earlier this week, i received an email from a vsb regular who sent me a transcript of chat she had with another vsb regular, lamenting the “death of courting“.
here’s a few highlights
chick 1: I get mad every time a man thinks it his damn right to get some ass.
what happened to the artificial wait period?
I mean really
U don’t want a tramp! Stop trying to make me into one!
it’s like once you have sex, what else is there??
cuz the default thing to do when together is f*ck
often times ruining the chance to do other sh*t like go on dates and just chill and talk and get to know each other
chick 2: it seems like it always has to be the end activity
ok we went to the movies
lets go home and f*ck
ok we had dinner lets go home and f*ck
ok we had brunch lets go home and f*ck
I mean really
just get in the damn bed and lay there!
chick 1: like can you just hold me??
chick 2: you not turning my vajayjay into a pulled pork sandwhich
chick 1: maybe if you put more effort into other aspects of me and US then perhaps i’d be more in the mood and really put it on you and have you wanting to do more so you can get
chick 1: dead @ turning my vajayjay into a pulled pork sandwich
granted there are plenty of loose, pulled pork sandwichy girls out there
but WE aren’t them
and dudes need to know how to adjust accordingly
chick 2: I want to know what other women go through
is it a certain type of woman that gets this treatment
why do men think this sh*t is ok
when did things change?
two thoughts immediately came to mind after reading this
1. there are only two ways for a woman to be absolutely certain that a man they’re seeing isn’t thinking about sleeping with her the entire time they’re together.
a: he’s not straight
b: he’s gay
since most straight woman try not to actively date gay men, i find it odd and a bit humorous when they’re still surprised, after decades of dealing with us, that we want to f*ck them. sure, we may find time for watching tv or talking or knitting together or some sh*t, but we approached you, we bagged you, we called you, we asked you out, we took you out, and we foot the bill all because we want to f*ck.
sure, other things about you might eventually interest us, and if you’re interesting enough, we might even want to marry your ass, lol, but sex is the latent cause beneath pretty much everything we do with you. granted, some of us may be smoother or more patient in our prowl than others…but we’re still all on the prowl. some of us are just better hunters.
also ladies, trust me. you dont (i repeat, you DONT) ever want to date a guy who isn’t making an effort to sleep with you. you wouldn’t know how to handle that. trust me.
2. i agree that the actual act of courting doesn’t seem to have much relevance anymore for many of us…but did it ever? think about it: when you consider arraigned relationships/marriages and the fact that many of our elders ended up shacking up with each other by their 17th birthday, maybe men have to do more courting NOW than we ever did before.
thats it for me…for now.
thoughts, people of vsb?
—the champ
Am I first?
@Peyso, I aint gone ignore you P… you were first…LMAO
@Peyso, and ERRRYBODY ELSE UP IN HERE!!!!
“Am I first?”
is not an appropriate “first” comment.
So stop it just STOP IT!
@Intellectual Hedonist,
you do realize this just makes everyone want to post that, right? lol
bullshyt.
the chat was not about dudes wanting to sleep with her…it is about dude thinking that because she s hould know that he likes her and thus wants to sleep with her her agreement to the date constitutes immediate sex with no effort…and courting/dating is very relevant. you need to do more than stand there and look pretty for me to give up the goods. I need to get to know you and feel comfortable with you, trust you with the precious. and even if our parents were shacking by 17 they a$$ was dating at 14 and 15
@Shay-d-lady, I hate to say it but I agree with you here
@Peyso, LOL why do you hate to admit it?
@Shay-d-lady,
You are totally right!!
Just coz u bought me a meal doesn’t automatically mean I owe you some.
@Shay-d-lady,
You have a good point, me like any other man wants those goods when we’re around each other but you have to find ways to keep the excitment in all aspects of the relay especially the bed room and if she’s not in the mood lay off and just chill
@J. McFly,
How about if she’s not in the mood, get her in the mood?
Sometimes, they just need a little coersion not force.
@Shay-d-lady, i have to disagree and it does pain me so since we were on an agree streak LOL..
It takes two to tango. Like I wrote down thread if you’ve found a man whose body doesn’t like your body, then be very afraid. That is apart of being a man. Now I would agree men express sexu@al attraction in varying ways from overt to subtle.
But if its SUCH a turn off for a woman (and is it really i guess is my question) perhaps she needs to put him back where she found him.
I suggest that sometimes its scary to ONLY have a man appear to want the @zz..but like I wrote down thread its a woman’s job to steer the ship. A man is going to ALWAYS try you sexua#lly to varying degrees.
So what do we do with that information? We move it to “a higher ground”. Just becauase he wants it, don’t mean you gotta give it to him.
thats all apart of pu$$y power.
@Princess Duvet,
“I get mad every time a man thinks it his damn right to get some ass.”
Unless I’m totally off here: I think that the point she was makin is that dudes seem to expect that just coz he took u on a date, then u are expected to sleep with him. Like they don’t need to make anymore effort beyond that.
I don’t think any woman wants waste her time with a man who won’t try to get into her pants (unless they are both gay)!!
@YGB, “Unless I’m totally off here: I think that the point she was makin is that dudes seem to expect that just coz he took u on a date”
and the point i was trying to make is that it has nothing really to do with a date…that sexu@al energy and drive is running through every fiber in his being regardless of whether its over a hamburger or hamlet. Its always going to be (or should be) there. Again its what you do with the info that makes the difference.
the woman does have all the power, in my estimation. unless she doesn’t want it..then he’ll take and do of it what he pleases.
@Princess Duvet,
and the point i was trying to make is that it has nothing really to do with a date…that sexu@al energy and drive is running through every fiber in his being regardless of whether its over a hamburger or hamlet. Its always going to be (or should be) there. Again its what you do with the info that makes the difference.
princess, i see that you’ve made a comeback and sh*t. good job
@The Champ,
I love the (unintended? I doubt it) pun!
A comeback indeed!
@Princess Duvet,
Okay. I got you!
@Princess Duvet, I think we are talking about two different things. its not about power, or if he likes me..its about wanting a guy that wants to get to know me as well as want my body. I know I control what he gets, thats not up for debate, I know I want a man that is digging me physically. I am just saying aint nothing wrong with a grown a$$ man that knows he likes me and I like him but aint on some if I do this for you..what you gone give me….
@Princess Duvet,
I suggest that sometimes its scary to ONLY have a man appear to want the @zz..but like I wrote down thread its a woman’s job to steer the ship. A man is going to ALWAYS try you sexua#lly to varying degrees.
So what do we do with that information? We move it to “a higher ground”. Just becauase he wants it, don’t mean you gotta give it to him.
thats all apart of pu$$y power.
this entire statement reeks of alexyss k tylor, lol
@The Champ, what do you mean “that entire statement….???”
i got steer the ship from my momma….now i will admit “pu$$y power”" came from Alexyss but so what?? i know you be watchin her on youtube cosignin too. stop it. lol
@Princess Duvet,
I stan for Alexyss (with the 2 s’s)
@Ms. Sula, she is the bomb. Sometimes im like i can’t believe she just said that…but its all truth…even the stuff thats not easy to swallow.
@Princess Duvet,
“she is the bomb…even the stuff thats not easy to swallow.”
…………………………………………..
@The Champ,
my father used to tell me that men only behave the way women allow them to… it is unfortunate for those women who do not appreciate men who are sex hounds that so many other women do NOT exercise their P. Power for respect… some women fall back on the “slim pickings” attitude and take what ever men offer them without setting a higher standard for themselves or the men…BUT the easiest way to get rid of that is to stop tolerating it.
however, as women, sometimes we would rather just have someone be around, even with the poor behavior, than to tell men who do not live up to our standards to kick rocks…
so the cycle continues…
@Shay-d-lady,
the precious?
@The Champ, i was thinking the same thing. got visions of gollum running all up in over in my head. lol
@SouthernGirl, LOL well it has been known to drive ninjas crazy….
@shay-d-lady, you ain’t neva lied….lol
@The Champ, LOL yes …you mad?
damn, this sounds like something i was talking about just the other day. weird.
anyway, i don’t think it’s any surprise dudes want to have sex with us women. they def should want to!! h*ll, we want to too!!
but i think the real jest of the convo (maybe i’m reading it wrong) is at what point is it appropriate to engage in sex in a relationship?? if you have sex too early in a courtship, are you missing out on developing the relationship in other aspects?? should there be some type of waiting period (not necessarily a dead-locked time, but a non-sexual span of time)??
sh*t like that. and if you can answer these questions i’d greatly appreciate becuz i’m always curious of this.
@Gem of the Ocean, I have to agree with your inquiry Gemmie, what is the appropriate waiting period on giving up the goods?
I mean if we go out on three dates in 2 weeks or two months is there a difference if I give it up on the third date? these are the answers I want to know
hopefully the VSBs will stand up and give us answers…
*tapping foot, waiting for menfolk to offer their insight*
@Intellectual Hedonist, “what is the appropriate waiting period on giving up the goods?”
Do what feels natural. I wouldn’t give it up on the first night because guys don’t usually respect women who do that, but follow your instincts. I like to get to really know a guy, so I’ll usually wait a few months.
@Leila,
“guys don’t usually respect women who do that”
if he respects you, he respects you. giving it up on the first night is not going to skew his view of your character that much… unless you suck at it.
@Deviant,
LOL!
@Deviant,
Thank you for this comment! Just because a guy is able to hold off on sex doesnt mean he respects you any more than if you wait until you’re married. If you’re dealing with an a**hole youre dealing with an a**hole from day one, he doesnt just switch up!
@Deviant,
ive had conversations with many a man who firmly disagree with that comment.
maybe respect isnt the right word…but there was a definite consensus that giving it up on the first night gets you put into an entirely different category of woman…and as a woman, i dont feel that category is just brimming with respect.
@shatani,
did it ever occur to you that those men were just assh-oles?
@Deviant,
did it ever occur to you that those men were just assh-oles?
lol…i was thinking the same thing
@Deviant,
why sure, it did! are you saying that all men arent @ssholes?? revolutionary!
lol
@Gem of the Ocean, there should be a waiting period not a hard core 3 month rule or anything of the sort but you should know enough about him to trust him before you f!@ck him if you are looking for a relationship….i mean if you wouldnt leave your purse with him you shouldnt open your legs…LMAO otherwise the whole relationship will revolve around s.e.x and when that gets old so will you….
lmao i feel you. but i’m more interested in knowing how guys feel about a waiting period. and if i say i want to wait, and “get to know you better”, is this a turn off for men?? would i be wasting my breath and end up in a cold bed alone?
you feel where i’m going with this??
i kind of need answers NOW. i met somebody who does not appear to be (a) crazy, (b) a stalker, (c) a loser with no potential of ever dating normal girls. it’s been a loooooong time since i met a man i liked and got the “he might could get it (one of these days)” nod from me.
@Gem of the Ocean, I feel ya… but I also know that on shyt like that trust your gut and go with it.. .
you right. it’s not brain science. shouldn’t be over thought.
@Gem of the Ocean,
I, for one, don’t believe it’s so black and white on setting a time constraint. All relationships/courtships are different and must be judged on a case to case basis. As long as a mutual comfort zone exist in the two adults, whether it’s a week or three months shouldn’t really make a difference.
I think many women tend to over-analyze the whole waiting period thing. Just because you made a guy wait 6 months, that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s going to think that you’re “good, clean, and wholesome”. In the back of his head, he may be thinking that you’re just trifling and you got another steady f-buddy that you’re not being up front about. Just because you call yourself making HIM wait, doesn’t mean that you won’t give it up on a one-night stand to some other dude.
However, focusing on something like this is as trivial as asking someone how many sexual partners they have had.
@Monk,
“Just because you made a guy wait 6 months, that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s going to think that you’re “good, clean, and wholesome”. In the back of his head, he may be thinking that you’re just trifling and you got another steady f-buddy that you’re not being up front about. Just because you call yourself making HIM wait, doesn’t mean that you won’t give it up on a one-night stand to some other dude.”
See, this statement right here shows me that there’s just no winning as far as some men are concerned. It’s like either way the woman’s on the horns of a dilemma. So any decision a person makes, the man will still be suspicious!!! Sigh!!!!
@Monk,
I think many women tend to over-analyze the whole waiting period thing. Just because you made a guy wait 6 months, that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s going to think that you’re “good, clean, and wholesome”. In the back of his head, he may be thinking that you’re just trifling and you got another steady f-buddy that you’re not being up front about. Just because you call yourself making HIM wait, doesn’t mean that you won’t give it up on a one-night stand to some other dude.
good point
@ygb
See, this statement right here shows me that there’s just no winning as far as some men are concerned. It’s like either way the woman’s on the horns of a dilemma. So any decision a person makes, the man will still be suspicious!!!
lol…this is life. ever choice you make has a consequence, even if the consequence is unintended
@Gem of the Ocean,
got the “he might could get it (one of these days)” nod from me.
Yay GEM!!!
lol u silly!
@Gem of the Ocean, “but i think the real jest of the convo (maybe i’m reading it wrong) is at what point is it appropriate to engage in sex in a relationship?? if you have sex too early in a courtship, are you missing out on developing the relationship in other aspects?? should there be some type of waiting period (not necessarily a dead-locked time, but a non-sexual span of time)?? ”
This is a difficult question. Me, I am a relationship type of man, but I have not been in one in a long time (until recently). The problem is you give it up too easily. People complain about chivalry is dead and courting is no longer relevant, but if you know our ultimate goal is to sleep with you, why not make it interesting? I think that I would be willing to wait . . .not no d@mn 2 months though.
Call it immaturity, but I always am weary of girls that sleep with me on the first date (I won’t even address one by her given name in my thoughts if they sleep with me after a night clubbing). Bottom line is, you know a man is going to try to sleep with you, if you say no and homie gets pissed and never speaks to you again then you probably shouldn’t have been sleeping with dude in the first place. If you say no, and demonstrate interest (not on some I’m gonna lead this n!gg@ on till the date fund dries up), I believe a good man (or at least me) would be willing to deal with it. BUT once I get a glimpse of that treasure between your legs . . . It’s go time.
@IVR, “BUT once I get a glimpse of that treasure between your legs . . . It’s go time.”
Go time? You mean once you finally get it, you leave or once you get it you can now think about whether or not you want to have a serious relationship?
I’ve had guy friends say that they aren’t with a woman until they’ve had “communications.” Before that, they are just friends. Others say they want to get past the “deed” so other things can be explored. Is “the act” a hurdle that must be crossed before someone can take a relationship seriously?
@Ivy St., “Go time? You mean once you finally get it, you leave or once you get it you can now think about whether or not you want to have a serious relationship?
I’ve had guy friends say that they aren’t with a woman until they’ve had “communications.” Before that, they are just friends. Others say they want to get past the “deed” so other things can be explored. Is “the act” a hurdle that must be crossed before someone can take a relationship seriously?”
No, go time means that all common sense pertaining to relationships and maybe I am the one that should wait goes out the window. I will take it when you give it to me . . . That doesn’t mean I’m gonna bounce when I get it. . . especially if it’s good.
That part about the relations being a hurdle is an interesting point . . . I would like to say no, but what I look like boo’d up with some girl that I don’t know what it tastes like . . . I would have to agree with your male friends on this one.
@Ivy St.,
I’ve had guy friends say that they aren’t with a woman until they’ve had “communications.” Before that, they are just friends. Others say they want to get past the “deed” so other things can be explored. Is “the act” a hurdle that must be crossed before someone can take a relationship seriously?
just as your comment alludes to, it depends on the guy.
@IVR,
This… “Call it immaturity, but I always am weary of girls that sleep with me on the first date (I won’t even address one by her given name in my thoughts if they sleep with me after a night clubbing)…”
Is some Bull*hit! Thats wahat I cant stand about men. How the hell you gonna condemn a woman who did the SAME DAMN THING you did? If you were banging after two hours in the club, you should be looking in the mirror thinking the same shameful thoughts you try to put on her!
@Dom, “Is some Bull*hit! Thats wahat I cant stand about men. How the hell you gonna condemn a woman who did the SAME DAMN THING you did? If you were banging after two hours in the club, you should be looking in the mirror thinking the same shameful thoughts you try to put on her!”
I agree, it is some machista double standard bullsh!t . . . I can’t help these thoughts Dom . .rest assured that I am the only man that feels this way ; )
@IVR,
Sadly Im sure you’re not. But to be honset, if a guy is going to be judgemental of me for doing the same damn thing he did, then I’d rather find out sooner than later.
@Dom, “Is some Bull*hit! Thats wahat I cant stand about men. How the hell you gonna condemn a woman who did the SAME DAMN THING you did? If you were banging after two hours in the club, you should be looking in the mirror thinking the same shameful thoughts you try to put on her!”
AND Just to be clear, this is not common activity for me. If I am single, I go out to bag something, if I get it great deed done (and yes Dom I do judge myself after these things, alcohol is a helluva drug) . . . sometimes u can find a straggler in the parking lot. . . what normally occurs is that I end up with a phone number . . . thus begins the courting. . .
@Dom,
Amen! Hallelujah!!
@IVR,
Cats like you mess it up for the rest of us.
@WestIndianArchie, “Cats like you mess it up for the rest of us.”
And how is that my good sir?
@Gem of the Ocean,
but i think the real jest of the convo (maybe i’m reading it wrong) is at what point is it appropriate to engage in sex in a relationship?? if you have sex too early in a courtship, are you missing out on developing the relationship in other aspects?? should there be some type of waiting period (not necessarily a dead-locked time, but a non-sexual span of time)??
this honestly depends on your comfort level, whether its 2 dates or 2 months. i dont think theres a dead set time for waiting. sometimes sex can enhance the courting, and other times it can make the guy lazy. really, i know this seems like a cop out answer, but it depends on the guy
@The Champ,
“sometimes sex can enhance the courting”
on what planet does this happen? Courtship and se@x don’t even go together.
@Princess Duvet,
Sure dont. If we REALLY want to talk about old fashioned courtship men would be courting and women would not be having sex until marriage. Havent heard not a single soul on here today talk about not giving it up till marriage…
@Dom,
Coco was just talking about that down thread.
@Dom, yeah…me and you here…our “pocketbooks” are aligned..LOL…
i took a courtship class in church..and se!x aint come up narry one time..except that it don’t belong there.
but hey a man’s definition of courtship is usually different.
i have a adapted the definition slightly…
***Jesus be a whole lotta biblical interpretation***
@Gem of the Ocean, Odd, this was deja vu for me as well… hmm
also ladies, trust me. you dont (i repeat, you DONT) ever want to date a guy who isn’t making an effort to sleep with you. you wouldn’t know how to handle that. trust me.
—SOOO TRUE…i dated this guy for three months who REFUSED to do anything more than fingering. i told him that i felt like i was in high school and he got all offended. dude was 25. after a while, i got too frustrated and we parted ways. but you couldnt tell me for about six months after that that dude wasnt some kinda gay
@trin-trin, He’s gay…
@Leila,
*splashes hot yogi cardamom tea all over screen*
@trin-trin, yeah, his lack of effort at that age in this day and time sounds like something else was going on his life. Gay, a gf, a wife, a STD he wasn’t ready to reveal, something…
@trin-trin,
Yeah definitely gay, 3 monthes and you were willing, gay
@trin-trin,
“—SOOO TRUE…i dated this guy for three months who REFUSED to do anything more than fingering.”
*throat punch*
I’m not gonna say he was all the ghey…but either he was a virgin, or you were an experiment to see if he actually like girls (possibly bi).
@miss t-lee,
All of the above, definitely!
Or maybe he had a really small one and had been laughed at by so many women that he was scared of getting the same reaction. (Okay, I lie. Sh!t, I said it and I don’t believe it)!!!
Definitely fruity!!!
@miss t-lee,
he wasnt a virgin but he might as well be…he had two bodies…and one of them was a one night stand…and since then, celibacy (i guess thats the way to put it ?)
@trin-trin,
lol, what exactly is “some kinda gay”? are there categories and sh*t? rankings of some kind?
@The Champ,
oh, theres all differnt kinds of gay! lmao!
@The Champ,
now u know the dl gay, the gay guy who aint decided yet, the all out juicy fruit, the ‘been locked up for the past 10 years and i had to bust one somehow’ dude, and the omar….im sure im missing some….either way i couldnt place this dude…he had alot of suspect tendencies tho that really made me wonder if he was just scared or if there was sumthin else going on that i aint know about
after reading shay-d’s comment and rereading the chick1-chick2 (creative) convo, Champie you missed the mark. i don’t think you addressed the real concerns at all.
it’s not about wanting a man who doesn’t want to have sex. on the contrary, i think it has more to do with the way in which you incorporate sex into a relationship.
and it’s also not about whether or not courtship is relevant. dating is what you make of it and what you are expecting out of it. so everybody’s dating experience is going to be different and customized to reflect what the couple wants in a committed relationship.
basically i think you did an injustice to this convo, one of which i often have with my gfs (some of whom are well on their way to being of the pulled pork persuasion). and you have provided no good male insight to the complexities of sex during the courting period.
so BOO!!
@Gem of the Ocean, are you saying The Champ is suffering from “cave vision”?
@Gem of the Ocean, exactly because also once you have gotten to know the person why is all the other s hyt out the window…. just because we started f!@cking doesnt mean I stopped liking movies, or dinners out..or sleeping and not “sleeping” …LMAO
“just because we started f!@cking doesnt mean I stopped liking movies, or dinners out..or sleeping and not “sleeping”
A-to-the-MEN!!! lmao
@Shay-d-lady,
This is interesting. In my last relationship, we still continued to watch movies, but in a more intimate setting. Every once in a while, we might go see something with a group of people, but if it was the two of us, most likely we’d watch it someplace where we could be in each others arms.
The going out for dinners and other stuff didn’t stop though, though we did start cooking for each other a bit more often.
I guess to me going out to movies or dinners were part of the getting to know each other phase. Then movies became movies at home, dinners became dinners at home and the times we did go out where either with other people, special events, or if one of us wanted to surprise the other w/ something out of the ordinary.
me and my ex had a very similar kind of relationship. but we were also celibate for some time in the beginning of the relationship.
@kamakula, are you normally a homebody? see I like to go to movie”s, and out to dinner.. you know I likes to kick it home too and I know that the dating pace” will disappear..but I think a lot of men do a lot of things while dating that they dont necessarily like..they dont mind it but its not their preference…after they get the prize they fall back into whats regular for them and the game changes..men pursue until they get it and then women pursue to keep it…and so is life..LOL …thats one of things me and mine have in common we both love the big screen …we like to see the hot new movie opening weekend live and direct….you know we still “date” after all this time….he buys me popcorn and drinks…even the big box of jr mints…
@Shay-d-lady,
men pursue until they get it and then women pursue to keep it…and so is life..LOL …
This is a very good point.
@Shay-d-lady,
Hmm, I can’t say I ever did something I didn’t like. . . or rather, if I did do something I didn’t like (say holding someone’s purse in the middle of a mall while they go to a restroom), I didn’t stop 10 months later.
Actually, now that I think about it, there were a couple exceptions to that. . . but I always made it clear that I was only doing it that one time (or that there needed to be incentives to get me to do it again).
It’s normal that people put their best foot forward when initially dating. I’m sure for the first 3 or 6 months a guy dates a girl, he’s under the mistaken impression that she never farts. Should guys complain that the girl “never did that while they were dating” one year later?
You gotta pick and choose your battles. You want something (or not want it), add conditions that enable you to always come out on top, but make sure you do it from the beginning, and not spring some “you know even though I’ve been giving head for the past year, I don’t like it so this is the last time” sh*t.
I think one should expect some things to change. Let’s say I started dating you in my first couple years of school, I had a lot of afternoons and evenings free, or easy classes. It wasn’t a big deal to spend a lot of time with you. But once I get to senior year or started on my Masters, you need to understand that at times, my schoolwork will come first. You can’t have your cake (successful engineer) without letting it bake (learn and graduate).
@kamakula,
You can’t have your cake (successful engineer) without letting it bake (learn and graduate).
Its finals time and that just gave me inspiration to live.
Thank you.
@kamakula, “m sure for the first 3 or 6 months a guy dates a girl, he’s under the mistaken impression that she never farts.”
LOL! Women don’t fart! They pass gas.
@Ivy St.,
LOL! Women don’t fart! They pass gas
the worst farts i ever smelt where from a woman. she was a vegan, and her farts smelled like the industrial areas of niagara falls.
lmao @ “I’m sure for the first 3 or 6 months a guy dates a girl, he’s under the mistaken impression that she never farts. Should guys complain that the girl “never did that while they were dating” one year later?”
i’ve known sooooo many dudes to think/ do this.
@kamakula, I understand that things change.. but a lot of times relationships suffer because men tend to no longer think of things like “dates’ as important enough to make time for..and they are…thats how you grow apart..you have to make time to check in and keep in touch with the person that you are in a relationship with, otherwise you will look up and realize you are with a complete stranger…..like you said if you want the cake (succesful relationship) you have to do the baking (making time for shyt other than s.e.x, but you need to make time for s.e.x too..thats a woman thing sometimes)…..
@Gem of the Ocean,
it’s not about wanting a man who doesn’t want to have sex. on the contrary, i think it has more to do with the way in which you incorporate sex into a relationship
I’m not sure I see the issue. If you incorporate sex into your relationship the way you want, where is the problem? Other people who think differently from you?
I don’t think male behavior has changed that much in the past few hundred years. Guys will take as much as they can get. Going for sex at the end of every outing – it’s not that every outing must end in sex, but that every outing can end in sex. Only one way to find out, and if it doesn’t work, well, you can always do crosswords together.
If you’re the one on the give side of the equation, one’s gotta wonder what the complaints about? I mean, couldn’t you just stop giving as much? That’s how it was in the good old days of courtship
lmao @ “Only one way to find out, and if it doesn’t work, well, you can always do crosswords together.”
but seriously…
I’m not sure I see the issue. If you incorporate sex into your relationship the way you want, where is the problem?
i try to avoid awkward situations at all possible. and it’s very awkward to be with some one making the “let’s have sex now” move when i’m clearly thinking about crosswords and sudoku as a late night activity. and often it’s not becuz i don’t want to have sex (tho some guys just don’t get that nod from me so wordplay is as intimate as i’ll get), it’s becuz i want to make sure there is substance in the relationship so that once we do start to engage in sex, it’s not JUST about the sex. i want to date more than a penis so a man needs to be able to stimulate other regions of my brain in addition to the “pleasure center”. and some men don’t always seem comfortable with this idea of “waiting”.
and perhaps it’s just the type of men i meet. i’m trying to get a sense from some brothas what their take on it is and if there is some sort of general concensus on how yall view first time sex in a relationship.
@Gem of the Ocean,
and if there is some sort of general concensus on how yall view first time sex in a relationship
theres not
@Gem of the Ocean,
I think this is one of those things when you sit someone down and say “I want to have a relationship of substance before I get freaky in the sheets with you. For me, sex this soon puts a different focus on the relationship, and its not necessarily the one I want right now. I’m not going to try and say it’s going to take use 3 dates, 3 weeks, or 3 months to get there, but if you’re willing to work with me, we’ll see what happens”.
I assume we’re all adults here. If you’re looking for a serious relationship and this comes up and you feel in a manner similar to what I outlined, I don’t see anything wrong with having such a conversation early on.
At the very worst, the guys who stick around after that are either ones who didn’t think you were serious and were going to give it up tomorrow, or those ninjas who have a bet riding on how long it takes to get into your pants.
i see your point. and i don’t need advice on what to say and how to say it. i’ve had the “im going to lay everything on the table and you can choose what you want to do next” convo many times. and i’m comfortable with putting it out there.
but sometimes i can’t help but wonder if it’s my trying to control the relationship with the “p” or is it really a justified concern. i believe the latter, but not always sure men understand/believe it.
@kamakula,
just brilliant! that sounds like something ive said…i can think of one time that it went over well…which i dont see as a sign that im wrong as much as i see it as a sign that i need to be more choosy OR work on whatever it is about me that is attracting a type of man that i just cant work with.
“If you’re the one on the give side of the equation, one’s gotta wonder what the complaints about? I mean, couldn’t you just stop giving as much? That’s how it was in the good old days of courtship”
HOLLA.
@Gem of the Ocean,
You are a great moderator today Gemmie dear.
thanks other 1/2
@Gem of the Ocean,
“basically i think you did an injustice to this convo, one of which i often have with my gfs (some of whom are well on their way to being of the pulled pork persuasion). and you have provided no good male insight to the complexities of sex during the courting period.
so BOO!!”
boo deez
you already did that.
“i find it odd and a bit humorous when they’re still surprised, after decades of dealing with us, that we want to f*ck them.”
Me too.
That’s not to say that dating and courting isn’t important, because it most certainly is. It can be fun too! But women need to embrace the fact that men do all that dating and courting and junk so the can get the panties…duh! And only because we require it. S3x is their driving force. Everything they do, they do it to get in between. It’s their base nature.
@PBG, I dont think the girls were questioning that though, I think they were lamenting about the men that no longer seem to get that dating is part of the ritual.. you dont get to skip right to the good parts.. you get no cliff/spark note coochie….
@Shay-d-lady,
I can’t relate. I date grown azz men. They come past the VSB porch in their sweater vests w/lilies in one hand, hat in the other. They take me to the picture show and then out for cake and coffee. I wear my good panty hose to go a’ courtin’ in.
@PBG, Do you do the lindyhop to records on the Victrola and go out for root beer floats at the drug store?
@Relax, Relate, Alise,
Why yes, I sure do. While you are back @ the house while I’m gettin’ my lindyhop on, don’t feed my cats any of that generic mess, ok?
@PBG, They come past the VSB porch in their sweater vests w/lilies in one hand, hat in the other. They take me to the picture show and then out for cake and coffee. I wear my good panty hose to go a’ courtin’ in
see thats the ticket.. grown a$$ men date.. and like it..
@Shay-d-lady,
see thats the ticket.. grown a$$ men date.. and like it..
I agree with this statement wholeheartedly.
@PBG,
Lipton Ice Tea Green Tea to go all over the comp screen….
made my morning
@Shay-d-lady, “I dont think the girls were questioning that though, I think they were lamenting about the men that no longer seem to get that dating is part of the ritual..”
Men would if you all stopped handing it out like flyers . . . Dry d!ck will change your perspective very quickly . . . I’m not gonna sit up in my apartment with dry wang just because I’m fundamentally against courting. I’ll court the F outta you if that is what it takes to get in.
Now, don’t get me wrong, I do like to go out, and I enjoy taking a woman out. But A. of all, what the hell I look like walking around with this woman on my arm that may sleep with men she doesn’t know often – sh!t she screwed me and all she knew about me was that I like greek food and bowling (not really) and second of all, as my whorish uncles would say . . . why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free (I said this yesterday I believe). If I had courted you, I would know more about you and have a good idea that you were not a scallywag. But if you screw me early. . . I am rolling the dice taking you anywhere except to bed . . . I am not a gambling man nor am I the good Captain Save’em.
@IVR,
yeah, that sounds about right…
as i mentioned downstream, i just have a problem with the fact that women who dont hand it out like flyers are somehow being made to feel that they are in the wrong…that its abnormal to want to know a man before you get it in…some of them talk a good game. im not gonna lie to you, there have been a couple times when im like, you know, he’s right! i should just give it up…and then i think, wait, whats his name again?
@shatani, get outta my head! they act like you’re in the wrong. and then, every now and again a man will have you thinkin, “wait. maybe i AM a prude!”
“S3x is their driving force. Everything they do, they do it to get in between. It’s their base nature.”
i don’t think this is a newsflash. not even to teenage girls. i almost think we, as women, instinctively KNOW this even if it takes us years to admit it to ourselves.
that being said, just becuz men want it and do everything in their power to get it does that mean we should just oblige them simply becuz they feel entitled?? are our vajayjays just slot machines where men can pay and use at will whenever they want?? whats the exchange rate of p*ssy for meals/shows/gifts/etc and how often do you need to barter and adjust for inflation??
for me, i guess the issue is this–when it comes to giving up the goods for the first time, do you go about it different in a purely sexual situation (FWB/FB/JO) vs a committed relationship??
@Gem of the Ocean,
“just becuz men want it and do everything in their power to get it does that mean we should just oblige them simply becuz they feel entitled?? are our vajayjays just slot machines where men can pay and use at will whenever they want??”
No.
And I don’t even acknowledge FWB/FB/JO situations because there are no respectable rules there, despite the 100′s of blogs that declare that there are.
@Gem of the Ocean, i guess the issue is this–when it comes to giving up the goods for the first time, do you go about it different in a purely sexual situation (FWB/FB/JO) vs a committed relationship??
I would say yes.. with a sexual situation it doesnt matter what you think of the person, if you have shared interests, if you can stand him long term.. you need a little bit more than good loving for a relationship to last long term and s.e.x makes you see everything through Big O blurried glasses and shyt is never as it appears in those…you need to take a little time to get to know dude and he you if you trying to build a relationship.. you want to build a solid foundation before you build the house….
i totally see your point, shay-d. and i’m not really concerned about how i (particularly) go after the sexual aspect of my relationships. i’m more curious how men view this.
@PBG,
“Everything they do, they do it to get in between.”
Not necessarily true. I happen to like doing fun shyt (read: dating) with a female I’m interested in. I’m not just doing it to do it. Shiiiddd…I like food…I get hungry. Hell, I even like movies and other social activities. If it ends in us having relations, so be it. I just think it’s rather presumptuous to think that that’s all of our’s sole purpose in doing such.
@Monk,
You’re right. What do I know? I’m just an old cat lady, kickin’ it w/the felines and wearing a red sweater.
@PBG,
Carry on Pretty Browness.
@Monk,
@Monk, “Not necessarily true. I happen to like doing fun shyt (read: dating) with a female I’m interested in. I’m not just doing it to do it. Shiiiddd…I like food…I get hungry. Hell, I even like movies and other social activities. If it ends in us having relations, so be it. I just think it’s rather presumptuous to think that that’s all of our’s sole purpose in doing such.”
I hear you bro. Maybe it is just me being simple but even though I like those things, I like women more. I want to go out and have a good time at a nice restaurant or wherever, but at the end of all that I would like to be inside the woman I am with (otherwise we would be at Red Lobster sharing an appetizer). I won’t say it is the SOLE purpose . . . but if it’s not, it’s definitely the MAIN purpose . . . entertainment (to me) is secondary.
@IVR,
i agree. i mean, yes, i enjoy watching movies and eating food and sh*t too, but if it was just solely about that, i would have gone to see the “quantum of solace” with my boys. you can do stuff that you both enjoy, and still have sex on your mind for the end of the night (which you hopefully should both enjoy as well)
@The Champ, “you can do stuff that you both enjoy, and still have sex on your mind for the end of the night”
Exactly
@Monk,
but thats not what the other menfolk are saying…
Do you know what I think is a big reason for the beautiful relationship I have? A car accident that I had at the beginning of our courtship that caused me unable to do any sort of ho-sh*t for over a month and a half, a forced ho-sh*t hiatus allowed me to really be able to be courted and get to know my mate. Ain’t that some sh*t?
I said that to say, when you don’t start a relationship off with sex it doesn’t guarantee awesomeness, but makes the conditions a little more suitable for awesomeness…
@Relax, Relate, Alise,
Guys have to make at least token attempts at getting some, otherwise, they get branded as gay. Once the suspicion is there, anything the guy is doing to convey his interest is suspect:
Guy opens doors for gal – “hmm, he really knows what women like, must be gay”.
Guy has long deep conversations with gal – “hmm, he likes to talk and he was actually listening to my entire 4 hour story of why I burst out crying whenever I see a teddy bear falling from a little girl’s hand, no real man would listen AND make insightful comments, must be gay”.
Guy makes changes to his wardrobe based on gal’s suggestion. – “No man is ever that well put together, he must be gay. . . or sleeping with some heffa. . .”.
@kamakula,
That comment was funny. :snickers:
@MsSula,
Funny, but true.
@kamakula, funny but so untrue……LOL your not gay until I give you the signal to come and get it and you dont…then all of that chivalry becomes gayness..
@Shay-d-lady,
That too. See the problem here. On the one hand, guys are hearing “you’re going for the nookie too fast, slow your roll, give the relationship time, don’t be pressed to leggo my eggo”. Then you have guys who are conflicted. When should they try to hit the home run? If they’re running at third base and the girl lets the ball drop a bit behind her, is it safe to run home or is she just testing you? Getting reading to pop you in the back if you make a dash for it?
Unfortunately, most of the time, we don’t have a third base coach right there giving us the go/no go signal. The strategy of no guts no glory guarantees that nobody will be calling you a p*ssy. The strategy of trying to read the girl’s mind may end up with you getting no p*ssy.
@kamakula,
But they don’t hear you, though.
@Scipio Africanus,
i hear it, i hear it….so whats the solution?
Well, given that I am the queen of LDRs, I rarely have this problem.
But I do believe that developing intimacy using ways other than sex makes for a solid foundation.
Ho-sh*t comes easy (at least to me… hi hi hi), and it’s restraining to not do ho-sh*t that’s hard… And when done right can be quite fulfilling.
@MsSula,
“But I do believe that developing intimacy using ways other than sex makes for a solid foundation.
Ho-sh*t comes easy (at least to me… hi hi hi), and it’s restraining to not do ho-sh*t that’s hard… And when done right can be quite fulfilling.”
Hee-hee-ha.
Good comment.
@MsSula, kudos
Courting needs to be revivied–where the man was really trying to get to know the woman and vice-versa.
@Shelia,
i’m intrigued that you put vice-versa there, which suggests that woman may put forth much effort to really get to know us either
I’m annoyed…my comment is gone. But I’ll paste it again…technical difficulties…ugh!
I get that guys want sex. I get it. I know they want it. Girls want it too. There’s no confusion in that.
Women see things completely differently from guys…
I’ve read that guys feel that they’ve EARNED sex because they approached you, called you, took you out, footed the bill, etc. So now you need to give me sex.
I’m sorry but your plan isn’t MY plan. You approached me…ok, I responded. You asked me out…I was interested so I obliged. You paid…you’re the guy and you asked me out…that’s kind of your job. No where in my dating manual or job description does it say…THEREFORE ADMINISTER SEX…um, no. There’s some mix-up there. No one is EVER obligated to give you sex…puh-leeze…that’s just an insane way of thinking.
AND another thing…if I could draw a diagram, for men, sex is in the middle and dating, talking, spending time, etc. revolves around what their desired yield is…SEX.
Women on the other hand have relationship in the middle with dating, talking spending time, etcand sex is also included in that list…revolving around relationship…unlike our male counterparts. Our actions do not revolve around sex (this is a generalization and doesn’t apply to all of course…this goes for both men and women…just making general observations).
Men just need to be patient…and when the time is right, you’ll get some. If you can’t be patient…move the hell on!
@Coco,
question: if this…
“You approached me…ok, I responded. You asked me out…I was interested so I obliged. You paid…you’re the guy and you asked me out…that’s kind of your job.”
…is all the man’s job (which i’m not denying), what exactly is the women’s job?
@The Champ,
The woman’s job is to go out with this man and have a good time. Again, just because you paid for a date doesn’t mean I automatically give you some.
If that were the case, this is just glorified prostitution except I’m not Julia Roberts and you sure as hell aren’t Richard Gere so get off your high horse and stop EXPECTING something.
I will say this. Women aren’t just holding out on the goods because we want to make you suffer. We hold out because one a woman sleeps with you our emotions change and something is different and you will know it. Then you’re gonna go and write a blog about “why women gotta get all weird? that’s why we regret sleeping wit y’all!”
So it seems like this…we’re damned if we do and damned if we don’t. That’s why I choose to “don’t”.
@Coco, ” We hold out because one a woman sleeps with you our emotions change and something is different and you will know it. Then you’re gonna go and write a blog about “why women gotta get all weird? that’s why we regret sleeping wit y’all!”
So it seems like this…we’re damned if we do and damned if we don’t. That’s why I choose to “don’t”.”
This point should sum it up for all women. It worries me that men can just compartmentalize sex. How do you give yourself in such an intimate manor to someone you don’t care about
@Coco,
“I’m sorry but your plan isn’t MY plan. You approached me…ok, I responded. You asked me out…I was interested so I obliged. You paid…you’re the guy and you asked me out…that’s kind of your job. No where in my dating manual or job description does it say…THEREFORE ADMINISTER SEX…um, no. There’s some mix-up there. No one is EVER obligated to give you sex…puh-leeze…that’s just an insane way of thinking.”
LOL! I couldn’t have said it better myself!!!
@YGB, i know. this paragraph says everything i would have wanted to say and more. lol.
@Coco, “if I could draw a diagram, for men, sex is in the middle and dating, talking, spending time, etc. revolves around what their desired yield is…SEX.
Women on the other hand have relationship in the middle with dating, talking spending time, etc and sex is also included in that list…revolving around relationship”
Very well put. I like your diagram. You should publish it.
Courting is an urban legend.
The great Andre 3000 says:
“I don’t care if a woman give it up on the first night, that just means she knows wants out of life”
Alot of men think this way, alot of men think women who give it up early are hoes, alot of different men, alot of different opinions.
Courting varies with different regions.
For instance, people i know who live in the Bay Area tend to date more, while in LA, people chose to do alot group/large crowd activities. (I think it’s strategic in LA in order to maximize returns on potential number gathering, but I digress). Southern people still tend to go out on dates, hell new yorkers in all there alleged rudeness still date.
I personally have become jaded and think there is no such thing as courting. Upon meeting people, they fall into two categories.
People you could Shag
People you won’t Shag.
Nothing really lifting them above a C, both of those categories get a C. And no E for effort or T for nice Try.
@Jeandra, but if its someone that you will shag.. you dont want to make any attempt to get to know them better? to know more about them and them about you than I how close your legs can get to your ears?
@Shay-d-lady,
Quite honestly, I can discern pretty quickly what category someone would fall in. Once you make that determination, it’s how you act on it.
Once that category is determined, depending on the social setting you met them in, you’ll either get to know them better or you won’t. if you have the fortune of meeting them in a setting that enables to you learn other aspects of their make up, then hey that’s great. you are in the game.
when anyone meets anyone for the first time, you are determining their shagability, period. the other stuff comes along extra.
now, courting is a whole other thing. that’s when you’ve gotten past that shag or no shag acessment, if you’ve decided to court with someone that wasn’t in your initial acessment, and i think this happens for women more than men, it may have taken a longer route but you’ve decided the idea of fornication is not an abomination.
what i’m saying is, i haven’t really encountered anyone recently that lifted them out of either of those categories, thus making them average at best.
@Jeandra,
That is sad, even with the riffraff I have encountered in my years of dating I still managed to get courted, and by different types of people, even in my dating thug stages and when I was on super ho-sh*t. You kind of have to tell them what you want, I put it out on the table subtly and sometimes directly that you WILL date me ninja, lol…. Urban legend, unicorn, or shooting star it ain’t.
@Relax, Relate, Alise,
Me too… Maybe it’s the men that I am attracted to.
I never had the impression of not dating. And trust me, I like my ho sh*t. But there was always a get-to know you/courting/dating period (even after ho sh*t went down).
@Relax, Relate, Alise,
“you WILL date me ninja”
i feel like embroidering that on a pillow!
@Relax, Relate, Alise,
I didnt’ say i didnt meet anyone. I said i haven’t met anyone who was more than average.
@Jeandra,
People you could Shag
People you won’t Shag.
Nothing really lifting them above a C, both of those categories get a C. And no E for effort or T for nice Try.
you know, although you put it rather bluntly, you’re making a good point. if a man believes that a woman has already made up her mind whether or not to sleep with him, whats his incentive?
i mean, i can understand the thinking behind the guy who’s thinking “why do all of this, spend all of this money, and waste all of this time for someone who isn’t gonna give me some anyway?”
@The Champ,
well it depends on the man.
If the man predetermined this woman is someone worth sleeping with he will put in the effort to be an hourly courter. This is a person who will put in a few hours for partial benefits but will never be a full time employee.
If the man meets the woman in a setting that allows him to see more than her waist to hip ratio, then the courting game begins on the male side of the fence.
Bottom line, courting isn’t dead.
It’s living the same fate as the economy. in a slow down and/or recession.
Dating is cool to me cause I actually like hanging out and getting to know a woman I’m interested in. Of course, since I’m ‘interested’, I may be prone to ‘bust a move’ and see where it leads. If it doesn’t get me to homebase, so be it…no big deal.
I say just feel the vibe, enjoy yourselves, and let it flow.
Re: Monk’s comment. Now there’s healthy approach to dating. Healthy, low or no stress, goal is to enjoy the date and the person holistically, and combined with being a gentleman. What a breath of fresh air.
@Kit (Keep It Trill),
I second this emotion.
i dig it like a grave too.
@Gem of the Ocean,
how morbid! lmao!
but i agree as well…i have a hard time with this though. im very imaginative and my mind starts to wander to what its gonna be like when we’re in love LMAO! and that shyt aint cool….thats not just enjoying the date.
@Monk, i like this. i def. don’t mind if the guy makes a move early on. because you never know! right? as long as he’s trying to get to know me and isn’t expecting something.
but, for the most part, if i’m ready he’ll know. bc we gone have to cut the date short. “i’m rets to go!” lol.
@Monk, LOL and I feel that..like my husband.. I remember when we were dating he was like.. shyt I mean dont save it for a grand occassion for me..I can take it regular.LMAO he tried and if he didnt get any he aint get no attitude and get brand new…made it a lot easier to give it to him..
@Monk,
This is good.
@Monk,
Dating is cool to me cause I actually like hanging out and getting to know a woman I’m interested in. Of course, since I’m ‘interested’, I may be prone to ‘bust a move’ and see where it leads. If it doesn’t get me to homebase, so be it…no big deal.
even with this being said, though, i’m sure theres a mental limit on how long “no big deal. i’ll just go home and watch sportscenter” continues. obviously, our limits are varied, but, after a while, every man eventually tires of the mr. miyagi treatment
@The Champ,
after a while, every man eventually tires of the mr. miyagi treatment
and women get tired of strumming a 2-fingered tune. There’s only so many ways you can play, and after a while, you’ve heard it all before.
I’m wondering why my messages are being marked as spam and then deleted…what did I do????
@Coco,
You’ve angered the Blog Gods.
@Jeandra, I guess so…those stinkers.
@Coco,
they werent deleted. they were marked as spam and held for moderation because you probably double clicked
@The Champ,
I think it just happened again…maybe it’s my browser…it keeps messing up on me.
@Coco, I commented on a couple of things too that have not yet posted while others have. Go figure
ugh. i loove courting! and it sucks that (some of) these punk ass men are not trained in that anymore. i agree with the interpretation above; the ladies don’t want men without a sex drive, just men who know how to court and wait and go about it. but, i’m sorry yall. i blame women. it’s entirely too many women out here on some ho sh*t. so when a man does take an ol’ whimsical ass person like me out on a fabuolous evening and i’m trying to have none of it (right not), he just cannot process it. it’s unusual. peculiar. odd. and then he’s faced with a decision.
i think high schools need to teach chivalry courses to boys. and young girls need a class on “how not to be a clingy freak that ruins the man for everydamn-body-else” 101. because ain’t nobody got time to be re-training these men. we’re in a recession.
just to clarify my def of “ho sh*t.” . i’m talking about doing whatever it takes to please the man, for every man, no matter who the man or how new the man and without ever learning a lesson. i’m not talking about grown people being liberal with their bodies when and if they want to. naw, i’m cool with that! haha. it’s this culture of female desperation that curdles me.
@charli skipper, “culture of female desperation” this is interesting
@Intellectual Hedonist,
indeed! i have some of the most disturbing conversations with some of my girls….like are you THIS afraid of being alone? serioulsy? youre gonna just go ahead and take this nonsense from that man? wow.
all i can say is, better you than me. i have left the lowering standards phase of my life behind…
@shatani,
I co-sign this whole comment.
@charli skipper,
“i loove courting! and it sucks that (some of) these punk ass men are not trained in that anymore.”
Shame huh?
@charli skipper,
i think high schools need to teach chivalry courses to boys. and young girls need a class on “how not to be a clingy freak that ruins the man for everydamn-body-else” 101
we actually already have people in place who are supposed to handle that. they’re called “parents”
@The Champ,
Why did this make me laugh out loud? Like literally.
@The Champ, lol. parents aren’t doin it. and i don’t want any child to be left behind!
Just curious and off topic, but are you all ever going to set your blog on Eastern Standard Time?
@Kit (Keep It Trill),
you read my mind
@Kit (Keep It Trill), LOL! I was thinking that also. I was thinking there were a lot of lonely people on this site to be posting at 3 and 4am. LOL!
@Ivy St.,
I was thinking there were a lot of lonely people on this site to be posting at 3 and 4am. LOL!
…instead of a lot of lonely people on this site to be posting at 2 and 3am?
@The Champ,
right! lmao
I was thinking there were a lot of lonely people on this site to be posting at 3 and 4am. LOL!
damn, why do i feel you pointing at me?? we all know i wouldn’t be blogging so late/early if i (a) didn’t have to work on this damn fellowship and/or (b) had my roopiece close by…
@Kit (Keep It Trill),
that sounds like a job for our managing editor (the lizzard), who’s been on safari’s in third world countries for the past month
@Kit (Keep It Trill), I think the site never converted to Day light savings time
Maybe this seems kinda backwards, but I know that I do more by getting a continuous supply pum pum than if I feel like I have to do stuff to get any kind of play.
If we’re already at a point where we’re having sex, why should I have to keep working toward getting some. It gets tiring to feel like you still have to work for something that you already have. I feel like the more you make sex a non issue, the more you can focus on doing other ish to help improve the relationship and make the other person happy (going out, concerts, plays, skydiving, w/e).
@J.R. Bernard, you dont have to do it to prove anything but why after having s.e.x does that then become the only thing of interest? why cant we sit and watch a movie ALL the way through for real without it being just a ruse to get over and get naked.. I mean dayum..I want you to want me but dayum I want you to also recognize I am a whole person and not just a c.u.m receptacle…
@Shay-d-lady,
why cant we sit and watch a movie ALL the way through for real without it being just a ruse to get over and get naked..
This is the reason I wear layers now.After the third shirt the chase grows cold.
@Limeade,
a chick did that layer thing to be before. I thought she was weird and I didnt call her back. I gues it was weird for her cause I still had to see her everyday in class but o well. Shouldnt’ve been messin with my head like that.
@Shay-d-lady,
Ok, how long are those relationships been? Because of course, in the first few weeks after you first have “relations” that’s all you both think about (at least in my case, because I DO like and enjoy chex)… but then the novelty wears off or you now have a certain schedule to when it might go down (try early morning every day, *swoons*), and life gets back into its normal daily humdrum.
People are who they are. If they didn’t like a certain activity, they are not going to like it because you do. They may do it at first (which I find extremely wrong actually) but eventually they’ll fall back into their familiar patterns.
That’s when we need to make sure we are dating people we are compatible with (and not just chexually either). Do we have some hobbies in common? Can we agree on some TV shows to watch? Do we like to travel? Etc… Etc…
We can’t expect every day to be exciting. Life is made up of a lot of very boring moments. Having a s/o doesn’t change this fact.
@Ms. Sula,
i think maybe the point is finding out about those potential commonalities BEFORE having your chex mix….that way, if youre not compatible, you wont have wasted a condom.
First time commenting…..
I dated a guy who wasnt’ trying to proactively get in the panties and it bothered the hell out of me. We slept in the same damn bed together and did nothing but CUDDLE….I died a million deaths that night. He didn’t even try to cop a feel. We f*ckin’ spooned and I didn’t get an ounce of sleep cause he proceeded to toss and turn the whole night. I finally had to make the move (after a few restless nights of spooning) just so I could actually get some sleep.
Yeah, a dude who isn’t trying to get it poppin’ in some way shape or form…bothers the hell out of me. But it’s also a fine line of how you go about it.
I think the ladies were addressing more of the issue of how men go about it and their shamelessness. Its fine to test the waters, after at least two dates, but don’t go for gold just cause we had one phone conversation and you paid for dinner.
@B.elieve,
welcome and sh*t
@B.elieve, Just curious, how did it go? I thought this story was going to end with you typing he is gay.
@Ivy St.,
lmao!
@B.elieve,
I was going to spend the day lurking about this conversation, but i gots to do my job
Welcome!
**Diva Dust ™**
If they haven’t already, the rest of the Sparkle Sistas (PBG, SouthernGirl) will be along shortly.
enjoy
**re-engages lurking device**
@blackberry molasses, me too! sista got a deadline and sh!t…
@B.elieve
welcome! *generous helping of gold stars*
*borrows bbmo’s lurking device*
Have to disagree with the Champ in some respects.
IMHO,
Some men will put some women they come across directly into the FB/FWB catagory strictly based on initial interactions, etc. Sometimes that is because the vibe the women give off is that THAT IS WHERE THEY BELONG. If you are crazy but have that body goin on, then we know where to place you. And once there, you will probably never move out of that slot.
The other catagory are those women that truely bring something positive to a guy’s life and thus we will want to nurture it. So the Co. picnics, dates, courting, family reunions are all good because the overall experience is good. So are the conversations, interactions, etc. But the key is, the lady has to be a plus, and not a minus, to the guys life.
If the experience is negative overall, ya get moved to the FB/FWB slot, pulled pork sammich and all. Yeah, we can be like that, just wanting to taste the BBQ sauce, but not wanting to spend “quality time” with you. Sorry bout that.
Two questions however.
1. Is this a younger vs. older guy thing?
2. Is there no way to let a guy know upfront you expect courting to continue? Because some of those relationship books talk about courting and seduction throughout the day in order to get the best lovin possible.
Just askin……….
@Swamii,
I think it may be a young guy vs. older guy thing. Young guys have more social interaction so they have more opportunity to get some kitty. HoS*hit doesn’t last very long but that’s water under the bridge to a young guy who comes across lots of hos*hit opportunities. I think an older guy would rather have a more reliable kitty and might not mind putting in a lil more work in the beginning to secure regular kitty.
@Swamii,
i sho did like this comment. LOL.
On a real basic level, a man’s body SHOULD naturally like your body. Cute little inuendos should probably insue…that is the natural order of things and as PBG mentioned.
My role erryday allday is to navigate the ship.
And yes to me women who can’t do that successfully or appeal ONLY and Primarily to a man’s se#xual urges do go in the “THAT IS WHERE THEY BELONG” bucket.
You asked the question:
“1. Is this a younger vs. older guy thing?
”
I would say generally older men are more patient. And as long as their parts still work, they still jokeying for the booty just like their younger counterparts.
“Is there no way to let a guy know upfront you expect courting to continue? Because some of those relationship books talk about courting and seduction throughout the day in order to get the best lovin possible”
I mentioned this a little earlier in my comment but yes. I heard Temple Christian (the youtube guy say) and it pretty much mirrors what I’ve heard most of my life too: “if you want a guy to see you as more you gotta be more.” Regarding seduction, I don’t think you need to learn that in a book. I think its apart of women just knowing who they are emotionally, phsycially and even sex@ually and to appeal to all parts of a man in and out of the sack. I do believe that some of this comes with a little age and maturity (but i suppose everything grown ain’t emotionally-sexually mature).
@Princess Duvet,
if you want a guy to see you as more you gotta be more.”
Hallelujah!! Praise the Lord and AMEN!!!
@Princess Duvet,
oh, princess i love me some temple christian! thats why im not buying that whole, “men dont think poorly of you if you sex it up on the first date”
i dont believe that for one sec.
@Swamii,
“Some men will put some women they come across directly into the FB/FWB catagory strictly based on initial interactions, etc. Sometimes that is because the vibe the women give off is that THAT IS WHERE THEY BELONG. If you are crazy but have that body goin on, then we know where to place you. And once there, you will probably never move out of that slot.”
We do the same thing to dudes too…lol
Know your role.
@Swamii,
how is this disagreeing with what i said?
@The Champ,
You make it sound like it is about the sex ONLY. It may evolve or devolve to that eventually, but I don’t think that every contact minute we have with women we are scheming as to how to get them in the sheets. Because if you got game and she is open to the idea, it is going to happen. She just may not know it at the time………
@Swamii,
You make it sound like it is about the sex ONLY
nah, that wasn’t what i was trying to convey. what i am saying is that sex does drive the process, subconsciously at least.
@Swamii,
Good questions.
And I want to say it’s a younger vs. older guy thing.
I have never dated someone younger than 22 years old (which at the time was 5 years older than me… Yeah I know!!
), and I don’t think I have come across a lot of guys who expect me to put out after a first date. If anything, I have experienced the opposite.
Swamii, i appreciate your comment and your honesty. your insight into these matters is appreciated.
I’m going to try and put this courting myth to rest. Courting is a set of behaviors engaged by men and women where men attempt to get into the pants of women and women don’t allow it until certain conditions are met period.
100 years ago, getting into the pants required more work on average. Believe you me, if your chastity belt had a lock that could only be defeated with 3 solid months of hand holding, conversation, trips to the museum, walks on the beach, wine, goodnight kisses, flowers, and teddy bears, that’s exactly what you would get.
If your chastity belt is defeated by a trip to McDonalds. . . that’s what you will get. Some guys are so slick, even after defeating your belt w/ MikieDs, they may take you to Olive Garden just so you don’t realize how easy you are.
For those who still don’t follow, this means that courtship is defined by the woman, namely, by what is required to get into her pants. In some places and times, you practically had to marry a woman. . . What makes people think guys want to return to the good old days?
@kamakula,
“For those who still don’t follow, this means that courtship is defined by the woman, namely, by what is required to get into her pants”
I totally agree.
@kamakula, “I’m going to try and put this courting myth to rest. Courting is a set of behaviors engaged by men and women where men attempt to get into the pants of women and women don’t allow it until certain conditions are met period.”
EXACTLY!! ENTIRE POST . . . GOOD MAN!
@kamakula, “I’m going to try and put this courting myth to rest. Courting is a set of behaviors engaged by men and women where men attempt to get into the pants of women and women don’t allow it until certain conditions are met period.”
Shouldn’t courting be about more? Don’t you want to get to know me better? BTW, I like rock climbing and I was raised on a farm.
“What makes people think guys want to return to the good old days?”
STDs? Messing up a good thing? Turning a housewife into a h*e and then having to turn her back into a housewife?
Maybe the real issue is that men can’t think about their future and every women is just “the next woman I’m going to screw”
@Ivy St., “Shouldn’t courting be about more? Don’t you want to get to know me better? BTW, I like rock climbing and I was raised on a farm.”
Why do women try to make men so complicated? It is OK to complicate everything else, we know you do this, but don’t complicate men, we are not that difficult. Women trying to make men into this complex transcendental being is inappropriate.
We are easy . . . I want sex from you, you control the sex, you give it, i take it. You like mountain climbing .. me too . .maybe we can do it on a mountain. A farm? I’ve never done it in a barnyard.
@IVR,
“Women trying to make men into this complex transcendental being is inappropriate.”
That tickled me, bc it is true in my experiences. Excellent observation.
@Relax, Relate, Alise, “That tickled me, bc it is true in my experiences. Excellent observation.”
Thank you kindly.
@IVR,
i dont knwo why, but i am so amused that you said “inappropriate” lol
@IVR,
You sounds like I Green Eggs and Ham. At least I know you had a good childhood.
BTW, IVR is toooo close to Ivy, new name please.
@Ivy St., “You sounds like I Green Eggs and Ham. At least I know you had a good childhood. BTW, IVR is toooo close to Ivy, new name please.”
Negative troop. . . these are my initials – not budging (how would anyone find me on facebook?? jk). . .AND I wouldn’t call childhood ‘good’ but my experience dealing with women types and their complexity has taught me that I am a simple creature. No deciphering necessary . . . the only time I have to be not so simple is when trying to get the precious from a woman . . . this (along with the good times I get trying to figure out what the hell my FAR is trying to say at work) are the only times I enjoy not being so simple.
@IVR, “the only time I have to be not so simple is when trying to get the precious from a woman’
Also, when trying not to hurt their feelings. . . pretty much any interaction I have to have with a woman to get what I want complicates my life. I look at it in a good way though, a woman (in this respect) is everything I am not, this makes life interesting.
@IVR,
You like mountain climbing .. me too . .maybe we can do it on a mountain. A farm? I’ve never done it in a barnyard.
this made me laugh aloud.
@Ivy St.,
You raised some questions. . .
Shouldn’t courting be about more? Don’t you want to get to know me better? BTW, I like rock climbing and I was raised on a farm.
This can be tough to answer. Who’s to say courting isn’t like that? Like I said, the woman defines what courtship is. If you want us to get to know each other better before jumping in the sack. . . then that can be your condition.
Anyway, the reason it’s tough is because your implied question is “Why don’t guys want courtship to be about more? Well, we’ve sorta answered that. Sex. But then that leads to “Do guys even care about the more stuff?” The answer is yes. We do care. And we’d be interested in getting to know you better. . . as long as we can f*ck you while doing it.
“What makes people think guys want to return to the good old days?”
STDs? Messing up a good thing? Turning a housewife into a h*e and then having to turn her back into a housewife?
This was sort of a rhetorical question. It doesn’t really matter because guys are doing now what they did in the good old days – the minimum necessary to get the panties.
Maybe the real issue is that men can’t think about their future and every women is just “the next woman I’m going to screw”
Hmm, I’ve sorta addressed this above, we can think about our future, it just involves horizontal polkas as much as it does business meetings, raising families, and engineering marvels. I mean, can you imagine a future where you had no s8x? Most guys cannot. So you shouldn’t be surprised that s8x is involved when guys think about their futures.
@kamakula,
Seriously, you are the man today.
lmao @ “Some guys are so slick, even after defeating your belt w/ MikieDs, they may take you to Olive Garden just so you don’t realize how easy you are.”
ohhhhhhh Kam you tickle me so.
p.s. are you coming out to shadow lounge/ava on friday night?? hot party going down!!
@Gem of the Ocean, and I’ll be there too!
@Gem of the Ocean,
Yeah, I’ll be there. What time is stuff getting started?
@kamakula, 9ish but don’t arrive at 9. 5 dollars before 11
@kamakula, I’m going to try and put this courting myth to rest. Courting is a set of behaviors engaged by men and women where men attempt to get into the pants of women and women don’t allow it until certain conditions are met period.
I agree completely
When’s a man gonna challenge ME and make ME want to work for the D? They hand it out like [insert WIT here]…
I do agree with the women that after you have s3x, it seems like the default activity…
Courting doesn’t seem to have much relevance because we (women) have allowed it. The second we put our foot down (since, we’ve already confirmed that you ALL want the P), then we can get this whole thing back.
@Nicki Sunshine,
“When’s a man gonna challenge ME and make ME want to work for the D? They hand it out like [insert WIT here]…”
That would be me. I’ve been told by a few women that I am stingy with the D.
@Humble_One, Well Challenge me then. LMAO! Or teach these ninjas something.
@Nicki Sunshine,
judging by this comment, as well as others in the past couple weeks, i think you’re hurtin for a squirtin
@The Champ, I have been celibate for almost ONE DAYUM YEAR??? What do you think? LOL.
@Nicki Sunshine,
lol, i knew it. its my advanced powers of deduction and sh*t
@Nicki Sunshine,
“Courting doesn’t seem to have much relevance because we (women) have allowed it. The second we put our foot down (since, we’ve already confirmed that you ALL want the P), then we can get this whole thing back”
gold star for you Sunny.
@Princess Duvet,
if we could get all women on board with this, that would be something! but theres always gonna be a hussy out there givin it away and depreciatin yo value! lmao
@shatani,
“if we could get all women on board with this, that would be something! but theres always gonna be a hussy out there givin it away and depreciatin yo value! lmao”
***shuffles around forthe YAYA handbook..turns to page 567 paragraph 6…***
“cream always rises to the top”
@Princess Duvet,
*looks through kanye west lyric bible*
“Man the top so lonely
Ayee Aye
So lonely
Ayee Aye”
@shatani,
lol, there are nights when I’m out with some friends and talk turns to women and i’m like “I’ve got the solution, just need to convince all the guys in the world to do. . .”
Of course, it’ll never work. 30 seconds into it, some woman would drop her clothes in front of some poor guy who’s been waiting his entire life and my whole plan goes to hell.
@kamakula,
yep…neither of the sexes is going to be able to mobilize on anything!
@shatani,
Isht… even family related by blood and gender can’t agree on a single thing!
The beauty of the brain. ’tis a blessing, ’tis a curse.
@shatani, Ain’t that the truth… those that just hhhhaaaave to have a man.. at any costs.
@Nicki Sunshine, well said… well said…
@Princess Duvet and Ladebelle:
Thanks ladies.
@Nicki Sunshine, “When’s a man gonna challenge ME and make ME want to work for the D? They hand it out like [insert WIT here]…”
The same day a man and a woman goes shopping, man goes upstairs to watch TV while woman empties Suburban full of groceries.
@IVR, “man goes upstairs to watch TV while woman empties Suburban full of groceries.”
I can do that… I’m not one of those women that think just bc a man is a man he must take out the trash and unload the car, etc.
@Nicki Sunshine, “I can do that… I’m not one of those women that think just bc a man is a man he must take out the trash and unload the car, etc. ”
That is good that you are not like that, but that would make me feel as awkward as sitting around with a stiffy and making you work for it. . . different strokes for different strokes.
@IVR, LMAO! Not awkward. I appreciate your honesty.
@Nicki Sunshine, “When’s a man gonna challenge ME and make ME want to work for the D? They hand it out like [insert WIT here]…”
Great point! I like to work at it too. Me having to say “NO,” “NO” and then “okay fine” is not cool all the time.
@Ivy St., Right. I feel like I get worn down for the cooch A LOT. I’m not doing it because I am h***ny, I am doing it bc you don’t got on my nerves!
@Nicki Sunshine, oops… done
the question is how much sex do you want or need? every woman is different about the amount of sex they need, men are going to give it try every time so they can find out this amount. if you want it everyday, I’m going to give it everyday but I’m going to try every other hour. we are hunters and this is big game hunting ( i brought my shotgun)
@J. McFly,
so basically its about libido?
@The Champ, It’s not just about libido. Libido will increase and decrease based on the INETEREST and how physically attracted she is to you. It comes down to how much interest the woman has in you and how much she wants to engage in that act with YOU. I’m sure libido would get real high if say Tyson Bexford or Morris Chestnut showed up at the door.
lmao @ “I’m sure libido would get real high if say Tyson Bexford or Morris Chestnut showed up at the door.”
substitute Idris for Tyson and D. Wade for Chestnut and i’d have all the “interest” in the WORLD!! whew lawdy *fanning*
“i agree that the actual act of courting doesn’t seem to have much relevance anymore…”
Maybe courting isn’t as relevant to men but it’s definitely important to me (and unless I’m some strange mutant, other women).
It’s not that I don’t enjoy being f*{ked but I want to make sure the door for making sexy beautiful love is still open. There’s nothing more beautiful to a woman (at least this woman) than having the big O from the kitty and the heart at the same time. I’ve found that you can only reach that beautiful sexy place when you’re on the same wavelength with your partner. I don’t think there’s a set number of dates to be on that same wavelength, it could take a few hours or a few months. Courting is just the ride that gets you on the same wavelength. What I have found is that if you do the do before you’re riding that common wavelength, it ends up just being a f*{k and each time you f*{k without having done the sexy beautiful/love making thing it becomes increasingly difficult to reach that unicorn filled mountain.
If we’ve already started doing the do, haven’t made sexy beautiful love, and there’s barely any courting then I’ll end up feeling like that pulled pork sandwich. Once I’ve been to that sexy beautiful place with a guy then I’m open to fu*{king, doing the sexy beautiful, or any other variation we make up together.
@shhwhisper, “There’s nothing more beautiful to a woman (at least this woman) than having the big O from the kitty and the heart at the same time.”
Soooo true!
This takes me back to the idea of having a FB. it’s ok to have empty, mind blowing, sheet clinching s*x but that can only last for so long if you don’t have feelings for that person. The novelty is gone and it becomes a lonely situation.
basically integrate the pleasure center with other limbic structures. gotcha.
@shhwhisper,
i’m just mad that you all have sullied the image of a pulled pork sandwich today. now, next time i eat one i’ll be thinking i’m eating a raggedy vagina
@The Champ,
Either that or the next time you’re faced with a raggedy vagina, you can just think of a pulled pork sandwich.
Turn that frown upside down and what not.
@Deviant, “Either that or the next time you’re faced with a raggedy vagina, you can just think of a pulled pork sandwich.”
Meat Curtains . . . long sloppy dirty curtains made of meat . . . *shudder*
@IVR,
oh snap! i thought my crazy friends were the only ones that called them meat curtains…i have a lovely female british friend that calls them piss flaps. utterly disgusting, but with her accent it sounds positively dainty!
@shatani,
“piss flaps”
Okay…that is nasteeee.
I’m off to dry heave now…thanks. lol
@shatani, “oh snap! i thought my crazy friends were the only ones that called them meat curtains…i have a lovely female british friend that calls them piss flaps. utterly disgusting, but with her accent it sounds positively dainty!”
LOL! and DISGUSTING! all at once.
@IVR,
theres nothing like a concept that makes you laugh and barf at the same time…its a special thing!
@Deviant,
LOL!!!
@The Champ,
This had me howling!
@shhwhisper, beautifully said, I love the imagery or a unicorn filled mountain. It took me to a special place
@Intellectual Hedonist,
I second that emotion wholeheartedly.
When we as ladies realize that dudes are tying their best to smash-(at all times) you realize the ball is in your court.
You pretty much can dictate how things will go as long as you understand that booty could or will be the end result. Again, you make that choice as how early/often you’re giving up the goodies.
When you realize what you want and make that clear, they have no choice but to either come correct, or leave you alone.
Courting is still relevant. If you make that relevance work…lol
@miss t-lee,
more truth…
@Princess Duvet,
*what’s up nod*
@miss t-lee, “When we as ladies realize that dudes are tying their best to smash-(at all times) you realize the ball is in your court.
You pretty much can dictate how things will go as long as you understand that booty could or will be the end result. Again, you make that choice as how early/often you’re giving up the goodies.”
I agree. . . but too much of that the ball is in my court do this to get these draws attitude is gonna get you left. . . early or after we do it all just to screw you and then leave because you’re an A-hole (depending on how good you look). . . It is the truth, but flaunting it around openly is A-holish behavior. . . lol
@IVR,
I know that…I’m a self-proclaimed azzhole.
My tactics won’t work for everyone…lol
@miss t-lee, “I know that…I’m a self-proclaimed azzhole. My tactics won’t work for everyone…lol”
This is true, and this is why I am hooked on this site . . . there are sooo many damn different viewpoints that are seldomly expressed in a relationship . . . It’s like I get to peek into the circus that is a woman’s mind and actually understand it. It also confirms (for me) that there is someone for everyone . . . some women on this site I can see eye to eye with . . . some I end up agreeing to disagree with in writing (thinking in my head – she CAN’T be serious). It’s like an epiphany to a relationship driven man whose body stays in relationships even when everything else says. . . u need to part ways with this broad.
@IVR,
“It’s like I get to peek into the circus that is a woman’s mind and actually understand it.”
I hate to actually admit this is somewhat true…lol
We definitely have a cornucopia of opinons and points of view.
@miss t-lee,
vsb.com: where cornucopias and sh*t happen
@The Champ,
*chuckling*
@IVR,
I have to co-sign this comment. Reading some of your comments disturb me, but ultimately I feel enlightened just from seeing how you think.
Reading this site is sort of like dating. I can see what I like and what I dont like and become more aware of who I am as a person.
@Dom, “I have to co-sign this comment. Reading some of your comments disturb me, but ultimately I feel enlightened just from seeing how you think. ”
LoL! Sorry, I am really not a bad guy . . . Promise! I honestly would like to be in love and married and all that . . . my experiences with females have caused me to adjust to the norm. Maybe if my first was “the one” then I wouldn’t be like this. . .but after screwing other people’s girlfriends and getting screwed over . . . u realize its not a fairy tale.
@IVR,
Totally irrelevant, very much so, but I’m a teensy bit curious. How old are you, IVR?
@Ms. Sula, I am 26 and 362 days.
@IVR,
“Sorry, I am really not a bad guy . . . Promise! I honestly would like to be in love and married and all that ”
Oh no, I got that from your comments. Its just that what you said about thinking negatively of women who do the same thing you do ticked me off. Perhaps I took that a little too personal, but I hate to hear hypocrites try to rationalize BS.
Anywhoo, hope it all works out for you on the marriage/relationhip front.
Carry on.
@DOM, “Oh no, I got that from your comments. Its just that what you said about thinking negatively of women who do the same thing you do ticked me off. Perhaps I took that a little too personal, but I hate to hear hypocrites try to rationalize BS.
Anywhoo, hope it all works out for you on the marriage/relationhip front.”
LoL @ your sarcasm . . . I am not a hypocrite, I had to clarify my statement. I said I DID judge myself after doing these things . . .who hasn’t had a wtf did I just do moment . . . but this is not the norm. After these VERY few occurences am I supposed to wife them? I had a chick draw me a picture of a liger the morning after we hooked up . . . is this the future mother of my children? How does that conversation even begin? It’s funny that so many of the women folk in here are throwing around the hypocrite word when the sheer existence of “chick logic” is hypocrisy to begin with. There is no chick logic, there is logic, and the quirks that come with a woman; which by nature (IMO) is PURELY illogical but a man has to deal if he wants to stick around.
I do like to court a woman and will gladly oblige a woman that requires this. If she doesn’t require it then why do it? The majority of women that I have met in my life are NOT this way. As I said, normally you get a phone number and have to put in some kind of work.
I believe it was MsSula who took my cow/milk statement out of context so let’s look at it. Why pay for the cow if you can get the milk for free . . . why would you want free milk to begin with . . . if it was free for you, it was probably free for everyone else sticking their raggedy lips all in the free milk with their moufblisters (maybe drunk once or twice you stuck your own raggedy lips in the milk, but after getting your checkup and being free and clear of the supercooties you promise yourself not to do it again). . . but if you fancy yourself a connoisseur of milk then you are willing to pay for it, go to the gourmet section and pick you up the 20 dollar a gallon joint . . .sh!t if it’s good enough you will buy the d@mn cow that produces this wonderful milk. All the hypocrisy being spewed by the “pot calling the kettle black” folks is a bit unnerving. . . but then again . . .I guess that is just “chick logic”
@IVR,
SO MAD @ the picture of the liger!! LMAO!
but the answer to your question is yes. yes, you wife a woman that will draw you a liger in the morning.
@IVR,
… debating weather or not to let you have the last word…
…Still thinking….
…Okay. Good day sir…
@Dom, “… debating weather or not to let you have the last word…Still thinking….…Okay. Good day sir…”
Good day, ma’am.
@All,
Is it the liger as in a cross between a lion and a tiger, or is it code/slang for something else? I am rather clueless.
And just to clairify, IVR, that is a rather common quote. I was not referring to your usage of it today… Although it fits.
you know champ, i totally agree with you… if a dude has not thrown some sexual energy towards me then i think he’s gay. not saying that i’m tryna jump your bones as soon as we meet but i think that it keeps things interesting having a certain amount of sexual tension in play.
however, on the flip side, i do think that all the sexual tension causes for people to introduce others to their “agents” hoping that the agent will get the draws faster then they could… sadly, due to safety and people just not caring, you can’t have sex on the first date cuz u might walk away scratching or “clapping”.
i digress… either way, men do things to bone women and quiet as it’s (not) kept, women do things to bone men too… equal opportunity at it’s finest
@ladebelle,
“quiet as it’s (not) kept, women do things to bone men too… equal opportunity at it’s finest”
*waving with my funeral home church fan*
@ladebelle,
women do things to bone men too… equal opportunity at it’s finest
this is a future vsb topic, actually
@The Champ, I’d be interested to see this. I’d really like to know wat purpose it serves for a woman to run around tryna get some d. Totally foreign to me.
@Dom,
it happens. Its not all that uncommon.
@Deviant,
I can see how a woman would chase a ring, or what they think a d will eventually get them, but a woman chasing a man for sex? I just dont get it. I guess I’ll have to wait to see this topic come up.
Before I read the 100+ comments that seem to be on every post this early in the AM (it’s not even 9 yet…), I’ll just say this…
This is a microwave vs. oven argument. Men don’t see the need to take the time to pre-heat the oven and the bake a chicken for a hour when they can zap a hot pocket in 3.
@Deviant,
Co-sign. That shit is in our DNA. What I’m about to say will make me seem like a pig . . .but oh well . . .
For me sex is one of the most important deal makers or breakers. So why waste time, money and effort, when we can get it over with in the beginning? I was once with a chick who made me wait 2 months, within those 2 months we did alot of dating and shyt, and when it came time to do the do, the shyt was wack. And I not saying females that make you wait are corny in bed. If you think were I’m coming from is bullshyt then ladies think about this . . .
Imagine you met the most wonderful man and you make him wait for all this time before you put it on him . . .cool . . .then the time comes for when your finally ready to take it to the next level by having s3x. So your laid out on the bed and this ninja pulls his pants down and he was a penis the size of a pencil!!!! Wouldn’t you be mad as shyt with all the time and effort you wasted on that ninja knowing he could never satisfy you sexually?
And don’t get me started on the numerous story’s I’ve read here on VSB where some of you frustrated ladies stopped relations mid stroke, because homie was wack in bed.
@eff yo couch,
you hit it right on the head
@eff yo couch,
This is tooooo true. Im glad you broke it down with that analogy. Women can relate to that. I know I’d be pissed. I feel like getting it out of the way early makes things less complicated. Now Im not going and giving it up to everybody, but I feel like its not one of those things you wait too long on.
A close family friend recently told me she’s a virgin, been with her bf of 2 years and never got it in. DAMN! My first thought: he’s getting it somewhere else. My second though, what if she gets it after marriage (which is what she’s waiting for) and it totally let down? I wouldnt want to be in her shoes with that decision.
@Deviant,
Come on Devs show your units. zap a hot pocket in 3 minutes.
@WuDaMan,
You’re right. Always show your units.
@Deviant,
Mr. Keller?!!! R U my cool ssa high school physics teacher? That was his line a lot of times ‘Always show your units.’ It always cracked me up. Cuz I usually wanted to see the girls units n show em mine.
I say we t-shirt this slogan. I’m sure some nsbe or nobcche aiche or engineering group has already done this but it’s worth repeating. lol
@Deviant,
and another thing if you slap a dry ssa bird up in my over. It’s gonna be you that get’s cut messin up that precious yard bird. Season brine marinate and dress that bird he’s been waiting his whole life to be something great and this is how he is treated. I can hear him now he’s screaming ‘I’M NOT A PAWN’ remulade fricassee deep fried w/ waffles on a good beer on the grill paired w/ some great lo mein jerk injection marinade and deep fried in tacos tomales tostados sopes tortas burritos encheladas marinated and grilled over pasta or salad confeit casoule gumbo etufe…. just don’t do that to the bird
@WuDaMan,
and now im confused AND hungry. thanks a lot Wu…
@shatani,
hahah
After waffles I just started thinking about lunch…lol
@Deviant,
Well my box says microwave over preparation not recommended.
And I guess when you’re starving a hot pocket will suffice but I will take slow-cooked chicken over some microwavable instant stuff in a second.
You will regret your hot pocket choice eventually….
@Coco,
why is that?
@Deviant, Are you saying you want quick over quality? That’s the difference. If someone gives you sex instantly, that’s all it’s gonna be (generally speaking based on observation). But when the relationship takes a natural progression and it happens when the time is right, it will only enhance what has already been built.
@Coco,
“… If someone gives you sex instantly, that’s all it’s gonna be…”
This isn’t necessarily true. Sometimes the natural progression happens after-the-fact and it will still enhance what’s been built.
@Deviant, True. I can agree with that.
@Coco,
“Well my box says microwave over preparation not recommended. ”
You meant oven right? Either way I got it.
LMAO!!!!! How in the hell did I miss this one the 1st go round?
hee-hee.
I need a t-shirt.
@miss t-lee, Yes I meant oven. Hahaha…I’ve been told I need to go into the t-shirt business…more to come.
@Deviant,
Ha ha ha ha. Brilliant analogy if I ever see one.
Another issue I have with FB is that you risk the chance of messing over a relationship with someone that could have potentially been a great mate in the long term. Sex too soon is never a good thing. There shouldn’t be a time limit.
Also, being a man is NO excuse for it being okay for you to try and break my back in on the first date. Why is it ok for a man to want it on the first date and not a woman? Men should respect themselves just as much. Why is she now a ___ (fill in your own word) if she enjoys sex just as much as you do? There was a cohesive point at the beginning of this comment but then it just left and here we are.
@Ivy St.,
Why is it ok for a man to want it on the first date and not a woman?
its ok for a woman to want it too.
@The Champ, “its ok for a woman to want it too”
Apparently not according to an earlier comment. It seems men will keep it moving if you want it just as much as they do on the first date.
@Ivy St., “It seems men will keep it moving if you want it just as much as they do on the first date”
I hope this is not in response to my comment on your post earlier because this is not the intention of what I said. The girl that I am seeing now, we slept together on the first date. She even told me that she didn’t expect for me to call her afterwards. I am with this girl at the moment and believe me, I will continue to court until I have a reason not to. All I said was that I am cautious with women who sleep with me on the first date and that I WOULDN’T wife a woman I dragged out of a club one night (although never is an extreme word). I am cautious with a lot of things this doesn’t mean I won’t give it a shot.
@Ivy St.,
thats not always the case….sometimes it works out. but we should most certainly not get our hopes up! lol…we all have that friend…mine met a dude and it was supposed to be strictly FB and it was, for like 5 months…and then he caught feelings and she was on FB mode so that didnt even occur to her…they started to actually date and that was the beginning of the end! lol…theyve been together for about 3 years now.
i see that as some one in a million isht, though…i have no delusions that jumping into a FB situation is gonna end that way for me. and if it ever does, well i guess i will just be pleasantly surprised…
GIRLS BE TRYIN TO FORCE A DUDE TO GET TO KNOW THEM
THAT MAY BE WHERE TEH PROBLEM IS U CANT MAKE A DUDE COURT U. A GUY MAY REALIZE WHATEVER U HAVE TO OFFER BESIDES BUTT AINT WHAT HE LIKES OR HE MAY REALIZE Y’ALL AIN’T COMPATABLE BUT HE STILL WANTS TO BONE
SO AS LONG AS TEH GIRL ISNT TOO MUCH STRESS HE WILL STAY AROUND
@Deviant, *SMH* UGH!
@Deviant,
Brutally honest.
this was an excerpt from a chat convo with a friend. no edits.
its the truth though. my brother says the same thing. phuc you now, like you later
@Deviant,
I can’t speak for all males but, one thing I know about myself is that I already have it in my mind if I’m going to put you in JO status or Wifey status.
So ladies sometimes it’s not that deep. Maybe that guy you were so interested in just wanted you for sex and nothing more!!! I think there are many factors involved with this subject.
@eff yo couch,
Truth to that. Another things the ladies have to keep in mind is that when you say “just be honest and upfront about wanting the booty” that many of you all are taken back just the same when we actually say it. Our actions pretty much tell you what we are thinking.
I remember telling a girl that I wanted to hit dat, she agreed she wanted to do the same. Only thing was she said she wanted to be in a monogamous relationship if that were to take place. I declined. No ultimatums for me. Another thing: she was just too coo coo for me to take seriously.
@eff yo couch,
so, is it against the rules if you jsut tell us from jump which category we fall into??
i mean, personally, i would absolutely respect that. my problem comes with the dude that strictly wants you for jumpoff activities and pretends to want more because he knows you want more….like, there are TONS of women out there that are lookin to jumpoff, why phuck with the one that is not and then mess her whole shyt up??
ive had a few men in my short lifetime tell me exactly what they were looking for…some of them got it, and some of them got the polite refusal (and a promise that they would be notified, should circumstances change)
honesty rules!
@shatani,
“my problem comes with the dude that strictly wants you for jumpoff activities and pretends to want more because he knows you want more”
I hate that with a passion, it just shows a general lack of empathy that some guys have. That kind of trickery leaves behind some damage.
….like, there are TONS of women out there that are lookin to jumpoff, why phuck with the one that is not and then mess her whole shyt up??
@shatani,
Because we are men and sometime we enjoy the trill of the chase
@eff yo couch,
*smh*
then ya’ll wonder why she bust the windows out ya car….
@Deviant, That’s the UGLIEST comment I’ve heard today.
@Coco,
the world isn’t always pretty.
@Coco,
But it is 85% true.
When the one guy who wants to get to know you comes along, he won’t try to get in your pants right away. He will show sexual interest of course but that won’t be the be all, end all.
Thank Feminism.
Thank Grrrl Power for giving you all the right and power to do what you want.
Thank testosterone for all of it’s chemical goodness and it’s influence over sexual prowess and aggressiveness.
Thank easy women for flooding the market with readily available puss, thus making the premium of puss plummet.
Thank your God for making man a simple creature that is wired to procreate or simulate the act any chance he can get.
@CPT Callamity, “Thank easy women for flooding the market with readily available puss, thus making the premium of puss plummet.”
This is really the problem. Can’t you still recognize premium, no jump off puss when you are around it? Why should my value decrease because another woman doesn’t respect herself?
@Ivy St.,
cause thats how the market works… and we are in a recession so the price is steady droppin
@Deviant,
and the price drop causes the draws to drop
@eff yo couch,
damn this recession!
@Deviant,
People need something to make em ‘feel good.’ And while spending money won’t be available for a little while.
@ Ivy St.
Sure I can. But look at my analogy closer: it’s all bout supply and demand.
Men demand or want puss (consumer). Women (suppliers) have puss (product). When the supplier cannot meet demand, the cost of the product escalates, making it very sought after and hard to get (think Wii last year). However, as the supplier begins to meet the demands of the consumer, prices begin to plummet. Then you find yourself with a surplus once the consumer is able to easily get the product.
At least that what my limited business and economic skills tell me.
@ Ivy St:
Oh yeah. Nobody said you are less than. A dude will get some of the Equate stuff while he is waiting for you to give up that Proctor and Gamble.
@CPT Callamity, “Oh yeah. Nobody said you are less than. A dude will get some of the Equate stuff while he is waiting for you to give up that Proctor and Gamble.”
LoL
@IVR,
sad but true…and lots of time, they wont give up the equate even when they are claiming brand loyalty with that prctor and gamble.
@shatani,
Then he is not a quality dude and/or doesn’t like you very much.
@CPT Callamity, Things just aren’t going to go my way… do you NEED it THAT BAD?!?!?
@Ivy St.,
No, it’s not that we need it that bad. It’s actually easy to get without too much hassle if you have your ish together. I just think some women should recognize that they don’t have the monopoly on cooch supply or premium on puss.
I’m just speaking like a man though. Ignore the dude behind the curtain…
@CPT Callamity, “”Thank Grrrl Power for giving you all the right and power to do what you want.
Thank testosterone for all of it’s chemical goodness and it’s influence over sexual prowess and aggressiveness.
Thank easy women for flooding the market with readily available puss, thus making the premium of puss plummet.
Thank your God for making man a simple creature that is wired to procreate or simulate the act any chance he can get.”
EXACTLY! Why complicate things?
@CPT Callamity,
Thank feminism for what? For liberating women from thinking that all she could ever be in life was a man’s accessory? I’ll definitely thank feminism for that… and i disagree wholeheartedly that men are wired to procreate or simulate the act any chance he can get… there are lots of men who go for looong periods of time without s*x when they have to…so it’s not something they can’t do.
@pgh muse,
Men who go long periods of time without sex when they have to are considered married men.
@CPT Callamity,
Lol! Dam* shame…
@CPT Callamity,
LMAO…
that was funny.
I LOVE THIS TOPIC! Coincidentally, this same subject has come up between a very close friend and I.
Quickly her back story: They both share the same field, age, nationality, and have similar views on life. On their first official date he asked if she “believed in courting” (yes ladies, just came right out and asked her that!) and won major bonus points for his old fashioned sensibilities. Plus, the courting thing is something she is in to and that makes her feel special. Currently these two are at an impasse about another subject, but I think she should get over it and give this guy a chance (sorry for the plug but she reads this site) since he seems to be respectable and respectful of her views.
On the other hand, I have to wonder if courting is really necessary from jump if you honestly believe that there is nothing left to a relationship after sex? If you’re eventually going to give it up then what difference does it make if its three dates, a bunch of flowers, and a box of candy away?
It’s my personal MO to give it up when I feel like it, and not after we’ve done all of the things society tells me I should be “holding out” for. So far, its working for me. The guy I’m seeing and I got it popping QUICKLY and surprisingly we still find plenty of other things to do besides have sex. We have spent plenty of time literally just sitting on his bed and talking, still go on dates and don’t have sex afterwards, and I honestly think it’s because of the fact that I don’t view sex ass the end all be all in a relationship. It’s not a bargaining chip to be used at your discretion. I really think that view is what’s standing between a lot of women and their happiness.
@Dom, “I don’t view sex ass the end all be all in a relationship. It’s not a bargaining chip to be used at your discretion. I really think that view is what’s standing between a lot of women and their happiness.”
I have to agree with this Dom, I think you and I treat this very similarly
@Dom,
The guy I’m seeing and I got it popping QUICKLY and surprisingly we still find plenty of other things to do besides have sex
I agree with this.
@Dom,
If you’re eventually going to give it up then what difference does it make if its three dates, a bunch of flowers, and a box of candy away?
good question and sh*t
@Dom, “It’s my personal MO to give it up when I feel like it, and not after we’ve done all of the things society tells me I should be “holding out” for.” and “I honestly think it’s because of the fact that I don’t view sex ass the end all be all in a relationship. It’s not a bargaining chip to be used at your discretion. I really think that view is what’s standing between a lot of women and their happiness.”
I agree completely. I think many women are holding out b/c that’s what society has said a good woman is supposed to do. We are not supposed to engage in sex as often as men, and we definitely are not supposed to enjoy it, or even want it. In many instances, we define ourselves through sex, and we believe we are doing some great thing by “holding out”, basically denying ourselves.
And I don’t think courting ends just b/c you had sex with the guy you’re dating. Why should sex have such a negative connotation, when it could mark the beginning of something even deeper b/t you and a man. IDK, just a few of my thoughts.
@Dom, “It’s not a bargaining chip to be used at your discretion. ”
why aint it LOL???? everyday life is about bargaining and negotiations. Hopefully people dont take the first job offer, or money offer, or first sticker price car offer..there are negotiations..why should as a woman my vajayjay be any different.
Im a modern woman with some old school sensibilities…i just can’t believe that with the inventions of say an iphone or a microwave there no longer exists a natural order to relationship dynamics.
i got the same clitoris (ok not the EXACT same) my grandmama had when she was my age…now i don’t have the same life path..but on very basic levels we wanted/want alot of the same things.
@Princess Duvet, I wouldn’t necessarily call what you’re talking about bargaining…I think it’s more about being selective and being careful and being thoughtful/discerning.
I don’t think it should be a scenario where the woman thinks if he does this much for me over the course of this much time, then we can have sex. Personally, I think that devalues sex, and the role it can play in a healthy relationship. Instead, it should just be a natural progression of dating and feelings, and if that comes sooner (second date) rather than later (20th date), then so be it. It really depends on the man you are with, your motives, his motives, and your intuition about his motives.
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha…., “I wouldn’t necessarily call what you’re talking about bargaining…”
i understand what you’re saying..im big on language..and im also big on truth in language. I can’t call it being selective-discerning. I can’t tip toe around that mulberry bush LOL..it is bargaining..it is negotiation..it is the push…it is the pull…it is a little bit of power struggle. It is a little bit of boundary testing. Its a little walking the line. Stepping outside. reigning it in.
a woman thinks the clearest pre-sex..and a man post sex to paraphase granny-mama nem..why not use that to our advantage.
@Princess Duvet,
The problem is grammy-mama nem are talking from their personal experiences… and that sure doesn’t include every woman out there.
(Cf. Seinfeld episode where Elaine and Georges were both not having sex —> funny sh!t)
@Ms. Sula, “The problem is grammy-mama nem are talking from their personal experiences…”
agreed however…i have no intention on sewing aprons (particularly as it relates to granny)..but the same thing she did to get and keep her man..yeah..im real interested.
and find overlapping truths in my own life.
@Princess Duvet,
A couple things:
#1 I’m disturbed you refered to your grandmas lady parts LOL Ewww!
#2 Once you get into the idea that your “precious” (this term is too funny not to use) is worth XX amount of dates and XX amount of dollars spent, you’re selling yourself! To me, that aint but two steps away from prostitution.
When you start talking about negotiating with your crotch, all you’re trying to do is have the upper hand in a situation that requires a give and take from the TWO people involved.
@Dom, “#1 I’m disturbed you refered to your grandmas lady parts LOL Ewww!”
ok..i can call it what she called her’s and mine…my grandmama’s “pocketbook”…lol..i was thinking i was just being exact with the reference.
“When you start talking about negotiating with your crotch, all you’re trying to do is have the upper hand in a situation that requires a give and take from the TWO people involved”
i agree..but then i don’t..(btw..i don’t like “crotch” in this discussion LOL)..im just trying to keep it real. We all use something as leverage. Men may not use their pen!is’ sometimes its their money other times its their time. Sadly it could be their affection. And more depressinginly it could even be their love.
im disturbed that people don’t know this. Even those with the best intentions use SOMETHING to get what they want. i suppose the best push and pull has a common destination in mind.
@Princess Duvet,
I totally understand what you’re saying. Everyone uses what they got to get what they want. I just dont think its right for women to put a price on sex with just because they can. Thats the same antiquated philosophy that has men thinking that XXX amount of dates = automatic booty. We dont want men to devalue us but at the same time we’re devaluing ourselves by using it as a negotiation tool.
Im sure we all know that you could put a million dates on it, but if the man still wants to up and leave after the deed is done, can’t nothing stop him from bouncing.
@Dom, “I totally understand what you’re saying. Everyone uses what they got to get what they want. I just dont think its right for women to put a price on sex with just because they can.”
you would have hated this women’s studies class i had once where the professor arugued and supported it with text (cant think of it off the dome)…that marriage is a form of prostitution, a mere sex!ual exchange.
almost 12 years later im still pondering that LOL.
@Princess Duvet,
I probably wouldnt have. I really like hearing different perspectives, and I feel like I grow from hearing what other people have to say.
Plus, I was an English major so I know any person with half a brain cell can write a book. Just cuz you prof. had documentation doesnt make her theory right.
@Princess Duvet,
I do believe marriage actually is. The highest form for that matters. And the woman is still getting the short end of the stick.
@Dom,
“If you’re eventually going to give it up then what difference does it make if its three dates, a bunch of flowers, and a box of candy away?”
It shouldn’t matter but it does because men seem to view women based on their sexual practices. I think even if you have given him the “you can get it nod” you still have to make sure. There are other things to consider like if you actually like the guy. If he dances like the Champ does… keep it movin!
@Dom, “If you’re eventually going to give it up then what difference does it make if its three dates, a bunch of flowers, and a box of candy away?. . . . The guy I’m seeing and I got it popping QUICKLY and surprisingly we still find plenty of other things to do besides have sex.”
That is just it, that is exciting to me. The thrill of the chase/keep. If women were like men this would be one big @ss boring world of pissing contests and arm wrestling matches . . . Although I can’t deny my ultimate goal is to get it, dealing with female idiosyncrasies is a beautiful thing (as long as she isn’t crazy) because it provides a glimpse into something I can never be. If the whole courting up until sex deal could be looked at as a sexual encounter (from my point of view because apparently some of my VSBs think I ruin it for them). . . .the courting would be the sex and the sex would be the org@sm. A relationship, to me, is this repeated. You don’t always have to org@sm for the sex to feel good (at least I don’t anyway). I hope someone understands that mess I just wrote . . . lol
@IVR,
if this comment was a dream…id being doing really naughty things in it.
i totally agree here….
It’s too much shtuff floating around out there, to not make a brother wait. We can get busy once all your test results come back….. if the prognosis is good! You healthy hunk you!
@Mme. Editor-in-Chief, “We can get busy once all your test results come back….. if the prognosis is good! ”
LOL!
More seriously, should a couple get tested before they have unprotected sex? Let’s say they’ve been together for an “extended” period of time.
@Ivy St.,
Yes!
@Mme. Editor-in-Chief, Is this one of those things that you should do but just don’t (theory vs practice). Do most people get tested? I get tested once a year. I went to my doctor the last time and requested a test. It was like pulling teeth. She couldn’t understand why I was requesting one if I didn’t have a real reason besides it’s just the right thing for an active young woman to do. I don’t think people get tested. The test is, “well it hasn’t fallen off or shown any signs of a rash…”
@Ivy St.,
YES! And even after you get tested you’re still gambling with your life.
@Ivy St.,
Why YES!!! And then every six months afterward.
MANDATORY! HIV KILLS. THE END.
I swear I love my sistern, but there are days and blog posts that make me hate that by the mere virtue of my ovaries, I am associated with chick logic. Women over-analyze the shyt out of everything. We want rules for every aspect of our lives instead of simply living by a few basic principles. Having principles is what guides character and cancels out pesky azz personality crap (which is what rules cater to, for the benefit of how others see you). I have one rule: “Don’t do stupid shyt”. Keeps me from over using my estrogen because I just don’t have that much left @ this point.
@PBG, “Don’t do stupid shyt”
I would definitely wear a t-shirt that said this….
@PBG
I totally agree that women can over-analyze shyt. I refuse to live by so-called rules. I do what I feel comfortable with and that’s it. I don’t need anyone to agree/disagree with my choices. I do them because I want to and I’m okay with the decision I made.
F*ck rules! They’re for the birds.
LOL I feel like I know exactly which two very smart sistas had this conversation. It is certainly something I discuss with my girls at least once a damn week.
As a 25 year old, I’ve finally come to terms with the fact that for most men, relationships are not the initial draw to a woman. I used to live in a pink pastel world in which I thought sex wasn’t the goal, but I’ve woken up now. I know that every man that approches me, is doing so for the end goal of sex, and that’s fine, just so happens that my end goal is completely different. Sometimes it leaves me single for LOOOOOONG periods of time. Its cool, I’ll wait it out.
Courting is not dead, but it is on life support. And I’m
notsorry to say this, but women are responsible for putting it on its last legs. If women weren’t so damn easy, courting WOULD be just like it was in the olden days…when it wasn’t at all unusual for a woman to wait until marriage to give up the good stuff. Now, I am certainly not suggesting that, lol…but having some sort of LOVE for yourself and your body and not sharing it with every ninja that offered you a crotch thrust and a popeye’s dinner…would significantly improve things. Thanks.If I were a man, and I knew all I had to do was buy you a drink and tell you I liked your smile to get some, that’s all I’d do too.
*shrug*
@8th Wonder,
“the olden days…when it wasn’t at all unusual for a woman to wait until marriage to give up the good stuff”
My cuz that just got married last month did that. They both decided to wait.
Total courtship time including marriage– one year, one month.
It’s not impossible, it can happen it’s just fewer and far between these days.
She’s given us all new hope though…lol
@miss t-lee,
For various reasons some people think that method is just antiquated. It doesnt work for everyone. I know I’m not goin a year and some change without any a$$. There is no comprehendable reason to do so.
@Deviant,
I know it doesn’t work for everyone.
I think we all know that…lol
That’s why I gave him the side-eye when I first met him, but then I realized he was for real.
@Deviant,
So D, if you’re really feeling a girl and and she makes you wait – but y’all are spending good time together and you’re pretty sure she isn’t just knocking back a FB while you’re taking her out – how long would you wait for her?
@Lil’T,
I dont know..can’t say cause the only time I have even been in that position was high school and that was before I knew better. No girl has ever put an arbitrary timeleine on me. Then again maybe I just aint stick around long enough to find out.
@miss t-lee,
I give a standing ovation to your cousin…good for her. AND good for him too.
Perhaps I am old-fashioned, but I too, am waiting for marriage to have sex…so yes, I’m a virgin. BUT I’m a bible-believing Christian and I think it’s pretty clear on what God thinks about pre-marital sex. Anyhoo, I’m not here to preach, I’m just sayin. I’m willing to wait…and I’m willing to wait for the man that willing to wait with me. And I’ve met some great ones…so they do exist.
@Coco,
You’re innocence betrays you. I see why your perspective seems so green… it is.
Where are these great ones now? I only ask because you say met which implies that for one reason or another you’ve parted ways.
Waiting when you’re already a virgin ain’t really all that hard. That’s like dieting when you’re already anorexic.
@Deviant, Thanks for the support. (Sarcastically said.) I just because I’m innocent (in that department anyway) doesn’t mean I can’t have a platform to say anything…
@Coco,
I’m not suggesting its a bad thing or that your opinion isn’t welcome.
I am saying, however, that your perspective is one of ideals and not necessarily experience.
@Coco,
Congrats to you Coco. Hang in there, cause I know it’s hard.
@miss t-lee, Thanks for you support (genuinely said). heehee…
@Coco, “Perhaps I am old-fashioned, but I too, am waiting for marriage to have sex…so yes, I’m a virgin. BUT I’m a bible-believing Christian and I think it’s pretty clear on what God thinks about pre-marital sex. Anyhoo, I’m not here to preach, I’m just sayin. I’m willing to wait…and I’m willing to wait for the man that willing to wait with me. And I’ve met some great ones…so they do exist.”
my duvet and bible are deeply conflicted LOL..along with my ummm drive and err aaa…peak im in right now..but i applaud your efforts and your resolve to wait.
@miss t-lee,
My cousin getting married in July is too. She’s 30 and a virgin. Her fiance is waiting with her. They have their faith to sustain. It works for them. And I am really appreciative of their loves.
The problem is, it’s really not suited for everybody. I know damn well, that I am a highly sensual being. And I will not be a happy person if I am chexually frustrated inside my marriage. I need to know beforehand. Now (as religion often requires), if I had no idea what I was or what it felt like i.e. if I was a virgin, I could have maybe tried it out. But I am not. I know that bad s3xed me is extremely miserable.
I am not trying to risk that for the rest of my life.
Yes, you’ll hear “Why buy the cow if you can get the milk for free?” My answer? ” I need to know what that milk tastes like before investing in a whole cow!” If it was just a bottle, it would be fine if it’s spoiled. But the only milk I’ll be drinking for the rest of my life? Yeah, Imma need more info.
Then again, different strokes for different folks.
@Ms. Sula,
I agree. It’s definitely not for everyone. I didn’t wait for marriage, and even after being celibate for almost a year, I still don’t think I could wait until I’m married. But, again…you truly never know in life…lol
I applaud anyone who is able to do so, and if you’re able to find a man who would do that with you, that’s truly a special thing.
Congrats to your cousin. She hung in there and for that I have to give her props.
@8th Wonder,
If I were a man, and I knew all I had to do was buy you a drink and tell you I liked your smile to get some, that’s all I’d do too.
*shrug*
You are absolutely right. It’s like a lot of guys don’t put forth an effort because 9 out of the 10 females they recently met, they didn’t have to. So, it’s like meet you and all of sudden, they’re shocked because you want to get to know them and have conversations and ish…
@Tay,
then they realize they aint got shyt to say! lmao
@8th Wonder, “I am certainly not suggesting that, lol…but having some sort of LOVE for yourself and your body and not sharing it with every ninja that offered you a crotch thrust and a popeye’s dinner…would significantly improve things. Thanks.
”
gospel.
Since, I’m in college (I graduate on Monday… WOOT WOOT), I think about this a lot.
You meet something
You go out on dates
They come over and hang out
At what point do you decide to have sex with said person. Me, I believe in waiting. Not because I want to be in control or anything like that but because I’m not into having sex with randoms and I’d like to be comfortable with said person, get to know him, etc… before I do anything.
Besides, I think it’s a good way to weed out all the guys that just want some as opposed to the guys that are actually interested in something other than whats b/w the thighs…
@Tay,
“You meet something”
This has endless potential. Way to be openminded.
@Tay,
Since, I’m in college (I graduate on Monday… WOOT WOOT), I think about this a lot.
congrats and sh*t. now, prepare to be underemployed for the next ten years of your life
“Besides, I think it’s a good way to weed out all the guys that just want some as opposed to the guys that are actually interested in something other than whats b/w the thighs…”
@Tay,
Not to shyt on your method of weeding out the good men but I hope you know some of the ninjas interested only in what’s in between your thighs will actually wait it out with you. Some ninjas will want the pu$$y so bad that they will wait months to hit. I know because I was once like this. Of course I had JO’s on the side to hold me down . . .
I’m just sayin
@eff yo couch,
I am laughing at your post…that’s terrible…terrible I say!!!!
If you expect to be courted, you will attract men who court and you will be courted. Also, a lot of times men try to hit for the sake of trying. They don’t really expect you to agree.
@Hostess, “Also, a lot of times men try to hit for the sake of trying. They don’t really expect you to agree.
”
this is one of about 5 things i know for sure in this life.
@Princess Duvet,
same here! having close male friends has taught me many a lesson and that is one of them. they try because theyre supposed to. and we are supposed decline….well, until that day! lol
@shatani, i deeply believe this…now there are some excpetions but i think most men are rooting for you to say no..men like boundaries…because with most once you give it up at his random whim, there always wondering, well who the hel#l elese she do like this.
@Princess Duvet,
“men like boundaries”
like children! it makes them feel safe…lol
@Hostess,
I agree on the you attract what you give off. The Universe doesn’t have it messed up. It (almost) always is true.
Big believer over here.
When I think about the topic of courting, FBs, slip-ups, and whatnot, I can’t help but to think of what Andre 3000 said in a skit on The Love Below:
girl: “He gon’ think I’m a hoe…F*ck that I liked it
I was drunk and it was my birthday anyway…
Maybe I should just lay here and let him touch my booty
Mmmm.. but he don’t even know my name…”
3000: “I know she think I just think she some kind of hoe
I don’t give a sh!t about givin it up on the first night
That just let me know she know what she want out of life…”
Truth is, you win some, you lose some. As women (well one with any type of sense and fear of catchin that “die slow”) will naturally take the option of waiting to give up the yoni…it just makes us feel better about the whole situation. We want it just as much as yall do, but we’ve been conditioned (and rightfully so) to think that what we have is super precious (and it is!). You wouldn’t let someone you just met borrow your brand new laptop…they might break it, put a virus on it (oh no!) or even steal it. Same thing with the yoni…you have to be careful with whom you trust your most prized possession. And how do you do that?
COURTING….or something that at least resembles courting.
)
Don’t get it too twisted, I’m not saying that a ninja has to break the bank on you simply to get in them Secrets, but to get to know someone and their true character takes time…some serious conversations…and you might wanna meet their buddies b/c birds of a feather flock together.
At the same time, some ninjas are slick…they’ll play the game with you…wait it out…but in all honestly, they know if they want to pursue a relationship with you or not/respect you or not…yoni or no yoni probably won’t change that too much…unless it stinks or is just bad…but then that’s a whole ‘notha story.
@This Just In,
Truth is, you win some, you lose some.
this is it, in a nutshell. some sh*t works, some sh*t doesn’t. some people like some stuff, some people like other stuff.
@This Just In,
“the yoni…”
you must be a student of Tantra and Kama….
IMO, the root of this is how both side see each other. If you meet some girl and both of you are on some ole physical stuff then everything is good. Successful jumpoff achieved. The problem comes around because often we’re not upfront with our feelings and one side feels stronger than the other.
When I ask my man friends/family what kind of “waiting period” they’ll accept for a girl they really want to be with I get a different answer from each one. And most of them say it doesn’t matter at all.
At least, that’s what they SAY.
But their actions are a different story. What I’ve noticed is that they really do enjoy the chase, and if there isn’t one they keep movin’ till they find one. And I’ve seen this from friends/fam and guys I’ve been involved with.
Getting your freak on can be fun – for awhile. But it only takes a few times not realizing you were a jumpoff and getting played to re-assess your “wait game”. Been there, done that.
And the funny (not) part about it is this: many women will give up the cookies early ONLY if they know they don’t want the man for a relationship. If I meet a guy and I want to get to know him better I’ll wait longer than if he has “FB” written on his fo-head. It may change later, but that’s my initial thought. Kinda flucked up – but there it is.
@Lil’T,
i feel you on that last paragraph…i guess this would qualify as chick logic? but there have been a couple of guys that i really truly liked as people and wanted to wait to be sexual because of that…and then there were guys that i knew i couldnt be in a relationship with for various reasons, but they were still hot and well….
now my guy friend gave me that whole, “see women dont want a nice guy” talk after hearing about that. my thing is…i want a nice guy, certainly…i jsut dont want a nice guy for my jumpoff, i want a nice guy to grow old with.
@shatani,
ahhh, the infamous “chick logic”. I think this definitely counts – I have no idea why it makes sense, but it does! And yes, we do still want “nice guys”…why can’t some men realize they’re the male equivalent of Supa Head – toss away booty…
@Lil’T,
“why can’t some men realize they’re the male equivalent of Supa Head – toss away booty…”
Those guys dont have any problem with knowing their role. The issue lies with the nice guys. Who wants to be the dinner date when someone else is the phucbuddy? That ish is for the birds.
@shatani, yet life is not so simple…I know plenty of nice guys who were sluts point blank period. They wore nice suits, spoke proper, some in church, IT, or in business mgmt and yet they were DOGS the one thing they were was honest. But when you are 25 yr old black dude making around 45k you can tell a young black women, “I am screwing other chicks” (hell men making NO money say this and some of yall get with em regardless) and half yall up here given those “stats are gonna mess with him anyway (and if he HAS any good looks about him hell to yea!!!).
Not sure what about a nice guy means he aint a jump off, shit I know I took advantage of that in my first few yrs of college…”let me tell you about my only vice, its gots to do with lots of loving and it aint nothing nice…”
i can most certainly say that ive had this conversation many times! its sad, the state of male/female relations these days…
some men dont even think they need to buy you a meal to get some…they feel that just showing an interest in you means that you should give them some @ss. and its our fault, really…
some women have been allowing things to go on that they absolutely should not and thus giving men the impression that these things are alright to try with every woman. and thats really all it is…a try. as many have said, if a man youre seeing isnt sexually attracted to you, then thats your friend…most likely, your gay friend. you should be sexually attracted to each other…i think the problem is the entitlement of some men. like, ive put in my time, now turn loose summadatass!
i can understand that mentality, certainly…and there are women out there so deathly afraid of dying alone that they will do it, just to keep him around, just so they can say they have a man. its sad…
IMO, there needs to be more than a sexual attraction for there to be any semblance of a workable relationship. and women need to stop settling for bullshyt in the hopes that this man will magically morph into the man of their dreams.
if he wants to sex and you dont, dont. its really that simple. and if he disappears after that, then good riddance. any man that cant wait for me to be comfortable/ready to give up the goods, is not qualified to partake.
i understand men have their time tables as well (i was once told if im not giving it up within 3 weeks, then the dude is gonna be gone or gettin it someplace else) and i respect that….if im not everything you need, then please go on bout ya business.
@shatani,
This:
i can understand that mentality, certainly…and there are women out there so deathly afraid of dying alone that they will do it, just to keep him around, just so they can say they have a man. its sad…
and this:
women need to stop settling for bullshyt in the hopes that this man will magically morph into the man of their dreams.
is the heart of the problem, methinks. That “ho into a housewife” mentality runs both ways.
Interesting post Champ!
I’m so torn on this. I think that courtship is alive and well as a female if you allow yourself to be courted. I will agree with 8th Wonder when she says that women have to have enough love for themselves to show some restraint and better selection in the people you allow in your temple (the body). But sometimes a sista just wants to get her freak on too… sooo… idk . What i will say in regards to dating is that I truly believe that relationships are beautiful and wonderful and all that but when a person goes out on a date – that is all they’ve signed up for, a date. A date doesn’t mean p on lay-a-way (and I wonder if this is mostly women’s perceptions playing tricks with them bcuz i have never felt like I was being pressured to give up sum p at the end of a date… now me wanting to do it is something else… but that makes me go hmmmm….) but i digress, dating in this age is challenging because it seems that nobody wants to bend and nobody wants to lose. But loving is a part of life and losing is a part of life too… i said that to say to women, if you meet a man that you genuninely care about and want to hump him – waiting 10 months isn’t going to guarantee a ring on your finger. If you aren’t a h*e then he’ll know cuz you won’t act like one. But also to women I say DO YOU! Too many girls and grown women get caught up in sacrificing themselves and their standards to please a man or other people. If you don’t stand for something you’ll fall for anything… sex is such a small part of life but people big it up to be everything. It’s not. Dating and courting is supposed to be fun…
“What i will say in regards to dating is that I truly believe that relationships are beautiful and wonderful and all that but when a person goes out on a date – that is all they’ve signed up for, a date. A date doesn’t mean p on lay-a-way”
@pgh muse, Amen to that…I completely agree. And that’s what gets me about this post…men thinking that a date qualifies them for sex. Sex is hardly equivalent to dinner and a movie. How absurd is that??
But sex in a committed, loving, firmly founded relationship is different. If we go out AND I have a great time AND I like you, etc…then sex would be the natural progression and I will WANT to as opposed to feeling like I OWE you.
It’s disturbing to me that sex nowadays has a price tag. And it disturbs me that I’m being compartmentalized into “I eventually want to bone you” when a guy asks me out.
I think there are men out there that still date, still have fun, still approach women for the sheer reason of getting to know them without strings attached. Do they think about sex? Most likely (as men will always be men)…but I don’t think all men are expecting me to give it up just because they took me out.
I’d like to think that not all men are THAT shallow.
@Coco, It’s disturbing to me that sex nowadays has a price tag. And it disturbs me that I’m being compartmentalized into “I eventually want to bone you” when a guy asks me out.
I agree. However, I think it is us women who put a price tag on it in the first place, thus leading to a continued devaluation of sex ( and ourselves) within and outside the confines of a relationship.
“I think there are men out there that still date, still have fun, still approach women for the sheer reason of getting to know them without strings attached. Do they think about sex? Most likely (as men will always be men)…but I don’t think all men are expecting me to give it up just because they took me out.”
Re: the first sentence, I think that is most men. I don’t think most men are expecting you to give it up just b/c they took you out. I think a lot of women think all men think that way, and then act accordingly…which sometimes means acting foolishly.
@Coco, “And that’s what gets me about this post…men thinking that a date qualifies them for sex. Sex is hardly equivalent to dinner and a movie. How absurd is that??”
Maybe I haven’t read through all the posts but I haven’t read a dude co-sign on this “I took you out so now you must screw me” business.
@pgh muse,
and I wonder if this is mostly women’s perceptions playing tricks with them bcuz i have never felt like I was being pressured to give up sum p at the end of a date… now me wanting to do it is something else… but that makes me go hmmmm….)
Exactly. Where does this happen? This pressure to have s3x after the first date?
I have spent whole week-ends at a new guy’s house. But because he knew I was on a chexual hiatus, he didn’t make any (obvious) moves. We were sleeping in the same bed, lovingly cuddling in the couch, cooking, etc… etc… without any pressure. And that’s just one story out of many.
I think when a woman know who she is and what she wants and more importantly WHY she wants it, then the rest just falls into place. If someone is to be a FB then they will be, if not then they will not.
Like PBG said, just “Dont do stupid shyt!” and you should be fine.
@Ms. Sula,
co-sign 1550%
How much of this has to do with age and maturity? I see a lot of comments from both men and women here who say that is is women who have lowered the standards and made room for trifling behavior from men – and now men don’t know how to act or court a woman. Even if they do know they don’t have to.
I can agree kinda – but really? One of the things we have that previous generations didn’t is time. Time between high school graduation and your 40′s to learn, figure yourself out, make stupid mistakes and still clean your act up and settle down in time to make mature relationship decisions. In my mother’s generation you were an old maid if you weren’t married with kids by 25. If a man didn’t go to college he was employed with a wife and kids by 25. How many of us would be ready for that kind of commitment at that age? Not.me. I was still playin’ around. It’s like we get an extra decade of foolishness that our parents didn’t have. Proper courting just ain’t gone happen if you’re comparing today’s version to what your folks did.
@Lil’T,
i agree… i honestly believe that people have to be ready for a committed relationship so with 30 being the new 20 (lol) maybe that’s why things seem so out of wack. But the couples who have gotten married later and taken the time to actually get to know each other… aren’t they happier?
@pgh muse,
I think they’re happier. Get the growing pains over with before you link your life to someone forever.
@pgh muse,
And they tend to stay longer in said marriages. They don’t do the whole “starter” marriage thing.
@Lil’T,
great perspective. it’s different for our generation. this was a real a** comment.
“it’s like once you have sex, what else is there??
“cuz the default thing to do when together is f*ck often times ruining the chance to do other sh*t like go on dates and just chill and talk and get to know each other.”
And who decided that sex is the beginning of the end of all of these things. How does sex ruin the chance to date, chill, talk, and get to know each other? I really think women assign such a negative connotation to sex, that we don’t think of it as a healthy part of a relationship, even in the beginnings of the relationship. instead we consider it to be something set apart from all of the things we are told we are supposed to want or things we should demand from a man we’re dating, all of the dating, talking, chilling, and getting to know each other. The truth is, if you are dating a man, chances are you want to have sex with each other…the only difference is he is being honest, and you are in denial.
Do people really believe that women do not want to have sex just as much as men? I mean, sometimes, I’m ready to go after the 2nd date, sometimes after the first if I’m that into him. but that’s just me. I’m sure all other women are good girls who held out…probably still single but at least you have your virtue to keep you warm at night….
^^^ This is the best comment of the day, I just have to disagree with you on one point. Not all females that have a man are warm at night, especially not my girl, because I usually snatch the covers from her during the middle of the night, thus leaving her cold. lol
@eff yo couch,
LMAO!! Thanks a lot….and yes, that is one way for a woman not to be warm at night…but then you can roll over and warm her up.
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….,
“I really think women assign such a negative connotation to sex, that we don’t think of it as a healthy part of a relationship, even in the beginnings of the relationship.”
That’s what I get from a lot of women. Again, us men are wired a little different and we haven’t changed much in all of our years on this planet. When a lot of potentials speak of sex, you can almost hear the “ewwwwl” under their voice, or you have to pause while they gazingly picture making love on a sea of pink clouds with a cherub playing a lute in the background.
I know one thing’s for certain: I’ve waited with a few of my women folk and just hoped that the holding out would make for a more exciting bang-up session…I was rather disappointed. I rather have been disappointed from the jump instead of driving a car scheduled for recall.
@CPT Callamity,
I’m starting to think women with bad “goods” held a secret meeting and decided to jumped on this “waiting” bandwagon, just to distract men from there not so pleasant goodies. I guess they think that there stuff will be better if they have us waiting like a little kid for x-mas morning.
I also thought Camron was a pretty good rapper at one point so what do I know?
@eff yo couch,
Camron? You ain’t right, man. But your theory is humorous. What if the “holding out” chick is also “holding back?” I for one don’t bring my absolute “A” game to the table my first time with someone – there’s almost nowhere to go after that, and I want my man saying, “Dang, did we really DO that?” years after meeting me, not just days.
@CPT Callamity,
“I know one thing’s for certain: I’ve waited with a few of my women folk and just hoped that the holding out would make for a more exciting bang-up session…I was rather disappointed.”
That sucks that you were disappointed. I thought waiting (not that it takes that long) kinda helps you feel more comfortable giving each other directions which should make it better. Well I guess you could replace waiting with 3 rum n cokes.
@shhwhisper,
“That sucks that you were disappointed. I thought waiting (not that it takes that long) kinda helps you feel more comfortable giving each other directions which should make it better. Well I guess you could replace waiting with 3 rum n cokes.”
I’ve just learned to read a woman’s sexual energy a little better before even thinking about it. Some ooze and drip sensuality, while some make me want to go home to a good book.
@CPT Callamity,
Not a good book! Ha ha ha ha! Hilarious!
@CPT Callamity, I’ve just learned to read a woman’s sexual energy a little better before even thinking about it.
Reading is fundamental!!
@CPT Callamity, yea, you can make me wait all year but when it goes down ITS STILL a one night stand/ booty call/jump off/ hook up………..
““it’s like once you have sex, what else is there??”
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….,
We’ve been running into this quesion all day, so I guess I’ll be the one to answer it. After sex what is there . . .More sex!!! duh
@eff yo couch,
After sex what is there . . .More sex!!! duh
*sniggling*
Niiiice.
@eff yo couch,
LOl!! I was quoting the question posed in the topic up top. Personally, I think there are all kinds of great things to do after sex, including, but not limited to, more sex
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….,
not to suggest that I’m not a virtuous woman….
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….,
This is my point exactly. Lol. Kinda like that skit off the first Kanye West CD about degrees. I may be homeless and live in a box but you know what keeps me warm at night? That’s right! My degrees!”
@Dom, LMAO!! I was thinking the same thing when I wrote it. Great minds and shit….
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….,
**sprinkles a mix of Diva Dust, PBG homemade glitter, SouthernGirl golden stars, 3 baby pandas and a litter of baby unicorns on NIA’s head**
In case you didn’t notice, I concur.
@Ms. Sula,
**collecting dust, glitter, stars, abby pandas and baby unicorns, and taking them home after work**
Thanks a lot…
@Ms. Sula,
*de lurks*
As much as I love showering sparkly goodness all over errythag, y’all are getting mad liberal with the Sparkle Sistas’ supplies… that stuff ain’t cheap! We in a recession.
Just wanted to note that.
Carry on (but sparingly, please.)
**re-ups lurking device**
@blackberry molasses, “y’all are getting mad liberal with the Sparkle Sistas’ supplies… that stuff ain’t cheap! We in a recession.”
I’m sayin…i’m still recovering from yesterday…lol.
“I mean, sometimes, I’m ready to go after the 2nd date, sometimes after the first if I’m that into him. but that’s just me. I’m sure all other women are good girls who held out…probably still single but at least you have your virtue to keep you warm at night….”
Hmm, I don’t think anyone is saying that women don’t have the same very real sexual urges that men do…but just because you wanted to have sex with him the moment you met him does not mean you have to.
I don’t knock folks for what they do, but I definitely see a trend in the lives of myself (someone who likes to wait) and other women(who chose to be more impulsive) I know, and it has solidified my belief in the importance of waiting before you jump into a sexual encounter with somone.
There are just as many women holding on to thier “Damn, I thought he’d still respect me afterward” blankets at night as there are women being lulled to sleep with their virtue, please believe it.
@8th Wonder, There are just as many women holding on to thier “Damn, I thought he’d still respect me afterward” blankets at night as there are women being lulled to sleep with their virtue, please believe it.
Personally, I think these women are smoking from the same pipe.
And I agree, I do not have to give in to those urges, but even if I do, it does not mean I or any other woman is opening herself up to anymore BS than a woman who is holding out, using sex as a bargaining tool, and still ends up feeling disrespected. In the end, women have realize what we want out of the situation, and be wise enough to ask a man what he wants. Perhaps this all boils down to communication…being honest with yourself and the one you’re with
“Perhaps this all boils down to communication…being honest with yourself and the one you’re with”
I totally agree. If more people did this, instead of trying to force comittment by witholding sex, or trying to gain comittment by having sex immediately, the whole convo would be null and void.
@8th Wonder,
Amen!!
@8th Wonder,
amen amen!
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….,
@N.I.A. isonebadmutha….
I totally concur!! People should do what they’re comfortable with. You have to tune out other people’s voices and listen to your own. At the end of the day, it all depends on how YOU feel, and NOT anyone else.
@8th Wonder, I honestly cant believe a woman is thinking I will lose respect for her after the sex…maybe I had no repsect for from “hello”.
If you want to wait fine, if not fine. BOTH have pro and cons, both bring pain and fun and yes both can be used as a quick fix…the one thing they dont do is ASSURE you of anything..the only thing we know for sure in life is DEATH. When dealing with people waiting or being implusive doesnt garuntee a damn thing. I use to feel good about not having been with tons of women but that shit is weak when you not only want her company but she wants you to rock her boat and you (me) have doubts since you arent gettin any like you use to…and no one wants to hear “well its been a long time” man if you are not about to spit the rest of Rakims verse after that just put the clothes on go home and masturbate!!!
So me I’m an engineer by trade, job yadda yadda yadda. I am also into pageantry. I know good n well that I am the one that creates designs angels and authors my home life. & there are lots of tests to run to be sure I want some woman parading about my home n life.
Now grant it, this man machine loves to operate w/ a lighter sac vs a heavier one. And the idea of new right quick punnany can be appealing but does not a happy Wu make long run speaking (my Mama taught me n my siblings delayed gratification early). It has it’s appeals though; I can trick my mind into thinking that there is some magic behind the two of us meeting and we were born for this moment together, born for it and shall continue it for as long as we shall live. And if I am still feeling the ‘magic’ and want to be distracted from this ‘end’ with getting to know yous, working, worshiping, and stuff together after we’re done then it wasn’t a mistake.
I think that it is more fun to see someone’s stage presence bravado if you will. How well can you convince me that we wouldn’t rather be doing it right now? Sometimes it’s a good show. But when it bombs so be it.
@WuDaMan,
I acutally understood this. LOL
Kudos to you sir.
@miss t-lee,
i know! i was shocked!!
i think some men dont be worried about that long-term ish sometimes…
@WuDaMan,
yeap, having a lighter sac makes me and everyone else around me more happy
*getting smoke in my eye*
I sure do miss my grandaddy’s bbq n my great uncle’s pulled pork sandwiches. That dude (great ucle) had some sauce that would induce slapping of mothers. And my grandaddy knew the value of a phenominal marinade and seasoning of tools mesonplus.
@WuDaMan, LMAO!
all the answers can be found in a book (take a look)
or at least on a bookshelf, see here:
http://failblog.org/2008/11/21/bookstore-sorting-fail/
i had to, it was irresistable.
(and girls that say the above on a first date get no respect.)
@kaliber,
lol…this was funny
You know maybe dudes that only want to faulk are too into you? Eating drinking talking movie watching nothing compares to gettin it N/U. So why you mad? Yall is gettin yall cookies after the food is done. What’s the problem? There is no I want to talk drive in your brain so why bother? You know what drive is in your brain? Cecks!
@WuDaMan,
There is no I want to talk drive in your brain so why bother? You know what drive is in your brain? Cecks!
i dont know if i should be happy or sad that i understood this completely…and agree
i haven’t had a chance to read ALL the many comments, but i will say a big THANK YOU to all the very smart brothas contributing to this post, since many of you don’t always comment as much.
for me, i’m not on here looking for advice, how to act, what to do and when to do it. becuz ultimately i have made up in my mind how i handle my courtships and relationships, and i’m very happy with the standards i’ve made for myself and how i break it down to the men with whom i deal. but i’m always curious how other ppl (esp men) go about these situations and the thought process involved. becuz in order to grow and effectively communicate with others, you have to have a basic understanding of where other ppl are coming from and what experiences have driven them to that point.
i’m not satisfied with the “men are simple”, “men’s driving force is sex”, “women control the relationship” arguments becuz though our individual selves may be very true to form, the dynamics sometimes shift when we interact with one another. becuz at the end of the day, relationships aren’t just about peens and vadges. it’s important to integrate all our thoughts, values, and instintive behaviors in such a way to have a deeper understanding of the complexities of our relationships.
if the interactions between men and women were so basic and fundamental, VSB.com would not exist and we’d all have other ways of spending our time.
@Gem of the Ocean,
your welcome and sh*t
Fellas, in chapter 2 of the player manual, it trots out exactly what you can do to combat a female who wants to ‘wait’ or “be courted”. To sum up the entire chapter in one word, “rotation”.
Let’s move forward to chapter 8, “When She Courts You”
Option 1
We know that the 27-30 stretch, some of her friends have found good men and are now married, and possibly have a kid or 2. Now the pressure is on to find her one. Her biological clock is ticking, but her social clock is worse.
She can’t even relate to all of her girlfriends and sorors. She’s lost many of her friends to domestic bliss. (well that’s what it is in her mind. If her friends were truly honest, they’d fill her in on a lot of the regular/mundane horrors of marriage.)
She now is in the unenviable position of having to find new chicks to kick it with. A man can not imagine the horror that a woman goes through in trying to replace her crew.
No more girls night out where they play how many free drinks can they score. No more trips to the all star game to get wined and dined and then her back blown out by some anonymous cat.
The game shifts in your favor. She’s older (minus for her), you’re richer and more experienced (plusses for you).
Maybe If she wasn’t so cute @ 25, maybe she’d have a man @ 31. I digress.
Before long you will find yourself @ someone’s pot luck dinner party, whilst some ever-ready chick is trying to pass off her cornbread as real, when you can see the empty Jif box in the trash.
“oh you have a master’s degree in public health…good for you”
*checks watch dismissively*
^^This is the easy game reversal, letting time take its toll. The insecurity of never finding the right one, the idiocy of “not giving it up until date 3″ that gets pushed to the side. Does she really want her days to be filled with cats, the game show network, and church? No. And the fact that she has a fairy tale idea of marriage, only bodes well in your favor.
But what real player is going to want a woman out of her prime?
Option 2
During that 18-26 sweet spot, the world is her oyster. You don’t want to go too young, cause ain’ t no way Chris Brown is getting play in your ride.
But how do you deal with a chick using the mere promise of her va-jay-jay to manipulate you into spending time, energy, and money so that *she* can evaluate you?
You must make it clear to her (without saying so), that you’re evaluating her.
These fees crave novelty and challenge.
She wants to conquer you. As soon as she knows that she really can have you do stuff for her @ drop of a hat, the second you become a door mat – she loses interest. That is the mindset of a young woman. Even a few older women think that. The smart ones value a partner who’s willing to go to the ends of the world for her.
Real talk, if doing good deeds for women were in anyway attractive to a woman, boy scouts would be swimming in p.
When she gets old, 27, she knows that she is being evaluated. (assuming she’s dealing with a man of quality, and sometimes the fees will relent and just date a guy @ a help desk, reformed thug, or aspiring rapper who’s going nowhere)
But prior to that, the idea that she’s not Jah’s gift to the world – that’s totally new to her – but she’s “up for the challenge”.
What you want to set up is not a slam dunk for her, nor an epic fail, but the near miss.
- it has to be a “neutral challenge”
- You set up the challenge, rigged of course.
- she recognizes the difficulty, but she has plenty of chutzpah and moxie.
- when she fails, just barely, you have to show her that a little piece of you has just died.
This is of course all non-verbal, and may be harder to telegraph to the chicks who live in a social bubble where everything they do is applauded.
But having hopes for her and then being slightly disappointed…that will show you a ton of what she’s about.
This is where you begin your evaluation of her in earnest.
- does she look to you for help
- does she ask for it
- does she joke around and pretend that nothing’s wrong, or try to do something different, try to change the subject
- does she take it seriously
- does she hunker down and try to be successful for *her* own sake
- does she hunker down and try to be successful for *your* sake
It’s key to ask yourself during the courting process, what do you really want in a long term relationship. Funny, Sexy, can cook….but those are tangible things that can be learned or faked.
Do you want a chick that needs you to solve all of her problems?
One that never lets you help with anything?
Does the “balance between the 2″ always fall on the wrong side?
Ultimately, you’re trying to get down to her thought process.
Can she be trusted?
It’s the same question she is asking about you. It’s the whole purpose of her the woman’s game – to reveal the best partner who can also be trusted.
She’s constantly evaluating everything that you do, who your friends are, what you do for a living, how you butter your bread, whether or not your shirt fits and matches
Now it’s your turn.
@WestIndianArchie,
Spoken like a true West Indian (or African) man.
**and I am not sure how I feel about that.
**
@Ms. Sula,
lmao!! im not sure how i feel about it either!
::snicker::
@WestIndianArchie,
i have never hated and loved a comment so much at the same time as i have this one.
@Princess Duvet,
and he is REALLY good for comments that elicit this response!
@WestIndianArchie,
Do you know my cousin? Get out of my fam like dat!
Seriously, tho – most (American) women are only better in their late 20′s, early 30′s. Emotionally more stable, better sense of self, reaching their sexual peak, done with school, making more money, less likely to play games just to validate themselves, etc. Not to say that young gals ain’t the shiznit as well, but those years do add some maturity.
I am 29 now, and most of my girlfriends who were married or settled young are now single again. Being a divorcee at 27 is not da bizness.
Statistically, the most stable marriages (lowest divorce rate) occur when both partners are over 28.
In other words – don’t play around with that “older” (cuz 27 ain’t nowhere near old) lady. She will turn.your.azz.out.
@Lil’T, “In other words – don’t play around with that “older” (cuz 27 ain’t nowhere near old) lady. She will turn.your.azz.out.”
i agree with errythang you said…and don’t sleep on the sex#ual peak.
@Princess Duvet,
Yep!
@WestIndianArchie,
I’m in awe of this post. I now officially have an e-crush! This is it in a nutshell… and ladies… how many of us passed over perfectly good guys while we were in our prime and feeling ourselves??? Life keeps moving and when you’re too fly you can lose…
@pgh muse,
I read about this “Eligible Bachelor Paradox” explained in terms of economics and game theory (I think WIA alluded to it somewhat). It basically attempts to explain why there is such a big pool of older, unmarried, gorgeous, accomplished women versus a rather shrinking pool of the equivalent in men…
It kinda made sense.
http://www.slate.com/id/2188684/
(I read it on a blogger’s site but he cited the article so there you have it)
@Ms. Sula,
Another explanation for the abundance of attractive, fabulous, glamorous so-called “older” women is that they did try to settle down @ the “right” age with the “right” guy. She tried, and the relationship didn’t work for whatever reason.
I know with my female colleagues, this has been the case. They met this one guy in college, dated for years, families met – and then something happens and the relationship falls apart.
Back in the day, a woman would have just suffered silently. But nowadays, she can get out of a bad relationship and not suffer the severe economic consequence or social stigma.
This of course only makes the stakes much higher during her early years – but this is also when she knows less.
@Ms. Sula,
That was definitely an interesting article… and so relevent!
@WestIndianArchie,
But you forgot about love WIA… people do still fall in love sometimes… and I think this changes the game… some
@pgh muse,
Indeed. Love is the X-Factor.
Quiet as kept, men have a shelf life too.
It’s a given that not every woman is gonna feel a little grey in the beard – what’s more important is how the man changes as the days grow old.
Pockets fat, finally got his work out wired, lay pipe like a roto rooter…almost perfect, but he has gotten rigid in how he thoughts.
Even if the man is supposed to be the eye in a woman’s hurricane – he still has to bend.
Not for her sake, but for his own.
@WestIndianArchie,
Even if the man is supposed to be the eye in a woman’s hurricane – he still has to bend.
Not for her sake, but for his own.
That imagery is powerful.
Champ, tomorrow please find a way to make VSB not so interesting. . . I got NO work done today. . . AT ALL . . . nah im just kidding, REALLY good job today. Getting folks all riled up and such. I will lurk from iPhone. ONE HUNNED!
@IVR,
Champ, tomorrow please find a way to make VSB not so interesting
hey man, it’s ya’ll that are in the trenches, doing the groundwork. we (p and i) just provide the battlefield
Man… your ending comment was soooooo true. We definitely do not want a man that has no interest in sex. When he finally does want to share you may find that all those flowers and meals were to mask the lack of properly working equipment. LOL… So shameful. I just could not even call him again….
I love my sistern, but there are days and blog posts that make me just hate that by simply the virtue of my ovaries, I am associated w/”chick logic”. Women over-analyze everything. EVERYTHING. We want rules for every little thing, majoring in minutiae and needlessly complicating the simplest of concepts and situations [men]. RULES…blah! The only rule I have is “Don’t do stupid shyt!”
I hate rules. They cater to notions of hierarchy and superiority, which are just disposable personality traits. Why not just live by a few solid principles that are based in common sense and overall respect for all? Principles guide character and enable you actually stand on and for something, as opposed to rules that are always subject to change.
Time limits, tradition, societal dogma and puritan rhetoric. *shudder* What do you really believe in?
*hops off the tiny soapbox and goes to feed the cats*
This whole thread makes me soo glad I’m married!
First time on the site and I have to say that I am extremely impressed by the high quality of work put into the site. I showed it to my coworkers last night(one middle aged white chick & one young hispanic gal) and they laughed their flat asses off! But I digress…this topic of a woman really filling a brotha only when she able to give them money is dead on like a dead hooker in a sleazy motel in a small town right outside of your favorite strip joint that you happened to not be at the night she was accidently killed by O-Ding on cheap X(I sometimes say to much…please disregard that last line) . I could testify to this in court and pass any lie detector test administered (I would also need a thumb tack in my shoe and ice pick in my left buttocks). But I wonder why the rule doesn’t apply vice versa. Case in point brothas break bread (trick) on females all day long. I know poor saps who will pay a females rent, electric, and utilities just after smashing pumpkins three times with a skank (or floozy). All they want to do is hit, beat, smash, punch tickets, drum trash can lids, etc. Most cats know several brothas who have or will break bread repeatedly on a girl they know to be nothing more than a bust down at best. Can someone tell me why? (the only reason I can think of is b/c guys and dolls have totally different views on money, tricking, and prostitution rates on the Las Vegas Strip)
Side note***I had this butter pecan young thing in college that was a year out of high school but decided to work and go to jr. college for a year(strip at the local T&A bar for tens and twentys)…well long story short I was on line pledging that great A-Phi (that’s Alpha Phi Alpha worlds oldest and coldest frat) and b/c some dic* head big brothas thought it would be funny to see if I could make it through the process on a 106 dollars…well one of the big brothas was trying to get at the same caramel cup cutie too while she was hollaring at me and so you know how ninjas talk and she came to find out that I was riding low on ends (not from myself b/c I speak nill of frat bizz to the hos…word is bond). One day after a little S&S(smoking and smashing) she drops me off back at my crib and tells me to check my bag when I got inside. Low and behold the young tender thing gave yours truly 5 dead white guys named Ben Franklin(in college money terms thats like 5Gs) The next time I see the light chocolate sun goddess she blurts out (while Im giving her some, scratch that, the best, wonder pipe of her 19 year old life) I love you. Total deal breaker! Now this honey nut cheerio wonder gave bomb blow, always brought and paid for the dro, and could cook a mean steak Au Poivre, the no falling in love rule (which is rule numero uno) had been broken and so she had to be replaced, upgraded, dismissed, kicked to the curve like the chick that shi* on herself on flavor of love (side bar**** that was some of the nasty shit* I have ever seen…pun intended).
Well, that’s ALLLLLL folks…stay away from that swine!