i realize most guys will call me nuts for publicly admitting this, and that there’s no bigger ego boost than getting propositioned by an attractive and sober woman.
i understand these sentiments, because i feel the exact same way, lol.
still, personal selfishness aside, i’ve always believed that women shouldn’t attempt to “bag” men, and i’ll give you four reasons why.
1. from a relationship standpoint, a woman making the first move usurps one of a mans most basic duties: to show a woman that he has enough balls to approach her
believe me, nothing takes more guts than a sincere cold, “i dig her, but i have absolutely no idea if she’s feeling me or not” approach. still, regardless of how shy or socially awkward he might be, stripping a man of this task subsequently strips a woman of one of natures inherent bitchassness filters. i mean, how the hell is he going to be able to protect you from lions and tigers and crackheads and sh*t if he wasn’t even able to muster a meek “hi” while in the meat line at giant eagle?
2. women don’t grow on us
***i spent at least 30 minutes trying to come up with a less blunt way of saying what i’m about to say. blame it on jim jones. and miss dominican republic in the miss universe pageant***
there’s no convo, cooking, or coitus invented yet that’s great enough to get a man to overlook lukewarm physical attraction to a woman. even if it had been, shaq would have stolen it already anyway.
women don’t grow on us, and there’s nothing a woman can do to “win” a guy, just lose. basically, if he wasn’t attracted enough to you to approach you first, he’ll never be attracted enough to you to do anything but close-bus you.
3. its not hot
lisa lampanelli
brigitte nielsen
an albino cockroach
the redheaded weekend barista at the crazy mocha down the street, who looks like a freckled white female version of jason whitlock.
pizza the hut
***these are the only things i could think of that are more unattractive than an perpetually thirsty and propositioning woman.***
4. it doesn’t work
i’ve been lucky enough to be around a couple dozen or so successful marriages, and i can’t name one where the man was blatantly bagged by the woman. i’m not saying it can’t happen, but like the existence of people who actually celebrate kwanzaa, i’ll believe it when i see it
now, i’m not saying women don’t have a part in this. just as it’s our job to approach if we’re interested, its their job to make themselves somewhat approachable.
smiling, eye contact, starting conversations, subtly making your relationship status clear, and responsive body language is perfectly within a women’s wheelhouse.
bagging him on the bus, making moves on your crush, and fed-exing a thong to his cubicle with a “digits, please. sexy-ass” note attached isn’t.
what say you, people of vsb? do you think a man should always instigate the approach? if so, why? if not, why not? does it even matter? why am i asking so many questions? if a barren womanist bagged a black blogger in the woods, would her roommate buy a round?
—the champ
i was with you until you took the low blow on kwanzaa
habari gani champ…
@moks,
I have met only one person who celebrated Kwanzaa, and she was one of those wealthy mulatto chikas who went to college and became all militant. I don’t celebrate any holidays, and it led to a hilarious blowup between us where she ended up questioning my “Blackness”. Screw you Kwanzaa! You cost me some a Guyanese swirl. Poseur ass Holiday Festival. Festivus>Kwanzaa
@Legendary Dash,
I don’t always get down with the Seinfeld, but this: “Festivus> Kwanzaa” made me snort. Really loud. lol
@Selah,
It’s time for the airing of grievances!
@Legendary Dash, I celebrate nothing so I don’t know anyone who’s down with Kwanzaa either…
@moks,
I actually wanna know who devotedly celebrates Chrismahanukwanzakah.
@Cheekie,
Growing up we celebrated Kwanzaa and Christmas. My dad is African and he couldn’t have cared less about Kwanzaa. My mother the super pro-black African American was the one that had us celebrating Kwanzaa.
@Cheekie,
I thought I was the only freak who said that.
**waves at fellow freak**
@BlackBerry Molasses,
Oh, yes, ever since I saw those commercials (I forget who…was it a phone company?) I’ve embraced the term.
@moks,
i was with you until you took the low blow on kwanzaa
if i had a dollar…
@moks,
Ick – just ick. Kwanzaa is a made up “motherland” custom. I have yet to meet one African person who recognizes it. Yes, I ended my sentence with a preposition. And?
@RedBeanzNRice w/Catfish,
Thank you. – Everyone
@RedBeanzNRice w/Catfish,
And I quote:
“My daddy says Kwanzaa is just a made up holiday for Black people who are too uppity to celebrate Christmas.” -Cindy from The Boondocks Comic Strip
@BlackBerry Molasses,
I “less than three” you. <3
“how the hell is he going to be able to protect you from lions and tigers and crackheads and sh*t if he wasn’t even able to muster a meek “hi” while in the meat line at wegmans”
I wholeheartedly agree. I live on the west coast where the guys are really passive and the women are usually the aggressive ones (at least in my experience). I still won’t approach a man. I feel that if he’s interested, then he should approach me. It’s funny talking to my boys here because they say that they’re intimidated by women and have a hard time approaching them (I’m talking about tall, built men who don’t like they’re intimidated by anything). I don’t get it.
@Leila,
That’s not just the west coast, that’s the Midwest too. We actually went out and interviewed random single men about that and they said the same thing.
While I agree with this post (in theory) it seems the only place where this would truly be applicable would be in the South where men still have the gumption to walk up to a woman without feeling like he has to take his balls off and put them in her purse to do so.
@The Lioness,
Add the east coast to that list. The DMV has a good amount of men who will approach.
@Lil’T,
Really? Many of the women I know in the DMV have experienced the opposite. Especially in comparison to the guys in B-more up the hwy.
@The Lioness,
You ever thought that the reason why a lot of these dudes don’t step to sistas has less to do with “manhood” and more to do with “not wanting to get clowned”? Let’s not pretend that all women are acting like they will carry on a convo with anyone.
@T. Troy Stewart,
Whatever happened to go old fashioned risk taking? Why does everything have to be a sure thing anymore? Do you only apply for jobs that you are overqualified for? No. You go after the ones with the best salary & benefits. You apply to schools that you don’t have a shot in he double l in getting in to. You try anyway and hope for the best because even if there’s a 1% success rate, if you happen to be in that 1% then it’s all worth it. If you can do that in your career/education, you can do that in your dating life.
And MOST women will at least entertain a dude if he comes at her right. If she doesn’t, then she wasn’t in your 1% and you keep it moving.
if it were that simple why don’t more women pursue who they want?
simple…gals have a hard time dealing with rejection….
for us average looking dudes, well it’s a way of life….. not to mention demoralizing
@The Lioness, The South WILL still approach you…except it on the South it goes like this
Him: Ayo shawty…when you gonna sit on my face?
Me: What?
Him: Lean in so I can whisper it
Me: *Leans*
Him: When you gonna sit on my face *Sticks tongue in my ear*
Me: *Lean Back Quickly and Stare for a few seconds…then bust out laughing
Gotta love the South
@Siobhan means Woman of Wisdom,
*DIES @ the above foolishness*
@Siobhan means Woman of Wisdom,
As a woman who’s from the South, that sounds like a winner to me. LOL.
@Siobhan means Woman of Wisdom, Wow….LMFAO on that one…that is something my fellow southerns would say…SMH!!
@Siobhan means Woman of Wisdom,
I can’t even think the number of times some variation of that happened to me…it’s the South all day, and YES you must die from the madness.
I’m still trying to work out how that became a viable pick up line…even in HS.
*smh*
OMG, that “stick tongue in my ear” sh*t happened to me. I live in the DMV and I met this guy who was visiting from Texas. We had just met and he was trying to take me to a bar. When that didn’t work, he tried to take me back to his house and when that didn’t work tried to lick my ear. All this within 10 minutes of meeting me. What is that about??? Really
@Leila, The word intimidation always burns my toast. I don’t buy it. I think it’s just an excuse to get dumb women to chase them so they can sit lazily back and reap the benefits.
@Ms. Smart,
This doesn’t sound isolated at all. There has to be a reason, a cause for this lack of trying.
*Puttin on the Kevlar*
Are women themselves somehow effecting this change? Is it that dating is dead? Why date if you can get chex for cheap? I’m just sayin…
@Stank-0, You’re gonna make me pull out my MLK,Jr./Swanson Funeral Home church fan early in the week with those questions.
@Leila,
It’s funny talking to my boys here because they say that they’re intimidated by women and have a hard time approaching them
are your boys gay?
@all the girls, maybe these dudes are intimidated because they don’t have the finances that give a lot of guys courage and confidence (as they’ve had it beaten in their head that having money–and other pedigree-makers like professional degrees–is the only way the ladies will f*ck with men)
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
No.
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
there ya go how can mr walmart step to miss prada?
@BLUNTBLAZER,
Simple. By saying, “I find you attractive and would like to get to know you better.”
@The Lioness, whats the chances of that being sucessful
@BLUNTBLAZER,
or you can say “Would you like to see THESE balls?
@Stuff Ghetto People Like,
stop pandering… it does NOT become you.
Thanks,
Management.
@Leila,
Im in cali too and I wont approach a man either. I may do a ” flirty eye thing”..lol We have more than our fair share of bitchassed men out here. If hes a real man and interested he’ll holla..if not, press on homie..lol
of all the points you mentioned, i think your #1 hits it on the head. as much as i empathize with the struggles of approaching a woman, i still think its weak when men make it a mountain. get over it, you get to nap until an hr before the wedding, and i get to nap for an hr until i have to get ready. in short, deal.
oh, and your # 2? rude.
@overitnomore!, whatchu mean “no more”? booooooooooo!!!
@overitnomore!,
Hey I saw homegirl whose apt you took me to last week on 34th. She’s so cute! Did she tell u?
@Me fail english?, the runaway slave,
Hey I saw homegirl whose apt you took me to last week on 34th. She’s so cute! Did she tell u?
***filed under “things that lesbians probably say to each other all the time”***
@The Champ,
file deez…
…in ya mouf
@Me fail english?, the runaway slave,
*DEAD* iHate that iLove u
@Thuggie,
I accepted your Gchat and then it went bye-bye????
*needs to get up on this Gchat*
I’ve missed some FOOLISH convos because of not signing up for that thang yet. lol
Champ,
I first wanna say that men don’t grow on women either (well…not this woman. I know a few who have said “he’s kinda ugly but he likes me” or “he’s missing a tooth but I can tell him what to do” – I’ve actually heard these things said.) Those relationships have never lasted).
I also want to add that I agree with everything you said.
BUT…I think a woman can let a man know she’s interested. I have written here before about my patent-pending walk by, make eye contact, mutter “dayum” and walk away technique. That has always, always worked. I also, if with friends, will separate myself from the pack if I notice a cutie scoping me (if he’s fugly, we close in on each other).
By taking these steps, I let him him know that he won’t be immediately rejected or laughed at when he comes over. Closing the deal is up to him.
@V.E.G.,
Co-sign. Wholeheartedly. You said what I wanted to say but didn’t feel like typing out. lol
@Selah,
A woman letting a guy know that she’s interested, I think, is the best thing a woman can do. Guys still love a little chase..it gives us the impression that hopefully she’s not THAT easy as to where she has been around the block or smutted out by every Tom, Dick, and June Bug and ‘nem. In my experience, I have very rarely approached a woman until I had some type of inclination that I wouldn’t be shot down and rejected. I’m not throwing up half court shots when the lane is open for a lay up.
@Monk,
I’m not throwing up half court shots when the lane is open for a lay up.
lol, true, but you gotta be suspicious if the hoop is only four feet high
@The Champ,
lmao lololol its too early
@The Champ,
Really this doesn’t make any sense. How is the woman supposed to know that the guy isn’t “easy” himself? What if it’s a guy that approaches every woman in the hopes of reducing things down to a numbers game.
Perhaps it’s just me, but I only date women I’m actually interested in. If 100 women that don’t fit that category approach me, I would go home and figure out what I’m wearing.
@Monk,
True..true. Men are hunters by nature. Let a brotha know you interested without being too aggressive. Me personally..if I know I got u from jump street, that’s just gonna put me in “fallback” mode automatically and make me feel like I’m not pressed to close tha deal. Think about it as tha carrot on tha stick routine ladies. Put it out and let us know it’s there and let us chase. But don’t keep it out there too long cause eventually I expect 2 bite….
@V.E.G.,
Okay the seperating from the pack is a man move. You just supposed to look @ him in the eye from across the room like twice and touch yourself above the neck line. yeah
@V.E.G., BUUUUUUULLLLLLSHEEET. Men grow on women allll the time. If not for this little glitch in the woman’s matrix, half of us would never have had a chance. Our ability to overcome initial lukewarmness or even complete dislike is the only reason the human species hasn’t died off and been replaced at the top of the food chain by bears.Bears are bigger than us, stronger than us, and a much more handsome species in general. It is they who should rule the earth. But because for millenia, man has been able to talk, romance, lie, charm, and cajole women into liking them, we remain the top of the heap. I can’t tell you how many women told me they initially didn’t like me who I went on to sleep with. Women ARE much more succeptible to being sold on a man than vice versa, and thank Jeevus for that.
@Brandon St. Randy,
“Bears are bigger than us, stronger than us, and a much more handsome species in general. It is they who should rule the earth.”
LOL!!!! This sounds like some shet from South Park.
And I gotta agree with VEG. Physical attraction NEVER changes for me. In fact, I’ve dated some VERY, VERY physically attractive guys and they always look less attractive as time moves on. Then I see another chick drooling over dude, so I’m reminded I got a stunner. Heh, heh…
But that aside, I can friend zone (read: dead zone) a dude within mere seconds of making his acquaintance.
@Me fail english?, the runaway slave,
And I gotta agree with VEG. Physical attraction NEVER changes for me. In fact, I’ve dated some VERY, VERY physically attractive guys and they always look less attractive as time moves on. Then I see another chick drooling over dude, so I’m reminded I got a stunner. Heh, heh…
what brandon is trying to say is that most women can grow to like a guy that she’s not immediately physically attracted to. the physical attraction might not change, but everything else does, which makes them more sexually attractive.
we can’t.
@The Champ,
“most women can grow to like a guy that she’s not immediately physically attracted to”
Me fail and I are not among these women. Sue us.
@v.e.g.,
sue deez
@The Champ,
Thanks VEG. I thought that was clear in my post. And further, I’d argue that “most” women prob arent like that either. You’re not really growing on a woman just cause she hasnt left yet.
Maybe women are just more likely to go through the motions with someone that’s good-on-paper and that they can tolerate cause they dont wanna be alone or pay their own bills. I dont know too many of my girls that genuinely started liking some lame/busted dude, though I do know some that “surrendered”
@Me fail english?, the runaway slave ,
“You’re not really growing on a woman just cause she hasnt left yet.”
lol. Good way to put it.
@The Champ,
I guess what I’m trying to understand is why would someone date someone whom they don’t find attractive?
@kamakula,
“I guess what I’m trying to understand is why would someone date someone whom they don’t find attractive?”
That’s what I wanna know. The physical attraction, to me, differentiates that cool guy you like to hang with as “dateable” as opposed to “friendable”.
@Cheekie,
Exactly. Champ must be referring to the gold diggers and chicks to lazy to find a man they like.
@Brandon St. Randy,
Bears are bigger than us, stronger than us, and a much more handsome species in general. It is they who should rule the earth
lol, i actually have something coming this week along these lines and sh*t.
@The Champ,
I can wait ’til this post. Cuz I can’t imagine what you’d possibly have in store. lol
A post about handsome bears? A post about bears taking over the dating world? I’m so curious…
@V.E.G., CO-SIGN!
Accept I will proclaim that he has a nice ass…or some other attribute…because that’s just how I roll.
ugh.
@Miss Patterson,
Lol.
@Miss Patterson,
Reply of the year
@Miss Patterson,
I loved how this summed up an opinion better than any our tomes. It’s so simple, yet complex.
@Miss Patterson,
my bad. i didn’t think anyone would smell that
@Miss Patterson,
This… was poignant. Kudos
Thank u for writing this. Now I can just post a link to this whenever this comes up in the blogosphere. It will mean I won’t have to write it…again.
@Ms. Smart,
no problem and sh*t, ms smart. any time
what if you sort of bump into eachother in a field of buttercups in his backyard and exchange phone numbers and start talking about the clouds and the children. and what if at the end of this conversation, the dude says “hey, what are you getting into tonight? and then what if you say “nothing” and then he says “let’s exchange numbers”, but it’s pointless because you’re flight leaves real early the next day and you live 3,000 miles away. but, it’s cool because you end up doing the long distance thang, visit eachother, and eventually move to the same city. THEN whose fault is it if he turns out to be an inattentive, socially inept, LSD, text-only, mute, retard?
p.s.- i’m moving to utopia.
@Miss Matterson,
Miss Patterson is that you?!
@Miss Matterson, Then y’all moved without really knowing each other. *sigh* Sorry.
@Miss Matterson,
Okay easy on the girl pron.
This weekend I had some Voodoo Grand Met 10.5 % alcohol by volume, delicious.
I’m going to have to agree with this post. Maybe its just me, but the guys that I make the first move with all seem to be homotional clings that I end up dropping because of their femininity.
Cased closed. No further arguments needed. At least in my book.
@chaoticdiva,
homotional:
adj., a.)displaying b*tcha$$ness or punk-like tendencies. b.)skinny jeans.
@Ms. Hall,
why some yungster in red skinny jeans with a red mohawk tried ta mug me cause he was walkin in the middle of the street wit his ipod and i honked tha horn so he would move cause he cant hear shi. i was thinkin ninja i aint scare of you you cant even fit a 22 in them nuthuggers u aint gangsta
@BLUNTBLAZER,
LOL. I hate the mohawk. Almost as much as I hate sunshades in da club. Why are the parents allowing the young’ns to get this foolishness? I would allow my child to get a face tattoo before that mess.
@chaoticdiva,
Homotional = classic…I love you and the example you used. Like Eazy-E said in the “we want Eazy” video when asked why he wears his pants like that…easy access baby. I don’t condone the county jail sag, but I will take a Sag over a tight pants wearing p***y.
Bond.
@BlkBond,
I wish there was a ‘like’ button on this site.
I would use it all over your comment.
@BlkBond,
LMAO! the propaganda against skinny jeans on males must cease at once!
@postmodern pwnage,
Skinny jeans caused me to disown an entire generation. Where does the wang go when you rock skinny jeans? And why would a person buy jeans that skinny to sag them? Questions…
@Legendary Dash,
I passed a group of boys this morning waiting at the bus stop, and they all were sagging with their skinny jeans. When will the madness stop?!!!!
@Legendary Dash,
skinny jeans are 249.5% gay.
moving on..
@postmodern pwnage,
It’s not propaganda, simply the truth. I will also co-sign Dash–an entire generation of homotional, bromance-having, socially-inept, lames. Ugh. A bunch of fun boys dancing and twittering each other all day with loud a** clothes on. Disgusting. Only one thing is good about this…the amount of women b/w 18-25 me and my guys get to have our way with, because the guys their age are busy dancing & facebooking each other…LOL, thanks.
Bond. BlkBond.
@BlkBond,
I just googled “bromance”. What would compel a manly man to use such a word.
@BlkBond,
It’s one of the newer and PC ways to say something instead of using another term to describe these relationships. This was added to the lexicon some time ago. I have hella 2520 friends,classmates, former co-workers, etc. (shrugs).
Bond.
@BlkBond,
LMAO. I wanna make your whole comment my status update on twitter. Too bad I don’t twitter.
@postmodern pwnage,
love you but… umm….
SADDOWN.
How in heaven’s name are you attracted to a man whose jeans are tighter than yours? Just HOW?!?!?!
@postmodern pwnage,
Is it propoganda or is there clearly a movement??? Basically, they’re like mini-metrosexuals but worse, cuz they’re lookin almost asexual. Throw in the sunshine yellow, neon pink & lime green and they’re now elevated to homosexual. Or so it seems…Jus sayin’.
@postmodern pwnage, There is an ignored upside of skinny jeans. Tight things around man parts discourage sperm from being sperm. With continued use of skinny jeans, these men won’t be able to reproduce.
@Ms. Smart,
These fun boys don’t care, it’s not like they’re having chex with anyone…lol.
Bond. BlkBond.
@postmodern pwnage,
“LMAO! the propaganda against skinny jeans on males must cease at once!”
U must be a male skinny jeans-connoisseur. o_O Yes, I’m judging you
@postmodern pwnage, Skinny jeans aren’t a big deal…the day-glo style is amusing. I was in England when that REALLY got started in Europe around 02 so America is just late (as usual with fashion).
With that said…I watched that “You’re a Jerk” video…those jeans are STRETCH LOL…if they weren’t they would have split in TWO! It’s HILARIOUS!
@chaoticdiva,
See, you shoulda gotten a copyright on homotional cuz I’m d@mn sure adding it to my colloquialism collection…
You are a Meanie for the Kwanzaa diss. I hope KwanzaaKlaus doesn’t bring you sh¤t on December 26th!
I can see and respect your point. But as a woman sort of getting my feet wet again in this whole dating thing I see things differently.
Things have changed as far as roles in relationships and dating. To me people [men] just don’t try that hard anymore. There used to be something kind of nice and innocent about dating but now there is a lot of work involved. I know in most places we out number you all so it is doing the work! Maybe a woman approaching a man is her just trying to make something happen? This is one I have to think longer on because on the one hand we are told that we are to be these strong independent women yet we can’t approach a dude who aint got the stones to approach us? Or he knows that he possibly has more options? I thank you for your honest blog but it just left me confrustrated.
@Yaa,
Yeah I wish I could disagree here too. But as a woman who used to “bag” dudes, I gotta agree they never wind up being what I wanted. But on the other hand, I’ve run into dudes that bagged me and still wound up being bishes. Damned if u do, damned if u don’t.
@Yaa,
“This is one I have to think longer on because on the one hand we are told that we are to be these strong independent women yet we can’t approach a dude who aint got the stones to approach us”
do you want to be with a guy without the stones to approach you?
@The Champ, Never thought about it like that. I guess if my personality is strong enough to make the first move then I’d get bored easily w/him huh? Damn you Champ and your thought provoking blogs!!!!!
I agree with this. I tend to think that–along with the whole “how can the man kill lions to protect you if he can’t even approach you?” idea–the man who gets bagged by the woman will have an inflated sense of importance. and the relationship will be all skewed and shifty. i mean, both parties should be into each other reciprically and all that, but the fact is that one person is going to like the other one a lil’ bit more. and that someone should be the man.
i do, however, think it’s okay to help bring the man home when you know he’s interested and you are too. i’ve been known to up the touching and accidental rub against’s to give the guy confidence if i know what he’s trying to get around to.
@charli skipper,
“but the fact is that one person is going to like the other one a lil’ bit more. and that someone should be the man.”
Why?
@Monk,
“but the fact is that one person is going to like the other one a lil’ bit more. and that someone should be the man.”
you know, a part of me recoiled when initially reading that, but i think there’s some truth to that statement. while the relationship shouldn’t stay that way, in the beginning, its probably best that a man has a bit more interest in the woman than vice versa.
like i said in number 2, we can make up the difference, but a woman never can.
@Monk,
Because I da*n said so.
@charli skipper,
But, seriously, men have been known to turn into huge d-bags when they suddenly realize, “oh! you haven’t grown on me. after 5 years, i just discovered that i don’t want to be with you anymore.” women usually try to break their lack of feelings for a guy to him easily, to spare him. but men are just like, “you’re old b*tch, i’m done!”
for security purposes, a woman should not be tryin to pursue a man that she is more into than vice versa. because one day he’s going to grow a pair, think he can do better, and break her world down.
@charli skipper,
Now this has never been my experience in bag-a-man-world. I’m the woman goddamnit! Past the initial # exchange I go back to playing my old school gender role and dude can get with it or get lost. And funny enough, I’ve never had any problems in this regard. The dudes I bagged always knew to take over. In fact, some of em got extra aggressive once bagged cuz they assumed I was more into them than I was. I asked for your phone # fool. Not to have yo’ babies!