Dating, Relationships, & Sex

These Are The Tales, The PJ Tales, Part III

photo (3)When we last left our hero, Panama, he was looking like a damn fool after being given as much of a green light as possible in a mall in Chattanooga, Tennessee by the object of his admiration out of bounds from their normal center of dalliance.

My senior year (and her junior year) went by like any other last year. Fast as f*ck as I attempted to figure out what I was doing with my life. Jackie pledged Delta, because of course she pledged Delta. I’d again see her millions of times and never say sh*t. To be honest, by this point, I was over myself. And it ain’t like I wasn’t dealing with other women anyway. She’d gone from woman I was intrigued by to symbol of my need to step up to the plate more. She achieved a purpose in my life by being a reminder of just how wack I was in certain areas of life. Hell, my senior year of college I fell all the way in love with another woman from Spelman who I’d eventually end up dating for like a year. She is the reason why I don’t date Jamaicans anymore. Point is, while I was still checking for Jackie, I’d chalked it up as an L and sorta moved on.

For most stories, this would be the end. I graduated and moved to DC and she went off to do whatever it is she was going to do whether we ever met or not.

But God has a sense of humor. Which brings us to the final chapter in this tawdry affair. And it happened in Durham, North Carolina in September 2003. By that point, I’d just finished up my Master’s Degree from the University of Maryland-College Park. It turns out that in September 2003, Morehouse College would be playing NC Central University in football in Durham, NC. One of my boys was going to be DJing a party that a gang of Morehouse cats were throwing so me and my other homeboy decided to drive down to the game and party. It was the first time Morehouse was playing Central so it was a bit of a big deal b/c most of us from DC had to go way down south to see Morehouse play. This was a four hour drive.

All in.

I don’t remember sh*t about that game because both teams suck. I’m positive Morehouse lost though. That much I’m sure about. But here’s what I do remember about this game.

Me and the compadres are sitting in the bleachers. Watching the game soaking in the NC sun. North Carolina has a beautiful sun, which explains why so many beautiful women come from there. Yes, lawd.

Out of the blue, who but who do I see walking up the steps and then sitting down like two rows in front of me and across the little aisle.

Jackie.

Mind you, there was nobody at this game so I had PERFECT line-of-sight. I was stuck like Chuck and am pretty sure I said, loudly, “GET THE F*CK OUT OF HERE!!!”

She didn’t hear me but like all people do at games when you’re sitting in the stands you look around to see who else is there. She looked behind her about 87 degrees saw me and had one of those “WTF” looks on her face. Like a true look of holy sh*t! I’m fairly certain our faces shared that look.

Did I go speak to her? Of course not. For the rest of the game we both did the “look and pretend we didn’t” thing. Some of her friends showed up and she ended up rushing off while I looked on in a tortured…what am I doing with my life manner.

Fast forward to the party. Now, I had a bit of comfort in knowing that because this party we were attending was the Morehouse party, if she was still there, she’d be there. And lo and behold, she showed up with some friends, a few of whom I knew from Spelman.

Keep in mind, this is two years after Morehouse and I’m kind of in a different lane so I’m a lot more confident at this point. So this time…I was determined to go speak to her. Sounds like I’m about to win the game right?

I see her by herself and I walk right up to her and say, “hello…how are you? I remember you from Spelman and the many times I saw you around campus. What’s your name?”

Her: I’m Jackie. I remember you too.

Me: Well it’s nice to finally meet you.

Her: What is your name?? (Important to note, she asked me this with some urgency, kind of caught me off guard)

Me: I’m Panama. (Despite being donned with the nickname Panama in 2001, I did not actually refer to myself as such until I started blogging in 2004)

Her: Do you live here?

Me: No, I live in DC. I came down for the game.

Her: Oh. Do you make it down here often?

Me: No. In fact, this is the first time I’ve been here. (Funny enough, and I’ll get to it, but after that night, I actually DID make it down there often…but I’ll get to that)

Her: Oh. I’m glad you came over to say hello! Weelllll (dawdling), my friends and I are about to leave…so….

Does he do it? Does he go in for the kill? Does he man up and ask for her number and say, hey…I would love to stay in touch if it’s possible because I’d like to get to know you better?

Me: Cool. Well it was nice to meet you Jackie…enjoy your evening!

Walks off…AGAIN.

In the history of green lights, I’m pretty sure that was the greenest light I’ve ever been given. Almost as if it the light itself said, “dumb a**, all you have to do is ask for it. Literally, that’s all…just say the words, “can I have your number to call you sometime?” That’s it. But I couldn’t do it. Not even for the vine, which was about 9 years away from being invented.

She looked at me funny then left into the night. I kicked myself AGAIN for not even trying to get her information or giving her mine. My email or phone number or something…SOMETHING. DC ain’t nothing but four hours away…back then I’d take a road trip in a heartbeat.

Oddly enough, at this same party, I got a woman’s phone number who lived in Durham and was at the dentistry school at UNC and was a Delta from Howard, and we ended up dating for a while. So I was back and forth to Durham quite a bit.

Thus ends the tale of Panama’s Immaculate Fumble. I feel like I had been given as many opportunities as one man deserves. If you fumble that many times, its just not meant to be. She’s happily married now and doing quite well based on what I know. Again, I’m friends with a bunch of her friends here in DC. And I can’t complain about life either. Things happen the way they’re supposed to. But I still think back to how bad I f*cked the dog in this regard. Forget what could have been; it’s unimportant.

I literally SUCKED at attempting to talk to the woman that I had been interested in, in a very real way, for years. Obviously, I’m over it and I don’t have that problem anymore. But Jackie reigns supreme in my life as a memory of a real time and a real lesson learned. In that sense, I’m glad she happened. She’s one of those women I’ll never forget, even though I never even knew her.

Thanks, Jackie. You’re aces. And in the words of Bill Withers…

…I wish you well.

-VSB P aka MR. YOU WONT CATCH ME SLIPPIN’ NOWADAYS aka GIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRL HE A 3

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Damon Young

Panama Jackson is pretty fly for a light guy. He used to ship his frito to Tito in the District, but shipping prices increased so he moved there to save money. When he's not saving humanity with his words or making music with his mouth, you can find him at your mama's mama's house drinking her fine liquors. Most importantly, he believes the children are our future.

  • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

    It brings me great comfort knowing that even an extrovert’s extrovert was that shook over a woman . . . for yearS.

    • http://stanoffewwords.wordpress.com/ Tristan

      Word, extrovert envy be real yo. I caught myself being jealous of a bum talking to a girl on the train. Like he hasn’t bathed all week and still got more confidence than me smh

      • CrayolaGirl

        You are hilarious.

      • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

        Got me feeling hurt with these homeless dudes pulling numbers and I’m out here awkwardly exchanging eye contract for 25min on the train.

        • Val

          To be fair to you though those “homeless” dude’s success is based on them talking to a very high number of women just to get one number. Prolly like one number per every thousand women talked to.

      • T.Q. Fuego

        BOL! Them dudes are inspiring man. They don’t talk about “I got no fukcs to give” they really live the sh*t lol

    • panamajackson

      Yeah…crazy right. To be fair, that last time I saw her, I pretty much hadn’t thought about her in the 2 years since I’d graduated b/c of other life goings ons. But that last time was truly a blast from the past and took me right back to my lack of confidence place. lol.

  • BeautifullyHuman

    Since you couldn’t build up the courage to tell her yourself, why didn’t you have a mutual friend do it on your behalf?

    I’m positive you had a wingman somewhere in this…lol

    • BeautifullyHuman

      And most importantly, how do you walk away with some random chick’s number and not the girl of your dreams???

      That’s comedy in itself. Lol

      • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

        Ish is difficult. DIFFICULT. You don’t even understand.

        • BeautifullyHuman

          I believe it. As a woman, I’m not too familiar with that fear that men sometimes have when approaching a woman. Especially when you’re not too sure how the person will respond in kind. Some women do the most.

          I can sympathize.

          • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

            Honestly, my fear is largely in investing too much in the conversation and getting little returns. Like her asking me how I feel about X and I take the time out to elaborate as lucidly as I possibly can my feelings and thoughts in regards to whatever subject matter and she in return gives me a rather pithy response. LOATHE IT.

            There are only a handful of people I’ve conversed with in my life where I felt that conversation was immediately substantiative enough for me to want to continue revealing portions of myself to this person. That’s not to say/imply that they were all (or even most of them) immediately fluid with a back-and-forth as though we’ve known each other for our entire lives. Just that I felt that she was putting in some effort to engage with me as I was with her.

            Me putting myself out there is something extremely important to me and being met with apathy just makes me not want to talk to a person again for weeks at a time. I’d honestly much rather someone flat out say “I don’t want to talk to you” than feign interest or passively back out of the conversation or let it hang in the air like women tend to do when approached.

            • BeautifullyHuman

              You know though…you’re a pretty interesting and complex guy, especially for your age. I can totally see a lot of younger, uninformed women not knowing how to engage you.

              I’m always impressed with your Tumblr and your insights.

              You posses a certain honesty and vulnerability in your answers and I’m sure they don’t know how to respond to that.

              • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                @Ms. BH:
                Then aren’t you arguing in favor of the very things I profferred yesterday – that there IS such an animal, as a (Black) Woman who passes on a Ricky when young and hawt, and then finally sees the light at the fag end of her fertility, often with a few kids in tow sired by Mr. You Know Who, and now has an interest in him?

                If so, what is the upside for our young hero Ricky? What is he getting that’s so great, at that juncture – say, 15 5o 20 years(!!!) from now? How is that anything to shout about?

                Please explain? Thanks!

                O.

                • BeautifullyHuman

                  I’m not too sure if what I wrote is in favor of your argument, as I didn’t read it yesterday, nor do I often get the opportunity to read every single comment; however, I believe that both women and men (excluding race/ethnicity) pass on certain great opportunities for others that don’t really serve their best interests.

                  I think that can be attributed to the folly of youth. Sometimes when you’re young, you don’t think about long term consequences and who might actually be in your best interest.

                  But yes, I think there are people out there who pass on good people only to regret their decisions later. I won’t exactly play into your generalization about Black Women because this situation happens to a degree to almost anyone in the dating world. You get passed up, so do I at some point. We have no control over the object of our affection’s desires.

                  I’m not too sure what you’re getting at with our hypothetical “hero.” Personally speaking, I think Ricky (Malik) will be okay. He’s intelligent, deep, and multi-layered. There’s not a doubt in my mind that he will find a congenial partner who understands him on his most intimate level.

                  • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                    @Ms. BH:
                    “I’m not too sure if what I wrote is in favor of your argument, as I didn’t read it yesterday, nor do I often get the opportunity to read every single comment; however, I believe that both women and men (excluding race/ethnicity) pass on certain great opportunities for others that do really serve their best interests.”

                    O: It would behoove you to make time to read my commentaries, starting with yesterday’s (as well as my weekly columns over at Just Four Guys!); doing so will put things into their proper context and perspective, making the case from a particular Black male point of view that simply doesn’t get the airtime it so rightly deserves. That changes, Now.

                    “I think that can be attributed to the folly of youth. Sometimes when you’re young, you don’t think about long term consequences and who might actually be in your best interest.”

                    O: Sure; but ignorance of the Law, in this case Universal and Natural, is no Defence, I’m afraid. Penalties must be meted out regardless.

                    And, they will.

                    “But yes, I think there are people out there who pass on good people only to regret their decisions later. I won’t exactly play into your generalization about Black Women because this situation happens to a degree to almost anyone in the dating world. You get passed up, so do I at some point. We have no control over the object of our affection’s desires.”

                    O: This is a Black forum; why not confine our discourse to that sector of the human population? You know, I find that Black Women are so averse to critique, that they will do any and everything they can to squirm and weasel their way out of it(!). We are discussing Black Women here; of course, not ALL Black Women; but Black Women nevertheless. Why can’t we simply deal with that, and let the chips fall where they may, without all the qualifiers and caveats and goalposting shifting and Red Herring tossing? I say it’s because of the guilty conscious on the part of many of you – not all, but enough.

                    “I’m not too sure what you’re getting at with our hypothetical “hero.” Personally speaking, I think Ricky (Malik) will be okay. He’s intelligent, deep, and multi-layered. There’s not a doubt in my mind that he will find a congenial partner who understands him on his most intimate le vel.”

                    O: Nor do I – but you have not addressed my crucial point – chances are likely that this will NOT happen until after homegirl gets burned, has kids (and a bit of weight, ahem) in tow, is saddled down with debt, et al. If you will kindly checkout my commentary yesterday, you will see my method of questioning ladies I’ve been out with; would it surprise you to know that they couldn’t answer me?

                    Why should a Ricky, a decade or more from now, partner with such a lady? What is the upside for him? What are the bennies? Can you list them out for us? Perhaps you can do so since so many here either cannot or will not.

                    If you know anything about me, you will know that I don’t do abstract theories; I roll on Experience, both my own and that of others. I wed Theory with Practical Application, out in the field and in realtime. I say all that to say, that I’ve been where Ricky is, right now, and I can tell him what he’s likely to encounter. He would not be wrong to question those ladies who, only a decade-plus later on down the line, with all their baggage who now see the light at the end, “Why me? Why Now?”

                    And insist on them giving him some straight answers.

                    They owe him that much.

                    O.

                    • BeautifullyHuman

                      I don’t have the most time today, but I’ll try to hit on a few of your points:

                      “O: Sure; but ignorance of the Law, in this case Universal and Natural, is no Defence, I’m afraid. Penalties must be meted out regardless.”

                      I agree with this. Although we’re given the ability to choose and sometimes not in our best interests, we ultimately get what we get. Should we choose to ignore the red flags, we have to deal with the impending repercussions. If we let a great catch go because they don’t meet certain superficial requirements, we have to be prepared for that person falling into the lap of another and us possibly wanting it later at some point.

                      O: This is a Black forum; why not confine our discourse to that sector of the human population? You know, I find that Black Women are so averse to critique, that they will do any and everything they can to squirm and weasel their way out of it(!).

                      I get it, but your tone and approach many times is far too condescending regarding Black women and thus, your points often get overlooked. You’re within your right to critique Black women and Black people as a whole; however, you read very condescending and misogynist at times. Perhaps, if you step outside the frame sometimes, you might be able to see the larger picture.

                      “Why should a Ricky, a decade or more from now, partner with such a lady? What is the upside for him? What are the bennies? Can you list them out for us? Perhaps you can do so since so many here either cannot or will no”

                      I still haven’t read your argument from yesterday (I might at some point during the weekend) but speaking from the surface…I can’t see why he would be interested in dating someone with baggage when his own doesn’t match said person’s. Outside of the possibility of loving someone and accepting them for who they are and what they bring with them, and having that requited, I don’t think there are too many benefits to this situation.

                      I’d personally advise against dating someone who isn’t evenly yoked with you, but hey…the heart wants with the heart wants. And if one is willing to explore that, then they should be prepared for whatever possible outcomes.

                    • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                      @Ms. BH:
                      “I don’t have the most time today, but I’ll try to hit on a few of your points:”
                      O: OK…

                      “I agree with this. Although we’re given the ability to choose and sometimes not in our best interests, we ultimately get what we get . Should we choose to ignore the red flags, we have to deal with the impending repercussions. If we let a great catch go because they don’t meet certain superficial requirements, we have to be prepared for that person falling into the lap of another and us possibly wanting it later at some point.”

                      O: Fair enough; I can work with that.

                      “I get it, but your tone and app roach many times is far too condescending regarding Black women and thus, your points often get overlooked. You’re within your right to critique Black women and Black people as a whole; however, you read very condescending and misogynist at times. Perhaps, if you step outside the frame sometimes, you might be able to see the larger picture.”

                      O: LOL. What have I said that “reads as misogynist”, pray tell? You know our Republic is in the deep end of the you know what when critique is equated with irrational hatred. And it’s Women more than anyone else who overreacts in such an irrational manner. I say that it is my interlocutors (all of whom are NOT Women, I might add), who need to take a step back and get some fresh air, THEN come back and actually address what I’ve said.

                      As for the “condescending” nonsense – I am civil with any and everyone until I’m personally attacked – then, I rip my opponent’s head off and have dinner over their still-warm corpse. The moral of this story, madam, is You No Mess With the Obsidian. We can have a civil discourse, or I can rhetorically cut you into little pieces. Your choice – but, either way, the conversation, WILL happen.

                      “Why should a Ricky, a decade or more from now, partner with such a lady? What is the upside for him? What are the bennies? Can you list them out for us? Perhaps you can do so since so many here either cannot or will no”

                      “I still haven’t read your argument from yesterday (I might at some point during the weekend) but speaking from the surface…I can’t see why he would be interested in dating someone with baggage when his own doesn’t match said person’s. Outside of the possibility of loving someone and accepting them for who they are and what they bring with them, and having that requited, I don’t think there are too many benefits to this situation.”

                      O: The reality is that it is becoming increasingly difficult for guys like Ricky to find (Black) Women who aren’t saddled with debt, have kids be previous marriages/relationships/situationships, often sired by Mr. You Know Who – and this is only compounded as the years go by. I can tell him and anyone else who wishes to hear it how often I’ve encountered such situations – to be told “you’re who I’ve should have met back then” – and now, they see the light.

                      Well – I want them to sell themselves to me – like George Clooney had the greenhorn gal do in Up In The Air. Go: sell me on how and why I should partner with someone like you? What’s in it for me? List it out. Should be easy enough to do, yes?

                      But, you see, Women, and this includes Black, feel they shouldn ‘t have to do any such thing, and are often “offended” by merely being asked to do so(!). Now, in truth, I know why they won’t do it – it’s because of what they have between their thighs, and they feel that the whole of Mankind is seeking access. Though they would have legitimate reason to think that way, their crucial flaw is, as always, the Devil being in the Details – there IS a such thing as a Brotha who is not at all Thirsty. Indeed, a few of us can actively resist direct overtures. Imagine the Shock & Awe on the faces of the many, many, manymanymany ladies whom I have posed such questions! I tell ya, that’s worth the price of admission all by itself!

                      “I’d personally advise against dating someone who isn’t evenly yoked with you, but hey…the heart wants with the heart wants. And if one is willing to explore that, then they should be prepared for whatever possible outcomes.”

                      O: LOL…your naïveté has a certain allure. Youth, perhaps.

                      O.

              • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

                I don’t know. I’m probably a lot to deal with when I sincerely talk to a woman than I realize.

          • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

            Are you sure you’re a woman? I swear I mention this stuff to other women, and you’d swear I had the Movie Voice Guy go “In a world..” LOL

            • BeautifullyHuman

              100% woman.

          • http://batman-news.com MicTheMessenger

            MANE. Some women do, especially if they’re usd to being approached and it seems like its often all the time or never (i could be wrong). But when you want something you want, it’s all desire. It sounds like your heart is pumping in your ears. This damn ego is just too fragile. I think the reason why it’s difficult to approach someone is because it’s all on the line.
            I’d also like to add my speculation as to why women will “set up the oop” but men gotta catch and finish. Cuz no one wants to be left hanging. From an old world stand point, I don’t know if women should be approaching men unless you’re about that life. It’s important for women to know dude is down for the cause and willing to ride for her on a primal level. It’s chivalry, although based on the current population count and what’s deemed as a worthy mate, the odds aren’t in women’s favor.
            In all, who doesn’t wanna know they are desired? What woman doesn’t want to know that a man will put himself out there for her and risk embarrasment and rejection? Funny how the same thing affects both parties.

        • tgtaggie

          Ain’t it tough. Its hard out here for us introverted brothas.

          • jazzyLia

            As an extrovert I didn’t understand how real this struggle was until I became friends with an introverted guy. He’d always tell me these stories about women he was interested in, who, in my opinion were giving him a roadmap, wearing neon signs, and having a homegirl hold up cue cards for him to read off of but he just couldn’t get over the anxiety of small talk (and his fear of rejection). He’s 33 and still single (and a pretty decent dude), po’ lil tink, tink…

            • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

              In my experience, “obvious” signs are usually things like wearing non-earth tones, smiling approximately 3 mm wider than usual, laughing at jokes or turning your foot 13 degrees closer to him than normal. That isn’t obvious. Obvious is, say, (and I’m taking this line from my personal history) I wanna suck the skin off your D. Or, come over, and I’ll show you whether I’m lying or not. Or women straight asking me out. THAT is obvious.

              • jazzyLia

                “I wanna suck the skin off your D. Or, come over, and I’ll show you whether I’m lying or not.”

                I’m DYING over here at the thought of saying this to the hottie at my gym.

                I understand your point on wanting to be approached, but for someone who has had ZERO success with making the first move… I suppose I’d never get the introverted / slightly socially awkward set out with me on a date.

            • panamajackson

              Po’ lil Tink Tink for real. lol

            • SweetSass

              Yeah, shy guys… I feels for ‘em. (And all ova ‘dem.)

        • http://brown-c6h12o6.tumblr.com/ RubyWooWho

          No it’s not. I walk up to men all the time and bag. Easy.

          • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

            We have wildly different ease at small talk.

            • http://brown-c6h12o6.tumblr.com/ RubyWooWho

              Small talk is wack and I hate it though. But you are right. I can see you floundering with something like that. I try to get you to be better but let me help you help yourself.

          • SweetSass

            AfroPetite gives positively no f__’s…

      • panamajackson

        It is comedy. I got nothing.

    • nillalatte

      I think Panama was in college, last years of college. A wingman? Seriously.
      This is how I picture that encounter… LOL
      Wingman: My friend over there, in the corner, with the cell phone in his face not looking cool, yeah, he’d like to get to know you.
      Girl: (suspect: setup) Why didn’t he come over himself then?

      Wingman: He’s shy and, well, you know, wanted to know if you’re interested?
      Girl: (*this guy has to be a psychopath) Yeah, sure. Tell him to come over here himself tho.

      Wingman: Cool. I’ll tell him.

      Girl: (*thinking, leave now, leave now, LEAVE NOW!!!)

      • BeautifullyHuman

        I think she would’ve gave him the pass on the wingman because I’m sure she wanted to explore or at the very least understand these awkward encounters.

      • jazzyLia

        A wingman could of worked in this, actually, though not in the manner you described. A good wingman would of started chatting it up with one of her friends (didn’t matter who or about what) to keep the woman around a few minutes longer to give his homie a few minutes longer to get out of his own head and speak up, or to give her a chance to do so. Though I do agree that wingmen at the college level would of sprouted that “my friend over there…” ish.

        • Epsilonicus

          Naw. I was a pro-wingman in college. I would have set i up so well that they would call us Lob City.

      • http://stanoffewwords.wordpress.com/ Tristan

        Well in that sense yes, you cant make it that obvious the wingman supposed to start convo and be like you know my boy P right and pass the torch

        • panamajackson

          LOL. Right.

      • panamajackson

        I think in this instance it would have seemed ridiculous. Granted I know she knew who I was…but I’m also making a fairly large leap in assuming she actually was interested…so…assuming she was, she probably would have been even more annoyed. Not only are you not coming over yourself, you’re sending goons???

    • panamajackson

      You know, at one point, I did ask a mutual friend of ours to put in a word for me. She refused. She never even told me why. She just refused.

      • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

        Cause she has hate in her heart.

      • Val

        The mutual friend may have been crushing on you.

      • LMNOP

        I’m picturing her passing Jackie a note “Panama likes you. Do you want to go out with him? _yes _no”

  • nillalatte

    You brought us down to that on a Friday?! I should…. ugh. On the real, I think you felt something, but that something was ‘maybe I should stay the F away from this one. She bad, but, yeah, it ain’t gonna’ happen. I’ll admire from a distance.” I think if you wanted it and felt it was right, you would have pursued.

    And this, “I would love to stay in touch if it’s possible because I’d like to get to know you better?” Wow. That must be a standard pick up line. People always wanting to stay in touch… until they’re not.

    • panamajackson

      Saying “stay in touch” is simple and everybody knows what it means. They teach us that in Kindergarten.

  • http://brown-c6h12o6.tumblr.com/ RubyWooWho

    I stopped reading at “North Carolina has a beautiful sun, which explains why so many beautiful women come from there. Yes, lawd.” because WHERE. IS. THE. LIE?! WHERE IS IT?!!!!!!!

    • tgtaggie

      One of the baddest chicks I’ve ever seen came from the area code 252……

      • http://brown-c6h12o6.tumblr.com/ RubyWooWho

        Rocky Mt? Greenville?

        • tgtaggie

          I think a small town outside of Rocky Mt. I would say that was my “Jackie”. lol. I fumbled so bad. I was like Roy Hibbert playing in the finals

          • Val

            Lol@a small town outside of Rocky Mt.

            That’s like saying a big town outside New York City.

            • panamajackson

              I laughed at that too.

          • jazzyLia

            as someone who spent 2 ill fated years living in the 252 and working in Rocky Mount, I’m shocked that anyone would say anything good comes from the area. Ratchet Mount is the official unofficial name nowadays. So, I suppose I can see anyone going gaga over a bad chick from there (a rare sight indeed)

            • tgtaggie

              I heard the same thing too. Lol. I think she was from Roanoke Rapids

            • http://brown-c6h12o6.tumblr.com/ RubyWooWho

              It’s an interesting little town lol All of what you said is true.

            • camilleblue

              Girl…I had to work in *Tha R-ruh* for a month for my job. I was like…what in the entire hayle is going on here?

              • jazzyLia

                I wouldn’t wish it on my enemies. The entire 252 is the armpit of the Carolinas. When I lived in VA, I would see the signs on 95 for Rocky Mount like it was some big city.

    • http://stanoffewwords.wordpress.com/ Tristan

      I’ve seen some “lies” in Durham

      • http://brown-c6h12o6.tumblr.com/ RubyWooWho

        I believe it lol

    • panamajackson

      I’ve met more than my fair share of super bad women from North Carolina. Even women I’ve just met who were inNC.

      Or drove thru. NC does something to the women.

  • IcePrincess

    Dang, P. You prolly gave that girl a complex. Yall mufuggas were traveling the whole United States wit this f*ckery. Lmao. I hope writing this peice gave you some closure. Since you & Jackie still know mutual people, I wonder will she read this. Hmmmmmm….

    • afronica

      You know she wondered for yearzzzz what the deal was.

      • IcePrincess

        Ikr?! She had to reevaluate her life after that. Looool

        • Sweet Ga Brown

          Her pet peeve is a man that won’t say sh!t.

          • http://stanoffewwords.wordpress.com/ Tristan

            Her man now gets the 3rd degree because he doesn’t know what he wants for dinner

          • IcePrincess

            Rite!! Kno why she married now? Cuz after the whole Panama snafu, the first dude that came at her halfway correct, she let wife her up. She was feeling some type of way lmfaoooo

            • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

              @Ms. IcePrincess:
              I’m just gonna go on ahead and put it out there: WHITE WOMEN STEP UP when they like a guy. I’ve seen it happen over and over again over the years.

              Last year here in the forum, I relayed a story about how me and one of my buds was hanging out on South St., and how we got shot down like Japanese “zero” planes by a gaggle of Sistas – but when we stepped to some White chicks, they hopped right on it.

              Mind you, we weren’t trying to pick anyone up; just wanted to hang out with some feminine company.

              Once we got to where we were going, the Sistahood, seeing us all together busting it up and laughing, etc., decided to make a scene. Scared them White gals to death, too I might add.

              Sistas keep shooting themselves in the foot and then wondering why they can’t walk straight…

              O.

              • Rawtid

                why you continue to make this an issue of race is hilarious and annoying at the same damn time

                • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                  Translation: “I wish I sure knew how to quit you”

                  LOL

                  O.

                • Epsilonicus

                  I have had an experience similar to O’s

                  I was at a party in college and there was a pair of roommates, one Black one White. I approached the young sista for a bit. We had a great convo but not any clear signals. Later that evening I chatted her White roommate. Her roommate was a lot more clear in her intentions. She asked for my number and hit me the next day and we went out for lunch.

                  The Black roommate told me later that she was interested. I told her that she should have said something because are signals were confusing.

                  I will say that overall, The White women I have encountered were more willing to make a move if interested. I have dated Black women willing to do so to, just in fewer numbers. However, women overall don’t make a move and I do not get why. It makes no sense to me.

              • IcePrincess

                Dang. I mean, there is truth to some stereotypes, maybe white people ARE extra friendly or whatever, I really don’t kno. Did a group of BW in the bar really confront your group? Wow. But I’m sure you held it down. You prolly roasted that azz to pieces! A situation like that (when someone actually deserves it) is your perfect time to shine, O. ????

                • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                  @Ms. IcePrincess:
                  Well, I try! ;)

                  But, to answer your query: oh yes, it happend as your humble correspondent has repoorted. As I said, I’ve relayed this incident in the forum before, but just for shakes and giggles, I will briefly recount here for your consideration:

                  It was Summer some years ago, and the O-Man got a nice little inheritance from a dearly departed relative going on to her reward (the ladies, have always loved me). Deciding to have some fun, I rang up one of my best buds – “Kevin” – and suggested that we paint the town red.

                  He came through picked me up and off we went; after making a few stops along the way, we wound up on South St., one of the city’s hotspots. By now it was about 9pm and sweltering hot. And the ladies of all colors, were out in force.

                  Because I like enjoying whiling away the time among the ladies, and because I was holding the purestrings, I suggested to Kevin that he hit up the small group of Sistas across the way from us at about 6th & South, while I secure us a spot at one of the eateries dotting the thoroughfare; I instructed him to inform the ladies that dinner, drinks and all was on me; just show up.

                  I selected our venue – Johnny Rockets – and as I was instructing the wait staff as to what kind of table I required, etc, I could see through the window the Sistas shooting down Kevin before he could even get a shot off – a classic Nuclear Rejection of seismic proportions. Now, let me tell you – Kevin is a good looking guy with formidable success with the ladies, so this ain’t no tomato can we’re talking about here.

                  as I walked out to meet Kevin, out of the corner of my eye I spied two cute White gals chatting amongst themselves at a cafe’s style table. Instantly, the O-Man transforms into Urban Human Mating & Social Dynamics Experiment Mode – and without any further thought, I approach them, and request their presence – same deal, dinner and drinks, on my dollar.

                  Boom! The Beckys hop right up, all chipper and whatnot, and come right along. We’re all seated, with Kevin and I sitting against the wall so as to be able to keep an eye on the front door (standard operating procedure for the O-Man).

                  Things are swimmingly well – we learn that our ladies for the evening are homegrown, from South Philly, and attending one of the local unis. We were finishing up dinner and knocking back another malted, when in comes a gaggle of Sistas, decked out in Afrocentric attaire – they had just come in from Odunde’. They got settled in about two tables over, and right from the rip they see us and out come the daggers and deathrays.

                  At just about that moment, Kevin gets up to get the attention of the waitstaff; as he’s walking by the Sistas of Odunde’, he greets them and asks “how ya doin’?'”

                  The Mother Hen Sista responds: “Not so good, Brotha!” with that exagggerated neckroll the Sistas are so well known for. She then goes on to mention that it always seems that the “good” Brothas are “hugged up with European Women”, to which her fellow Sistas chime in from the chorus: “Ummmm-hmmm!”

                  Kevin, an affable guy, attempts to explain what happened prior to the arrival of the Odunde’ contingent, but to no avail; the Sistahood ain’t tryin’ too hear it. Simply put, we’re infused with “self-hate”, are “sellouts”, mentions of Clarence Thomas are uttered, you get the idea.

                  At this point, Kevin becomes indignant: “Wait a minute. First, who are any of you to tell me and my friend O who we should spend our time with? And it’s O’s money – he has the right to spend it any way he wants!”–he was getting upset by the Sistahood’s irrational and irascible histrionics.

                  By now, the whole of Johnny Rockets was transfixed on us – it seemed like the music stopped, the clinking of dinnerware and the chatter of others had stopped as well. Our White lady friends were mortified. I leapt into action, dropping a C-note on the table, and herding both the ladies and Kevin out of the place, briskly walked to the whip, get them all in it, and took off.

                  Back in their native South Philly, we stopped off to get some water ice to cool their nerves; we spent the rest of the evening at their place, having quite an eye-opening conversation about racial matters in contemporary America.

                  Perhaps you know what I speak, Ms. IcePrincess? If so, do share!

                  O.

                  • IcePrincess

                    I mean, I’ve been hated on by both black AND white women. I figure it’s cuz of my beauty & swag, plus I’m used to it, so I just dust it off my shoulder. The most overt, malicious racism I’ve encountered has been from usually older, white males. Quick story- few years ago, my ex & I were traveling thru FL. We pull into a motel in west palm beach. I go inside the lobby to check in while bae pulls the car around. The old white owner/clerk was nice as pie. I get the room & everything’s just peachy. Well, I guess he saw my man out the window while we were taking stuff out of the car. Because 2 minutes after we step in the room, the phone rings. It’s him asking me to come back to the front desk real quick. I’m thinking I forgot to sign something or whatever, no problem, right? Wrong. I get there & he already has my money ready. He gives it to me & tells me he is refusing me service & that I need to leave immediately. All while staring daggers at me. Now that was one “creepy azz cracker.” Smh lol

                    • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                      You do realize that by sleeping with your bae that you have plotted to render all White men $exless, advocate for the destruction of all European influenced culture throughout the world and devalued his very existence so that he and all of his friends are turned into transgendered pr0stitutes whose soul existence will be to service the Supreme Black Man.

                      Oh, and all of those cultural relics in Europe? Bombed to bits and incinerated.

                      It’s all your fault, you know. ;-) Could you have just f*cked Eminem if you like that hippity-hop music so much? ;)

                    • IcePrincess

                      Bwahahaaaaa

                    • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                      @Ms. IcePrincess:
                      Yes, your experiences and mine, have confirmed what has been long true – that the most vociferous opponents of/to the Swirl, have always been from White Men and Black Women themselves – which makes the socalled “Black Women’s Empowerment” movement quite anironic sight to behold…if not a comedic one…

                      O.

              • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                In my experience, our country’s f*cked up racial history makes White women look bolder than they really are. Since White women are usually scared to high heavens about approaching a brother, the ones that do are the few, the proud, the Snow Bunnies complete with mess dress and sword drills. Regular White women are probably *more* scared than the average sister.

                • IcePrincess

                  Dead & buried!!

                  • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                    I’m exaggerating, but the White women that hang around Black guys are a different breed than the average White woman. It’s just my experience talking here.

                    • IcePrincess

                      Oh, no argument on that here. Lesbehonest, it’s still plenty of WW clutching their purse at the mere sight of a BM. Then u got the ones that are low key curious, but scared of the anaconda lmfaoooo

                    • Turk Dickerson

                      I work with a White woman that’s like that. She makes Sista Souljah look like Laura Bush. She was trying to talk to me and a couple of other brothas at work about the lack of diversity in the company, and how she was uncomfortable around so many White people.

                      The schit was kind of surreal.

                    • LMNOP

                      I really don’t understand why more white people aren’t like this though.

      • panamajackson

        I feel like that’s a pretty big leap tho. Even though I’m working on the assumption that she was interested, I still doubt she was like overly concerned.

        It’s likely that she just lumped me in with the simps. Where I belonged.

        • afronica

          Sounds like she was fine as red wine, so you might be right. But women wonder. Or at least I always do.

    • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

      To paraphrase Vince McMahon’s interview after the Montreal Screwjob, Panama didn’t screw Jackie, Jackie screwed Jackie. I wonder what her issue was that she didn’t step it up. *smh*

      • IcePrincess

        Agreed

      • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

        Don’t speak this evil into the universe Todd.

        • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

          How is this evil? Seriously, how is this evil?

          • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

            Any mention of the Montreal Screwjob.

      • panamajackson

        While I realize you want the playing field to be level…how about we just say that we both dropped the ball.

        • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

          I’m learning during the past couple of days that I am apparently asking for all women to be on Seal Team 6 status in this dating realm. That I’m asking women to border on $exual assault. That I ask women to be too bold and somehow limit myself.

          Yeesh. LOL No shade at you man, but I don’t think I’m asking for much.

          • http://www.BlackLatinaFabulous.com/ Maris

            Todd, sweetie.

            There are two factors that matter here. One is important for the “outside world” and one is important for the women you date.
            1) You are QUITE the imposing figure. So I get why you need more “airplane signaling” than “body language signaling”.
            2) You do not JUDGE aggressive women, nor do you consider any form of interaction as an invitation to impose your imposing figure (you DO impose anyway, but we’re not discussing your tendency to hit on women WHILST they are with their dates, lolol). This is probably the most important. I am acutely aware of how I am perceived and unfortunately, I already have enough stereotypes thrown my way that grabbing a peen would just make things infinitely worse. I prefer being taken seriously (darn it), so certain physical advances would hinder that pursuit.

            • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

              Interesting points. Perhaps because I generally don’t perceive women as
              a physical threat, therefore I am more comfortable with aggressive
              women than the typical dude. Also, the whole part about women being
              less likely to just open up does line up with what other people have
              said. Good points.

              Also, it reminds me of something that happened during a date I had with your taller sister at a BDSM dungeon. (And don’t worry, this anecdote is G-rated.) My company for the evening is 5’8″, was wearing 4 inch heels and told me that she was 245 lbs., which is the same as I weigh. (Long story as to how she decided to tell me her precise weight.) Anyway, perchance, I happened to pass by a mirror as we walked by. Now, I knew she was taller than my associates with her heels, but I made her look like a normal sized woman. It kind of blew my mind.

              It’s happened over and over with tall women in heels, but it’s still hard to wrap my head around.

    • panamajackson

      I have zero inclination to believe she’d ever see this. We know mutual people, but unless I tell this story, nobody knows it exists. I’m good that way.

      And she was bad enough to not get a complex from some wack dude not stepping up to the plate. lol. She had suitors.

      • IcePrincess

        Chile, that’s exactly WHY it would’ve given her the complex! She could have any man she wanted, and here your lame azz is, swerving her. I would’ve demanded to kno what the heck your problem was, real talk. The whole thing is just hilarious.

  • Reemo

    After Chattanooga, the thrill would’ve been gone for me. Conversation would have ended at it’s nice to meet you. Half-way would have expected her to talk bad about the previous fumbles and wouldn’t even be mad.

    • panamajackson

      You know…and I didn’t make this clear enough. AFter I graduated, I was over it. I left and figured I’d never see her again anyway save for Homecoming. Plus, I was FULLY invested in somebody else and then I met a chick who I was ABSOLUTELY SURE I was going to marry though it never panned out. So the thrill pretty much was gone.

  • Andrea

    That is cool you had the confidence to believe that she was interested in you too. I suck at that. I always think I am just imagining things. I don’t know how many people from Morehouse I had relationships in my head with. Too many. And I still believe….they were probably just all in My Head.

    • http://stanoffewwords.wordpress.com/ Tristan

      It would be funny if somewhere far far away she’s retelling this story about some lightskinned dude who would go way out his way to just say hi like they were that cool

      • panamajackson

        That would be hilarious. In fact, I’d love it if that was the case.

    • panamajackson

      Yeah, its entirely possible I was fooling myself.

  • Val

    Whenever I don’t do something that I really want to do and I’m not really sure why, I think maybe fate is taking me by the hand and leading me to something I can’t see yet. So, maybe that’s the case here, PJ. Maybe getting to know her would have taken you off the path you’re supposed to be on.

    And, anyway, believing this is much better than accepting that you just blew it. ‘Cuz damb!

    • http://stanoffewwords.wordpress.com/ Tristan

      “Everything happens for a reason” because accountability is overrated sometimes.

      • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

        “Everything happens for a reason” because, Plausible Deniability…

        O.

    • panamajackson

      I prefer to look at it as i just blew it so that way I had to learn from it.

  • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

    Panama, I don’t see how you blame yourself. If she was as interested as you think she was, she should have stepped it up. If she didn’t, that’s her problem. Then again, this comes from someone who has a history of straight playing themselves in terms of social stuff instead of missing signals. I’d rather fail horribly than wonder if it could have happened. Not saying that I picked up every signals from women, but when I picked it up, and I was feeling it, I swung for the fences.

    Jackie ain’t sh*t, and that’s that.

    • Rawtid

      totally disagree with this

      • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

        Explain yourself then. What did I say wrong?

        • Rawtid

          I wouldn’t say “wrong,” but I am a firm believer in women are supposed to set up plays, not execute them. I think our job is to give men the signals to know its safe to approach—that if you do you won’t get carried. Yall have to run the play. Its so important. lol. And if I give you all the signs, I mean make it absolutely unequivocally clear that I am interested in you and you fail to execute…well that says to me that you aren’t interested. ***Note the difference between executing and executing well. I can forgive/laugh off a poorly executed attempt, but if you don’t even try what should i think?

          She was definitely interested otherwise she would not have continued to entertain him over the years and dance that dance. She just was waiting for him to execute.

          • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

            Got it coach. OMAHA

            • Rawtid

              LOL

          • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

            @Ms. Rawtid:
            Thank you validating everything I have said in this forum and elsewhere both yesterday and over the years. Educated Black Women such as yourself want to have it both ways – “Leaning In” when it suits them, and “Leaning Back” when it suits them. Todd is 100% right – what was to stop her from steppng up and simply saying “I’d really like to gt to know you better – HERE’S MY NUMBER”. There was NOTHING stopping her from doing that.

            But, you see, Educated Sistas want to play Scarlett O’Hara but only – ONLY – when it suits tham to do so. Otherwise, they’re oh-so-strong-and-independent.

            I find it to be a massive turn-OFF when Sistas of the kind Panama is discussing does these kinds of things (keep in mind please, the Caveat: Mr. Big always gets flagrantly hit on). It’s Patriarchal in Extremis. It’s Sexist. It’s Unfair. And it is infantilizing to the very “SIWs” themselves.

            This is the 21st century. Black Men, nor Men of any other color (and I note, that there are actual manuals written by Swirlin’ Sistas, for Sistas who are Swirlin’ Curious, which are very clear in stating that they must step up and make that first move! See my comments on Mr. Big), should have to be shackled by some arbitrary and moldy set of “rules” simply because Black Women are Rank Hypocrites of the First Order. This explains how and why more and more Brothas are leaving the field of play – I reming you and everyone reading along, the upwards of SEVEN TO ONE RATIO at “meet market” events and the like. More and more Brothas simply do not want to be bothered with the Sistahood’s cherry picking, and they vote with their feet. Please do not take my word for it – ask an internationally recognized matchmaker, Paul Carrick Brunson – someone who literally has to PAY Black Men to show up at his events(!).

            As I said the other day in my commentary in the wake of Ms. Solange’s Chimp-Out, the gig is up, Sistas – and the results, speak for themselves…

            O.

            • Rawtid

              I am not validating your point by any means what so ever. This is not cherry picking. Or wanting to have it both ways.

              There could have been a lot of things stopping her. First of all he had minimal outward expression of his interest in her. Everytime they had an interaction it was brief. Although he knew her name he didn’t actually ask until years later. What reason did she have to think that he was interested?

              This has nothing to do with Scarlett O hara or being “oh so strong an independent”.

              21st century or not, I am not asking any man for his number on a romantic level. Ever. Its not my style. If I am interested i’ll set it up but if he doesn’t make a move then in my mind he wasn’t interested. There are so many things I could say but I don’t want to go in. Is it hypocritical in the same way that men don’t want gold diggers but women must allow their men to pay so they don’t feel emasculated?

              And let me further state this has nothing to do with being a BLACK WOMAN. I’d appreciate staying on topic. Brothas can “leave the field of play” all “they” like. I only need one. I’m not losing sleep over any Black man who is ignorant enough to swear off of black women for he has many more issues than I.

              • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                Is it hypocritical in the same way that men don’t want gold diggers but
                women must allow their men to pay so they don’t feel emasculated?

                Yes, it is. And if a man is that insecure about paying, that woman needs to do the dip herself. #NoCountryForInsecureIdiots

              • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                @Ms. Rawtid:

                “I am not validating your point by any means what so ever. This is not cherry picking. Or wanting to have it both ways.”

                O: Only a (Black) Woman would attempt to BS even herself, when the evidence is staring everyone dead in the face…

                “There could have been a lot of things stopping her. First of all he had minimal outward expression of his interest in her. Everytime they had an interaction it was brief. Although he knew her name he didn’t actually ask until years later. What reason did she have to think that he was interested?”

                O: Because, maybe SHE was interested? I don’t know…

                “This has nothing to do with Scarlett O hara or being “oh so strong an independent”.”

                O: Yea…riiight…

                “21st century or not, I am not asking any man for his number on a romantic level. Ever. Its not my style.”

                O: *exaggerated eyeroll*

                “If I am interested i’ll set it up but if he doesn’t make a move then in my mind he wasn’t interested. There are so many things I could say but I don’t want to go in.”

                O: Why not, darling? The day’s still young…

                “Is it hypocritical in the same way that men don’t want gold diggers but women must allow their men to pay so they don’t feel emasculated?”

                O: Uh, what Mr. Todd said…

                “And let me further state this has nothing to do with being a BLACK WOMAN.”

                O: Wrong – it has EVERYTHING to do with Black Women of a Certain Class. I have studied the matter, madam – you, have not…

                “I’d appreciate staying on topic. Brothas can “leave the field of play” all “they” like. I only need one. I’m not losing sleep over any Black man who is ignorant enough to swear off of black women for he has many more issues than I.”

                O: LOL – there is an entire industry making killer bank off of Black Women who can’t pay Brothas to tap that, and you talking smack?

                Whew…

                O.

                • Rawtid

                  not even going to entertain this level of ignorance.

                  • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                    @Ms. Rawtid:
                    Coming from you, you not “entertaining” anything would be a welcome improvement *motions to barkeep* – make it a double!

                    ;)

                    O.

                    • Rawtid

                      yea im a fan of logic. when you get some…

                    • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                      Wait, didn’t you just say (with cobraheaded gesticulations and “monkey clapping” to boot) that you “ain’t got time for that” a few minutes ago?

                      Hmm?

                      Yea, Ms. Rawtid, you’re a stan of logic, alright – ChickLogic101 – BOL

                      O.

              • Rachmo

                I don’t think she had to ask for his number (that’s not really my style) but I’d have asked if he wanted to get coffee/brunch/SOMETHING bc this is painful.

                • Rawtid

                  lol it was painful.

                • IcePrincess

                  Yup. After the mall run-in, I woulda got one of my homegirls, & we woulda hung out as a foursome wit P & his man in chat-town.

                  • Rachmo

                    Holler.

          • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

            No, I need a sign of interest from you. If all you want is for me to approach, for all I know, you could be setting me up to get robbed, beaten or conned. A sign that it’s safe to approach is a trap. That you are too immature to say that you’re interested in a dude is a sign that you’re too immature for a relationship. If this is how the game starts, I can see myself 5-7 years from now working 60+ hours a week, taking care of our kids while you watch reality TV, eat junk food and play with your Hitachi, then complain that I don’t have enough time for you even though I f*ck you 4 times a week and take you out twice with the help of copious Red Bulls. After all of that, you’ll take half my scratch to support some Jody that you begged for the D from.

            Nah, kill that noise. Show me some interest as a sign that you will be willing to build a life together, instead of me building a life for you. And if that means some of your female friends regard you as a h0e for doing so, get new friends.

            • Rawtid

              wait what? i cant even follow how you got to this argument. And if all of those presumptions are plausible then couldn’t she say the same?

              I definitely said women should give signs of interest. I just don’t think that means she needs to be like well “since you aren’t going to ask for my number despite me making it painfully obvious that i’m interested, ill ask”. Bc as a woman now in my head im going to be going down that same slippery slope you just did. If asking for my number is too heft of a task what about the 50-11 other things that could/will happen if we got together? will i always have to intervene?

              Idk how the opinion of some of my female friends even became a part of this conversation

              • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                Well, this confusion and fear is why I support very explicit language. Subtle hints don’t work, and neither do “obvious” ones. Why not say “hello, my name is (Rawtid), and I am interested in dating you.” Throw in a few reasons to reinforce your sentiment. Then, the ball is in his court. He will either ask, or not ask. And there you have it.

                • Rawtid

                  they may not work sometimes, I def agree with that.

                  ehh. Personally, that is not my style so I would never do that.

                  And this case the ball was in his court too–he just did nothing with it.

            • Rachmo

              Todd I’m so sorry but I LOL’d reading this.

              • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                @Ms. Rachmo:
                In humor veritas, hmm?

                ;)

                O.

                • Rachmo

                  NO O! I am not cosigning Todd’s vision but it was hilarious

                • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                  In hyperbole, there is humor!

                  • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                    In exaggerated cobraheaded gesticulations and monkeyclapping, there is pain in the neck and palms of hands!

                    O.

                    • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                      lol, I saw no monkeys, O; are you hallucinating today?

                    • http://justfourguys.com Obsidian

                      Perhaps that might be because, you need a new pair of spectacles?

                      O.

                    • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                      These are brand new, cuz! I’m good on glasses for a while, thank the Maker.

                  • h.h.h.

                    In hyperbole, there is humor!

                    which explains my jocundity following O’s locutions

            • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

              Todd! I didn’t know you moonlighted as a fiction writer! lol

              • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                Why do you say that? Though I did have a side hustle writing copy for pr0n sites at one point.

                • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                  You have a vivid imagination. It probably serves you well. :)

                  • Rachmo

                    Yo I DIIIIEEEDDD laughing

            • God Shammgod

              “That you are too immature to say that you’re interested ”

              I call 100% foul on this. Not necessarily in context of Panama’s story but in general. Communication is both verbal and nonverbal. If I’m out with my girls and I go out of my way to speak with solely you for 45 minutes and no one else and you don’t glean that as a sign of interest unless I grab your Richard and lead you out the bar, then you strike me as someone who lacks social cues and ultimately not someone I would want to rock with. I won’t speak for all women but just me. I do believe that women need to make themselves attainable but if im giving you the 80%, you cant give 20 and just say “can I have yo numba?”. Psh.

              • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                Maybe I’m just someone with a few issues, but until there is some sort of $exual contact (at ABSOLUTE minimum some tongue kissing), I’m thinking that what you’re doing is Just Entertainment. All that conversation is just that: conversation. Show and prove, please. If you aren’t willing to lay a marker out there, how do I know you aren’t a pillow princess or someone who is just needy for attention?

                That said, this is my opinion, and I could be wrong.

                • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                  “Maybe I’m just someone with a few issues, but until there is some sort of $exual contact (at ABSOLUTE minimum some tongue kissing)”

                  bwhahahahah! I respect a man who knows exactly what he wants and makes no bones about it. But it really depends on what you’re seeking. (You don’t have to answer that; I know.) You say that all that convo is just convo, but aggin, I LOVED CONVO! lol. Convo was the absolute best way to get me to tongue kiss you at a later date lol. I valued good company. Me looking unbored in a dude’s presence was 100% of my marker. I wouldn’t grab peen because, frankly, strange peen was meh to me. Friendly peen…well…

                  • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                    As I’ve re-established myself in the dating market, I’m OK with a bit more conversation. Before marriage, conversation was something to be endured until I got some. Then, and only then, would I be willing to talk. Otherwise, why am I bothering to speak with someone with whom I share no real interests? Rare were the situations where I spoke to someone I had much in common with.

                    Now, with a bit of life experience., I have a better shot of getting a good conversation (and a better shot of screening out women worth talking to on top of that), so talking isn’t as much of a burden now. Still, I prefer a bit more aggression out of women. I ain’t got time for the BS.

                    • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                      You don’t seem to mind Internet conversation…what about F2F differs for you?

                    • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                      Unless I have an in or have some sort of bead on what you may be about, I’m just thinking “OK, what is this female dog trying to get out of me?” I can do business conversations fine, but social ones are still rough on my nerves. I just want to get to the point so we can move forward.

                    • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                      Fair enough. I spent a good amount of time in the middle of convo thinking most men were just looking for chex…

                    • T.Q. Fuego

                      It depends on what you mean by “just” cause otherwise you may have been right lol

                    • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                      lol, that was my point, TQ. Neither of us are necessarily wrong in our assessments.

                    • esa

                      ~ I’m just thinking “OK, what is this female dog trying to get out of me?”

                      you on that Kurt Cobain talking about “just cause your paranoid doesnt mean they arent out to get you.”

                      operating from fear ensures fear will be met with equal force. the thing about worst case scenarios is how easy it is to make them come true.

                    • LMNOP

                      Your marriage seems to be a good case in point of the benefits of getting to know someone well before sleeping with them. A straight to chex approach can have some serious consequences. I learned this the hard way too. My daughters father is really an azz hole, and in hindsight I probably should have got to know him better before ending up in a situation that could leave me pregnant with his child.

                    • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                      I see your point. That said, from when I originally slept with her to the time I got her pregnant was almost 3 years. That’s a lot of time for f*ckery to come out.

                    • LMNOP

                      Where dafuq did my comment go?

                      I said hmm, in my case it was like 2 weeks. And sometimes it happens that way. You never know.

                  • afronica

                    *tabernacle*

                  • http://batman-news.com MicTheMessenger

                    Personally, I ain’t know exactly what i wanted til i found it. Before then, life is a Baskin Robbins. As for PJ i wouldn’t sweat it cuz we’ve all dropped at least one pass in our lifetimes. And other times, went for the ball when it was CLEARLY out of reach.

                    • http://trulytafakari.com/ dara

                      TRUTH.

                • camilleblue

                  Just seems like you may be missing out on a lot bc your parameters are so narrow. Like, realistically, how many *non-working* women are just gonna come up and grab your johnson right off top in a regular, public setting??

                  • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                    That is why I’m working on change. I need to open up my parameters a bit. I still prefer a very direct approach with women. Even when I was in college, the more direct you are, the more rhythm I gave you. Plus I do admit my preferences have gotten me in trouble. Still, I like what I like, and I’m not going to radically give it up for sweet little innocent who isn’t bold enough to make a move.

                    • camilleblue

                      Yeah….wouldn’t ask you to give up your preference of a very direct woman, but wanting someone to basically chexually assault you to prove they are really interested seems extreme. But you’re smart…I’m sure you can find the balance if you try.

                  • miss t-lee

                    Exactly.
                    This is real life.

                  • esa

                    i think some men dont read cues period. their brains are wired differently, and the more extreme cases don’t discern any shades of grey.

                    this may be because men have less communication centers in their brain. i cant remember the source but it said women have something like 13 centers for communication, while men have 8. there is a reason for this: women need to read more detail in order to keep safe.

                    • http://www.twitter.com/IluminatiNYC Todd

                      FWIW, I blame my childhood. When your cues are played with so that some women can abuse them, you learn to shut down for your own safety and sanity. One can only take but so many false come-ons.

                    • esa

                      Todd i am totally with you about childhood trauma. it really fukks up the brain and rewiring from that conditioning is a lifelong process that .. man i struggle with every day.

                      the thing is. as long as you lay blame and continue to map the past on to the present you only promise more of the same. my girl broke it down to me last week like this:

                      yea. your parents sh*t on you. they made you carry this bag of sh*t around and taught you to believe that it was yours. but now they’re gone and you’re still carrying a bag of sh*t around like you don’t have a choice.

                      it was an ugly enough metaphor to snap me awake. i know they gave me/you a bag of sh*t. but to continue to carry it ? the choice is yours. word to Black Sheep.

          • miss t-lee

            *applause*

    • h.h.h.

      pretty much….she had 3 opportunities, and she had friends that knew you.

      if she was interested, she coulda made a move too. everything happens for a reason.

      it is what it is.

      • T.Q. Fuego

        There’s levels to interest. She was definitely interested as in “open to the possibility, but also completely ok whether it happened or not”. She wasn’t interested as in “I GOTTA find a way to make this work and get with this dude” (which is how certain chicks will approach it if their interest level is at a 9 or 10). Yall (you, Todd, Joel and crew) are waitin on a chick to have a level 9 or 10 interest in you and to have the courage to act boldly on that. Good luck wit that and sh*t. Hopefully yall got the patience of a Buddhist monk lol

        • http://vagabondaesthetics.tumblr.com/ Ricky

          best comment today.

          • T.Q. Fuego

            Preciate it fam. I get where they’re comin from though. In an ideal world women who have that level of interest in you would find you and fall into your lap so to speak (luckily for me I just so happen to be living in an ideal world at the moment, but I suffered for a while dealin with the ones who only had a 5 or 6 level of interest in me). I get how hard it is to leave your comfort zone and lay your cards on the table without the safety net of ambiguity (what sane and self-respecting person wants to get rejected by someone they just demonstrated a clear interest in?) but if you do it with faith/confidence and courage you could turn a 5 0r 6 level of interest to an 8 or 9 cause you just made yourself more attractive to her. It’s worth the risk. Trust me. You’ll respect yourself more even if she doesn’t reciprocate (or if it fizzles out before the best part happens).

        • Joel

          Since my interest level has to be at a 9 or a 10 to make a move, why can’t I look for the same in a woman? I’m all about reciprocity. If I feel like I’m not being met somewhere in the middle, why bother? Anything else is just me hopping out there for a woman that isn’t nearly as interested as I am. Waste of time.

          • Val

            The thing is though, Joel, a whole lot of relationships start with one partner being way more interested than the other. So, it’s not where the two start that’s important, it’s how you end up.

            • Joel

              Well, if my interest level is a 8 or a 9 and hers is a -2….then there is no relationship happening in the first place. I would surmise that two people have to have something close to the same interest level in each other for anything to go beyond friendship, correct?

              • Val

                The anecdotal evidence says otherwise. I personally have been in a couple of relationships where in the beginning I wasn’t nearly as interested as the other party and vice versa and yet we ended up in roughly the same place.

                • Joel

                  So let me get this straight….There exists a demographic of women that, when approached by a man whom they may not be nearly as interested in as he is in her, will not only accept this approach, but actually date him and possibly enter into a monogamous relationship with this man as well?

                  Yeah, I can’t buy that. Every woman I’ve ever approached wasn’t as interested in me as I was in her….You’re telling me that the fundamental textbook mathematical definition of rejection ends up turning into dates and relationships for people.

                  • http://www.BlackLatinaFabulous.com/ Maris

                    Men grow on women all the time. The ones where it works the most is when
                    the man continues to “check in” on her while…

                    …wait for it…

                    LIVING HIS OWN DAMN LIFE.
                    I’ve definitely dated a guy or two after a year or three of knowing their
                    interest…yet also, two or three girlfriends later. People forget a large part of finding a special someone is luck and timing, and sometimes the timing is off. Doesn’t mean you stop the clock for one person.

                    • Joel

                      One monkey doesn’t stop the show….I agree with that. Even though I don’t have anything nice to say about the dating game, I still live my own life…I work, pay bills, chill with my friends, and pray for the day the Detroit Lions become relevant….lol

                      Checking in on a woman that has already told me she’s not interested? I don’t have the faith or the forgiveness in me to do that yet. Maybe this is one of those things that comes with time, experience, and a few successful stories under the belt.

          • T.Q. Fuego

            Well, you’re grown so you can do what you want to, but I say first work on becoming a more attractive person. Then work on spotting the chicks who are open to you (I’d recommend looking for the ones who are at least at a 6. The best news I have for you is that you can effect that interest level and turn a 5 or 6 into an 8 but it’s gonna take you leaving your comfort zone and taking the risk that she might not be interested in you. She might reject you. If you can’t deal with that possibility then you should just accept that your chances of getting a woman (especially the one you want most) are slim to none. Luckily the choice is yours.

            • Joel

              As I’ve said to Sweet Sass elsewhere in today’s conversation….I know I need to continue to work on being a better person.. Working on self and trying to date at the same time….it’s not an easy balance, especially as far away from perfection as I am. I get it.

    • CrayolaGirl

      She had two brief conversations that end with him saying nice to blah blah blah and walking off, in a 5 year time span, it translated as not interested. Nice talking or seeing you ends the conversation…no pursuing necessary.

      • Rawtid

        exactly

    • panamajackson

      Jackie ain’t meet me halfway. That’s true. But I’m fine with that. Not her job. She was hot. Very much so. When you’re the hot one, you have more leverage. It ain’t like if I didn’t step she’d be waiting around lonely. I respect Darwinism.

      • T.Q. Fuego

        Which is another way of saying you respect reality. Apparently everyone can’t relate though smh

  • CrayolaGirl

    Them’s the breaks. It just wasn’t meant to be because you didn’t want it. (Based only off these tales)

    If possible, what was it that made you pump brakes every time?

    • panamajackson

      I punked out.