platonic shmetonic…extended: six reasons why platonic relationships can’t and don’t exist

Posted on 4 May, 2009 by The Champ

***the following is a revision of platonic shmetonic, which was originally posted april 2008. in light of a few conversations i’ve had in the last few weeks, i felt it was particularly apropos and sh*t today***

bff1

we’ve heard it before.

boy approaches girl, and girl is charmed by his subtly effeminate masculinity non-threateningly secure heterosexuality, the fact that he noticed she’s wearing seven’s jeans and his proper use of “eclecticism” and “pragmatic”. boy and girl exchange numbers, and after a month or so of coffee-house outings and a trip to banana republic, they become…friends. not lovers, not even the awkward “friends with benefits”, but friends. bff’s serving as each others de facto permanent back-up weekend companion, but never, ever, ever, ever, ever crossing that line.

sure, they’ve seen “chasing amy”, and are aware that the odds stack up against two like-aged, opposite sexed, available, un-asexual people staying strictly platonic friends even in tough economic times, but theyre different, and they prove their differentness by staying true friends, forever.

everyone has heard this story before. everyone has also heard stories about the green man, virginal latinas, and beer that actually tastes good. just like the three aforementioned inventions, truly platonic like-aged male and female close relationships do not and cannot exist…and i’ll give you six reasons why.

1. unless online or in college (two paradoxical universes where the usual rules and regulations of social discourse are thrown out of the window, like mop water and caustic midgets) men and women don’t actively seek friends of the opposite sex.

2. if given the opportunity, most men who aren’t in a committed and monogamous romantic relationship will sleep with pretty much any reasonably attractive woman.

yes.

any.

we may not actively want to, but, in the right situation, we happily would. that pesky “would” kind of has a way of always completely contradicting the whole “free from sensual desires” platonic thing.

“well, what if the guy harbors absolutely no physical attraction at all towards the woman?? a platonic friendship can occur then, right??“, i hear you asking, which leads us to…

3. no unattached man is going to willingly spend a good amount of his free time with a like-aged woman he is completely unattracted to, a fact which “fits”, especially when you consider that…

4. women (please note the lack of qualifiers) aren’t equipped to handle regular contact with a guy who finds her completely unattractive. don’t argue this. it’s science.

basically, i’ll watch an entire episode of “meet the browns” before 3 and 4 have any chance of occurring.

plus…

5. …even if you claim to be in the 0.1 percent of people where there’s absolutely no romantic feeling harbored by either side in your platonic relationship, you have to figure in “the champ’s law of averages and percentages“,

basically, if you spend more than 20% of your free time with someone of the opposite sex willingly, there’s at least a 50% chance that at least one of you will develop sexual feelings…or already has developed them but fears that they would be unrequited. the higher the percentage of free time, the higher the chance.

the equation is x(time percentage)* 2.5 = y(chance percentage).

according to that, if you spend anywhere over 40 percent of your free time with a platonic friend, then there’s anywhere from a 100 to 250 percent chance that someone wants to bed somebody. dont argue. its science and sh*t

since i’ve already established that we don’t actively seek opposite sex friends while we’re single, the only way two people in separate romantic relationships can become truly platonic friends would be if they happened to first meet each other after they both were already in the relationship, an impossibility due to the fact that…

6. …no man or woman is going to be okay with their significant other making new close friends of the opposite sex.

you know, I’ve considered the fact that maybe my platonic friend viewpoint is a bit jaded. this is most likely due to the fact that the one time I tried the very, very, very close strictly platonic friend thing, within a four year span caught feelings, nasty emails, and some very, ummm, “unplatonic” things involving a staircase, a blackout, and an empty bottle of moet eventually occurred. thing is, all that experience did for me is reinforce what millions of years of evolution has taught us…men are simple, women are nuts, and holden mcneil is a f*cking idiot.

—the champ

http://nextbigthing.blogsome.com Hostess

IF they ever are PF’s, at one point, one of them will want the other. It might switch from time to time, but one will want the other. As a result, the wanter will consciously or subconsciously use his/her ‘trusted friend’ power to sabotage the wantee’s current relationship.

I’ve had so-called friends decide, upon realizing that a dude waltzed in and got into a committed relationship with me, up and decide to start calling during the non-friend hours of 10:31PM and 10:31AM. Or they OBVIOUSLY look at me in a way that makes onlookers/my guy ask, “Did y’all ever?”

From a woman’s standpoint, I don’t see why dudes don’t get that if I say I don’t want to date them and tuck them in the Friendship Zone, that’s where they will stay. Yes, I know life would be easier if I liked them like that. But I don’t.

*jazz hands*
- Jarrod Halsey
  
  @Hostess,
  “From a woman’s standpoint, I don’t see why dudes don’t get that if I say I don’t want to date them and tuck them in the Friendship Zone, that’s where they will stay.”
  
  Because people (see: women) often say things and do the exact opposite.
  - Humble_One
    
    @Jarrod Halsey,
    
    Exactly. If I had a penny for every woman that said this or that and went back and did the opposite.
    - http://www.awesomelyluvvie.com Luvvie
      
      @Humble_One,
      
      U’d have a pence
  - http://nextbigthing.blogsome.com Hostess
    
    @Jarrod Halsey, Those flip-flopping heffas have made it hard on me. To this day I have never went back on my word. If I don’t like a dude for more than an occasional outing with no physical contact, it is what it is.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @Hostess,
  
  From a woman’s standpoint, I don’t see why dudes don’t get that if I say I don’t want to date them and tuck them in the Friendship Zone, that’s where they will stay
  
  yeah, hostess, maybe you personally don’t cross that line, but i know of many instances when the line was crossed, stepped on, spit at, and shanked
  - http://www.myspace.com/wudaman19 WuDaMan
    
    @The Champ,
    
    the line was crossed, stepped on, spit at, and shanked
    
    hahaha reminds me of playing football in the street. guys would put the ball on the line of scrimage and say 5 yards over and under spit and errthang. Then they’d huddle up and call plays.
- Scipio Africanus
  
  @Hostess, It’s not that cats don’t get it. It’s just that it’s really hard to turn that off, for us.
- http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula
  
  @Hostess,
  
  Dead@ “jazz hands”
  
  But this –>Or they OBVIOUSLY look at me in a way that makes onlookers/my guy ask, “Did y’all ever?” <– is so true, it gave me shivers.
http://myspace.com/igotastory meleka on the laptop

Remember how I used to tell you that I was in a platonic friendship many moons ago? Well champ I lied to you, and myself- all in the same breath lol. He is now married and wants me to be “friends” with him again. I’m like cam “tell that s–t to anotha sucka.”

I apologize to the vsb community for having to quote Cam’ron Giles to further prove my disdain for my so-called platonic buddy. I had to…
- miss t-lee
  
  @meleka on the laptop,
  “He is now married and wants me to be “friends” with him again.”
  
  *throat punch*
  Tell him to be friends with his wife.
  
  *giggling*
  - sisanda
    
    @miss t-lee,
    
    “Tell him to be friends with his wife.” – LMFAO cause real men don’t giggle
    - miss t-lee
      
      @sisanda,
      You are correct sir.
      Men don’t giggle.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @meleka on the laptop,
  
  Remember how I used to tell you that I was in a platonic friendship many moons ago? Well champ I lied to you, and myself- all in the same breath lol. He is now married and wants me to be “friends” with him again. I’m like cam “tell that s–t to anotha sucka.”
  
  see how easy sh*t would be if you listened to me?
  
  that rhymed, didnt it?
http://theyounganddisenchanted.wordpress.com/ puff

lol… i have only male friend with whom i’m 100% sure our relationship is totally platonic (because i was convinced for the first 3 months that we knew each other that he was gay) which is kind of problematic as i spend a good 70% of my time with my male “friends”… but then again, i’m still in college so i’m hoping that these rules don’t apply to me.

but every single one of your points makes sense (although with 6, i’d say some women in my experience would still be mad at their man for having a female friend, even if they’ve known them for way longer)… le sigh. it’s frustrating because i highly value all of my friendships with my male friends, but being aware of the sexual dimension makes me have to be a little more cautious about the kinds of interactions we have (i.e. no sharing showers or trying on my new skirt in front of them), more so than with my female friends. i guess that’s just the nature of the game.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @puff,
  
  “….no sharing showers or trying on my new skirt in front of them….”
  
  ummm, you share showers with your female friends? you don’t happen to go to hustler u, do you?
  - http://theyounganddisenchanted.wordpress.com/ puff
    
    @The Champ,
    
    i’m currently on an exchange program there.
    
    but seriously, i was kidding with the shower thing. a little.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=73903598 Dom
      
      @puff,
      
      I’m going to steal a line from champ and say …………………………………………………………………………………… Cuz I just recently found out what that means.
      - Me fail english?
        
        @Dom,
        
        What does it mean?
        
        http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula
        
        @Me fail english?,
        
        Like really? I’m drawing a blank here.
        
        http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=73903598 Dom
        
        @Me fail english?,
        
        Sorry, Raising an eyebrow according to Champ.
        
        I prefer to call it the What The F*** Face.
http://graywords1000@yahoo.com Dorian G.

#6 can’t be truer. No new ni99as when we in a relationship. That’s a violation on many levels.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @Dorian G.,
  
  i actually think a typical woman would be more upset about this than a typical man
  - http://www.museacdonline.coem pgh muse
    
    @The Champ, Nope. Ur wrong.
http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com blackberry molasses on her Crackberry

I smell a re-hashed post.

Its all good Champeroo-sky.

And you are right. Every dude who is still in my circle of friends (and isn’t dating or married to another close friend) has expressed to me in one way or another that if given time and opportunity, it would be on and poppin’. D’ah well. At least I know my married azz can still get it (squirrel! Go ‘head if you wanna!)
- http://www.myspace.com/chicanextdoor Miss Patterson
  
  @blackberry molasses on her Crackberry, “I smell a re-hashed post.”
  
  i was going to say the same thing, but he made such effort with the new clip art. i guess we should all just let it slide. *snickering*
  - http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
    
    @Miss Patterson,
    
    snicker deez
- shay_d_lady
  
  @blackberry molasses on her Crackberry, yeah weve been down this road a plenty!!
- Gem of the Ocean
  
  At least I know my married azz can still get it (squirrel! Go ‘head if you wanna!)
  
  yes indeedy!!!!!!
- overit
  
  @blackberry molasses on her Crackberry, is it sad that I saw the “it (squirrel! Go ‘head if you wanna!)” first and did the paw paw? I did read your comment tho lol.
  - http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses
    
    @overit,
    
    sad indeed… but funny nonetheless.
    
    feeling too weak from 4 days of no food to be clever. maybe i should eat? but it HURTS to eat.
    - http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
      
      @blackberry molasses,
      
      did you run a marathon this weekend?
      - http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses
        
        @The Champ,
        
        nope…. had strep throat. was supposed to be in the Broad Street Run. Spent that day doped up on ibuprofen and an un-named steroid.
        
        Fun way to spend the birthday, let me tell you!
        
        overit
        
        @blackberry molasses, aww, feel better my little bee bee!
charli skipper

i mean, as much as i have to, i just have to agree with this whole post. in college i had a bunch of male friends. so i was one of those people that woulda been like, “what, champ? hell naw.” but, yeah, latetely i’ve learned that, yeah….it’s gonna get awkward.

and in other news: chile, is anybody watchin “candy girls”? these skeezers…i never knew there was a seniority system to video girlism.
- superwoman
  
  @charli skipper, candy girls is on air in south africa also, and i am sickeningly addicted!!! those women aren’t even that attractive, i’ve seen plenty, plenty FAR more beautiful girls walking the streets of NY, LA, Boston, etc… i mean.. really!
  
  but still, i’m addicted…
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @charli skipper,
  
  thing is, college is really the only time when something like this can work. well, college and people you might have met online.
  - http://myspace.com/igotastory meleka on the laptop
    
    @The Champ, yea i have to agree. I met ole boy in college, and things became shaky after we both graduated and didn’t have that “dawson-lets climb into each other window and be friends” complex anymore. And by “dawson complex”, i mean i totally just made that up.
- Me fail english?
  
  @charli skipper,
  
  Candy Girls is my favorite train wreck! Why won’t she fire that useless assistant with her annoying ass voice??? Although I’m glad she’s here cuz last week when she was going off was funny. Haven’t seen last nite’s ep yet.
  - CoCo
    
    @Me fail english?,
    
    OOOOHHH! wait til you see last nigh’s ep….
    DRAMA. annoying assistant almost got that @$$ whooped. chile… Brooke does not play.
    - Me fail english?
      
      @CoCo,
      
      Yeah I don’t know what that chick was thinking. How you gonna tell your boss, friend or not, that purposely sabotaged her employees during a job??
      
      Danielle needs to stop being a nurturing, big sister type to these chicks and start being a manager. It looked like in this last ep’s previews SHE was the one taking the most hits. Da hell?
      - http://carverthegreat.wordpress.com Carver The Great!
        
        @Me fail english?,
        
        someone please tell me how to watch reality television. i have tried numerous times but after 7 and 3/4 minutes my brain feels like the egg on the “this is your brain on drugs” commercial.
        
        Me fail english?
        
        @Carver The Great!,
        
        “my brain feels like the egg on the “this is your brain on drugs” commercial.”
        
        That means it’s working
        
        http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula
        
        @Carver The Great!,
        
        You and me both…
        
        ….but I can’t really say a thing because I’m an addict of “The Nanny”…
Imperfect

I agree with this post totslly. I have had 2 “platonic” relationships. Both guys and I are pretty close. The 1st occasionally requests to see my boobies, and I’ve been tempted a couple times (after a couple drinks) to show him…but haven’t. The 2nd recently told me that he was in love with me, completely threw me and I kind’ve been avoiding him since.

I think “platonic” relationship means simply “we haven’t slept together – yet.
- http://www.satyasslant.blogspot.com Satya
  
  @Imperfect, lol ummm the one who asks to see your boobies sounds like a guy friend I had back in HS.
  -I’m usually not bothered if a guy friend says if he had the chance he’d like something but when they drop the love card I find it weird. Can’t blame you for avoiding him
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @Imperfect,
  
  “…The 1st occasionally requests to see my boobies…”
  
  thats what friends are for and sh*t
  - Deviant
    
    @The Champ,
    
    thats the #1 reason to have a female friend.
    - sisanda
      
      @Deviant,
      
      Co-sign…..cummon now, that’s community t*tty as your friend i should get a couple of sneak previews and/or rubs…As a battered Tina once said, “What’s Love gotta to do with it?”
- Me fail english?
  
  @Imperfect,
  
  Lol. Girl, that first one aint no “friend”. Yall just been flirting/talking.
  
  I think one of the problems with platonic friendships is that we don’t have enough vocabulary to describe the different types of relationships. Everyone that’s friendly toward you or who’ve you known for a minute and don’t hate is not your friend. Some of these guys are just regular ol’ acquaintances. Asking to see my lady parts would put a dude squarely in the realm of acquaintances as I don’t think any men who know me well enough to be a “friend” would ask me no slick ish like that.
  - http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
    
    @Me fail english?,
    
    we don’t have enough vocabulary to describe the different types of relationships
    
    sounds like a future vsb topic
    - SouthernGirl
      
      @The Champ,
      
      really champ?
      
      because the list of future vsb topics should be longer than an albino midget clown’s arm by now and therefore, there should have been no need for this platonic friend rehash. but i’m just sayin’…
      
      *snicker*
      - miss t-lee
        
        @SouthernGirl,
        *sniggling*
      - http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com blackberry molasses
        
        @SouthernGirl,
        
        and this is why I love you, oh sparkly co-CSO!
http://www.myspace.com/chicanextdoor Miss Patterson

you know what i love? i love platonic relationships that are seemingly platonic until one of the parties relocates to a new city. there’s nothing like thinking you and your homeboy are ‘just friends’ until his last night in town when he suddenly discloses the fact that he likes you and wants to know if he can b.o.n.e. you the night before he moves. to that i say ‘you can get a hug and a peace symbol.’

by the way, this whole post makes me sad. the fact that it’s true makes me sadder. must there always be a repressed sexual agenda lurking between men and women?
- CalibyWayof LA
  
  @Miss Patterson,
  ‘you can get a hug and a peace symbol’…smdh. i’ve had to throw dueces to a few platonic friends. well until their “feelings” passed or i got serious enough with a dude that they felt uncomfortable comming at me. Those are the breaks.
- shay_d_lady
  
  @Miss Patterson, well I prove they do exist. maybe its the uncommon set of circumstances..1 male friend dated my female best friend, the other I dated his best friend. We developed friendships through those relationships. Our friendship has been tested by death, debt and foolishness but we’ve always remained strong. They are friends with my husband and we are like family. I am sure the thought has crossed their minds in our 15 year history of friendship just like there have been times when I thought it would have been easier if I could have just been with them but that had nothing to do with them and those feelings were never acted on. Now they are family, at all family events He.ll my husbands family even knows them.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @Miss Patterson,
  
  “must there always be a repressed sexual agenda lurking between men and women?”
  
  does a bear sh*t in the woods and wipe his ass with a boring ass blog?
  - Me fail english?
    
    @The Champ,
    
    no.
    - http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
      
      @Me fail english?,
      
      no deez
shay_d_lady

hmmm.. I disagree..and most of you vsb’ers no my stance and why but I will rehash for the new ones. My 2 best friends are male.. i have been friends with them since jr high school. We never dated, there has never been any kissing or s.e.x or almost se.x included in the equation. Both of them are attractive and I am sure both think that I am an attractive person . platonic does not mean unattracted but means relationship absence of romance or s.e.x…it doesnt mean if given the right circumstances you would or any of the other points you bring up. Those might be reasons a platonic friendship ends but not reason why they dont exist.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @shay_d_lady,
  
  it doesnt mean if given the right circumstances you would or any of the other points you bring up
  
  ummm…yes it does, lol
- Gem of the Ocean
  
  Those might be reasons a platonic friendship ends but not reason why they dont exist.
  
  i would tend to agree.
PrincesMo

Now this might sound like blaspheme, but i have some platonic male friendships and one of my best friends is a guy and there’s no kind of hidden agenda at all (we can both freely talk about the respective objects of our affections/crushes whatever with each other-and no neither of us is aesthetically challenged lol). We’re kinda somewhere in between jerry & elaine (though we were never had any kind of sexual relationship or anything close to that) and will &grace (although he’s not gay). We became friend in college and the relationship has remained intact and we still see each other regularly and spend lots of free time with each other. so champ, men and women who are platonic friends in college may be able to carry those relationships into adulthood. But i generally don’t think it’s true that men and women can’t be friends, i think that it’s true in many cases, but there are some men won’t just smash anything walking and value friendships with women because, in some cases, they can obtain greater personal growth from those relationships when compared to solely having male friendships.
- shay_d_lady
  
  @PrincesMo, YEAH!! its not just me!
  - http://myspace.com/shatani shatani
    
    @shay_d_lady,
    
    no, its not just you. until i went into my chosen field (which is very estrogen-heavy) pretty much all my closest friends were male. and i still have those friends…and although we dont live as close to each other and cant physically be in each other’s presence as we once could, i would bet money that none of them wants to sex me. and i dont want to sex them…that would just be…incestuous! do i find them attractive? absolutely. all my friends are hot! does this mean my female friends arent safe either?!?! *gasp*
    - Me fail english?
      
      @shatani,
      
      Good point. This post does make men seem kinda gross. Like if they had an attractive female cousin…
      
      I mean if they can’t turn the “I’d smash” switch off for friends, can they EVER turn the switch off? Not tryna be funny.
      - miss t-lee
        
        @Me fail english?,
        “I mean if they can’t turn the “I’d smash” switch off for friends, can they EVER turn the switch off? Not tryna be funny.”
        
        Yes you are!
        *bhahahahhahaah*
        
        Me fail english?
        
        @miss t-lee,
        
        lol. Sad part is I’m totally serious. I feel like Champ’s saying that it’s very rare if not near impossible for men to deactivate their “I’d hump” button. Even if the chick doesn’t really do it for them. Men never cease to say some isht that makes me wanna give them free Roman showers.
        
        What if it’s an attractive girls and then you find out she’s 16? What if it’s an attractive girl and then you find out up until last month she had a penix? And is that why men tend to be more homophobic than women? Cause if presented with the opporunity they’d totally take their shot. All men can’t be like this…right?
        
        miss t-lee
        
        @ me fail english?
        
        They aren’t. There’s plenty of them out there acting right, even if they don’t want to admit it.
        
        Me fail english?
        
        @miss t-lee,
        
        That’s what I was thinking, and it’s not like that’s the first time I heard it but that ish is saying alot. The first few examples were kinda extreme, but this just goes to show you that a some dudes, given the opportunity, would TOTALLY smash their best friend’s girl. *Frown*@ dudes not being able to deactivate the switch. Better friends my hiney
        
        http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
        
        @me fail english,
        
        “What if it’s an attractive girls and then you find out she’s 16? What if it’s an attractive girl and then you find out up until last month she had a penix? And is that why men tend to be more homophobic than women? Cause if presented with the opporunity they’d totally take their shot. All men can’t be like this…right?”
        
        some men have more, ummm, relaxed “i’d hump” buttons than others, but of course there are circumstances where sex never even enters the picture. thing is, for most men, if a woman is a general romantic/sexual match (somewhat attractive, like-aged, not related, not a tranny), the i’d probably hump button is gonna be in play.
        
        basically, being a “close friend” is great, but its not enough to get the “you know, i’d hump” button completely deactivated.
      - http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula
        
        @Me fail english?,
        
        That’s exactly what I thought.
        
        Finding someone attractive doesn’t necessarily translate into “I’m going to smash”… What happens to cousins? I don’t know, I think it’s all lazy thinking.
- http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse
  
  @PrincesMo, but there are some men won’t just smash anything walking and value friendships with women because, in some cases, they can obtain greater personal growth from those relationships
  
  I agree w/ this.
- http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ
  
  @PrincesMo,
  
  three things:
  
  1. “But i generally don’t think it’s true that men and women can’t be friends”
  
  i never said men and women can’t be friends. you can be close friends. sh*t, even best friends, but you can’t call it platonic. unless, of course…
  
  2. …you met in college (see reason #1). since you did meet this guy in college, its possible.
  
  3. just because a guy would sleep with you doesnt mean that theres a “hidden agenda” to get into your panties from day one. all i’m saying is that, even if he doesnt actively try to, the “you know, in the right circumstance, i probably would” kills that whole platonic thing
  - Gem of the Ocean
    
    i never said men and women can’t be friends. you can be close friends. sh*t, even best friends, but you can’t call it platonic.
    
    i see what you’re saying. and yes, platonic isn’t a good word when sexual/sensual feelings are/have been involved, clearly. but i definitely believe men and women can be JUST friends — meaning there may be underlying feelings or thoughts of the contrary but the behavior and actions don’t betray that.
    - overit
      
      @Gem of the Ocean, i agree. i think its not so much the thoughts or feelings, but the actions that determine any outcome.