He got those blues, too

*sung to Muddy Waters’s “Hoochie-Coochie Man” blues standard*

I once knew a man
he aint get a fair shake
he had a simple plan
he just wanted one date
But he always got dissed
passed over and played
so he got really pissed
and starting throwing all types of shade! Ohhhh, he got the blues!
He got those Bitter Man Blues!!!!
Ohhhh, he needs a shoulder and some luck. But everyone just says “Man up”

We all know this man.

He could be your brother, your father, your co-worker, your best friend, or your ex-boyfriend. Sh*t, he might even be you. While his backstory’s beholden to the same sad narrative, his identity’s bound to no specific culture, class, or creed.

Like everyone else, he started off with a completely clean dating and relationship slate. No baggage, no animosity, no propensity for prolonged spells of unprovoked hyper-sensitivity or bitchassness. Even if he wasn’t exactly an optimist, he was confident that he’d find his relationship way, and ultimately convinced of the latent good of mankind.

This man was my dog
this man used to smile
but he saw too much fog
no more sunny smiles for a while
I should have listened
I should have paid attention
I should have let him mention
but now his spirit’s missin’! Ohhhh, he got the blues!
He got those Bitter Man Blues!!!!
Ohhhh, he needs a shoulder and some luck. But everyone just says “Man up”

Then, it happened. Maybe it was a particularly devastating break-up. Maybe he was star-crossed enough to cross paths with a series of unfortunately awful vagina-laden people. And, maybe, well, maybe nothing ever happened, and he was just tired of sitting on the sidelines and watching things happen to everyone else. Whatever it was, something happened to him; something that broke something inside of him, replacing his happy nature with harshness and turning him from affable to antagonistic.

But“, you’d say after hearing his story, “this is common. Most people go through a period of relationship adversity. And, for some unfortunate people, sometimes this adversity is particularly bad. But, you eventually nurse your wounds and get back out there“. And, you’d be right. Sh*t happens to everyone, and sometimes that sh*t happens to be pretty damn sh*tty. What makes the Bitter Man unique, though, is that he never got that chance to heal. His highway had no shoulders for emergencies only.

While luckier and/or more sexually viable men find solace in the hearts and between the legs of silly women with sympathetic ears, and women facing hard times find comfort in the latent emotional flexibility allowed and encouraged by femininity, The Bitter Man had no one to turn to. The relentless stoicism expected from men (and attractive to many women) swallowed him whole, engulfing him with self and societal pressure to “Man up” and “Stop acting like a bitch“. Plus, even if he was willing to purge, he knew no one would want to listen to an average guy with completely anecdotal but completely real gripes of women sincerely lament that he’s been unlucky with love.

Eventually the untended wound festered, turning him from momentarily broken to permanently scarred, leaving him with nothing but a chip on his shoulder, a finger in his eye, and his blues; his Bitter Man Blues.

He was a good guy
but now he’s a dick
i don’t even try
i can’t take his shit
It wasn’t his plan
his pain, we should have felt
should have gave him a hand
he just needed someone’s help! Ohhhh, he got the blues!
He got those Bitter Man Blues!!!!
Ohhhh, he needed a shoulder and some luck. But…
….everyone just said “Man up”

—The Champ

P.S. One last time for the cheap seats. For all the DMV VSBers, tonight is the finale of the Centric/BET Master Of The Mix DJ reality show competition and Lil SoSo Productions is holding a viewing party at Muse (717 6th Street NW). Panama Jackson is one of the community partners and would love for you all to come out and hang for some free alcohol (open bar from 9-10 on Smirnoff drinks) and there is no cover charge. So come kick it with Panama and just do what you do. Peep a video of the last viewing party where Panama and VSB represented ferociously (and some video footage of the Panamanian one himself). Doors at 8pm. Check the flyer below and hope to see you there. For those who have already let me know you’re coming through, I promise you will know its me when you see me. For those considering it, just let us know via email (contact@verysmartbrothas.com) or via Panama’s twitter (@panamajackson). See you there.

Filed Under:
Damon Young

Damon Young is the editor-in-chief of VSB. He is also a contributing editor for EBONY.com. He resides in Pittsburgh, and he really likes pancakes.

  • http://testorshia.blogspot.com Tes

    Hoochie Coochie man was my sh*t growin up. That and Mannish Boy…
    In any case, Bitter men are everywhere you turn, just like bitter women. Some hide it, some don’t, some grow out of it, some won’t. I think it’s a personal choice coupled with a little luck to find someone willing to work them out of it.

    • http://www.citizette.com Lizzy

      Well said! Everyone’s had their fair share of heartbreak so just move on. Though I will say that in my experience, men have had a harder time bouncing back for tragic breakups. Many of my male friends and exes have used their heartbreak as justification for why they can no longer engage in healthy, mature relationships, and therefore must default to player/dickhead mode. Lame.

      • Orange Star Happy Hunting

        you still have a choice even after the most devastating heartbreak..its a cop out to use that an excuse to use/dog out /mistreat/be emotionally void etc with people that had nothing to do with your past hurts. Karma don’t stop.

        • Lelechigyrl

          Orange Star Happy Hunting….Good Morning to you! I couldnt agree with you more. Its a choice that you make and Karma will mos def getcha!

        • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

          I COSIGN x INFINITY!!

          I just recently was the victim of a STRING of bitter dudes. And I kept thinking to myself, “Dang. I’ve been through some ish too. Why do THEY want to dog perfectly good women out because of their past hurts and I foolishly to want to love again?” At least in my experience, it seems like the women are the ones to “man up” and try again…

        • Mo-VSS

          I 100% cosign…these bitter men need to get a clue

          Try getting engaged, moving from your home-state and family down to the south, and two weeks later you get dumped by your fiance…for another woman. Oh and he’s gonna marry her…Oh, and you’re 2 months pregnant…Oh and he doesn’t care and won’t return calls or talk to you, as if you never existed.

          Yet, I still believe in love and just because he was a dyck doesn’t mean all men are.

          So bitter people (men and women) need to understand that life isn’t fair. The sooner they get that, the sooner they can move on.

      • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

        “Though I will say that in my experience, men have had a harder time bouncing back for tragic breakups.”

        why do you think this is?

        • keisha brown

          because men aren’t socialized to emote..whereas.. ice cream, kleenex and your girlfriends (and chocolate) are associated with women and breakups.
          y’all have rebound chex and strip clubs. that aint healin nuffin.

          • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

            “because men aren’t socialized to emote..whereas.. ice cream, kleenex and your girlfriends (and chocolate) are associated with women and breakups.
            y’all have rebound chex and strip clubs. that aint healin nuffin”

            yeah, that was a rhetorical question. I was more getting it her calling it “lame”

            • keisha brown

              oh. well..
              i stand by my answer.
              rhetorical deez.

    • http://testorshia.blogspot.com Tes

      All of you hit on the very valid point that it is a choice. These bitter people think it’s their lot in life to be “the bitter one” and it’s really not. It’s about accepting what happened to you as a casualty of life and knowing that not every person is going to jerk your chain and screw you over. After that realization, love just comes to a person naturally I’ve found.

      • monique

        This quote is from a weird source.. but doesn’t that doesn’t make it one iota less valid.

        “The longer I live, the more I realize the impact of attitude on life. Attitude, to me, is more important than facts. It is more important than the past, the education, the money, than circumstances, than failure, than successes, than what other people think or say or do. It is more important than appearance, giftedness or skill. It will make or break a company… a church… a home. The remarkable thing is we have a choice everyday regarding the attitude we will embrace for that day. We cannot change our past… we cannot change the fact that people will act in a certain way. We cannot change the inevitable. The only thing we can do is play on the one string we have, and that is our attitude. I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it. And so it is with you… we are in charge of our Attitudes.” – Chuck Swindoll

  • http://twitter.com/kjnetic Peter Parker

    dang, i felt that. i’ve definitely been there when i was younger, i won’t lie. the key is to remember that you can put your best foot forward…but people will still be people. gotta recognise it and move forward.

    i don’t think i lashed out at anyone, or hated on folks…i just started to be 1/2way apathetic to it all. instead of being that dude hecklin’ the players and the refs on the court…i’d be the one walking out of the building. if that makes sense.

    • http://twitter.com/sonofthehorizon stlunatic

      That’s truth. I’m still young so it’s ok, but I just realized that not too long ago.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      “i don’t think i lashed out at anyone, or hated on folks…i just started to be 1/2way apathetic to it all.”

      yeah, this is what usually happens to bitter/hurt dudes. instead of lashing out, they just get emotionally distant

  • eff yo couch

    For some reason today’s post has me thinking about angry man from Martin

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZCCfGLIW6w

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      it’s funny watching that and seeing the guys in the background trying not to laugh

  • http://www.shay-d-lady.com shay-d-lady

    I dont know what the hell is going on in this post.
    lol
    but im sure my granny has this song on a 45

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      if she does, she owes me some royalties

      • http://www.shay-d-lady.com shay-d-lady

        @ champ…..lol

        im sure she will split half of her “commoty” with ya!!!!

    • Alana

      OMG, I thought I was the only one. I just didn’t get it. Which I’m okay with. I’m sure there are post that the VSBs write and folks are like, “WTH” and I’m over here in tears. Reading the comments is making it more clear, getting more perspective.

  • miss t-lee

    I would so love to hear you sing this Champy…lol and yes, bitter men are runnin’ round this camp just like bitter chicks. However bitter chicks seem to be the only ones you hear about, until you run into a bitter dude. It’s normally well hidden until the first date when he starts talking reckless about his babymama being a b*tch, or his ex-girl who cheated on him. Check please. PS Love the pic, this almost redeemed the Ton Jones fiasco from last week. Almost. :-)

    • Mimi

      What? You didn’t like the s exy Tom Jones pic? With his banana hammock and slight “not all the curled” puff of a fro?

      Also, I co-sign with your post.
      Bitter women are irritating, but bitter men are downright scary. Scary as in, “I will slash your tires and eventually your throat” kind of scary.

      • miss t-lee

        Nah…the banana hammock was doing nothing for me…AT ALL!!! :)

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      “I would so love to hear you sing this Champy…”

      maybe during the next podcast

      • miss t-lee

        YAY!!!!

    • kingpinenut

      “almost redeemed the Ton Jones fiasco from last week. Almost.”

      I still got my eye-protection on…..smh can’t risk another UPSET gut

      • miss t-lee

        LMAO!!! You were so appalled at the Tom Jones pic.

        • kingpinenut

          i still am :(

          and the worstest part…..i think vsb and SEE Tom Jones

          woe is me……wooooooooooooe is meeeeeeeeeeeeeeh!!

          Now that is the real BLUES

          *turns up Albert King*

        • CrisisCore

          f**kin ridiculous lol

  • Misty Knight

    I just wanted to Thank You, for giving me a perfect segue for posting this song from Grinderman..I’m sure it has some relevance:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lL3dNfxcpnw
    Yes 78.6% sure..
    Anyway..there are some real bitter negros out there, hell my Uncle is one of em, everytime he has a new victim “love interest” I just wanna yell “Run! Bish Run!” I use to think he hated women, because he was a suppressed homosexual, then I realized he was a very sensitive man with abandonment issues that stemmed from his mother since childhood, and serial bad experiences with women. He just needs to be a-sexual, because that nicca is 43 , hope is lost.

    • http://twitter.com/ManAboutIt Man About It

      Has another Black woman found herself in a Marvel character? First Storm, now Misty Knight? Who’s next, Monica Rambeau? :)

  • http://wewereninjas.wordpress.com/ Jay

    Although those verses were questionable @best (IMHO), the following is pure poetry…

    “While luckier and/or more sexually viable men find solace in the hearts and between the legs of silly women with sympathetic ears, and women facing hard times find comfort in the latent emotional flexibility allowed and encouraged by femininity, The Bitter Man had no one to turn to.”

    Well written sir. I dig.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      so basically, i should stick to my day job, huh?

      lol, seriously though, it took me a bit longer to write that song than i thought it would

  • Sweet lady

    wow, this totally confirms things for me. Me and my friends have a name for this guy- he’s a “bitter brother”. I know a couple of them. Any man who is over 30 and single is single because he wants to be regardless of how he looks (I mean really, there are bytches to the left and bytches to the right for any single black man, over 30 with half a decent job, some kind of home training, and no baby momma drama or even MINIMAL bmd) yet this guy constantly talks about how these women out here ain’t s*&t, they’re all gold diggers, he can’t find a good woman, blah blah blah. Dates with this guy always end up with him talking about whatever woman did him wrong. I used to be compassionate and want to show this guy how he was wrong (male friends included), but now I believe even if he doesn’t like it, he’s comfortable being bitter and that’s probably worse than liking it so I just let it go. Great Post Champ.

    • Jhane Sez

      “Any man who is over 30 and single is single because he wants to be regardless of how he looks (I mean really, there are bytches to the left and bytches to the right for any single black man, over 30 with half a decent job, some kind of home training, and no baby momma drama or even MINIMAL bmd) yet this guy constantly talks about how these women out here ain’t s*&t, they’re all gold diggers, he can’t find a good woman, blah blah blah.”

      I think the bitter man evolves from lonely dude into the entitled jack azz that you usually end up meeting.

      And it seems that there is no time self reflection on this journey.. only a desire to find the thing outside of himself that is responsible for his lack of social success.

      Totally co-sign that his frustration usually lies not in his inability to get women… but that he can’t get the women that he wants.

      And that is when the tantrums start and he begins lashing out like a spoiled child.

      As an observation whatever the issue was that caused him to stay loosing gets amplified with each failed experience and thus begins his downward spiral.

      His woman left him for a dude with more money… he says that he should have known because she was always at his pockets.

      So he vows never to let some women take advantage of him like that again… so the next sista can’t get him to spring for Starbucks let alone a first date dinner.

      But what he doesn’t get is that she left him because he was selfish not just with his money but usually his time and affection… always taking…

      Especially in his sexual expectations… cause he doesn’t want to admit or is ashamed of how thristy he is… and how that is a big turn off.

      And usually the dude she left him for didn’t make more money he just had a much more generous spirit… like if he was invited over for dinner he would bring wine and flowers not get into some long debate about how she should have brought the wine if she was cooking and giving flowers are for simps.

      And when you try to tell him the truth about why his woman left because you know her or are her he ain’t trying to hear it.

      And more people don’t help.

      The longer you know dude the more you see him do the same sh*t that didn’t work for him… and with each fail he just gets more angry.

      Because the bottom line is he doesn’t want to change… he wants his behavior to net a different result

      Which is why you can’t sympathize with dude… nobody likes a cry baby. ~JS

      • legitimate_soul

        This rings so true.

      • TheRealestLeo

        Now this I can agree with. I’ve done the self-reflecting and such.

        I’m not selfish at all….I’d say I’m one of the more generous people I know. However, I am not a sucker, and I know when I’m potentially being sucker-moved by a woman, and I won’t fall for those games.

        As I’ve said….I’m willing to do what a man is supposed to do….but only for a woman that is worth it.

        All the hypotheses in the world can’t make up for a lack of test subjects. (Scientifically speaking.)

        • Jhane Sez

          “As I’ve said….I’m willing to do what a man is supposed to do….but only for a woman that is worth it.”

          But what does that mean really.

          I addressed what you said you wanted downthread… and now we get to “worth it”.

          You know I hear this term a lot from brothas… with no clear articulation of what makes it worth it.

          Real talk… what ever that is you need to be real clear about defining it before you say you can’t find it. ~ JS

          • TheRealestLeo

            A woman that is ‘worth it’ is one that at least takes the time to get to know a man before judging him….not judging him off of the way he looks or how much money he makes.

            She’s willing to take a chance with me just like I’m taking one with her. It’s a two-way street.

            She is not looking for perfection….she’s looking for what is realistically possible.

            Is that somewhat better?

            • Jhane Sez

              “A woman that is ‘worth it’ is one that at least takes the time to get to know a man before judging him….not judging him off of the way he looks or how much money he makes.
              She’s willing to take a chance with me just like I’m taking one with her. It’s a two-way street.
              She is not looking for perfection….she’s looking for what is realistically possible.
              Is that somewhat better?”

              No…

              A woman wants a man she thinks is cute or she diggs his swagger or vibe… she cares how she looks to her even if everyone else thinks he is a mud duck that’s her boo mud duck.

              And be real here you ain’t trying to kick it with Precious… cause I hear she is looking… you care what a woman looks like.

              You shouldn’t want to be with anyone who doesn’t care what you look like… cause if she don’t think you are cute she won’t want to kiss you let alone give you none.

              A woman cares about how much money you make because if she is giving up the good good and things progress she needs to know that she will be provided for.

              The amount is relative… its the way that you use it. The worst thing in the world is to align yourself with a woman you can’t ultimately provide for because she was “open” enough to take a chance.

              Why should she take that chance to get to know you… you haven’t identified anything that would separate her from any other chick.

              Which is why you are attracting ghetto chicks with a gaggle of kids and/or no job… because right now that is who you are attractive to.

              Because those are the type of women who are just looking for someone to see beyond their situation and want a decent man regardless… and they don’t care who it is.

              Which is what you described

              You need to seek your compliment and ask for what you want that would match that.

              The universe is waiting for you to value yourself ~JS

              • http://www.shesoflyy.com Muze

                @ JS

                and… POW. there it is.

                i heart your comments. lol

              • keisha brown

                JS for the win.
                cuz..i. just. wont. go. there.

              • WIP

                “… because right now that is who you are attractive to.
                Because those are the type of women who are just looking for someone to see beyond their situation and want a decent man regardless… and they don’t care who it is.”

                LOL, now this really struck a nerve. What type of people are you attractive to?…

              • TheRealestLeo

                Did I ever say I didn’t care about a woman’s attractiveness? I swear you all take my comments and run to the extreme levels with it. I’m certain there are a couple million women in between Precious and what I’m looking for in terms of looks. Again….I have standards. When did the conversation ever become about whether I would date Precious?

              • Jhane Sez

                @TheRealestLeo…

                My point is that you are asking women who don’t find you attractive to over look your appearance when you aren’t willing to do the same… to give a shot.

                Most times if we are asking someone to overlook something about us it is because we are not compatible.

                @WIP…

                I went through a period when I was single where all I attracted where diva dudes and non-commitment types.

                This was due to the way I was dressing, a little too sexy thinking that was being approachable, and where I was going to meet men… at the typical single events.

                Now I’ve been off the market for 10 years but when I get asked out the guys seem like the type I would dig if I were single… but I only get a superficial glimpse because I am not Looking ~JS

              • TheRealestLeo

                @ JS

                I just specifically said that there is a happy medium between Precious and what I’m looking for. I figure that since I’m average looking on a good day, I should probably stick to somewhere in that ballpark when dealing with women. I don’t look for ANY quality in a woman that I can’t comparably bring to the table myself.

                Is there something wrong with that? Knowing how this place operates, I’m certain there is.

                I don’t implicitly ‘ask’ for a woman to overlook any flaw I have. If she decides that flaw is enough to pass on me, it’s her decision and there is nothing I can do about it. I will not beg a woman for anything. Word to Keith Sweat.

                And honestly….there aren’t enough women of ANY KIND whose description of attractive I fit, so that is even more reason why I’m limited with my chance-giving. It’s hard to do something for others when they aren’t giving me the same in return.

              • TheRealestLeo

                So you are proving one of my points about women for me…..that some women will take their ‘list’ and morph it into a standard by which a man MUST meet or he is no good.

                While it is perfectly acceptable for a woman to want to be attracted to her man….attraction, I always thought, was based off of more than just looks.

                And as far as seeking my compliment goes….If only I had any idea as to what that was…

              • http://twitter.com/sonofthehorizon stlunatic

                @TheRealestLeo

                I understood exactly what you were saying, and gave a silent applause as I was reading it. I’ll keep this gender neutral, since the women are pouncing today.*checks lunar cycle* I’ll give and agree that both sides are guilty (even though when faced with prospects for coitus men will turn off the lights and keep it moving. We really dont give a fck. . .or maybe we do, which is why. . anyway. . ).

                You are right in your definition of ‘worth it’-it is rare to find a good woman (or man), because the majority of us (not me or you, but you know, “them”) are extremely standoffish in public. Something about society, whether it be technology, too many bad encounters, whatever, make it such that in situations that are normally supposed to foster interaction and conversation between two people, you have Ms. BusyBody or Mr. PrettyBoy looking around, fiddling with his smartphone, auditing everybody that walks past as if they were the IRS.

                In my opinion, the good women I’ve come across were the women who didn’t have this air about them, who allowed me to approach them and were receptive and contributory to the initial conversation I just wanted to have. I’m trying to feel you out as well, and depending on how the conversation is going, I may walk away, bidding you a good evening without asking for a number or @, leaving you confused in my wake. #oops

              • keisha brown

                @stlunatic

                do you (specifically or generally) have sympathy for a single chick that laments her singleness? no. we’re told our degrees wont keep us warm, to lower standards, stop being picky, be more open to street harassment and on and on and on and on and..

                so. no. i have NO sympathy. if i have had to change my attitude and adjust what i put out there to the world, change my environment and mentality.. then so should any one else.

              • Rick

                This man is telling you what HE feels makes a woman worth it to HIM. Who are you to tell him otherwise? What if someone tried to tell YOU what makes YOU feel a man is worth it to YOU!?! You’d tell them to GTFO.

              • Alana

                “You need to seek your compliment and ask for what you want that would match that.

                The universe is waiting for you to value yourself”

                Miss JS….YOWZA! Straight slain. Properly said…I think the women reading this need to take heed to this post. YES, GIRL! A to the MEN!

              • Alana

                @ Rick- This man is telling you what HE feels makes a woman worth it to HIM. Who are you to tell him otherwise? What if someone tried to tell YOU what makes YOU feel a man is worth it to YOU!?! You’d tell them to GTFO.

                I have to agree with you on here. If someone told me what man was worth my time and I thought otherwise, I’d be pretty annoyed to the say the least. More like going to the point of STFU.

              • JediBrah

                Well you should definitely be attracted to your mate but with that said…there are PLENTY of IN SHAPE MEN that are attracted to big women. Genuinely attracted to them. A man however could be half the size of a big woman and 95% of the women won’t notice him simply because even though they’re obese there are going to be multiple men that like them.

            • Mo-VSS

              You judge all the time, yet you want a woman who does the opposite?

              • TheRealestLeo

                If I ever judged a woman…..it was something she has (or had) control over…..Kids by different dudes….being a skank….being a lesbian…..making poor choices in men and ending up with the drama…..things like that. Or, even worse, a woman that had a chance with me in the past but jacked it up for whatever reasons.

                And yes…..those women exist in the military, too.

                You cannot sit here and tell me I am supposed to give women like that a chance. (Or a second chance.)

      • miss t-lee

        *applause* to this whole comment.

        • simplysope

          @The RealestLeo

          “If I ever judged a woman…..it was something she has (or had) control over…..Kids by different dudes….being a skank….being a lesbian…..making poor choices in men and ending up with the drama…..things like that. Or, even worse, a woman that had a chance with me in the past but jacked it up for whatever reasons. ”

          But earlier you said you wanted a woman who isn’t going to write you off for your job, or how much money you make, right?

          Here let me quote you:

          “TheRealestLeo December 22, 2010 at 3:56 am

          A woman that is ‘worth it’ is one that at least takes the time to get to know a man before judging him….not judging him off of the way he looks or how much money he makes. ”

          But wouldn’t how much money you make or your job both be things that you can control?

          I’m not trying to be combative, I’m just saying just how you have things that you have ‘deal breakers’ or things you ‘just won’t tolerate’ women do too. So just as you are entitled to dismiss a chick with multiple baby daddies, wouldn’t she have the same right to dismiss you if you didn’t make “Insert arbitrary amount of money” here?

          Iono, I think its just a hard situation all around. Personally my must have list is pretty short. Smart and funny, and those are two things I know for sure that I am, so why not ask it in a Significant Other? If you want a chance for women to get to know you for you, you should afford them the same chance. I’m not saying lower your standards or go out seeking a woman who looks like the lovechild of Quasimodo and Flava Flav, but give people a chance, maybe?

          Also, very random addendum, I’m pretty sure lesbianism (at least the real kind anyway) isn’t something a chick chose, anymore than you chose to be straight, right?

      • eatshoots

        @ JS “whatever the issue was that caused him to stay loosing gets amplified with each failed experience and thus begins his downward spiral.”
        This!
        Self fulfilling prophecies are a mofo. Has someone ever recounted a conversation that you were party to, that leaves you wondering if you’re even talking about the same convo?

        “The longer you know dude the more you see him do the same sh*t that didn’t work for him… and with each fail he just gets more angry.”

        And when the woman du jour realizes that she can’t prove that she’s not like those other women, mainly because she is like those other women- exhausted, tired of being called out on some b.s., being judged against this master check list that just keeps growing, not as understanding as she could have been because hot dang, could he just be about something else but the blues?!! And she leaves him with some extra baggage that he now has to get through kinda like the poem about parents “They eff you up, your mum and dad. They may not mean to, but they do. They fill you with the faults they had, And add some extra, just for you…”

        Which is why you can’t sympathize with dude…
        I sympathize. But I’m not touching that with a ten foot pole. A man who won’t change for himself, is never going to change for me. That I know.

      • Betamale

        That was hilarious! Good comedy today

      • http://overthestory.blogspot.com Angie

        Truth. Well said.

      • Quiet Storm

        Couldnt say it better myself. *thumbs up*

      • sweetnessTO

        I love your comment. You hit the nail on the head. There are a at least a 100 bitter dudes like that in my city. Thank you for making it so crystal clear Jhane Sez!!

      • Eric

        This part sunk in real deep with me…
        “Totally co-sign that his frustration usually lies not in his inability to get women… but that he can’t get the women that he wants.”

        I was well on my way to being one of these guys in life. Then one day my life turned around and I had to realize that so many of the hang-ups in my life (even with women) where in some way my fault. Now, that doesn’t mean I’m a bad person and I know I’m not 100% good either. However I can accept the fact that I messed up in some shape or form (even if it’s just a case of being too good to someone who didn’t deserve it).

        As far as not getting the women that I wanted….. I actually had to sit back and realize that no matter what I wanted in a woman she would always have things about her that I DON’T want. But that’s the way life works. You want that hot new car, you better keep it maintained. You want that nice house and you gotta pay the taxes and maintain it. No matter how nice the prize you still have to put in work to maintain the rewards that it brings.

        Okay…. getting off the soap-box now… lol

    • Mimi

      Your post has managed to express my pain from spending X amount of years of being a platonic friend to a bitter man.

    • keisha brown

      I mean really, there are bytches to the left and bytches to the right for any single black man, over 30 with half a decent job, some kind of home training, and no baby momma drama or even MINIMAL bmd

      but are there cannons to the left of him and cannons to the right of him though?? are there?? *snickering…

      • PerceptionIsYourReality

        LOL at the Fresh Prince reference, circa 97′!! LOL!!

        • keisha brown

          fresh prince rocks!!

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      “Any man who is over 30 and single is single because he wants to be regardless of how he looks (I mean really, there are bytches to the left and bytches to the right for any single black man, over 30 with half a decent job, some kind of home training, and no baby momma drama or even MINIMAL bmd) yet this guy constantly talks about how these women out here ain’t s*&t, they’re all gold diggers, he can’t find a good woman, blah blah blah”

      sounds like you missed the entire point of the post. thanks for replying, though.

  • Mo-VSS

    Yeah, so we mostly hear bitter women (especially black women), but rarely hear about bitter men. Until you do. I’m sorry but I’m gonna say this. MOST bitter men are bitter because of stuff they assume about women. They assume nice guys finish last so they act like asses…and get treated as such. They get mad and think that its because they are inherently nice that they got treated badly. All the while not realizing their f-ked up beliefs are what keep them on the losing end in love. My point is that most bitter men have played the role they think will get them the most play and have lost their authentic self. Women can sense this and we treat men who do this accordingly. The remedy? Men need to stop believing just because they are men that they deserve the halle berry fine chick who cooks like Mrs. neely, f-ks like a porn star and has the social grace of Michelle Obama. No bruh…you get that when you work for it. But that’s the issue with bitter men. They don’t want to work for a quality woman but will hate on the first dude who did and got what he wanted.

    • http://lizburr.com Liz

      amen sister!!

      • Mimi

        ::passes out paper fans as the organ plays::

    • TheRealestLeo

      @ Mo

      Can’t speak for other men, but I was never looking for Halle Berry. I don’t play a role or do something because I think it’ll get me results with women. I’m me all the time. I would say that women can either get down with that or keep it moving….but since they have been all doing the latter, it doesn’t really make me feel as good about the situation.

      Lately, I haven’t been acting like an a-hole because I’m upset with women….I’ve been acting like an a-hole because that is the only way I can get my point across and be understood. That is also the only way I feel like I can be respected, as I have pretty much lost all faith in the Nice Guy way of doing things.

      And I don’t hate on anyone that’s getting theirs, unless they directly stepped on my toes to get there. (That has happened to me, by the way.) I am more than willing to work for the woman I want….if I could ever meet a woman that was worth putting in said work.

      When you go through life wondering if there is a such thing as being LIKED FOR WHO YOU ARE…..when you go through life not being able to enjoy simple things like the opportunity to ask someone of the opposite sex on a date….or even being around straight women over the age of 21 with a job and no kids/baby daddy drama (which is ALL I’m pretty much looking for)…..Sometimes a man can’t help but to be bitter. Not saying that it helps…..but what is there to be happy about? Who celebrates second place?

      • http://twitter.com/ManAboutIt Man About It

        I am more than willing to work for the woman I want….if I could ever meet a woman that was worth putting in said work.

        Where do you live? Your average big city got that in spades without major effort.

        • TheRealestLeo

          I currently live in South Korea, but when I was Stateside, I called Detroit and DC home.

          And when I was living in those cities, it was not the fountain of abundance you say it is.

          • http://twitter.com/ManAboutIt Man About It

            @TheRealestLeo

            I’ve known freaks in (and hear stories about) both cities. DC has especially had me wanting to book a flight. I mean, I live in L.A., where you meet a couple of bad ones taking your car in for an oil change, so it’s not that serious for me, LOL. Shoot, bring you home a cute English-speaking Korean you followed on Twitter.

            The women are there for guys…it doesn’t take that much work, even in some town with the whitest, frumpiest ppl in the world.

            • TheRealestLeo

              I can’t get with the Korean women…..they are not my cup of tea. I should add that they don’t like Black men either.

      • Jhane Sez

        “Lately, I haven’t been acting like an a-hole because I’m upset with women….I’ve been acting like an a-hole because that is the only way I can get my point across and be understood. That is also the only way I feel like I can be respected, as I have pretty much lost all faith in the Nice Guy way of doing things.”

        And how is that working for you…

        Yeah that is what I thought.

        Real talk… dudes who say that they want to be “liked for who they are” and find love usually are doing a poor job of self presentation.

        If all you want is single, no kids over 21 with a job and you can’t get that its usually because you are aiming too low…

        Nobody wants to be with someone who has no standards… because there will be nothing to differentiate one woman from the other except the fact that she said yes.

        Cause what you are describing is a warm body not a person.

        Between Nice Guy and Azz-hole is Interesting Guy… that’s who women want to get to know and ultimately sleep with… period.

        It’s easy to go to the extremes of the spectrum because they don’t require as much work as finding the middle ground and being interesting to women.

        When I was single I would say no to guys who approached me and asked me to dance… what are we in college…

        I would think that he wasn’t interested in conversation or getting to know me he just wanted to check out my body and get a vibe on how long it would take to get me in bed.

        But a guy who struck up a conversation and made me laugh had a 99% shot at a yes because he gave me a glimpse into who he was and he became someone I wanted to explore chemistry potential with.

        Just as an observation I have never heard you say that you made a woman laugh or smile or even engaged in lengthy conversations with women.

        The truth is because I have said no to nice guys and it was usually because I got the sense that any chick could have been sitting in my place…

        So why bother. ~JS

        • TheRealestLeo

          If you saw the rest of my post you copied from, you would have seen where I stated that it wasn’t really working.

          I believe I’m an interesting person, if any woman out there would look past the physical, past her list of what her perfect man is, and take me for who I am.

          I will admit that I don’t talk to many women these days because where I live…..there aren’t many women WORTH THAT CONVERSATION. I find out enough about them (and it’s usually things that make me not want to pursue them further) in the first few minutes of conversation.

          Now, I can’t say how skilled I am at conversing with women because the limited pool I’m working with doesn’t provide me with many opportunities to practice the art.

          When I said that I wanted a single straight woman over 21 with a job and no kids or drama….I meant to say that is all I’m looking for at first. From there, the conversation and the chemistry will determine how far things go. And I am never just looking for someone I can get in the bed. I have standards.

          • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh_muse

            I will admit that I don’t talk to many women these days because where I live…..there aren’t many women WORTH THAT CONVERSATION.

            I’m sorry. I had to come out of lurking to address this… Respectfully sir, here lies a portion of your problem. And I’m not bashing you — I don’t know you or your situation (besides what you post on this site)… but you have already decided that a large portion of living, breathing, human beings aren’t even worth your conversation. Up thread you said you have a generous spirit — this ISN’T generous. A few words isn’t really a lot to give… You can’t even give another person some small talk? A “hi – how you doing today?” Not for the sake of procuring panties – but just to sincerely be interested in how that other person is doing? Out of kindness and NOT thirstiness… If there was someone “worth” your conversation, you wouldn’t find out with this attitude… Just saying…

            judge not lest ye shall be judged
            love your neighbor as yourself… not to get preachy but genuinely treating people well goes a long way

            • http://twitter.com/kjnetic Peter Parker

              “but you have already decided that a large portion of living, breathing, human beings aren’t even worth your conversation. ”

              but don’t women do the same thing? i mean, dudes can come out and be proper and say ‘mornin’ how ya doin’ today” and get the gas face…
              what’s the difference between that and what dude ^ is doing?

              just saying…

              • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh_muse

                None. There is no difference.

              • eatshoots

                @Peter Parker “but don’t women do the same thing? i mean, dudes can come out and be proper and say ‘mornin’ how ya doin’ today” and get the gas face…”

                As pgh said, there’s no difference. I pretty much stopped RSVPing to the pity parties my girl throws when I see her consistently shut down men, all the time. At the club? He’s just looking for some one night action. At work? Don’t date a co-worker. At a cook-out? I don’t know that mofo! Church?Why’s he trying to hit on women at a church?Who does that?

                And on and on. Rinse, wash, repeat.

                Sometimes, you’re alone because you choose to be alone.

              • TheRealestLeo

                @ Peter Parker

                …Or how women will deem 88 percent of the male population unworthy because he’s not 6’2″…..I wonder if women realize that being tall is, biologically speaking, a RECESSIVE TRAIT.

                At least a woman had control over how many kids she chose to have with worthless ninjas before we met. She had control over the fact that she grew up only watching The Box and MTV, so all her conversations sound like they came out of that Right On! magazine. She had control over the fact that a few dudes she dealt with just might not have been the right one for her….but that alone is no excuse for becoming a lesbo.

          • eatshoots

            @TheRealest Leo

            FWIW. I hear you on your non-negotiables. We all have them. And what I inferred from “it’s usually things that make me not want to pursue them further” was that in the first few seconds, you can tell if they don’t meet your minimum checklist i.e. single, straight, childless. We all need a quick way to sort out the chaff from the wheat as we define it, so I hear you on that.

            Thing is, when this ” I’ve been acting like an a-hole because that is the only way I can get my point across and be understood” meets “When you go through life wondering if there is a such thing as being LIKED FOR WHO YOU ARE”, for me, who’s just sitting here eating kimchee, minding my own business, what I’m going to see is just garden variety a-hole, and I’ll pass on that with the quickness, as it’s just another a-hole with issues that’s coming on to me. Snap decision, erroneous as you say/infer. But for regular Tameka Jones with no masochistic tendencies, I will probably not want to invest in a man who’s angry before I’ve even pissed him off as guaranteed, there will be occasions, many and numerous that I, all by my lonesome, shall indeed piss you off, disappoint you, vex you and enrage you.

            • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

              LOL@masochistic tendencies. I’ve been getting over those myself. One dude recently shouted at me that he TOLD me I shouldn’t like him, that he wasn’t ready, that he didn’t want more, blah blah blah. He did so until I was crying and couldn’t respond.

              THEN, days later, he’s texting me. Trying to link up. Sorry crazy dude. You told me not to like you and now, thanks to you, I don’t. I got enough emotional abuse from my last dude, lol.

        • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

          It’s funny you mention a good convo. I recently had this kinda tight convo with a much younger dude. I used to date younger dudes but I’ve kinda switched to older dudes recently. Honestly, I don’t see much of a difference. They have different issues, but it all culminates in the same behavior, whether 22 or 32.

          Anyway, I wasn’t even thinking about him at the party we were both at because he was trying to holla at my gf and she had stories about him, plus there were other, more attractive men sweating me. But he gave me a ride home because we lived close and had this cool convo. A convo that had me taking a second look at him and at younger guys. I, at 26, was the oldest person at that party and was REALLY digging the attention, lol.

          Anyway, my point is that I agree, that attraction can be given a mega-boost when there’s a great convo to go with it. A borderline guy you wouldn’t normally look at or really consider can be thinking you might want to take a shot.

          Unfortunately, this story doesn’t have a happy ending, because although he got my number and I gave it to him, I forgot I knew him because he was sweating my friend, and even though they’d never hooked up, never even been able to link up before that party (at which she was flirting with the several other men she’d invited who were also courting her), SHE felt weird about it, and I felt obligated not to proceed with the dude to avoid drama.

          So yeah, I might be reconsidering younger dudes. They DEFINITELY don’t tend to be as bitter as the older dudes, or as arrogant as the dudes my age. They DEFINITELY have other issues. But bitter dudes have been ticking me off, lately.

      • CrisisCore

        For the record im in that nice guy finish last state but daamn homie you sound kinda bitter. like i see where you’re coming from, past experiences and whatever. But the whole worth it thing is a cop out dude. More often than not the girl that you even take the time to take out on a date is worth it or whatever, you just have to give everyone a fair chance. You know what they say about assuming. Assuming makes a**es out of you and me.

        • TheRealestLeo

          I will give fair chances when I am given fair chances.

          And it’s not a cop out…..Most women I come across here in the military are NOT WORTH IT. Trust me when I say that.

          • CPT Callamity

            Trust me I know about the military, Korea and the women there…you ain’t lying!

          • Mo-VSS

            And the assumption is that men in the military ain’t worth it either. I grew up on an Army base and have seen the good, bad and ugly of military life and relationships.

            But…that’s not the rule, it’s the exception.

            Keep believing it though…you keep options for the other, less bitter ones wide open.

            • TheRealestLeo

              I grew up a military brat as well.

              However, unless you’re IN the military NOW….I don’t think you’d fully understand where I’m coming from.

          • MzPW

            Brotha, in all respect…….I read a lot of your responses here (on other posts as well), and it just seems like you’re constantly complaining about how women don’t give you a fair shake because of their superficial reasons (whatever they may be), although you are a good guy and would be classified as a generally “good catch” for any woman. It also seems like, in that same breath, you focus heavily on women not being able to meet your standards and how there aren’t many around you that are worth you taking the effort to get to know them in a more personal manner. I guess it seems like you’re preparing yourself to lose the game before you even get out of the locker room. Maybe it would be a good idea to take a look at yourself on a more “in depth” level to figure out how YOU operate, what characteristics a woman should have in order to make you happy, and what characteristics YOU need to have to offer her the same companionships you’re currently searchinf for (rather than just being a “good match” because she has no kids, keeps herself up, can hold a conversation and gave you a chance).

            I don’t know if you’re currently looking or not or what your current situation is, but there’s so much more to finding YOUR perfect match (not just A perfect match, but someone that brings out the best and connects the best for you) than just holding the general “good guy” qualities. Trust….the a**holes in society now were once good guys; they just didn’t get the message that they need to know and understand their OWN self first before they can claim victories in the dating game, y’know?

            • MzPW

              oh yeah…excuse the typos and whatnot. A 10-hour shift will do that to you…

      • http://www.shesoflyy.com Muze

        “when you go through life not being able to enjoy simple things like the opportunity to ask someone of the opposite sex on a date….or even being around straight women over the age of 21 with a job and no kids/baby daddy drama (which is ALL I’m pretty much looking for)…..Sometimes a man can’t help but to be bitter. Not saying that it helps…..but what is there to be happy about? Who celebrates second place?”

        wow. this is my ex. had no idea more of him existed.

      • Mass

        Intro? I knew this story sounded familiar.

      • KAPSpecial

        “when you go through life not being able to enjoy simple things like the opportunity to ask someone of the opposite sex on a date.”

        The OPPORTUNITY to ask someone on a date is always there, you actually have to ask otherwise YOU miss the opportunity and that’s on YOU.

      • Mo-VSS

        “I’ve been acting like an a-hole because that is the only way I can get my point across and be understood. That is also the only way I feel like I can be respected, as I have pretty much lost all faith in the Nice Guy way of doing things.”

        We had a post a few weeks back about how women can be complete bytches to dudes when they approach…even if a man approaches in a respectful way. Most women and men agreed that that line of thinking is wrong and will net no positive results (and may even get one slapped).

        So, might I ask…why do you think that being a jerk will net you positive results? They won’t. Especially not from the type of woman you say you seek. It will, however, get you a rep for being a mean, nasty, arrogant jerk. True or not…perception is reality, my friend and if that’s the perception you put out, then welcome to your reality.

        And, as for someone stepping on your toes to get a girl, let’s be real here. She wasn’t for you. Just like a man who would get with a friend of mine who put on the advances…they did ME a favor. Let’s go one further…life ain’t fair

        Oh…….sigh…..shocker, I know. But, it’s not. And it’s time someone told you that.

        You won’t always get what you want. You won’t always have the happiest ending, the best relationship, the most opportunity to develop a relationship, etc, etc, etc as other folks may. But, life isn’t about what you DON’T have, it’s about what you do. Play whatever you have up and watch how that confidence in who you are, what you have to offer and your authentic self attract a decent chick…one you may want to pursue with, or not.

        But, anything’s better than the “poor me because life has handed me lemons and dirt” attitude.

        Just a thought…

        • http://twitter.com/kjnetic Peter Parker

          “So, might I ask…why do you think that being a jerk will net you positive results?”

          maybe because…in his situation…being “a non-jerk” didn’t work at all?

        • TheRealestLeo

          The opposite of being a Nice Guy isn’t necessarily being a complete jerk.

          As far as playing up my strengths….If only I could get a concrete idea of what those were. When every woman a man has ever approached has turned him down….How is a man supposed to know what strengths he has?

          • KAPSpecial

            @ TheRealestLeo
            I’m going to take your word for it, but I’m having a hard time believing that EVERY woman has turned you down. Like what is your approach, “B!tch give me your number or die?”

            Seriously though your strengths are your own. They are what you possess naturally or have learned over the years. Your dating history shouldn’t have a real affect on your strengths. Are you funny? Are you smart? Are you well-read? Are you creative? Are you wealthy?

            Also who are you approaching? Do you look for signs of receptiveness or friendliness? How often do you ask women out once every blue moon? Cause sometimes it’s a numbers game the more you ask the more likely you are to get a “yes.”

            When you get back to the States even for a visit, I think you should consider doing speed dating. It’s usually cheap as all get out for men (like $10 or $15) and sometimes your fee includes a drink. You can interact with 10-20 women in one nite and while there may be no love connection it can be good practice and you don’t have to actually ask anyone out. If you get a match you already know you have an “in.”

            • TheRealestLeo

              I don’t have a set approach I use with any given woman. It all depends on the woman, location, and what I’ve already learned about her.

              Hell, approaching and striking up conversation with a woman is not the hard part. It’s finding women to do that with that is the hard part. I’m in a country (South Korea) of 25 million women, and at least 24.5 million of them want NOTHING TO DO WITH BLACK MEN. Out of the half-million or so that aren’t Korean….very few of them are Black, and most of the Black women I’ve run into over here are in the military. Doesn’t automatically disqualify them, but it instantly makes dating and getting to know them more difficult. And unless you are in the military or have served….You. Would. Not. Understand. PERIOD.

              Truth be told…..it’s been at least four years since I last *seriously* approached a woman I was interested in. Mind you, 2.5 of those years I’ve been in the military (or considering joining)…..so there were no decent women in that time frame. Most times, while getting to know a woman, I can make up my mind as to whether I should make a move before I actually do. A lot of women have things going on that make me not want to approach them, but at least I made a friend.

              I’m not some bitter dude out here looking for vengeance against all women, because I’ve only been in one real relationship in my life. My story isn’t the same as the typical Bitter Man’s story is. I generally cut bad/not the right one/incompatible women off before they become bad relationship stories to sit around the campfire venting about later on.

              Of course….nobody is going to read this for what I wrote. Everyone’s got me painted with the “Oh, he’s just another Bitter Ninja who doesn’t wanna change”….

              ….Could not be further from the truth. I KNOW ninjas that don’t wanna change. They’re the ones laughing at me and my issues while bagging the same Loose Lucy chicks on base and thinking they have swag. They’re the ones the few decent women come to me complaining about. They’re the ones with Article 15′s hanging over their heads because they did some stupid ish like sexually assault a woman in the barracks one night.

              I an NOT that dude.

              Again….I doubt anyone will even see this…Why bother?

              • Kimmy

                I’m a day late and probably a few dollars short so you may not even read this comment, but methinks you’re the one with the issues. It is obvious that you want something genuinine, BUT you also come across as very insecure and sorry to say, very bitter. You’re just too deep in it to realize that. You can’t wait until the right one comes along to deal with that because those are the same things that will keep you from meeting the right one. Its difficult to let go and remain hopeful and expectant after life (or in your case, women) let you down but its the nature of this beast called life. I don’t mean to trivialize things at all but the truth is that ish happens. Its just a fact of life. And you can’t look to women to define your strenghts-that is probably part of your issue. You don’t know what your own strengths are, so how can you emphasize them? Plus…and I don’t mean this disrespectfully at all, maybe you don’t have as much to offer as you think you do, but that’s ok, you’re still alive so you can work on that. Introspection is hard but necessary. I’ve been through a lot in my life but I have come to realize that I STILL have a choice in how I act and what I expect out of life and so do you. Chin up soldier.

              • TheRealestLeo

                I know I have issues. Thanks for being the 1,000th person to point that out.

                As far as what I have to offer and if it’s good enough….time will tell.

                The challenge is….can I be patient enough to wait some more on what I’ve already bee waiting forever for?

            • redlatte

              I second the speed dating suggestion. It’s actually pretty fun if you walk into it with an open mind and light heart :)

              • Kimmy

                @ The Realest Leo. I didn’t mean to be mean at all. Nor am I trying to dismiss how you are feeling. It seems to me that you are really hurting and I get that. I just think that you are so wrapped up in it that you can’t see any other way. You feel so sorry for yourself that that’s all you can see. There may even be a little part of you that enjoys it because you are so used to it. My point in saying that maybe you don’t have as much to offer is that I think many of us (yes, meaning me too) get so caught up thinking we’re the ish, that we overlook the things about ourselves that really need to be worked on. As I commented on another post once, sometimes its “them” but sometimes its ME. This doesn’t mean you’re a bad person or that no one will ever want you, it just means there are probably some things you should work on. I think I read downthread that you haven’t had anything good happen to you for the past 5 years. I think the issue is your outlook on life, rather than life itself.

                I firmly believe our expectations very often shape what we get out of life. You seem to expect nothing-or bad things- and have been receivng just that. It is true that our expectations are often shaped by our pasts, but if our pasts weren’t great, what then? Can you still believe something good is going to happen to you? Why, yes! It becomes harder, but you still have a choice. That’s one of the greatest things about life. Choice. Choose happiness. Choose to be hopeful.

          • MzPW

            A woman, or any person that is NOT you, cannot tell you your own strengths; it’s up to you to take a long look at your life experiencs and figure out how you made it throuh certain situations, how you found solutions to certain problems, and how you managed to maintain your own wellbeing. YOU have to determine your strength.

    • keisha brown

      @Mo…
      i dont know what office i can elect you to for this comment.
      but you got my vote!

      • Mo-VSS

        Thanks.

        I was thinking maybe Secretary-Treasurer of the Anti-bitter movement. LOL

        • keisha brown

          @Mo..
          Sec-Tres it is!!! of ALL movements!! ;)

    • tgtaggie

      +1. From watching some of those Neely episodes. I would venture to think that Gina Neely puts it on Pat Neely like a porn star. lol. This can also be true about our Pres. and First Lady. I see how Barack looks at Michelle. lol

      Being a guy, a lot of us have a very bad entitlement complex (I really don’t have one per se. lol). Just because you graduated from here, work at this great place and “The Man” thinks you are the second coming of black Jesus doesn’t entitle you to a Halle, Gelia Bekele or a Jurnee Smollett. A good woman should be able to see past the material things (b/c those things fade) and see a guy for who he is. That is where we are most compatible at. A relationship not built on a solid foundation (material possessions, social status) and not true compatibility factors such as spiritual, emotional and financial compatibility. they will either fail or struggle with making the relationship work.
      From watching some of those Neely episodes. I would venture to think that Gina Neely puts it on Pat Neely like a porn star. lol. This can also be true about our Pres. and First Lady. I see how Barack looks at Michelle. lol

      • keisha brown

        i adore how Barack looks at Michelle.
        *sighs.

        • WIP

          When I saw them in the Barbara Walter’s special, I wanted to invite them over to play Spades. I looooved the way they joked with each other. When Barbara asked them about Christmas gifts and Michele said (paraphrasing) she tells her daughters ‘you have a bed to sleep in, you have a roof over your head, Merry Christmas’ I think I clim@xed a little. I love them.

      • Mo-VSS

        tgtaggie…I loved that comment.

        Men and women have entitlement issues. But, since today’s post is aimed at men, that’s why I went in the way I did.

        But it works both ways.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      “Yeah, so we mostly hear bitter women (especially black women), but rarely hear about bitter men. Until you do. I’m sorry but I’m gonna say this. MOST bitter men are bitter because of stuff they assume about women.”

      that’s the thing. this — what you stated in your comment — isn’t always the case. some guys do have genuine reasons to be a bit upset about things, but they don’t get sympathetic ears (from women and from other men). what ends up happening is that some of them just end up saying “f*ck it, f*ck everybody”. and, to be perfectly honest, I really can’t blame them

      • CPT Callamity

        Truf here. I don’t know dudes that can go to other dudes and sort of vent and let out how they feel about a bad situation without being told to either “man up” or “fuck dat b*tch!” There is no real healing for the most part. A lot of dudes just eat it and it doesn’t even have to be relationship wise either. Even basic traumatic events get no real addressing. The only solution people offer is to go to a shrink or “get over it.”

      • Mo-VSS

        But, y’all do have outlets. They just aren’t in the same form as women. But trust, your mother, some trusted female friends (preferably ones you aren’t trying to f-k and vice versa), and some of your more enlightened boys will lend you an ear and sound advice (if requested).

        It’s the pride of men that keep them from going that route though. Y’all keep in line with the “men don’t cry, have feelings” theme and stunt your own growth.

        • TheRealestLeo

          I don’t have those avenues, for the most part.

      • RedLatte

        “but they don’t get sympathetic ears (from women and from other men). what ends up happening is that some of them just end up saying “f*ck it, f*ck everybody”. and, to be perfectly honest, I really can’t blame them”

        I have to agree….And women do this too allllllll the time….Heck some women say “f*ck it, f*ck everybody” and throw the towel in on men period and get with another woman b/c they’ve been so thoroughly dogged out by men/a man.

        While men can and IMO (traditional feminists don’t ehate me) should be our protectors and providers, as is possible given this day and age, men are also sensitive and need and deserve to be allowed to heal from their pain in a healthy way- just like we do.

        Double standard for men/women on this. I.e. between men, there’s a lack of crying alone in the bathroom stall on breaks at work, watching movies that make you cry, writing in journals, eating chocolate things and ice cream, conducting retail therapy while eating chocolate things and ice cream, venting and other activities that are part of the female healing process after a sad break-up, being strung along and then realizing you’re being strung along, used, played or otherwise getting hurt through our relationships.

        • CPT Callamity

          There is always liquor and misguided anger [/sarcasm]

          • RedLatte

            more specifically car keying, stalking, prank calling (do ppl do that anymore?), calling to cuss out the new love of your so’s life….
            Um, I’m new to posting here and I am lost at how to add striken out text, but re-read the above as if it’s striken out.

            @CPT Callamity- Sarcasm…check. Actually though, not too far off-base w/some scorned and bitter folks’ (men & women) attempt at “getting over it.” Sad and quite counterproductive but true….

      • delicate g

        So does that mean we should put up with their bullslit behavior just to lend them an ear on our first couple of dates? Pulease!

        • TheRealestLeo

          No. Who said you were supposed to date them?

        • JediBrah

          Also if the guy is GETTING dates..chances are he isn’t bitter. He’s just a jerk. The bitter men tend to give up all together and stay to themselves.

          I’ve gone that road myself before. Stayed to myself, draw…programmed…read a lot. I’m just now getting out of it…stayed to myself for some 6 years. No dating…maybe went out to hang with friends 10 times in 6 years. Just reflecting*which is bad by the way*

    • KAPSpecial

      Oh my goodness! I just had this conversation yesterday with one of my married guy friends who was saying regular dudes don’t get no play and seemingly horrible dudes (those w/o jobs, never looking for a job, apparently allergic to jobs) stay booed up with seemingly quality women who are willing to take care of them.

      I was like the regular dudes that also have jobs think they deserve a Beyonce, plus all the ish you mentioned when they better settle for Keisha who is a paralegal, w/o kids, and when you hold your breath and squint she sorta, kinda does look like she could be Beyonce’s cousin.

      • KAPSpecial

        Hmm…my previous comment was @Mo-VSS, I’m not sure why it ended up down here. Sigh.

      • CrisisCore

        no one’s lookin for a beyonce. we trynna stay in our lanes. All we ask is that we get some kinda play from girls who you dont have to cross your eyes, squint, and pray for them to look decent.

        But anyway i can understand bein a little bitter but throwing every girl you meet under the bus is a little extreme

        Just my unsolicited 2 cents

        • KAPSpecial

          @CrisisCore
          I think there are a lot of attractive women out there that lament about their dating prospects. And me and my crew are fairly open minded (some too open-minded). However, I have guy friends (and maybe they just suck) who have some very interesting things on their wishlist.

          For example, my one guy liked this one girl but her quirk was that he believed she did her own hair and it wasn’t as straight as if a professional stylist did it. Umm…okay. Another chick he liked he met out and about and he was really feeling her and the convo was good, but apparently when she stood up she was thicker than expected. He was done. He was sad cause according to him she would be a straight 10 if she lost some weight. I’m not sure how her upper body and face didn’t give any signs to the rest of her body, but maybe she was ultra skinny from the waist up, who knows.

          One fool friend of mine told me he don’t date girls who wear capri pants and how NO MAN likes capri pants. Umm…I’d prefer my man not know capri pants by name. Just know I have on some type of bottoms, but please don’t diss me cause I have on capris.

          Another dude pretty much hangs in the black professional scene in his urban light city and although he realizes there are only a small finite number of folks that fit into the category of young + black + professional + not extremely crazy + attractive in his whack metropolis, he refuses to date any girl from that set who has EVER dated any other dude from that scene. Even if the dude is not a close friend, co-worker, or someone he has even had a real conversation with, etc. Sigh.

          Can someone address this idea that you can’t date a girl/guy who has dated someone you know? I mean I wouldn’t date my good friends’ exes* or my 1st cousin’s last boo, but I would open to being hollered at by everybody else’s ex.

          *Unless he’s great, they dated back in the day and she seems cool with it – hell I’m 30 and can’t be fooling with heifers calling dibbs on a dude they once kissed at that one party during college orientation.

          • keisha brown

            @Kapspecial
            CAPRI PANTS THO????? o__O

            • KAPSpecial

              What’s wrong with capri pants?!?!?

              • keisha brown

                oh.. sorry KAPspecial..
                i meant the dude rejecting based on capri pants.
                im with you.. what man knows capri pants.
                capri sun? sure.
                capri pants? no. not if you want to date a girl.

          • CrisisCore

            …yeah your friends just suck lol hate to break it to you. Cleary they are hell bent on bein lonely. I aint bout that life tho. And to be honest with you, if i barely even know/associate their ex they’re fair game. Its grimy in these streets haha

          • TheRealestLeo

            I cannot date any woman that used to date someone I knew. Especially if I still know the dude and we’re still boys. Even more so if ALL THREE OF US are still cool.

            Example: A few ladies I went to school with….I had some interest in them. I only really approached two of them (at different times, of course). Both of them turned me down, but later on ended up dating two of my homeboys. One has a son with said homeboy, although I don’t think they are still together. We’re all still friends with each other. If any of these women came around in the future….I don’t think I can do it. Especially not in the case of the one with the kid. I mean….she had her chance back then given as how I approached her first, right? I did my part at that time as a man and approached her…..right? Exactly.

    • sweetnessTO

      OMG. I love your comment too!! :)

  • TheRealestLeo

    The. Story. Of. My. Life.

    (Almost.)