are in their right to blame the man…and no not all cases are forseen and “prevantable”. You should really talk to some single mothers. I do agree with this point you made: women should take more responsibility over their bodies. This should be on billboards nation wide.
Women, especially black women, really are the victims of a multitude of injustices and often suffer from fates that are out of their control. However, 99% of the time, pregnancy is not one of those things.
Herein lies the crux.
Cool topic, and I understand where some men are coming from. But I’m gonna go ahead and call bullshyt on this argument. Because women already understand it. How really, are Black women seen as victims?When I look at my friends that had kids young and without a proper father in place I get a little judgemental. I see how they struggled throughout our 20′s and the sacrifices they made. And all along the way, there was a steady chorus of “Well, you KNOW you brought this on yourself!”
Let’s face it, the roles of “victim” and “damsel in distress” are usually reserved for women of a more *ahem* European background. Case in point: a man crawls in a Black womans window and attempts to rape her as she sleeps. The collective “we” focuses more on her hoodrat lingo and her brother’s antics than on the fact that SOMEONE CRAWLED IN HER WINDOW AND TRIED TO RAPE HER AS SHE SLEPT.
But here’s the other side of the coin: I, along with quite a few of my friends, did the “right thing”. We didn’t give Ray Ray a baby. We made it out of high school, through college, and through our 20′s without tying ourselves down with an unwanted baby. And now, many of us are swiftly approaching the end of our child bearing years, still searching for OUR “good Black man….ok ANY good man”. Meanwhile, those “foolish” girls that had babies young are less than 5 years from having their kids out of the house and are free to pursue romance without the thought of their soon-to-be hardboiled eggs in the back of their minds.
Meanwhile, Ms. Better Than That gets a hearty round of haterade, her accomplishments are diminished (your degrees ain’t gon’ hook my steak up), and pressure is added by her older family (the same ones who encouraged her at 20 are looking at her sideways at 30). That’s why many happily married Black women feel just as endangered as the “Good Men” they’re married to. Folks are downright surprised when we get the “happy ending” – educated, accomplished, loved and legitimized. So no, I will not be adding to the continued pile-on of Black women. Step your game up, men. Those VSB’s who readily admit to having homies who are deadbeats – really? REALLY SON?
I got more to say, but I’m ranting so I’ma stop now. lol.
*encourages Anna N to continue rant.
*pulls up chair and offers beverage of choice
*CNotes pulls up her chair along side Keisha Brown*
@Anna N.
I LOVE the fact that you’ve discussed what happens to “VSS” within this whole parenting debacle. And yes…enough with the pile-on to what black women are doing wrong. Your theory puts a (well placed) monkey wrench in the blame game.
“Case in point: a man crawls in a Black womans window and attempts to rape her as she sleeps. The collective “we” focuses more on her hoodrat lingo and her brother’s antics than on the fact that SOMEONE CRAWLED IN HER WINDOW AND TRIED TO RAPE HER AS SHE SLEPT”
good point
Well said.
Let’s face it, the roles of “victim” and “damsel in distress” are usually reserved for women of a more *ahem* European background. Case in point: a man crawls in a Black womans window and attempts to rape her as she sleeps. The collective “we” focuses more on her hoodrat lingo and her brother’s antics than on the fact that SOMEONE CRAWLED IN HER WINDOW AND TRIED TO RAPE HER AS SHE SLEPT.
ahem ahem WAKE UP PEOPLE
Please be a good citizen and continue preaching Anna N!!!
Has a slow clap been started yet? If not, let me do that…
*slow clap*
I empathize with all you have stated; however, doing the right thing (education, avoiding unwanted pregnancy, etc.) does not entitle you to anything.
The ‘good brotha’ is not entitled to anything either, such is life.
Though there is that chorus of ‘blame’ for those girls who made those bad decisions, there is still usually a network of support from family, friends, etc. who help out, despite how they may feel about said girls/womans choices that allow her to remain on tract to strive for her goals & dreams.
Bond.
Panama, I have asked my self this question a few times. ONCE THE CHILD IS BORN IT IS THE RESPONSIBILITIY OF BOTH PARENTS TO TAKE CARE OF IT.IT TAKES TWO PEOPLE TO MAKE A BABY. That being said I cannot excuse the fact that women make HORRIBLE choices in who they choose to have a child with. Yes it is the man’s responsibility to take care of the child. At the same time you have to hold yourself accountable for the choices you make. Gutta Black has 2 kids, is a small time drug dealer, and barely a high school diploma. Why would you consider having a child or even sleeping with him?
What makes this worse is some women tend to see and hear what they want to. Men can see that the dude really isn’t about ish 300 miles away. Why can’t women? If a dude has a baby by a jumpoff or a freak broad he was messing around with he is pissed. I can’t say that I’ve seen that attitude amongst young women. Rarely have I seen or heard of a woman pissed b/c a bum @ss ninja got her pregnant. I can understand if you are in love and in a LTR. But I don’t believe this always the case. I just think a lot of the single parent issues can be solved if women were smarter in who they decide to sleep and have a child with.
Because not all dudes look/act like “Gutta Black”. You are looking at the most obvious scenarios. Of course you wouldn’t want to have a baby by a drug dealer. You think those are the only men who don’t father their children? What about the corporate black man, college educated black men, hard working clean cut black men who “change” or decide they need “me time” or “aren’t ready” to be a father and then BOUNCE. You want to blame the black woman then? Ish happens and unfortunately people change. When this happens, it is all on the black woman and it’s not right. Panama is wrong nor can he relate to this issue at all.
@SmartFoxGirl
I did state the obvious. But I see more of that then the corporate guy bailing. I agree with you completely. Life is not black and white and there are always exceptions to the rule. That being said, I think we as a community need to do better to help young women or girls protect themselves from irresponsible men. Humans beings aren’t perfect but some things you can spot from a distance if you have the knowledge to interpret BS when it comes to you. I have homeboys with kids and I know they were reckless in their behavior. And these dudes were not thugs. I knew what these guys were about. At the same they stayed getting p***y. I couldn’t understand how a dude with no job, kids, and stays at his moms house kept getting it in. Like I said before I think we need to do a better job at schooling girls just like we have to do a better job at schooling boys. For every good example there are 10 bad ones so we have to counter that until things change.
I completely agree with this comment! There’s alot of gray and it all boils down to being smart. Even then you may get got. That’s life. But if we all better informed, it would decrease these chances.
You know Panama, I can’t even be mad at you about this. Facts are facts. You may be Mr. Go King Beef for a day….Lol….anyway….
At least I’m not the only women basher on here. Yay! There’s no way that the woman with 5 babies, 4 baby daddies and 2 possibles is making smart decisions. Every lay can’t be played like the game of monopoly-hoping to win. Oh, she used a condom every time? Right. Well that condom company needs to be sued for false advertising. Women do it to themselves. If he was an asshole before you went raw why would you think running that game of chance would pan out positively for you. Granted, babies are blessings, yes. But having the rainbow coalition tribe of chilrens isn’t adding to your credibility as a person who makes good judgment calls.
And the buck doesn’t stop there…let’s take say….Lauren London, Nivea and random Asian chick. Now you mean to tell me they all believed Wayne when he said he was single- for the night? O_o 3 babies within the SAME time frame and we want to say Wayne is the hoebag…..mmmmm yeah I’m pretty sure those women knew exactly what they were doing. Save the pity party for ya mama.
Oooh I had to come from out the shadows (where I usually lurk while reading your blog via email) to comment:
I work in social services and the program I work for deals specifically with families with children and pregnant women. Most of the families I interact with (surprise surprise) consist of single mothers with their children or single pregnant women. Yes, most of these single women are black or white-latina. So the question comes up all the time, whether asked directly to the woman or just in my co-workers’ conversations about dealing with particular clients: where are the fathers of these children and why aren’t they helping? When asking the clients, it is not uncommon to hear the woman say that she didn’t know the father(s) that well when she got pregnant (no idea how to reach him for child support) – or he got locked up again – or he’s living on the streets and can’t help. Another common scenario: the family consists of both man and woman but the man is clearly did NOTHING (and is not very interested in doing anything) to help prevent his family from needing my employer’s services. (For example – there are times when obtaining employment – or at least trying to obtain employment – is suggested. The reaction that some men give to that suggestion makes me sad.)
So I say all that to say that I agree with you. I come across situations all the time at work where it’s hard to ignore the fact that the woman is responsible for her situation. She (for example) knew he was living on the streets and sleeping on the trains when she got pregnant for him. Why did she open up her legs to him? Did she think he would be able to really help support their child? WTF was she thinking?
A part of the problem lies with one’s upbringing too. A lot of our women are not raised to understand their worth – and that is a lesson that can come from both mothers and fathers. Coming from a single-parent household doesn’t excuse the single parents from raising responsible children. Our single mothers had the responsibility to raise daughters to make responsible choices for their mates but so many just did not. This may be due to the fact that the mother doesn’t know her own worth, and thus wasn’t able to raise a woman up to know her own and what knowing one’s worth means when making life choices. And the cycle continues.
So we have problems that have causes – and it’s important to understand how a problem arises to find solutions. But what about the solutions? My experience at my job inspires me to do mentorship /outreach programs with young women. I’m thinking that even tho it might not solve the overall societal problem, that the effort I could put out there will help at least a few.
This is my job. ERRY. Single. Day.
My favorite story: 16 year old is applying for services. I’m discussing educational options for her, when her 32 year old mama says: “Black people don’t go to college!! That’s for white folks!” My heart broke. THIS is what I am working for? REALLY? Even here, in the DMV, neither had heard of Howard, UDC, Bowie State, UMES, Morgan, etc. My heart BLED. So, I let mom know she was speaking to a single parent (the daddy and I were college sweethearts, too young to get married, he passed May ’08), college degree holding Black person. Mom was astonished. Girl was too. WHY they were astonished bothered the heck out of me. When I asked where the daddy was, the mom went off. Girlie told me later, she hooked up with him at a party and that she found out afterwards that he had four other kids. *sigh*
I agree 100%.
This is more of the typical story that people don’t want to admit. It’s not the ‘corporate’ brothers that are driving the stats of single mothers, it is the OBVIOUS good-for-nothing guys, yet, people are trying to cherry pick exceptions when statistics, research, and everyday people like yourself who WORK in the field are telling them otherwise.
Encourage, Educate, and Empower this women. A strong woman leads to a strong nation. Unfortunately, alot of women would rather beat on men rather than help sisters…
Bond. BlkBond.
A strong woman leads to a strong nation. Unfortunately, alot of women would rather beat on men rather than help sisters…
And that’s a sad state of affairs. I am a feminist who often gets her feminist card revoked because I state the previous sentence. Sure, we should raise the men/boys/etc… to live up to the standards but and more importantly we should provide the little girls with the tools to avoid those situations until we get to the point where we don’t have to… Kinda like teaching your girls not to hit a man while super duper emphasizing to your boys that they should never, ever put their hands on a girl…
All of those are issues that need addressing… but I suggest we focus on the priority: how to make young girls avoid the traps that can emotionally damage them forever.
Great post Panama!
I must say, I never thought about it fro the angle of “let’s give women some blame ” for these fatherless children.
I think everyone has some fault, but since it is the women who step up to the plate, while the men run away and continue their lives, we have to blame the men for being absent. The women STILL get the job done.
At the same time we all make mistakes. Do we scold the women who “mess up” and have one kid out of wedlock or do we sit these women down with 4 kids and 4 different baby daddy’s?
Men don’t get a pass because they decided to not take care of their responsibilities. There are plenty of things (working a 9-5, paying bills, fighting monkeys) we don’t wan to do, but we still do them in order to survive.
Men try to play with and get over on women all the time. Women think with their emotions more than their head especially when they are young. This is the time when they are more likely to make irrational decisions. I still blame the men!
It takes 2. Yes plenty of us have had poor judgement and were experiencing clouds of delusion. But on both sides there are anomalies. Just because he smells like a sperm donor doesn’t mean he is. Just because you smell cleavage doesn’t mean she has her legs in a v shape on the daily.
Tiffany
Peace, Love and Chocolate
It’s because of how it looks. 9/10 (made up ratio) she takes care of and raises the baby, and he’s not there (I’m talking specifically about when the parents are not together).
There’s two parts to this:
1. The act of dating/sectsing each other ———>>>>> pregnancy
2. The raising of the child
Women *in these situations* tend to shoulder almost all of #2, and that earns them all the sympathy in the world. That sympathy gets retroactively extended to their role in #1, as well, even though it shouldn’t. So even though they tend to be equally to blame for #1, they get let off the hook because of all their hard work in #2.
I agree that women should be part to blame and need to be more selective about who they have babies with, especially if it’s a pattern. But black men do need to step it up too. I know a good number of men who were in caring relationships, had their career together, and still split the second the woman got pregnant. It’s not just black men though and I think the focus on them is unfair, but men do need to step it up and take responsibility for their offspring because at the end, the blame game doesn’t matter and it’s the kids that suffer.
My grandmother and my mother were pregnant by 16yrs old. That was a statistic I refused to be a part of. I’m 27. I made a conscious decision to not follow that pattern. Even though both my grandfather and my father were around. Mothers should be held accountable first. Mothers carry the child, mothers carry the choice.
Mothers carry the child, mothers carry the choice.
I was raised with an almost identical version of this statement… Not that I think it’s totally right to make women the only responsible party (which my upbringing kinda did), but it is indeed a good preventive step…
I think the blame should be put on the shoulders of both men and women. But at the same time, Women have way more birth control options then men do. Men can only do so much to stop conception. The receiver must handle her end as well! I definitely agree with the post!!
In all honesty, this mess started the moment the Welfare Act was created in the sixties, which gave money to women who had MULTIPLE children without a father in the house. Thus, creating the whole deadbeat daddy nonsense and being “cool” with it thanks to Lyndon Johnson. When women were handed the mentality that you could sleep with every Tom, Dick & Antoine and get some HUD assistance for it, the notion of having consistency in actual families died.
The blame can be passed from each gender but it’s more about what was passed down by the generations to create that blame.
Tyler Perry can paint the message of “black men, step up to the plate” because he knows women will eat into that mess without any real consequence. Point is, the greatest birth control ever conceived was not a condom, but common sense.
A control that is sorely lacking between both parties.
Women are not the victims in all situations, especially this one. Both parties should be held accountable. I’ve always said and believe that every man/woman you sleep with can either be the mother/father of your child or the death of you. If you can’t see them being around for the long haul, then don’t even lay down.
Wow Panama, my girlfriends and I have been having this conversation for at least 10 years. You see we are all in our mid 30′s and my girlfriends that have children out-of-wedlock- I’m not surprised about -and the ones that don’t – I’m not surprised about either.
Before any of us had children, we would have conversations about our VALUES. Some women value having and raising children in an intact nuclear family and some valued having a baby when they wanted, regardless of whether they were married.
I was raised by a single mother that had me out-of-wedlock so I saw first hand the perils and issues that come from not having my biological father in the home. Luckily I was raised in N. California, which was a lot more liberal, but trying to explain to kids why my brother, my mother and me all had different last names was harrowing at 11 years old.
I will not do that to my child. If I have to freeze my eggs, get weekly fertility shots, or chant around an African fertility statue – I will wait until I’m married to have a child. I refuse to be another baby-momma.
No, you’re right. 100% right! Tell it P! Women should be held just as much as, if not more accountable b/c they are the ones who make the choice to have the children knowing good and damn well they aren’t stable themselves. Not a pot to piss in…but pregnant.
There are far too many forms of birth control on the market today for black women to be popping out kids like they do, all will nilly.
I really think black women especially need to take a good hard look at how WE are effing up the community with the epidemic of single-motherhood.
If you are not married (In some cases even if you are), more likely than not the person you’re @#%ing is not necessarily the person you want to have kids with and I personally don’t believe there’s nothing wrong with that. Most people I know have had sex with people that they wouldn’t even speak to in public let alone have a children by. If I was waiting for the women I thought I wanted to have my kids to have sex, I would probably still be a virgin and when I did finally meet that women she probably wouldn’t want to have sex with my inexperienced @$$. However, if you get pregnant or get someone pregnant either way it’s your fault entirely. The responsibility for the child that comes from that pregnancy falls on both parties completely and individually. The two may work together to fulfill their obligations to that child but if one decides to renege on his\her duties, the others responsibility has not increased nor decreased. You are still completely responsible for that child. Since there are certain precautions that both parties can make to avoid the situation. What ever happens afterward is a direct result of your own indiscretions, so suffer with the mission. Now if all proper precautions are taken and a pregnancy still occurs, consider it a gift from God and treat it as such.
The on problem with my previous statement is that it’s a lot easier for a man to escape the situation then it is for a woman. So it would be logical for a women to be even more cautious about the situations she puts herself in, unfortunately the world is not always a logical place. SMH
Props for the Dastardly avi.
Bon chapeau!
The most unfortunate fact in this discussion is that those who most need to hear and heed this message are not participating in the conversation, have no idea that the conversation is taking place and if they knew, would come in and start a street blog fight because folk get mad when their toes get stepped on and they have to cover their embarassment with anger.
(And yes. I just wrote the longest sentence in VSB history.)
Lack of self-inspection, reflection and awareness is killing our community.
THIS!
*nods head.
The most unfortunate fact in this discussion is that those who most need to hear and heed this message are not participating in the conversation .
I agree!!!
Right now, they’re preaching to the choir.
Nothing but truth.
I offer: _______________________X
Sincerely,
The Black Bond.
I didn’t read through ALL the comments..but it stands to reason I’m going to repeat some things people have already said.
1) Condoms break- I would just leave it at that, but a condom breaking can be the cause of a baby. Maybe someone was doing the grown up with someone they KNEW they ain’t have no business doing it with and the condom broke. You can def find your self in an “aww SH*T” situation when you don’t find that out until someone pulls out.
2) Birth control fails- SOME people take their birth control religiously…whether it’s oral or patch or shot or ring or whatever. Now, for those people who miss a pill (or two, or three) and DON’T follow the directions on the package that say use another form of birth control…
No side eye on that one though, unless you DON’T use another form of birth control. If you do, please refer to point 1.
3) Maybe some little girl didn’t have someone to teach her that no man is going to love her because they did the grown up. Yeah, he might LIKE her, he might keep her around, but that doesn’t mean she is going to keep him. Somebody’s momma is running around RIGHT NOW talking about how she got “the snapper”. Hell, maybe their father is saying it, too. The point here is that women get conflicting messages (IF they get messages at all) about the power of the P. Sure, it’s a new kind of crazy that has you doing the same old thing expecting new results, but it can be hard to step out and try to do a new thing.
As for these pregnant women, they have a tough row to hoe, too. So maybe they don’t have a pot to piss in, maybe that means they don’t have money for an abortion. Maybe they don’t consider it or adoption an option (and both have their flaws). I’m not saying they don’t get some blame, but it’s certainly bigger than man -vs- woman. It’s as much of a social ill as it is in anything else.
some say don’t sex folk you cannot see yourself having a child with *shrug* thats TOO much like right, I know LOL
Some people don’t see that far into the future. And let’s not forget some people think that babies are a trap, too.
#1. IUD’s
#2. Don’t have sex
#3. Yay on adoption ( I was adopted : )
Snowflake, just curious, are you a woman?
Those joints can go in and as a result no baby will EVER come out, not to mention you body can attack it. There are side affects to ALL of those things, and I’m not sure all insurance’s cover IUD. Those joints are expensive.
1) The condom was Plan A….but do people forget that there IS a plan B that comes in the form of two pills?
I think they might..or they might feel ashamed about having to go get it, or they might live by a whole bunch of Catholic hospitals that don’t sell them?
I think you’re wrong for this post. Nobody ever questions how a baby was brought in this world (i.e. no one says yall are having too much sex) when making this argument. What they’re saying is, whomever is having babies is not taking care of these babies. And because we women are the ones who actually have to bear these babies, we’re probbaly less likely to dip out because we’re physically attached to the process of baby producing. Whereas ya’ll can just dip out and according to these stats, yall do. So, yeah, nice try P, but I’m not buying it.
Hey Liz! I agree with you that us women do have an emotional attachment with the child and men can just walk out all willy nilly. Please believe I’m not letting those loosers get off that easy.
HOWEVER………
Let’s not forget it takes two to tango and if that woman have any assumption (and you know we do, its the “Girl I can change him” or “He won’t do ME like his other baby mamas” syndrome) that he could possibly be a miss-out/skip-out Dad….then shame on her for going ahead and get pregnant by him. And also, BOTH women and men have the control to deteriorate the possibility of getting pregnant. Hell grown folks do what grown folks wanna do!
So can you and Panama shack hands (while giving each other the side eye) on this one????? LOL. But I feel ya girl!!
- AD
Please believe some women will walk out on their kids in a heartbeat.
*adjusts social services hat*
I agree Capricorn…..and you can include the mothers that are physically there but don’t actively particpate in thier child’s education or extra-curricule activities. They fail to see by not participating in your child’s life is almost the same as not physically being there.
AD
I’m sorry Liz but I think you’re missing the point. You are right, no one will question how a child is brought into this world. However, how responsible was the actions that brought about the child? …….The argument isn’t so much about women being able to dip out- as you point out- it’s about women being held responsible for their actions. Granted a piss poor father will be a piss poor father but what about the choice mothers make in selecting these men as fathers- over and over and over again. Once is a lesson learned…but repeatedly??? Come on. No pun. And yes, sleeping with a man without a condom is self selection in choosing him as the father. Period.
We are all tired of hearing the great debate over sucker MC black fathers but I think it’s time we shed some light on these women who act recklessly as well.
*how responsible were..
grammar check eek! Lol.
I thinkt his whole argument assumes women are making choices to have a child with some loser. I don’t think most women would knowingly do that. Yet…here Panama is asking us why we keep choosing to have kids with losers? As if this is our wrong decision process.
Aside from that, Ps point annoys me because he’s asking why women make the bad pre-sex decisions as opposed to everyone making this post-pregnancy conclusion about Black men. It’s apples and oranges. You can’t compare my pre-sex decision to some loser’s post-pregnancy decision. Furthermore, the proper question to ask in this analysis is why are men making bad decisions to have sex if they can’t ensure they’ll be able to take care of their kids? But that’s too controversial for most people to really ask themselves.
While I agree that women need to be more accountable for their choices, I wouldn’t necessarily say that they’ve always been painted as victims. The accountability bug in the black community seems to be cyclical. From 2007 to around June of of this year, the professional black woman was the root of all evil. Three years before that it was the gay black man. Fifteen years before that it was welfare queens. Two months ago the black church was to blame. One month ago it was black men and white women (again). Right now it seems to be black men who are educated enough to “know better” but still don’t. Next year it’ll probably be black midgets.
The cycle doesn’t surprise me though. Seemingly everything we do, from our music to our relationships, is antagonistic. There’s nothing we love more than writing/talking/singing/speaking/tweeting about how f*cked up we are.
Anyway, back to the topic. I think women are seen (by some) as perpetual victims because, to be honest, women are victimized by men more often than men are victimized by women. Part of this is biological (men are usually bigger and stronger than women, and it’s easier to victimize someone bigger and stronger than you. also, sex is more invasive and dangerous for women than it is for men) and part of it is sociological (women are conditioned to be “damsels in distress” waiting for a man to save them, etc) but the fact remains that our ability to “stick and move” as well as the fact that we don’t have biological clock pressure (the fact that women have a extremely small reproductive window does influence some of their sexual decisions. and, we definitely take advantage of that. to make a basketball analogy, they have 5 second shot clocks. we don’t have a shot clock) allows us to do things to them that they can’t do to us.
And, I don’t know about the rest of you guys, but I’ll take all the blame in the world over passing a 9 pound baby through my dick.
LLS and I do agree with alot of your points Champ
“And, I don’t know about the rest of you guys, but I’ll take all the blame in the world over passing a 9 pound baby through my dick.”
Damn I guess you really can’t argue with that.
I knew I had a fondness for you for a reason. Kudos with this response!!!
There’s nothing we love more than writing/talking/singing/speaking/tweeting about how f*cked up we are. .
A-phucking-MEN!
@The Champ
I co-sign this and am happy to see that you’ve captured the essence of the truth about men and women. It is very easy to say what should be rather than examining what is.
the fb/bbm thumbs up emoticon is NOT enough.
i need more!
co-signing with permanent marker will have to do.
that is all.
Good post!
i mean really, we can’t win.
if we complain that we cant find a husband and the story gets out,then we’re mad that the media is demonizing us or pathologizing us.
if we decide then to have kids with no husband,we catch hell
1. no man or woman should have sex with another person if they are not willing to have that person as the coparent of their child.
2.there are no guarantees. and the problem with testing a man to see if he will be a good father and stay is that it may be really easy to weed out the negatives,but its almost impossible to weed out the false positives. the fact is, no matter how good anyone seems you don’t know if they will crack under pressure until they are under pressure. there is always going to be some element of risk.
yes,we can often weed out the bad ones easily. but to presume that all women who got left or abandoned are in that situation because they ignored the signs,is foolish. its classic victim blaming- we like to believe the victim did something wrong and preventable that caused this to happen to her, because believing this helps us to believe that if we do everything right it could never happen to us. but smart,educated intelligent women make good choices and still find themselves beaten,raped,abused,abandoned etc.. it happens.
3.if a woman is stupid to sleep with a man who is pretty obviously not father material cool. she should know better. but its a shame when things are so bad that our response to unplanned pregnancies is like that of parents in a dangerous area- if you got shot its your fault because you know its dangerous out there. we’ve completely accepted that men aint shit and cant be expected to do shit and rather than hold them to any standards of behavior,we just chastise those who consort with them because any fool should know better.
4. some women are foolish.some women are just women,living in areas where nogood men are the norm. and yes,having 5 or 6 babies is dumb. but often women are with men, it doesnt work. they try again and think they made a better choice, and then that doesnt work. birth control is not foolproof, and many women can’t afford it. the fact is,sex is one of the strongest urges out there. and the need for love is strong. the desire for companionship and family is strong. a woman surroundd by nothing but ignant mookies is going to have to either live her entire life sexless and alone, or take her chances. and it is very very unfair for women to have the burden of remaining chaste and alone until some decent man comes up and decides to marry her. men aren’t expected to make that choice-well close your damn legs if you dont want kids.
aint nobody talkin bad about mookie because he knocked up shenene and she already has 3 kids. he shoulda known better too.
Haven’t read any of the comments, but the thing is this,
people, both men and women need to own their part in things.
BE ACCOUNTABLE for the decisions YOU have made and be prepared for consequences of such decisions, good or bad.
Own all that sh*t, live, learn, and do better!!!!
MESSAGE!!
People should take responsibility for their choices: The Smart, The Dumb and The Unbelievably Stupid. Review. Relate. Release!
While I agree with many of the points in this post, I have to say this… a good father is the first man a daughter will ever love and the one man who will show her exactly what she should look for in a mate. simply put… as women, we look for a man like our father. when black men abandon their children (in this case, their daughters), they completely break what could be a cycle of learning and leave a void. most of these chicks out here with 5 baby daddies and a gang of kids are searching to fill that void. does this mean they’re not to be held accountable? absolutely not. there comes a point when you gotta buck up, put on your big girl draws and act like you have some damn sense. especially in this day of HIV/AIDS and all other “gifts” that keep on giving.
while I have little sympathy for those women out here who will lay down with a man, knowing he ain’t about NOTHIN’, get knocked up and continue the cycle of madness and irresponsibility, i still have to say, if men in our society want to lead and be looked at as leaders… start by leading your damn families and stop having a bunch of children out here. it’s pathetic on both sides.
AMEN! If your boy would be “the most hated black man in America” I would have Al, Jesse, and who knows maybe Soledad doing a story on my feelings. . . I speak the words that you mentioned above daily.
#1. Where is the MIC? We tell young men “raise your children, give them a good home, get a job, bla bla bla” and yet we collect child support from these guys, don’t give them a place to stay . . in fact we ban them from the projects and we give their child’s mothers food stamps etc.
#2 CLOSE YOUR LEGS, sew up the Va jay’s. . .when I had to spend 7 hrs on H street in NE, DC applying for food stamps (praise the Lord I am OFF) it wasn’t so much the 7 hrs that bothered me it was the comments that I heard.. . . “Girl, they owe me this— he owes me that– the next one I have— I am getting my hair done” Oh Lord have mercy. If Fox news had been in there. . . .
#3 Grandma’s . . . why in the H#LL are grandma’s so excited about their soon-to-be grandchild?? Your child is 15! And why are you talking so much trash about their father? Do you think that will help the situation?
Woooo weeee….. Maybe it is because I have around 100 plus guys that I know that want to be good future fathers, fathers, etc and everyone/everything around them is telling them that they are failing or will fail and I get angry every time I think about it and speak with these guys!! Grrhhhhh.
First off I think it should be criminal/illegal to neglect or abandon your child. PERIOD. Whether you are male or female. I know too many black women who leave their children with their mother (grandma) to raise and black males who bounce at the sight of the positive pregnancy test. A law should be passed that child abandonment is illegal with stiff penalties.
Second, I don’t know what goes on in Philly but black women get blamed for everything! I think there isn’t enough blame put on the man. It’s always followed up with “a man is going to be a man” foolishness. Not to mention that all the burden lies on the mother who often times has to financially support the child ALONE.
I wasn’t going to comment because I felt myself about to say something evil and mean but I am so sick and tired of bad parents. Statistically speaking, black women make the worst mothers in America. Yeah look that ish up. Even hispanic mothers with equal poverty lines are better mothers to their children. Black men are the worst fathers in America. Yeah look that ish up. Even hispanic men with equal poverty lines are better fathers to their children. Point is, I’m sick of it. I think there should be mandatory parenting classes that all pregnant women should take. And if you fall below the poverty line, or under the age of 21, you should be assigned a life coach paid for by the state.
Okay I’m done. Side bar: I got pregnant at 24 by a Black man who didn’t marry me. He’s involved in my daughters life but we ultimately split so I am a single black mother. And ANYONE who wants to talk ish about me keeping my legs closed, or knowing better will get a big FCUK YOU and punch in the throat. Don’t ever be so ignorant to think that a man can treat you right but then change faster than the matrix when you have a baby coming. Not all situations are black and white. And just because you had 4 abortions and I had NONE doesn’t make you better.
It makes you a killer.Typo:
“Don’t ever be so ignorant to think that it’s not possible for a man to treat you right but then change faster than the matrix when you have a baby coming.”
Correction:
It’s not that I dislike persons who have had abortions. Plenty of my friends and even fam has. But I say this: if you have kilt your baby(s), I don’t want to hear ish about you bragging on being “kid free” or talking cr@p about women who do have children.
RAT-TAT-TAT-TAT!!!!!!!!
*in scarface voice: ok..im reloaded!!!
I can’t possibly know what it’s like to be a mom, and a single one at that (i only know the recieving end). i’m sure you get lumped with the women who dont know the person they are dealing with all the time.
That being said, I dont know about the we’re the worse parents. If you are using stats, than its likely that we’re doing more with less. If we get paid less than our counterparts.. it stands to reason.
But since there are many (incl your e-boo CBG) who were raised by single mother and turned out (potentially until confirmed and verified by twitter or the vsb bbq) ok..you can’t paint all black parents with the same ghetto, using govt money for your personal styling and not diapers brush. I heart-chu..but not that generalization.
And as well know.. men DO play games just to get the ill-na-na and dip faster than Christina Milian when things get tough…
http://www.verysmartbrothas.com/5-common-things-men-say-when-were-just-running-game/
…so until we know every womens story – we cannot judge her and make her a villan OR a victim.
did i mention that i still heart-chu??
LMAO!! You know I come in guns blazing…I need to stop that. smh You always acknowledge the plight of the good single mom. *ehug*
When did I say this?? “ok..you can’t paint all black parents with the same ghetto, using govt money for your personal styling and not diapers brush. I heart-chu..but not that generalization.”
Not all. I knows tons of good mothers. I was referring to hard core statistics for many but def not the majority nor all. As a mother that would make me crazy to make such a comment. Unfortunately, black people are the leaders in child abuse/neglect…and considering we are 12% of the population is very sad. Should we blame that on slavery? Talk to any woman over 60 and she’ll tell you women were mothers back then…the only diff is most didn’t work but other than that…they had many kids on half the dollar and opportunities we have. Women took pride in raising children and family. I honestly don’t know what happened. I read someone say that we are “victims” and do what was done to us. This may be true for some…but not for most. You mean to tell me a text book and a good childhood have to tell you that you shouldn’t punch your son in the back of the head and tell him he’s stupid? or that you need to take better care of your children? I think we blame too much on slavery. I also get irked when I hear women justify the mistreatment of their kids…I say “you can sit here and tell me why you do what you do so that means you are aware”…so stop it! We’re not all “victims”, especially if you are aware of your abuse.
I also laugh at the women on here who act like they’ve never been deceived or mistreated by a man. That’s ridiculous to say that women should know the type of man to not father a child before she sleeps with him. That’s like me saying women should know which men lie and cheat before she sleeps with him.
my post was in reply to your statements:
Statistically speaking, black women make the worst mothers in America. Yeah look that ish up. Even hispanic mothers with equal poverty lines are better mothers to their children. Black men are the worst fathers in America
but i hear what you are saying.
Let’s address that statement that “black people are the leaders in child abuse/neglect cases.” Simply put, it comes down to cultural differences. While I’m not saying that black folks can’t be abusive to their kids, many of them are not. And, many times what is perceived as abuse by folks with a different upbringing (i.e. White) actually isn’t. That leads to many cases being opened on black families…thus stats that say we’re more likely to abuse. Just because there’s a stat for it does not make it true…
Honestly, abuse cuts across social, economic and racial lines. HOWEVER, those in poverty are more likely to abuse their kids because of high frustrations and lack of resources and outlets.
*fist bump*
“Second, I don’t know what goes on in Philly but black women get blamed for everything!”
What does Philly have to do with anything?
I thought one of ya’ll was from Philly. My mistake.
About this right here…
“Side bar: I got pregnant at 24 by a Black man who didn’t marry me. He’s involved in my daughters life but we ultimately split so I am a single black mother.”
Dude being involved in his daughter’s life is obviously not the same type of man that the discussion revolves around. Not being in a relationship with you isn’t abandonment, not having a relationship with his daughter is.
Outside of extraordinary circumstances dudes completely jumping ship on woman and child happens way too often for there not to be a pattern in the choices both sides are making. We may need relationship classes almost as much as we need parenting classes.
I see your point. I agree.
Statistically speaking, black women make the worst mothers in America. Yeah look that ish up. Even hispanic mothers with equal poverty lines are better mothers to their children. Black men are the worst fathers in America. Yeah look that ish up. Even hispanic men with equal poverty lines are better fathers to their children. .
Where can I find these statistics?!?! Reason# 53987 why I hate statistics.
And just because you had 4 abortions and I had NONE doesn’t make you better. It makes you a killer. .
Wowser. So does not have an abortion make you better? I’d rather give women the option to have an abortion than to bring a child into the world that they can’t properly care for (or maybe not even want) any day.
Trust I hate statistics too but reality is reality.
And no way am I against a woman’s choice! I’m against the women who have abortions then trash talk the women struggling to raise their children. “I’m not going to be a good mom so I should just kill my baby” is not an excuse. Give your baby up for adoption. It’s one thing if you are really young or have been raped…then it’s another thing to just be selfish. Let’s call a spade a spade, abortion is killing your fetus. Period. I don’t think I’m better because I chose to have my child. I think I was brave. I knew the odds were stacked against me so I got my life together and put my ALL into motherhood…some of us aren’t that brave. Abortion isn’t my issue VRenee. Do what you (not you) want with your body but don’t talk ish about women who took another path. I had to give a friend the side eye the other day she was bad mouthing single moms and talking about knowing better etc…she forgot I was the one who drove her to the clinic. She saw my face and quickly shut up. lol
It makes you a killer.
As a proud pro-choice black woman, I often wonder why this is such a taboo? Why can’t a woman decide to do what she wants with her body? Whether it’s having a kid or not? So we shouldn’t judge the woman who has had a kid in non-ideal circumstances but she has the right to judge the woman who made the non-ideal decision not to have the kid?
I don’t know. It seems a bit hypocritical to me.
Judging a woman who has a child that she may or may not be raising well is not the same as judging a woman who killed her child. Now with that being said, I don’t judge women who have abortions…just the ones who talk trash about women with kids. I have my opinions on abortion but I know some women really need it so it is what it is…but make no mistake about it: you are killing your fetus…not your body. There is nothing hypocritical about that.
Judging a woman who has a child that she may or may not be raising well is not the same as judging a woman who killed her child.
Humor me and tell me why is that? I am all ears.
I agree and disagree. I think that men get blamed because as I’m sure no one intended to get pregnant in the situation but once it happens it’s the man that bails. Both sides can make the decision to not sleep with everyone under the sun because if you look at it mathematically they got pregnant that 1 out of __ times they had slept with someone so that part was left to chance. If you really want the eliminate the possibility of having a terrible ass baby father or you know you don’t want to be a father don’t have sex….but who’s going to do that???
I think that black women are the victim in some situations just like we’re the villains. If I see ONE more special, or Tyler Perry movie, that is focused on why black women have run black men off, how are standards are too high, and how we’re unmarried and ruining the “black union” I’m going to lose it.
I personally think as long as there is a problem black men and women (brown people in general) will always be the villains.
i think that women should be held responsible for who they allow to impregnate them. when a man says this he’s labeled a misogynist. i can bet most times that a trifling dude portrayed some type of behavior that he was trifling before you decided to sleep with him. if you chose to ignore these signs then you are at least partially to blame that your child is fatherless. yes he shoulders most of the blame but you are not absolved.
Great minds think alike..but I’m not afraid to say it. But you might like my reasons why things are all jacked up now. Hoe you enjoy my explanation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Evrb068tkP8
FINALLY. A man with the guts to say what I’ve been saying for YEARS, only for the men to look like “oh-oh” and the women to spit venom. I just had this debate again last week. Women are responsible for who they have a child with, period. No other way to put it. Like I always tell people, you don’t sit in the wet spot on the Metro and end up pregnant. Sperm doesn’t fly through the air randomly hit women, it does’t work like the cold virus. These women are making poor choices, sleeping with men they couldn’t find 2 weeks prior. When he does decide to come back around, they let him hit raw, then they all kinds of pissed when they get knocked up. Not because they got knocked up, they cool with that, but because he doesn’t want to be bothered. Well, surprise, surprise. I am so sick of hearing women complain about no good men and how they don’t need a man but they continue to do foolish things and make foolish decisions just to be with these no good men. And those that say, they thought he was going to do right because he said this and he said that, he has a good job, come from a good family, went to a good school, etc.,are you serious? Guess what ladies? They lie too. They often lie faster than the most because they know women are desperate, they have the goods and there aren’t a lot of them, so ball is in their court. These men aren’t stupid. They know they can get away with it. Folks say a lot of stuff, always has and always will but women need to start judging men not by what they say but by what they do.
I firmly believe that there are good men out there and plenty of them. Some men that are no good now, may be decent later but until that times come, ladies use your common sense, guard your heart. People treat you the way you allow them to treat you and if you set the standards and stick to them. I have found that men respond to that. If a man is really interested in a woman, they will step up to the plate. If not, they will fall back.
This is a good article to get people to think about both sides, because in any situation, there is always two sides to the story.
I do think that beyond the responsibility of both men and women have in a child they create, there is more to it than even putting the blame on either of them. There is a serious problem with our educational systems not putting more attention on students needs outside of the generic curriculum by giving more counseling, and even providing a wider variety of after school activities (beyond sports) to open opportunities for children to be more engaged, aware and include them for success instead of them wondering into trouble.
And parents… where are the parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins??? Too many people say “I don’t want to get involved in their business” or “its not my problem” or tell themselves they just don’t have time because they are just plain caught up in their own drama or escapes from reality (Too much TV, drinking, socializing, video games, internet, shopping… whatever).
Beyond that… it is ALL of our responsibility for even the community to get involved. This is why it is important to volunteer, its important to speak up when you see an opportunity to really help someone or give advice. Sometimes changes don’t happen right away and in this fast moving society its so easy for people to just shake their head and keep on hustling to get their next coolest piece of technology or to see what their FB friends are up to, or to find a fly outfit to flaunt at the club tonight… or maybe they are just working their butt off to stay afloat in this economy! But whatever it is holding people up from taking more action… there is more time that people will admit that would allow them to make a difference. It’s just a choice each person makes for themselves to do what’s “fun or easy”… or just do what it takes to help others.
When you do something positive… you CAN change the life of others and even yourself. If everyone made the choice to get more involved instead of just writing or reading articles that point fingers, then change would come and our futures will be greater because of it.
It’s always helpful to raise awareness… but is anyone really going to do something with this information? I hope so
Live… Learn… Love <3
*Playing Devil’s Advocate*
I’m sorry, but I can’t help thinking that there was discussion here about a woman having an arbitrary day or number of days to know a guy before she got chexually involved with him. Folks thought the Steve Harvey 90 day rule was silly and that whatever strict rule based on ‘x’ number of days and not the actual situation or relationship at hand was silly. Folks came out the woodwork speaking on a woman’s chexual freedom, personal choice, and that if a guy was feeling you before, he’s gonna feel you after. If he wasn’t feeling you before, he wouldn’t after. My position in all that was (and still is) do what works for you. If you know your treasure chest is attached to your heart, take whatever time you need to protect yourself. If you can do the grown-up with no strings and keep your name outta people’s mouth and handle yours safely and in an adult fashion, then do that. That said, it sounds really odd for many comments around this issue to be: know a guy better, just don’t jump in the bed and open your legs for anyone, choose your partners better. Now I know this issue is different than the other one discussed, but they are related. On one hand go on and be sexually free, but when kids come into the picture, you should know the person better. OK. Fine. This is very true. This is correct. But why the coming down on those VSS’s who made whatever rule of whatever number of days for themselves that helped THEM know a person better?
Now as we discuss this issue, attached to the blog is this picture of Plies and people have this specific idea of a woman picking that dude or worse to have chex with. A dude (or woman) can be a wolf in sheep’s clothing and showcase traits of a good guy, say the right things, YOU BOTH USE PROTECTION, and a pregnancy can occur. Even the college educated dude freaks out, is afraid, isn’t ready and becomes the wack dude that leaves. Let’s not also forget that Plies is college educated.
So, while I agree with a lot of the points about SHARING the responsibility, and both parents being accountable, and women (whether properly equipped in some cases) having no choice but to be accountable, I can’t lump another level of “blame” on the woman. The survival of the black family In many ways, not saying that we are thriving, because there is definitely room for improvement, is because of those black men and women who have stepped up. The survival rests on Big Momma, Big Daddy, Uncle Bobby, Aunt Susan, and older cousins, play cousins, 2nd cousins and more who have stepped up to bridge the gap and be there when mothers and fathers have left. I think I agree with the comments that to remedy this situation we have to stop placing blame and start looking at what can be done to effect change or help remedy the situation.
I think we also have to recognize that you can’t expect a woman to know the traits of a “good” man if she never had one in her life. If she never had one around growing up or saw one interacting in a loving manner with her mother. Also, If a man never saw a good man around. If a man has trouble defining what being a man is. Also, if the traits of a good man are not exalted, encouraged or respected. Even here, although it is in gest, a decent, sensitive act is referred to as “pandering”.
So yes, I am mortified and saddened at the woman on Maury claiming that she is 150% sure he is the father and she been on the show 3 times before and once again dude IS NOT the father. Yet, because she exists and because Gutta Black exists, we do not have to paint our people with such a broad stroke and place blame when blame doesn’t remedy a situation. Trust, it’s enough blame to be shared. Now, what can we do in our small corner to strengthen our families?
YOU BOTH USE PROTECTION, and a pregnancy can occur. .
What are the odds of this? Both using protection and pregnancy occuring?!?!?! Since making up statistics is the new rave (shout out to Lyfe Jennings), Ima say the percentage is .0001%.
^Not true. I’m not making up anything. The pill can be off and the condom can break. None of these things are 100%. None of them. So why is what I am saying so unlikely?
It can happen it is probably safe to say it doesn’t happen often so even if there is a woman who was on the pill, had an IUD and used a condom and still got pregnant wouldn’t change the fact that most women who have unwanted pregnancies are not using birth control at the time they got pregnant.
Are we forgetting that most people do not take all the measures to protect themselves PERIOD. Forget about kids…that’s just a living result of not protecting yourself. What about the deadly result like HIV, AIDS, STDS etc?
Agrees. The only 100% method is to not do the horizontal tango. NOTHING to worry about. Everything else carries a risk of pregnancy, STD/STI and/or HIV.
While I’m not arguing that birth control can’t fail, I’m convinced that 99% of the time pregnancy occurs because at least one party wasn’t using it correctly. And by not using it correctly, I mean not using condoms. I want to see the rates on how often pregnancy occurs with BOTH parties using birth control. Statistics can be misleading and misused.
Birth Control Failure rates:
http://www.contracept.org/risks.php
The male condome is 15%, the female condom is 21%. The Oral Contraceptive is 8% ASSUMING, one has not missed a day, forgot to take the pill etc. etc. So my point is not unlikely at all.
Also, was the only issue with my post to question the unlikelihood of pregnancy happening with two forms of contraception? It was just one example in many reasons why pregnancy happens and that there are no guarantees. My point was you can prepare for all sorts of things and be surprised by a person’s behavior and reaction. Sure, in many situations folks are referencing there was no preparation or consideration at all, but I was referencing other factors.
No. I just didn’t want to touch the first paragraph. Lol!
Also, let the record show I was and always will be an advocate of women having secks on whatever time table works for them, and not just to abide by some silly rule they don’t necessarily agree with.But also note that I am not one of the ones screaming that women need to be careful about who they are getting preggos by and to stop spreading their legs.
If you put your big girl panties on (or take them off *snickering*), be willing to stick by your decision and any potential outcomes and not scream woe is me. *shrug*
As for the rest of the comment I agree. But this is all stuff that’s said over and over again. WE know what the problem is (a vicious cycle of not knowing one’s self worth), so what’s the next step. I dunno…….
If you put your big girl panties on (or take them off *snickering*), be willing to stick by your decision and any potential outcomes and not scream woe is me. *shrug* .
Also please note that with the above, I’m referring to semi-grown/wanna be grown folks. Not teenagers aka babies. Babies having babies is a whole ‘nother topic in my opinion.
If you put your big girl panties on (or take them off *snickering*), be willing to stick by your decision and any potential outcomes and not scream woe is me. *shrug* .
Please note that I’m referring to semi-grown/wanna be grown folks here. I consider teenagers as babies. And babies having babies is a whole ‘nother topic in my opinion.
Hey V,
“But also note that I am not one of the ones screaming that women need to be careful about who they are getting preggos by and to stop spreading their legs.”
^I hear ya
Like I said, I was playing Devils Advocate. I was referencing the popular sentiment shift. It does shift back in forth with some folks depending on the issue. My stance, as yours, has been the same as well. The sentiment shift is very interesting and should be noted though.
Just opening your legs isn’t the same as letting dudes run up in it raw while you aren’t on birth control.
@ Omar, That goes without saying. At no point did I say that.
@Omar,
My apologies if you weren’t even responding to me and was responding to V Renee. My apologies also if my response reads “snarky”. That was definitely not my intent.
@legitimate_soul
“I think we also have to recognize that you can’t expect a woman to know the traits of a “good” man if she never had one in her life.”
*nodding in agreement*
I literally had to sit back in my chair and give you a round of applause. (a mental one because I’m at work) Your comment is effin on point! You know I thought back to the post where all these loosey goosey vss exposed themselves talkin about sleeping with a man with no strings and they don’t care about getting to know the man, it’s just sex yada yada yada and no 90 days is going to prove he’s not a dog. Now these same women are talking about getting to know the man and think about “life long” partnership incase you get pregnant. I’m sorry but did I miss something? I know 2 people who got pregnant on the bill, 8 people who got pregnant because the condom busted, and 100 women who have had abortions. GTFOH!! Can we get real people?
I always say this but you, KB and CBG are my vsb favs. I heart ya’ll!!
I heart ya’ back!
exhibit 2,456,123,875.89 why legit soul and i are e-sis’ for lyfe. jennings.
this deserves a double round of terrorist fist bumps for attending the aubrey drake graham school of referencing to denounce conflicting arguments within vsb. I. LOVE. IT.
*e-sis fist bump*
But that’s so not the point though… The point is not in “doing it” or not “doing it”… The point is to be ready to accept (like Buck Naked said) that if anything happens the responsibility is 100% that of each person involved. Both of them are 100% responsible for their child well-being… Whether the other party participates or not is a moot point. The point is that once you decide to have s3x, you are signing up for being a full time parent. Point blank.
Whether you wait 90 days or not, this reality is the same… Because even if you waited for 6 years and the father bailed on you on the 7th year, it is STILL your responsibility to take care of your child.
In other words, while it’s ideal for a kid to have both parents, each parent is 100% responsible for that child’s well being. It’s as simple as that.
Where did my comment go?
Oh well.
Basically, I was saying that the point of this post is not not to have s3x. The point is if you decide to have s3x, be willing to assume 100% of the responsibility for the child rearing and that goes for both parties.
Waiting for 90 days or 90 months WILL NOT ABSOLVE you from having 100% of the responsibility of raising your child. Like Buck Nacked said above, each parent is responsible at 100% for their child. If both are together, it’s swell. When one is not, it doesn’t take away the fact that the person is entirely responsible for their child.
Hey Sula,
I think there is a misunderstanding. That was never my position. I never said waiting absolved anyone from any responsibility. My position was and is that you are accountable for your actions and you take full responsibility. My partial point was the popular sentiment shift on the boards of sexually free vs. close your legs. I’m cool with either because adults choose what is best for them. That’s been my position through out as well. However, it was contrary to other things said here and I was bringing that up. I’m not about blaming anyone, period. I never blamed “the black man” for anything. I have been angry or frustrated at piss poor human beings, no matter the gender or race, when they refuse to be accountable and take responsibility for themselves and their actions. Also like my original post said, there is enough blame to go around and I’m solution driven. I also wanted to speak on other factors of this issue and not necessarily paint people with a broad brush of either Gutta Black or the woman on Maury. Not all people live recklessly. Part of my examples was that you can do all the planning in the world and be hit with a major life choice that you have to act on (i.e. use protection and end up pregnant). Yet, in no way was anything I was saying about shirking responsibility or that waiting ‘x’ number of days equals a happy ending or absolves one from anything.
* jest….and probably many typos. My bad.
There should be equal accountability for all consensual adult behavior. For example, it is the fault of both parties if you sleep with someone of a dubious past and NEITHER of you stress about wearing protection. It is also each person’s responsibility to have that “talk” before putting your Leggo Blocks together, including what to do about pregnancy, STDs, commitment, etc.
With that said, sex education among young Black people is lacking, the most that many girls get is, “Don’t be opening your legs for just anybody” without any emphasis on why or the alternatives. Boys may get the “Don’t be bringing nothing home!” but no one tells them truthfully about what is right.
Young Black women statistically do not always have a strong positive male influence in the family, and are often subjected to having a mother, aunts, cousins, etc. who speak of hate and disdain for Black men and will not pause to let a girl know how she should love and be loved. Her self-esteem is under attack, the media is telling them they aren’t good enough, and the adults that do exist in their lives have their own issues. Young Black men aren’t taught how to be a man the respects a woman and takes the necessary steps to keep child-free until they are ready. It is endemic to our culture here in the good ol’ USA, and we see the seeds planted.
Then, there are adults who know exactly what they are doing, and do not care that they may end up as a Maury Povich Show topic. Putting holes in a man’s condom, lying about who you are, and overall being dishonest about what and who you want in life. And it is both men and women who foster this trash mentality.
Agreed with the entire post. Well said.
“While the fathers aren’t there somebody needs to figure out how to stop these women from sleeping around with all these men too. Lord almighty, we might not have a father problem if we didn’t have some of these girls giving it up without protection.” <——-THIS!!!!
I have been saying this since I was 15 years old and a 12 yr old girl on the block got by her 13 yr old boyfriend.
I honestly believe that we ALL need to take responsibilty for the demise of the black family.
If girls/women took the time to figure out who these guys are, instead of jumping into bed with them, then you would discover pretty quickly that you wouldn't want them to be the fathers of your child, nor would you want yourself connected to them for life! Not saying that every dude is a dud, but NOT every man you meet is father material. You just cannot place the blame solely on men, especially since we are responsible for ourselves!
I like your blog! : )
Women are victims for the most part… it still boils down to the man (think about it) – if black men dissapear all the time (which majority do once they knock a chick up)… the same would apply to the woman’s father, 9 times out of 10 history repeats itself… soooo if dads raised their daughters, they would avoid the heartache *thanks dad!* The black family unit, as we know it is dead…. I also blame some ladies, keep your legs closed and wear a condom gat damnit to hell. Let him chase you, stop chasing… y’all are making it hard for me.
Ok so both sides have been blamed, now what?
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DING! Finally someone comes in with the conclusion.
Okay?!? You summed up exactly what I was gonna type.
*kudos*
best. summation. ever.
ummm IMHO….most often the guy getting the girl pregnant (that leads to the scenario Eric Holder and the likes are talking about) are usually the mirror image of the gal. Its a bad situation all the way around, but, the woman still plays her position when said reckless behavior catches up with her. She “raises” the child. I dont care how shiftless the negro is at the time of conception, he needs to get his act together by the due date. There are many parents who were suprised, hell…most..by a pregnancy….but that is what makes you either a human or a true degenerate (cant say animal bc they care for their young)…you do what you have to do to take care of your responsibilty. Indeed women should be mindful of the men they sleep with…that is a no brainer to me and perhaps that is the problem…women dont use their brain…I have no clue how women still do the whole unsafe sex thing…but I do think blaming dumb women is a matter the public addresses…but the fact still remains that once the kid is here there is a job to be done…and the fact our men are (and women) are dropping the ball bc they are too busy dropping it like its hot is really uncool. Every time you fluck you stand the chance to create Life…period…kids come from flucking and the fact is nobody is going to stop flucking…men will fluck loser chicks an women will fluck loser dudes because everybody loves to fluck and get flucked so the focus should be on getting men to be better fathers to the children they in fact father because they decided to indulge in…..FLUCKING. period.
***also I give no pardon to any baby mama nor baby daddy…because it was THEIR CHOICE. there are PLENTY of men and women who have been smart enough to not become a part of this trifling statistic known as babymama babyfava drama by either not having babies or being mature and decent enough to handle their responsibilty to their kids by any means necessary. Big ups to them.
PJ this is a real interesting topic. Let me first say this my son was born before me and my wife were married and I NEVER thought about leaving her once. I have even told her if she ever decided she wanted to leave me she could but the kid stays with me. Her father (who never married her mother even after their second child, moved on and married another woman who has two kids for plus one outside of the marriage) told her she should have an abortion because he felt that I could leave her at any moment and she would be stuck even though we had never met. Our son is now 5 years old and we have been married for four years and take precautions because we are not interested in having more children.
I honestly don’t know how to fix this problem in the black community or any community because there are so many causes; daddy issues, teenage pregnacy, ignorance, irresponsibilty on both parties and some people just don’t care or think is cute to have a house full of kids running around with different women or men. I will say this though I think both parties deserve equal blame. Pay attention to who you are sleeping with men and women, because even with birth control and condoms there is always a chance that a child may be conceived. I hate ninjas that don’t take care of their kids just as much as the next man or woman but, I also have little sympathy for women or men who constantly make bad decisions when it comes to their bodies. HIV and AIDS is real people and just because Magic is still kicking doesn’t mean there is a cure for it.
Let me first say this my son was born before me and my wife were married and I NEVER thought about leaving her once.
This doesn’t get said enough. A person who is in a real relationship with another person will technically not want that person to be all miserable all of the sudden just because there is a kid. I mean, they may separate later because of reasons unrelated to the child, but if two people are in a loving
realrelationship, they usually don’t mind being involved in the fruit of that relationship… At least, that has been my experience…Because marriage is not failproof either. People do divorce.
Sula
I agree with you me and wife have always had a real relationship there were never any games and we were always upfront with each other about our expectations from the other party. When she became pregnant I was scared as hell but i knew she was too so it was my responsibility not just to my undorn child but to her to be the man that she knew (or at least thought) I was.
It’s about time someone at least acknowledged that the women are just as much to blame as the men are.
And this ^^^^^ right here, just about sums it up for me. About time indeed.
Equal blame, and equal responsibility to fix the problems that plague our relationships and family households. This is not a one sided fix. Unfortunately, progress cannot be made until women acknowledge their role in this.
Last point:
I want to say this to all the women on here saying that women need to know which man is is most likely to not father is child and not sleep with him. And the women who are saying to double birth control and make better choices in partners. You’re right! So do me favor…why don’t YOU know which men are liars or cheats before you sleep with him. Double your birth control so you won’t need that morning after pill or abortion that I’m sure many have received. Make sure YOU know the man before you sleep with him and pray the condom doesn’t break.
My point is: if life was that easy, we wouldn’t have half the issues we have. It doesn’t matter who’s to blame. I think we ALL could learn to use some discretion with our bodies and our lifestyles. In case you aren’t informed…we are not doing that great when it comes to living a “healthy” lifestyle. STDs, HIV, AIDS, Heart Attack, Diabetes, Non Marriage, etc we lead in them all. We ALL make bad choices. I saw alot of undercover hoes on here a few posts ago blasting women who wanted to wait before having sex with a man and are now saying we should get to know a man before we sleep with him.
Take a look at yourself and what you can do to live the live you want. Don’t frown on that single mom and think you know why she’s a single mom…because you don’t. Things happen. Life doesn’t always go according to plan. Obviously the women who have multiple kids needs a good spanking, but don’t generalize the rest.
*reviving out of pandering induced coma to respond*
Apparently you are taking this to heart given the fact that you are a single mom. If you don’t fit the profile or your circumstance does not fall into the category of situations being described here, then you should’nt take it personal.
When discussions of this nature are discussed, it should be understood that the conversation will take on generalizations. There is no way anyone can cite every specific individual circumstance/household, etc to make an argument. Statistics that we rely on aren’t even done that way many times.
The one thing we do know is that there exists a problem and there are certain commonailities in a variety of instances that allow these generalizations to be made. You already know this. You generalize all the time. So hush.
–You generalize all the time. So hush.–
It always kills me when the educated generalize about the ghetto queens on maury with fifteen children who don’t know who is the father of which kid. See, that generalization allows people to ignore a very real reality– how close they came/could have come to having a child.
Men, well let’s just say most of y’all walk around unaware of how many of your seeds have been aborted or miscarried. Know this. Know this without a doubt that once you’ve had but so much sex with so many women, you really canNOT be sure. So you can continue to pat yourself on the back for a false sense of responsibility.
And women, when they’re honest (which most of the time they are not) know how many times they were praying for Aunt Flo or sweating at the store trying to sneak a pregnancy test on the low. Or peeing in a cup praying they didn’t get caught up.
But as long as we keep talking about the most gettoest of the ghetto we can continue to ignore that there’s a lot of educated working class and middle class folk in a similar scenario. And we can continue to pretend it’s always “them” and not “us”.
And that’s why things keep getting worse because no one wants to be honest and teach the younger generation any better. But you sure will talk about them when they’re acting an ass on tv.
You’re right. I did take it personally. Not when I read Panama’s post…but when I started to read the comments by people lumping all single mothers together in one pot. I have tons of female friends, and I know most of their secrets so I had to call out hypocrisy. We all make generalizations in humor…but if I came in here saying all black people are poor, I would have been stabbed, shot, killed. lol This is a serious subject that affects many peoples lives. So yeah, if you start talking about single mothers, then I’m going to assume you are talking about me. It’s just not funny to me.
Where have you been anyway? lol Welcome back.
You know, something about this just says, “HATERADE” to me. I can see where some of your points come from…but the proof is in the pudding. It kills some women to think that there are those of us who had fun, exercised our right to get some when we were young and managed to escape without babies or STD’s. There are risks and benefits to both sides (see my long winded comment upthread). But you’re not the first single mother to look down her nose at the “undercover hoes” that managed to do what you couldn’t: keep their business out of the streets.
But you’re not the first single mother to look down her nose at the “undercover hoes” that managed to do what you couldn’t: keep their business out of the streets .
I’m glad you said it. Because the comment went from “calling out” undercover hoes, to not judging the single mom in one swoop. colormeconfused#
–But you’re not the first single mother to look down her nose at the “undercover hoes” that managed to do what you couldn’t: keep their business out of the streets.–
That’s not really her issue, it’s the hypocrisy of women who have had abortions, morning after pills or “close calls” praying over an EPT test, who point fingers at other women who had a child.
If you “escaped” you were no smarter or more responsible, just lucky or fortunate, depending on how you look at it. Point is, both were getting down just the same, so why point fingers at “others” for being “irresponsible”.
THANK YOU MALIA!!! Some people can’t read.
Apparently the two of you missed the point. I’m no angel nor do I look down on any woman. That’s not who I am. Read this clearly:
“I saw alot of undercover hoes on here a few posts ago blasting women who wanted to wait before having sex with a man and are now saying we should get to know a man before we sleep with him.”
…so if this wasn’t you then I’m not talking to you. I don’t care who sleeps with who/when/why. I just hate hypocrites and people who pass judgement knowing they have massive issues.
Question:
Hate on what exactly? LOL I’ve never hated on another woman a day in my life…especially hoes. If you’re hinting that I’m somewhat jealous of another woman’s ability to sleep without regret, you’re being ridiculous. Do you know how easy it is to sleep with a man??? Why would I hate on that? I can do it if I wanted to. I just don’t like the women who HATE on the woman who doesn’t sleep around like some vss did a few posts ago.
But this:
“But you’re not the first single mother to look down her nose at the “undercover hoes” that managed to do what you couldn’t: keep their business out of the streets .”
….really? lol and you know me? you read that in my post? Single mothers look down on undercover hoes? When? Where? I’ve never seen that. Hoes are everywhere…with kids and all. Sounds like a silly hoe quote to me. LOL
@SmartFoxGirl
“I’ve never hated on another woman a day in my life…especially hoes”
This line made me laugh to myself. It just reads very funny.You made me chuckle.
@Mr SoBo
You’ve been MIA e-boo! : (
@CNotes
There’s my e-girl. I was in a pandering induced coma for a few days. Doctors said I almost didnt make it. I was exposed to severe toxic levels of pandering. See my AVI as proof.
I’m recovering now and on bed rest and fluids. They have me on anti-pandotics, so it is helping. Its just good to read you.
@Mr SoBo
*smiles at anti-pandontics*
I tried to revive you the day you passed out, but due to your being exposed to such high levels of pandering (ahem….CBG), your system shut down.
As long as you’re well….I’m happy.
You seem a bit keyed up today.
Everyone does, actually.
I suppose this is a hot button topic. Sometimes I feel the reason we can’t work towards improvement is because a discussion on this topic always turns hostile mighty quick.
I just hate hypocrites and people who pass judgment knowing they have massive issues. .
But aren’t you doing the same?!?!?! “Undercover hoe” sounds like an attempt at name calling to me (sidenote: the word hoe doesn’t carry weight with me…..in my eyes anyone having sex is a hoe). I guess this post hit a nerve as a single mom, because calling people who’ve had abortions killers just seems so harsh. And almost evil. I’ve never had one, but I also would NEVER call anyone that has, a killer….OUCH! But YET in the same breath, you want people not to say, “Hey you know what, you (not you per se) just may have gotten knocked up by a loser.”
To be clear, in no way shape or form am I pointing the fingers at single moms. Nope, I just can’t do it. I’ve been over finger pointing since elementary school. Matter of fact all of this is kind elementary. It’s like getting sent to the principal’s office and since you’re in trouble, you want to point the finger at Billy on some “But Billy did the same thing”. So. Billy didn’t get caught. That’s just the way the cookie crumbles.
That’s not really her issue, it’s the hypocrisy of women who have had abortions, morning after pills or “close calls” praying over an EPT test .
And because of Plan B and the MANY other options, I tend not to believe anyone truly “accidentally” gets pregnant. More like accidentally on purpose. LOL! I’ll say it again, I have NO problem with single moms. I just hate “Woe is me/my baby daddy aint ish talk”…..I’m a firm believer in a person sticking and owning up to their decisions. Whatever they may be.
–And because of Plan B and the MANY other options, I tend not to believe anyone truly “accidentally” gets pregnant. More like accidentally on purpose.–
There are two issues:
having sex
getting pregnant
Most people who get pregnant, got pregnant through sex.
If you want to hold true to your right to have sex with whomever, whenever, wherever, you accept that a certain percentage of those people will get pregnant. the only way to not get pregnant by a deadbeat is to not have sex with a dedbeat.
As long as you want to hold on to your right to make a bad decision (have sex with a deadbeat) know that you’re rolling the dice and everybody won’t be so lucky.
This is why nobody takes these arguments, from women, seriously. Because you still want to chex whomever but point fingers at those who are irresponsible with their hormonal birth control. That’s like wanting to do dirt right alongside Billy but acting like y’all are WAY DIFFERENT when HE gets caught.
The funny thing is, I actually think we agree.
I don’t think I’m different from people at all. I do so called h0e sh*t like most people do (although if you say so, they’ll vehemently deny that’s what it is) I’ve had a condom or two break and slid my azz right up to the pharamicist for that Plan B. But I’m also not out here acting like I’ve never done so called h0e shit/pointing fingers/calling people killers and things of that nature. V Renee isn’t judging the single mother (unless you have 5 baby daddies and you don’t know who they are….then I just may judge). I just don’t want to hear people crying about how so and so aint sh*t, when YOU made the choice to have the baby. That’s my main and only point…people trying to act like they don’t know how babies are made. lol
You know I was reading Malia’s post going, but isn’t that what V and Anna just said?
Meanwhile, sometimes it gets exhausting when people try to make a discussion on an anonymous blog with anonymous posters all about them… It’s not personal. People share their opinions. If said opinions is that purple unicorns suck and you’re a purple unicorn so be it…. Getting all flustered and bothered because of what people – you absolutely do not know by the way- think? Not what’s hot on the boulevard.
Again, who am I passing judgement on? Hoes? lol When it comes to my thoughts, I’m probably the biggest hoe on here. You know I’m the resident perv. But my actions? No. I’m a grown woman and I’m usually very responsible in my actions however I have made mistakes…as have ALL of us. THAT is the point I’m making today. We all make mistakes. There were tons of peeps lumping single moms together like their ish doesn’t stink. It’s not name calling. It’s fact. I’m not against what you do behind closed doors is your business…but DO NOT keep your ish (not you) undercover and all your trips to the clinic, pills, “raw chex cause I was drunk” nights in a closet and start talking about women making better choices in who they sleep with. THAT’s what made me go off. I know too many women who play this game, talking mad trash. The same ones who brag “and I don’t have kids!”…I call you lucky, nothing more nothing less cause if I went through the list of all the dudes you’ve (not you) slept with, I bet I find a bunch of dead beats…not too mention I want a woman on here to tell me she’s NEVER had unprotected sex before. Lmmmmaaaaaoooooo…I’ll wait.
I don’t really think women who have had abortions are “killers”…that would mean my mom is a killer as she had one before…and my cousin…and my best friend, etc. But that action of abortion is killing the fetus. It sounds harsh but it’s factual…you ever watched a video of an abortion? What would you call it?
@SFG
…my name is YAYER and i have never had unprotected chex before,probably because i have never had any chex before LOL! yes, i practice abstinence.
and before anybody gives me that ‘that don’t give you no right to judge’ , i don’t, i just speak truth, just like you SFG…
…….yeah, I’m starting to get a little e-crush on you FoxGirl.
You’re getting down to that good ol’ honesty that nobody with degrees, crazy hair, and pious ways on the internet likes to acknowledge.
(Jeezy voice) Yeeeeaaaaahh…
Bond. BlkBond.
get your own blkbond!
the girl is miiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnne…….
God I cannot post today! Ive typed all types of clever sh1t and can’t seem to post!
My question is if these men and women grew up in the same environments, with the same value systems, and morals. Then how in the hell are you gonna look at these women having babies with these “no good” men and say “you should no better”? How in the hell are they supposed to have a higher moral standard, and judgment abilities? Because they have ovaries?
I have examples in my own family , and sure I want to toss Seasonique at all them bitches.They probably won’t take it.
But what can I expect from a woman who’s own mama let her live with her 25 yr old boyfriend at 13? Sure that’s not the case for all single mothers, but most of the time these couples are evenly yolked ,and if these men can’t look at these women and determine that they should protect their penises from a future of drama and torment, why would their equal female counterpart be any wiser?
I’m not into placing blame, or playing a saint on the internets. I’ve screwed some questionable men before *gasp* unlike the rest of the seemingly virtuous womens of the internets, and while I use protection , its not 100%. Word to my BF with her newborn while on implanon. If you hump, babies will come. So I understand that surprises are conceived, and lessons should be learned.
But quite frankly its a cycle that both women and men actively participate in, and I’m not sure there is a solution that can combat it. And I’m not sure what assigning equal blame is suppose to accomplish.
But if that’s the objective, I guess blame should be placed evenly, as should the convenience of low expectations.
Everything that everyone said on here about blame, responsibility and accountability boils down to something that has been missing in the black community for the at least the past 30 years: respect.
Self-respect and respect for each other. As basic as that sounds, respect, or lack thereof, is mainly why a topic like always seems to come up in the black community, whether it is the man’s or the woman’s fault about anything. If a man doesn’t respect a woman, he is going probably go into her raw within a week, a few days, hell, even a few hours after meeting her. If a woman opens for any guy that shows her any attention, she doesn’t have respect for herself. When we stop respecting ourselves and each other, discussions like this happen. It causes baby mama drama. It causes dead beat dads. It causes abandoned and unloved children which lead to unloved adults who lash out at the world. This happens in all communities, but it is prevalent as f**k in the black community.
Lack of respect affects every part of lives. Lack of self respect leads to us and our children being morbidly obese, pregnancies with men and women we hardly know, not wanting to get a good education and do better for ourselves. Lack of respect for each other leads to burglaries, rapes, violence, unwanted pregnancies, abandoned children, and finger pointing instead of self reflection. It could be why no one doesn’t want to truly invest in our communities because they see that if we don’t respect each other, what would make them think we would respect anything that is put into our community.
Now, as most people know on here, I got love for single mothers and I am a product of a single mom. Women who are single moms who are raising children on their own due to divorces or breakups, this doesn’t apply to you. My mom had 3 kids by 2 men, but was married to both of those men and me and my sisters have a relationship with our dads. If you are a single mom and your child or children have a relationship with their father, count your blessings because some people aren’t as lucky. Relationships between a man and a woman don’t always work out, but if there is a child between that man and woman, that child deserves a relationship with both.
Pointing fingers at each other is not going to solve anything. People just need to realize the enormity of effects of having unprotected sex with someone you barely know. Men need to man up and strap up if you don’t want to have the responsibility of a living being coming into this world. Women need to be smart enough to realize that if this ni@@a ain’t gonna be worth a damn next week, let alone 9 months from now, you might want to tell him to strap up or close your damn legs. It’s not worth it for him not to be worth a damn to you and a child.
I know I will have someone counter my comment, but really, it all boils down to respect for me. Respecting myself and other people, especially women, has kept me out of jail, VD-free and no illegitimate children. It may sound like an afterschool special, but it is one major thing that makes the current generation, our generation and the generations of our parents and grandparents. The more we stopped respecting each other, the more things have changed for worse in our community.
i’ve been waiting for you to comment in the LEAST-SFG way possible. bwahaha.
Self-respect and respect for each other <-is THE root of all of our communities problems.
I guess I should now read the rest of the comment…
…now that im done reading..offers the most platonic, non-touching hug to CBG ever that wont get me e-shanked.
that is all.
You know true story I was talking to my grandma and she said the same thing. We were talking about how woman waaaay back in the day had less money, more kids and were better mothers. I was saying it was death of our leaders, etc…she said it was respect. We don’t have any respect now a days. I thought she was being mean and generalizing but she had some good points. Not all but many have no respect for their bodies, lifestyle, kids, and their choices. Back then, respect was everything.
I honestly reached that epiphany today before I wrote that. I knew there were going to be some arguments and jabs on this topic. Plus, I didn’t want to a panderer today. There are times where the woman should be the blame just as much as the man, but like sunshyne84 said upthread, both are the blame, so what is really the root of the problem. Respect is personally why I don’t try to hit the first time I meet a woman. It’s not about lack of game or being shy or being less of a man. It’s about respect for her and respect for myself. When a woman feels that she is respected by a man, that is when her heart opens up to him. Okay, I am going to stop pandering now.
It’s not pandering if it’s how you feel. I don’t know you but I can tell you are no player. Kudos.
“It’s not pandering if it’s how you feel.”
^Exactly @ SFG! Like I said we all can take a joke, talk ‘ish, clown/roast and some things are said in jest, but I did mean it when I posted traits of good men should be respected, exalted and admired.
No, it was pandering SFG. Stop lying to him. That n*gga pandered.
And I was rooting for you too CBG. You almost went an entire post without pandering and you just couldnt help yourself at the last minute.
Oh well. Hey. At least you tried. I give you that.
If I wasnt on my prescribed anti-pandering meds to combat being exposed to your toxic pandering, I would be in a coma again.
But on the real, CBG, you should try to hit on the first night. By not going for it, you are doing yourself a grave disservice by denying yourself the opportunity to see if she is truly ‘that chick’. By not going for it, you are essentially creating a character for her which may or may not be a false one. Think about it: A bird doesnt know it can fly until it jumps off a branch and flaps its wings. You will never know how a woman gets down until you put her in ‘get down’ situations. So throw that ho in the air and see if she flies n*gga.
Thats just my advice.
Okay, I just about flatlined because that was hilarious. I was hoping I would get by without getting jab by you but oh well. If the girl is ‘that chick’, I’ll definitely go for it, but not some floozy. A n*gga ain’t trying to get burnt.
@CBG
I hear ya. And you’re right about being selective. But remember, its a test, which means you’re not obligated to smash. All you are trying to determine is if you can. Once she gives you confirmation that the pumpkin is yours to smash, then you will know assuredly if she belongs in the ‘floozy’ category or the ‘Insert pen*s here’ down the line category.
Dude, you are effin hilarious.
I almost made it through all the comments without responding. There were a few comments I felt it was my duty to respond to, but didn’t because I didn’t have the NRG! But this one right here….this was the killa! You are wrong for this. Lol! Wow!
“You know true story I was talking to my grandma and she said the same thing. We were talking about how woman waaaay back in the day had less money, more kids and were better mothers. I was saying it was death of our leaders, etc…she said it was respect. We don’t have any respect now a days.”
I’m with granny on this one! The breakdown of pride/self-respect within the black community can partly be attributed to the institution of welfare within the black community.
The system rewards those who don’t have a father in the household through welfare. Back in your granny’s day when a girl/woman would get pregnant she would disappear(sent down south) because the family was worried about how that ‘bastard child’ would make their family look. After the current welfare system was in place it slowly became acceptable and is currently the standard.
Going back to the point that granny was making though, the initial breakdown came with the welfare system which then translated to it being acceptable to have 3 children by 3 different men then to having children with a man who sleeps on trains, then to having children with a man who is serving a life sentence.
This is overly simplistic but I should get back to work!
“SmartFoxGirl September 8, 2010 at 12:23 pm
I know a woman who has 2 babies by a man serving a life sentence…and yes she conceived while he was in prison. SMH”
What about the women who PURPOSELY get pregnant cause they think it’ll help them KEEP the lowlife “thug” they are SOOOOOO “in love with”??
I completely agree that women should be held accountable as well. As a woman, I know that I can choose who I lay down with. These women are not completely in the dark about the situation.
Thanks for putting that out there Panama Jackson.
I think it’s a lost cause @ this point. It would take too much (missing) effort to ensure the next generation is better off than us, & we’re too jacked up to raise whole human beings @ this point (not all of us, but in mass).
Some of these single moms want love, know damn well they can’t get it from dude, have a baby just to have someone around who loves them all the while hoping the baby will change dude’s mind & he’ll eventually come around.
& the deadbeat dads, I don’t know what the hell they’re looking for but more responsibility via a child is probably the LAST thing.
Yet both parties make ridiculous decisions & risk their entire futures on one moment. & while I do think the blame should be shared equally, the fact that women get stuck should be more incentive to be more cautious. & though there are lots of women who do it badly, most often women DO step up to the plate & raise the child & something should be said for that. The sad thing is its a contest of who’s more tragic – the men who ghost or the women who do their best to ruin the kid?
I’m just glad I’m not in the contest…
Panama is correct that black women are responsible for the high rate of out-of-wedlock births in the AfAm community.
Black women could unilaterally bring the out-of-wedlock birthrate to 0 if they each stopped having children by men who were not their husbands. They could use abstinence or condoms or IUDs or birth control pills/patches or RU487 or spermicide or plan B/morning after pills or abortion or neutering
or some combination of the above
to stop bearing kids outside of marriage.
AfAm women could still be as promiscuous or as chaste as they please while accomplishing this objective. They could have raw sex or use a prophylactic. They could beware of STDs or ignore the prospect of infection altogether and still not produce illegitimate babies. Even rape victims have options.
It’s simple. Women must deliberately and consistently opt NOT to conceive b@st@rd kids and/or NOT to carry b@st@rd kids to term. It would require planning and execution (and some self-discipline).
Most women who ignore these options in order to spawn non-marital children have no one to blame but themselves. A broken condom or a forgotten BC pill is no excuse, really.
**SmartFoxGirl**
Whether they have had abortions or not, feel free to overlook folks who pass judgment on single moms. You already have 99 problems. No need to add more.
I’m not sure who said it, but someone seemed to be making the argument that it’s hard to know which men are liars and cheats beforehand. That’s a damned good point. With that being said, according to this website http://bit.ly/bnoN20 in 2008 it was recorded that 65% of Black children were being born to single mothers, and from what I’ve heard within this past year, the number has gone up to 70%. I find it very hard to believe that every last one of those women were duped into sleeping with a guy who they didn’t even have an inkling about (with regards to him not being totally on the up-and-up).
What’s more likely? That Shaniqua didn’t know anything about Tyrone’s 4 other baby mamas? Or, that she thought it would be different with her?
I’m not exactly “blaming” Black women, but we do need to realize that society teaches Black women to make bad decisions.
We teach Black women to do everything to get and keep a man. Who hasn’t heard “if you don’t do it for your man, some other woman will”? Who hasn’t had a girlfriend compromise what she wants because she’s with a guy (not her husband) who might make it big one day (so, she makes all her decisions based on what’s good for “them” as a couple, as opposed to what’s good for her as an individual)? Who hasn’t had a girlfriend who hung on tight to a 40 year old dude who still lived with his mother because she’d rather be with someone than be single, or *gasp* have to get out and date?
Black women have not been taught to go with their intuition on men, we’ve been taught to ignore it, for the sake of keeping our man. So, we wind up being the other woman for the dude who said he and his wife were separated, instead of just leaving him alone entirely. We marry the dude who we know cheated on us when we were dating, because he promised all of that would change once we said our vows. We stay with the dude who’s verbally abusive because we don’t think we deserve better. We stay with the dude who’s physically abusive, because we hope and pray for the day he’ll change.
Oh, and let’s not leave out how the Church has taught Black women to be very passive when it comes to relationships. The Church doesn’t teach Black women to actively seek out good men, it teaches Black women to “pray” and a good man will find them. And, if the relationship starts to go sour, “pray” for an answer. There may be a few churches who don’t do this, but for the most part, that’s the message Black women are given.
P.S.
To whoever said Black women need to close their legs, I ask, why should they? Black men have never seriously been asked to keep their dicks in their pants.
You bring up some excellent points. I remember hearing something about a women being sexually assaulted and the pastor telling the young lady not to report it and for them to “handle it in the church”. After some initial googling I found a website for people that addresses many allegations that are not dealt with in the black church (the black church isn’t the only church).
^Where am I going with this? The fact that I agree that in some cases women have been told to not listen to intuition and that “they crazy to let that good man go”. So many are pushed to over-look abuse and mistreatment so they are not alone. So many take pride in having a man and not enough pride in whether that is a good man or not.
Agreed! And, then add to it the fact that their church (which for a lot of women is the center of their lives, if they don’t have kids) is telling them not to take action to protect themselves, and you have a recipe for disaster.
You do bring up great points but at some point life teaches you what you may not have been taught otherwise, experience teaches, and that is one teachin mofo.
People have to be astute enough to get the lesson EARLY the first one or two times, without repeating the same mistakes and patterns of behavior over and over. so you live, you learn, you do better.
How do you figure? If everyone around you since you were a child told you the sky was pink, hearing anything else doesn’t even make sense to you.
And, learning your lesson the first time? It’s kinda too late for the woman whose boyfriend just left her with their new baby. I mean, she can keep the cycle from being repeated, but I highly doubt that situation is going to result in some higher understanding of her circumstances. Especially when those around her are still telling her she needs a man by any means necessary. It takes some serious self reflection to learn from ones mistakes. And, unfortunately, MOST people don’t engage in it before, OR after, the repercussions of the mistake are felt.
When the blame is squarely placed on the shoulders of men, women, the system, or the extinct dodo, you’re going to have a problem. I think there’s enough blame to go around. You show me a deadbeat dad, and I’ll show you a woman who ignored the signs and symptoms of bull. Are there dudes who are ducking off and being absentee fathers? Certainly. But I think we should be willing to admit that we saw x, y, z and ignored it; then after admitting it, do better.
I have to say, I agree with you PJ, and you’re friend too. It’s a two way street, and I’ve longed thought that women shouldn’t be giving it up so easily to every offer of dick they get. While I certainly do think that lack of father is a huge problem that really is responsible for many of the issues in the black community, I also think that there needs to be more discussion about the responsibility of single mothers to ensure that their daughters don’t repeat the cycle. but then that could start a whole ‘nother extremely long conversation that I don’t have the time or energy for today. I’m not trying to say that black men don’t need to get their ish together, not in least. But this is 2010, and it’s high time the dialogue also included the role that women have played in the shitfuckery that’s plaguing our community.
I gotta say, I think a lot of this tendency to not hold women accountable in the aforementioned situations has a lot to do with the role that patriarchy plays in the socialization of the American nuclear family. The dad has historically been seen fit to be the breadwinner and the provider (even though oftentimes many women have had to fill this role as well, especially in many African-American communities, and for various sociological reasons) and so it just seems natural, from a societal standpoint, to condemn an absent/deadbeat dad rather than to invoke thought about what a mother might have done to contribute to the possibility that she might have set her kid up for a single-parent household.
Generally, I agree with today’s post. The problem I’m having is the assumptions and judgment running amok in these comments. Many have already pulled the card on “the dead beat dad and bm are of the hood variety” assumption.
But what about this judgmental “she should have known better” attitude? The truth of the matter is that its a hell of a lot of women who are so quick to say BM need to make better choices in men or at least get on birth control who have both made some really dumb ass choices in men and have had unprotected sex with said dumb ass choics. They just happened to not be ovulating at the time, or his men wasn’t marching, or they had a miscarriage or had an abortion or whatever else saved them from the single motherhood plague.
Too many times, the ONLY difference in the judgment of these BM’s and MS. Im better than that is that the BM’s choices are put on display to the world. Case in point….there’s certain school in Atlanta that produces many Ms. Im better than thats every year that has a policy of providing multiple free abortions to their students should they ever find themselves in an “unfortunate situation.” But i guess since they are childless, we are comfortable in saying their judgment is any better than the next girl.
That both women and men share some responsibility in the matter is OVERstood. These women feel the responsibility of their choices everywhere they go. They feel it from their friends as Anna.M pointed out, they feel it at church when they are shunned, they feel it on their job when their boss/co-workers asks about their husband when looking at the pics of their kids on the desk. Women get it.
Just remember all your WTF was i smoking decisions the next time you think a women just should have known better.
Very interesting topic. First, of all, I don’t think the post is about all single mothers, I also didn’t read it as being about women who were in a healthy relationship that didn’t work out afterwards for one reason or another. I think the post was directed to women who end up pregnant by men who they knew were losers. A lot of people are saying let’s not play the blame game but I didn’t read the post as talking about shifting blame from men to women, rather as focusing on the woman’s role but not saying the man didn’t have a role to play. I also read the post as more about accountability, and accountability is tough and not just in this context. I love watching the Biggest Loser and it seems to me that one of the biggest (no pun intended) obstacles to losing weight is the fact that people have to acknowledge their role in how they got obese. Yes, people have issues and it is more than just greed, but at the end of the day, the odds are that no one forced you to eat, you ate yourself to that size. That’s must be hard to acknowledge. In the same way, I think it is understandably difficult for women to acknowledge their role in getting involved with and ending up pregnant by someone they knew was a loser. No one is perfect and we all make mistakes, just not necessarily the same ones, but I think accepting your responsibility for your own decisions is an important step in not repeating the same mistake.
We also have to realize that the consequences you face for your actions depend a lot on where you are standing e.g. Paris Hilton getting arrested for cocaine possession is more than likely not standing in the same position that a poor black person arrested for the same thing is. Unfair? Yes, but it is reality. So in the same way, if a woman gets pregnant for a loser, unless she decides to have an abortion (and while I believe in a woman’s right to choose, I do not think that abortion should be just another method of birth control), then the fact is that there is a bigger consequence for her to face than it is for the loser. So to the commenter that thinks it is about us women opening our legs the same way that men pull their d*cks out of their pants, you are ignoring reality and I think you missed the point of the post. I don’t see this is being an issue about the sexual liberation of women at all.
The solution? I really don’t know but for those people who said much of the comments were preaching to the choir…maybe we could try an each one, reach one approach. If each of us tried to mentor/educate at least one person, maybe that would help. For instance, i know an 18 year-old girl who is unmarried and not in a relationship with the father, not in school and has 2 kids- ages 4 and 3, I think. She has 3 younger sisters who are probably taking their cues from her. I can’t fix her life or prevent her from getting pregnant again, but I try to do what I can to tell her she’s worth something, encourage her to go to school, to be thoughtful about who she gets involved with and to use protection if she chooses to open her legs. *Sorry for rambling so long*
I think the post was directed to women who end up pregnant by men who they knew were losers.
Please say it again, because it seems that this went over the head of many a person in here today.
@ both ya’ll
yup, yup and yup…
Ladies…..It’s not hard to see who’s lying and cheating before YOU become #256,447 on his list of conquests.
The dude who actually wants just ONE woman and only talks to ONE woman at a time? Probably better for you than Mr. I-Gotta-See-How-Much-Ass-I-Can-Get-In-One-Month will ever be. There must be some chemical code in womens’ brains or something that somehow makes a guy that has 60000000000 women look better to them. Never understood that. How could you expect 100 percent out of a man that has himself spread so thin already?
This is my policy on sex: If I can’t see myself fathering a child with this woman and raising it TOGETHER WITH HER for the next 18-21 years….Why am I having sex with this chick?
I think more of us need to get on THAT train.
Well let me off at the next stop n*gga. Cause I got on the wrong got damn train. I’m heading to Assville. One way ticket, express. Where your train stop at?
Just joking. But the train of thought you suggested is evidently the smarter approach to dating for both men and women. It certainly would be ideal and beneficial in a myriad of ways if we all operated this way.
^ LOL @ a one-way ticket to Assville.
I wish more people were thinking that way when it came to dating and relationships. It would certainly make my life easier.
I concur! Women are just as responsible for the current state of our community as men. Many know in advance that they’re about to lay down with a no-good ninja but do so anyway. For those who don’t know the calliber of man they’re sharing their bed with in advance are guilty of not knowing the calliber of man they’re sleeping with in advance. The secret behind the long held archetype of the strong black woman holding it down is that often that woman did some dumb shit with some dumb man and got caught holding the bag.
I don’t have children as a 28 year old black woman because I choose not to have children. I have chosen my sexual partners carefully and have had protected sex. My mother often said to me “Don’t have a baby with a man you don’t want to deal with forever. If you only sort of like him now, you’ll likely hate him when the baby comes.” As wonderful as they are, children make life a whole lot less fun. This is compounded when you don’t have a support of a spouse, life partner, of the other parent of the child.
Should Black women be held accountable.. at all? To even suggest that Black women are even portrayed as victims is ridiculous. To even suggest that they are not held accountable is simply not true. Black women are accused everyday in the media and within the Black community, of failing to discipline their children, of emasculating their sons, of defeminizing their daughters and of retarding their children’s academic achievement. Black men should be held more accountable to the mother of their children and their own sons and daughters. They are allowing the mother their children to support the growing number of Black children living in poverty.
Not sure if it has been mentioned but people “go easy” on them because. . . they are the ones raising the kids. They didn’t abscond from their responsibilities. Whether or not there were bad decisions made, they are seeing it through.
I can understand splitting the blame between the men and the women in this situation, however that’s pretty much it. Blame split. The men are still the universal bastards at the end of it all because not only are they getting people pregnant – when they don’t want kids and condoms are inexpensive, but also they are abandoning their children.
I propose that more important than assigning blame to either gender is considering access to healthcare and birth control. When you really think about how much reckless sex happens in America, the truth is that the rate of single motherhood could be considerably higher. The difference, however, is that in the low-income black community, access to healthcare, and by extension birth control, is often limited. You cannot get birth control without visiting an Ob/Gyn and getting a prescription. Further, birth control and condoms can get extremely pricey. Easier, more affordable access to contraception is needed, particularly for young black people in low-income areas. My guess (and hope) is that black people use contraception less because of the hassle and costs associated with it and not because of sheer and utter irresponsibility.
I wholeheartedly agree with this hypothesis. We often blame the man, but Black women often allow men into their boudoir to fulfill a void — equating sex with love. I’m a black women, and there is no way I can have sex without love. Sorry, I just regard myself too deeply and worry that I will respect myself less and less if I just allow ANYONE to become a part of me. If I don’t respect myself by having repeated sex, how can I justly expect any man to respect me? Of course, it isn’t about him. I have to look at myself and determine why do I have one night stands or why do I feel good when I’m doing the do, but feel empty when he leaves? I think it is called ‘self-respect’ and I only want a man who treats me as someone he can take to his mother’s house, or take me around his boys and not feel ashamed or embarrassed. If he can’t do those things, he isn’t for me!
@ Classic
“…You cannot get birth control without visiting an Ob/Gyn and getting a prescription. Further, birth control and condoms can get extremely pricey.”
Uh….Not sure about birth control for women since I am man….But if a Brotha can’t afford some Magnums (or whatever it is he uses), he needs to not be smashing…..Period.
Wait….Chicks like “Maybe I can upgrade him” guys, so chances are, she’s gonna BUY HIM THE RUBBERS ANYWAY and still let his broke-ass hit it….
Teach a sheep to be a good sheep and it will.
Teach a wolf to be a good wolf and 9 times out of ten it will get catch the sheep… good or bad.
To the recurring refrain of .. ‘black girls need to learn how to separate sex from love’ you have a point but it is a small one.
What about teaching black men at the same time to stop being so predatory?, to also stop equating sex as an uncontrollable urge that must be satiated with as many women as possible in order to prove their manhood?.
It seems many people simply think that black men have no obligation to themselves and no self control. (I don’t believe this).
Why are black men who don’t want kids, going raw dog anyway?.
So good people with good sense. Grab a young person and attempt to de-program the bullish they see on B.E.T. and every where else for that matter. WE have to take the recovery of families into our own hands.
I completely agree with this post. I’ve always blamed the women FIRST. It takes her making the choice to have unprotected sex with the man before he actually becomes a deadbeat.
Black women hold the key and they should begin to hold it with their knees!
I am female and there are no excuses for women thinking that having a baby gets the man. Wake up, ladies, and look around and be more responsible!
Grandma
wow, where to begin… i think homeboy is right in many ways. i mean come on, usually when a chick has 8 kids and 11 babydaddies, AT LEAST 7 of them look like the pic above. when a dude looks like that. how in the world wld it be reasonable to expect him to be a good provider (yes i’m judging the book by its cover)? also, many chicks in the above scenario know dude has one (or more) kid(s) with someone else and guess what? HE DOESN’T TAKE CARE OF THEM EITHER!!! by and large we have the ability to chose who we do and do not sleep with, and under what conditions the doin gets done. Yes, sometimes dudes will pull a 180 on you and leave you wonderin WTF just happened. but 9 times out of 10 there are huge signs about his character that get purposely ignored or a totally missed b/c of what some wld call “love”. the world WILL ALWAYS love beatin up on black men AND women, but some of the beating is deserved. if you give no thought about the fact that a baby is like a diamond (forever) and that dog a** dudes aren’t, it’s hard to get my sympathy. it’s also hard for me to be sympathetic to women who accumulate multiple baby daddies cuz they clearly refuse to get the memo! Yes, dog a** dudes are horrible, but if that’s the only type of dude you date…well how about you close ur legs for a few minutes and think about where you keep goin wrong? in the famous words of smokey the bear “only YOU can prevent forest fires (and unwanted pregnancy)”
Glad somebody decided to ask the questions and tell the truth. I have ALWAYS said it starts and ends with us (women).
Black women are very much accountable. Some of us gotta stop actin’ like we don’t know how it all works. Unprotected sex often results in pregnancy and/or disease. A woman who can’t seem to get a grip on her sexuality/reproductivity is the kind of woman a man should avoid…like the plague.
The burden is never equal. A man can walk away from a woman, after sex, and unless he’s contracted a disease, he’s good to go. A woman has to worry about pregnancy and disease. If she chooses to abort her child, she has to deal with the emotional burden…women don’t often talk about that. They act like aborting babies is like having teeth pulled…but it’s not, but I digress.
Women can’t have it both ways, either. We need to be very realistic when it comes to how we think about “casual sex”. Sex without a commitment is just that…and if a woman decides to keep a baby conceived from a consensual “one-nite hit”, then she should be prepared to go it alone, if the guy isn’t down…cuz he probably wasn’t down in the first place. He just wanted some sex for the nite, like she did. I’ve seen this scenario, more than once. Protect yourself, or pass on the sex.
We must do better.
Ok so I am a day late and a dollar short on this but I HAD to add my $.02
Men have only 1 chance to prevent pregnancy put a condom on. THE END. Women have an ENTIRE AISLE in CVS dedicated to birth control. A million forms of prescribed birth control and if all else fails, the morning after pill. Add to that the fact that the abortion decision is pretty much left up to the woman and adoption exists. I gotta be the bad guy here and say it. If a woman ends up being a single mom (aside from divorce and death) she wants to be and should therefore be held responsible. Guys kinda get the shaft in this particular sitch. He is still a douche if he doesn’t stick around but I think the BLAME for the situation falls squarely on the shoulders of the one who had every opportunity to avoid it.
Great article…
There is no defending ignorance, no matter how you cut it. Blame men all you want, but it still comes down to a decision YOU make. Outside of being rape, it’s a choice between 2 people. The woman has to take as much responsibility for said issue as the man.
It doesn’t make men innocent of the situation at hand…but to say the woman is the “victim” is lame. If you’re not married, you shouldn’t be opening them legs…
And if you do open them…
Be prepared for the possible consequences….
The Elephant in the room is Being called out now!!!!
Many Black women in general have this fascination with Thugs.
They think thugs equal good sex, protection and masculinity. We hear it in songs and see it every day.
This fascination with thugs is killing black women and bringing underserved children into the world.
70% of the new HIV infection in ATL, DC and New Orleans, come from BLACK WOMEN SLEEPING WITH MEN WHO HAVE BEEN INCARCERATED at least 3 years.
Some how a lot black women find this attractive and find decent black men boring or lame.
Black women are more responsible for our issues than any of us will ever admit its a big problem that wont be resolved because no one wants to call it exactly what it is.
In many situations, sisters who have it so hard are the cause and the cure of their own problems.
No, your opinion is stupid. You’re basically woman should have to repress her sexuality because the men she sleeps with are incapable of raising children, and that for some reason this is her fault and she “gets what she deserves” because she “should’ve known” that silly little man wouldn’t stick around to raise the child that is also HIS responsibility. So, how does one know with complete certainty whether their sexual partner is capable of raising children? Is there some kind of test? Women are not blamed for this particular problem in the black community because THEY are the ones stuck with the problem, not the men who run off on them. They have to pay for what is both her mate’s and her own irresponsible decision all by herself, and now you’re suggesting she should also be demonized the same way the men who leave women behind with children are? They don’t deserve to be. I’m sorry, but you have an extremely misogynistic viewpoint that I don’t find comedic in the slightest.
Better late than never. I have promised to post this 3x on facebook.