Dating, Relationships, & Sex, Lists, Race & Politics, Theory & Essay

Dear Champ (Vol. 4): “Is it possible sleep your way into a man’s heart?”

Dear Champ: I’ve been casually dating this guy for a few months now, and I’m beginning to develop feelings for him. Ok. I’m lying. We haven’t been “dating” really, just having sex once a week or so. Yes. We are the dreaded f-buddies. Anyway, my feelings for him have grown, and I want to know if it’s possible sleep your way into a man’s heart?

This question recalls a pretty colorful conversation I had several years ago with a couple of high school kids. We were discussing the idea of college, and although they were both college-bound, they argued that a college degree wasn’t a prerequisite for success; citing the careers of people such as Bill Gates, Naomi Campbell, and Wiz Khalifa as prime examples. (Yes, I do realize that this was probably the only time in recorded history that Bill Gates, Naomi Campbell, and Wiz Khalifa were cited in the same argument. Thanks for asking.)

While I conceded that A) college isn’t for everybody (If it was, it would be free.), B) it’s quite possible to be successful without a college degree, and C) having a degree doesn’t ensure success, I told them to think of degrees in basketball terms. Basically, trying to make it without a degree is like shooting a j from half-court. Sure, there’s a chance that you’ll make it, but your odds increase the closer you get to the rim.

To continue the analogy, contested three pointer = college degree, wide open three pointer = master’s/professional degree, foul shot = PhD, and lay-up = being born into the Bush family.

Ok, what was my point? Oh yeah, the “sleeping into a man’s heart” thing.

Anyway, while it’s possible to sleep your way into a man’s heart, it’s also possible to make a half-court jumpshot while blindfolded, covered in honey, and running away from a gang of especially angsty warthogs. Also, for most guys, you’ll probably have to sleep together approximately 600 times before the “heart” thing becomes a consideration. Since you’re having sex once a week or so, at this rate, he’ll completely smitten by June of 2024.

My advice? The f-buddy relationship is an inherently doomed proposition that isn’t for the faint of heart, and it sounds like you need to end this arrangement before you end up busting the windows in his car.

Dear Champ: Why is it so difficult for people to understand the viewpoints of those that have experienced differently than them? After trying to drive my points home in the Nice Guys Finish Last blog, I have never felt so isolated and misunderstood in my life.

Because the idea of a black man having actual dating struggles is the complete antithesis of the prevailing idea that we’re all carefree mandingos with limitless romantic options, I understand why it’s difficult for some — and by “some” I mean “some black women” — to have any type of empathy or sympathy for a black “nice guy” finishing last, especially since their own dating acrimony has been widely publicized, scrutinized, and politicized.

It’s almost like a white guy complaining about racial discrimination and intimidation. Even if he’s completely justified in his claims, it’ll take him getting actually murdered by a clan of Hebrew Isrealities outside of The Gap before anyone actually says “You know what? I think he had a point.

With that being said — and if you are who I suspect you are — there’s a way to give a viewpoint without being preachy, condescending, and antagonistic, and I’ve found that many “misunderstood” people haven’t quite grasped that. Because of that, what could have been empathy ends up being annoyance, and your words and feelings get lost in a self-defeatist haze of “I don’t want people to hear my story. I just want them to feel like sh*t for sh*tting on me.”

Dear Champ: Is there a way to tell if a man is packing heavy equipment or not?

He has a big tool belt? I don’t know. I mean, from my vantage point, it seems like women run the option gamut when trying to figure this out, using pretty much anything from “hand size” to “the way he drinks milk” as a concrete indicator of a guy’s equipment.

My personal favorite is their self-fulfilling “confidence” prophecy. Basically, if a confident guy is proven to be blessed, he’s genuinely confident because of his blessings. On the other hand, if a confident guy is proven to be, um, cursed, he’s overcompensating for his shortcomings.

Basically, everybody is wrong about everything, all of the time. (and by “everybody is” I mean “women are”)

Dear Champ: I’m a newly single, attractive 36 yr old woman with 3 children. I recently separated from my husband after 18 yrs of marriage. I’m not looking for a relationship now, but I’m interested in dating. How do I go about meeting handsome, nice, respectable, and available men?

A couple games into my freshman year, we played the University of Kentucky on our home court. This also happened to be one of the years that Kentucky won the national championship. Now, although we weren’t exactly slouches, we weren’t on Kentucky’s level, and it showed. We kept the game somewhat competitive in the first half, but their size and talent just proved to much for us to handle, and we ended up losing by 30 points.

Predictably, when we had our film session the next day, our coach was pretty upset with us. But, midway through the film session, he stopped the tape, hit the eject button and said “You know what, guys? I can’t bullsh*t you all anymore. That team has five guys that are going to play in the NBA, and they’ll probably win the national championship this year. You guys gave a great effort…but they’re just much, much better than us. There’s no shame in that.”

I’m telling this story because it would be a disservice for me to gas your head up with some pseudo inspirational “Just get back on the horse, and things will take care of itself” type of speech, ignoring the fact that your baggage — your martial situation (not yet divorced), relative inexperience with dating, and kids (I know kids aren’t supposed to be referred to as “baggage,” but in the dating sense they’ll be considered us such) — is probably going to make things difficult for you. This doesn’t mean that dating will be hopeless. There are available and worthy men out there, but you just might have to do a bit more work — online dating, attending events out of your usual comfort zone, etc. — to find them.

With that being said, I have two things I want to add

1. Wait until the divorce is final before you start thinking about getting back out there.

2. Wait until the divorce is final before you start thinking about getting back out there, and then wait another three months.

Half of your life has been spent being a wife and mother, and since it probably wouldn’t be a stretch to assume that this is how you’ve defined yourself, I’d advise you to take this time to learn a bit more about yourself. Travel if you’re able to. Get a few new hobbies. Hit the gym. Go back to school. But, don’t run out and try to fill your “void” with TNAN (The Next Available N*gga).

I’m also suggesting to wait a bit before you get back out there because I’m assuming that since you got married at such a young age, you probably didn’t experience the same opportunity to be young and carefree as most others. And, people in these types of “delayed youth” situations tend to act out –and act irresponsibility — when they finally get the opportunity to, something your responsibilities and (assumed) dating nativity don’t really allow you to do.

Relax and take a few deep breaths before you decide to get in the pool. The water can be quite cold, and I’d hate to see you drown because the shock wouldn’t allow you to swim.

*You can contact Dear Champ at Formspring.me/AskChamp and contact@verysmartbrothas.com*

—The Champ

Filed Under:
Damon Young

Damon Young is the editor-in-chief of VSB. He is also a contributing editor for EBONY.com. He resides in Pittsburgh, and he really likes pancakes.

  • http://Www.tinawatkins.wordpress.com Tina watkins

    First comment?

  • http://Www.tinawatkins.wordpress.com Tina watkins

    Arguably less useless… I bet money the lass in question one knew your answer and wanted as they all do, the reason why it would take 600 times, minimally, to cop a feeling.

    • Girl Kanyeshrug

      She needs to read “He’s Just Not That Into You”

    • Jhane Sez

      “Arguably less useless… I bet money the lass in question one knew your answer and wanted as they all do, the reason why it would take 600 times, minimally, to cop a feeling.”

      The best advice I have ever gotten on the subject of trading sex for love came from a guy friend in his early 20’s when I was still in high school and a virgin.

      He said that for men sex is a biological urge like using the bathroom… they are grateful that the toilet is there for use, but its not a place that they would want to spend the night… let alone a lifetime.

      That shut down my interest in casual sex…

      Because as an observation I found out he was right ~JS

      • kingpinenut

        “He said that for men sex is a biological urge like using the bathroom… they are grateful that the toilet is there for use, but its not a place that they would want to spend the night… let alone a lifetime.’

        truer words never spoken – skins is like air

      • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

        I just got through trying casual sex. It’s not for me at all, but it was a learning experience. but do guys really think of women this way? That’s sad.

        • http://tdlove.wordpress.com Tonya

          I would take this as a commentary on women, but just a statement of fact so to speak. Sex being a physical response to most men is an evolutionary by product.

          Oddly enough that is actually encouraging.

          What they are saying is that men need more than sex to develop feelings for a woman. They need relationship. Women need relationship in order to feel comfortable in having sex with a man. Theoretically, with a little time and patience both can achieve the same goal and end up in the same place.

          .

          • http://tdlove.wordpress.com Tonya

            I meant to say.. I would NOT take that as a social commentary against women.

      • http://www.tinawatkins.wordpress.com Tina Watkins

        “She needs to read He’s Just not that Into You”
        Yes… Or the Qur’an, Bible or somethin’. :-P

        “Biological urge like using the bathroom”…
        Yes, this is the best way to define casual romps. No, it isn’t the best way to define the way men think about it in general. Depending on the scenario both genders can have the same reaction.

      • http://emdottie.com EmDottie

        Well hell if that doesn’t define men and casual sex then IDK what will…

  • Miss A

    *Takes note of 2024 * So there is hope? I wont even be 40 by then.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      keep hope alive and sh*t

      • http://www.magnetforfoolishness.wordpress.com magnetforfoolishness

        Your candor is refreshing. And (I think) your advice to the newly-single 36 year-old woman with 3 kids is dead on.

        Related to the first topic, I would also be interested in knowing your (and anyone else’s) thoughts on “getting it out of the way”….this conversation has come up soooo many times in “very smart” circles over the past few weeks with, of course, no resolution. If two individuals are feeling each other, but there is clearly a level of awkwardness and sexual tension that is making things uncomfortable, does it make sense “get it out of the way” so THEN you can move on to really getting to know the persons hopes and dreams, lol….or is that an oxymoron?

        I feel like this is a topic that VSB may have covered before…if so, please point me to that post. Thx ;)

        • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

          I say DON’T get it out of the way. Sexual tension will have to be dealt with individually because, too many times, women have been fooled by the guy’s argument to “get it out of the way”, and then found out that, once they did get to know him, they didn’t like him, and now that’s another dyck she can’t take back…

        • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

          I say DON’T get it out of the way. Sexual tension will have to be dealt with individually because, too many times, women have been fooled by the guy’s argument to “get it out of the way”, and then found out that, once they did get to know him, they didn’t like him, and now that’s another dyck she can’t take back…

        • davidruffin83

          I would highly suggest you actually get to know each other if you plan on having anything beyond a sexual relationship. If you’re just curious about each other sexually and you really aren’t concerned with whether or not there could be more, DO IT! Be forewarned, men kind of have a tendency to have their brains clouded by snapper so if you drop that thang on him and he starts talking less and trying to beat more, don’t be completely shocked.

    • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

      LOL girl it is very possible to snatch a man up with great poon. I see it done everyday. I see tons of stupid men with women who don’t compliment them at all…then I find out she’s a good cook and gives good head. lol Guys fall for tricks and p*ssy all the time. Sad.

      Wow I sound so hood right now. My bad, I’m listening to Weezy 6’7 right nah.

      • keisha brown

        LMAO @ SFG.
        but you speak truth.
        i’d go off about how ‘good girls’ stay single and cold while certain chicks stay at least booed up for the winter..but that would just make me a bitter angry black woman right?
        *doesnt await confirmation before nodding head

        so i keep myself busy with projects, travel and have skype dates with dudes i’ll never get to smang in real life. lol.

        • Medium Meech

          If you can’t beat em…. But really though, the extra fertilization those chicks receive probably isn’t making the grass any greener on that side.

          • keisha brown

            if i cant beat em.. then sleep with a dude on the 1st date and to never be upgraded past jumpoff status? hmm.. sounds appealing..but i’ll pass.
            guess i’ll stick to marathons of the wire and missing the NFL once its gone.

            • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

              I just went to a wedding where the girl gave it on the first night WITH another woman, I told you that remember? They’re in love and got married. It’s really just s.ex for men…it’s what comes with it that makes them fall.

              • Mo-VSS

                Nope…this dude I was friends with got it in with his now wife on date one. He really liked her though so he kept dating her and it worked out.

                Definitely not the norm, but I’ve witnessed it first-hand happen.

                • davidruffin83

                  I’ve wanged out women on the first date that I dated afterwards. I’ve met women that were wack and I attempted to beat anyway. In all reality, if a dude doesn’t see any future in you and you don’t put out, you won’t hear back from him. If you have some potential, you can put out or hold out and he’ll still call you back the next day.

            • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

              I’m right there with ya. I tried joining ‘em, but if you don’t decide you’re into casual sex on your own, you DEFINITELY won’t like it once you do it. You’ll just keep trying to make your jumpoff your dude and he’ll keep enjoying all the effort you put into the “casual” relationship while he does nothing.

              After my last disastrous relationship, I thought I’d try the casual thing. I thought I must be doing something wrong in the relationship area, so perhaps casual was good. It was never my thing and I didn’t see the value in having sex with no connection when masturbation existed, but I tried it for the last six months and, as I knew, it’s NOT MY THING. I’m glad I explored, but it was a, basically, painful experience to put yourself out there repeatedly with many dudes who would never care about you, let alone love you. That didn’t feel nice at all.

              So, don’t do it, lol.

              • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                “Many dudes”? How many?

                O.

                • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

                  LOL. Wow. No comment. I guess I did kinda put myself on blast, lol. Not MANY. A few. Several.

              • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                *Gives KKC Mr.Spock raised eyebrow look – while taking a step backwards…*

                O.

            • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

              KB,
              Speaking of The Wire, I’m watching it as I type this, Season Four. As for what you and the ladies are talking about…

              Please note that SFG mentioned things about the gal did outside of sex to keep the guy – most notably, cooking. Now this isn’t as big an issue for Black Women as it is for many White Women, but it still is worth noting that a Woman who has knowledge of Cookery instantly bumps her overall point avg.rating up versus gals who merely rely on their bodies alone. That, along with other Wifely Arts, makes the difference btw a Woman being a Wifey, or a Sidejawn.

              I’m just sayin’.

              O.

              • keisha brown

                @ Mr Obsidian

                I hear you. I do. I’d like to think im wife material. heck..was even recently told im wife material..but i try not to even pretend that the features/attributes i have are any different from the many vsss (very smart single sistas) out there and that it entitles me to a man.

                i could start listing my features, but could be accused of embellishing/hiding behind the anonymity of the internet. which would be a fair accusation. i do have some references though via this site’s community. lol.

                at the end of the day, the person who wants to have and keep all parts of me, inside and out will win. until then, i’ll keep busy, take advantage of having chefs to help me grocery shop and run my football pool. ;)

        • http://thatswhatgemsaid.wordpress.com Gem of the Ocean

          hehe you said smang.

          (at least this way you wont get a cootch contusion *shrugs*)

          • http://twitter.com/#!/NewYork2VA NY2VA

            Dead @ Cooch Contusion!!

          • keisha brown

            @Gem
            im still looking for a carpenter.. tee hee…

        • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

          Like Meech said, the grass aint greener boo boo. The whole good guy/girl finish last theory is why work for what you want when you can get it easy elsewhere. That’s why the idea that you can’t eff/cook into his heart is true and false at the same time. Many people don’t see that wolf in sheep’s clothing because they do/say what they want. It makes it harder for good women like you. You don’t want those guys anyway. There’s nothing wrong with getting your physical needs met if you can handle it…You’re real with yourself and that’s all you can be at the end of the day.

      • http://www.shay-d-lady.com shay-d-lady

        @smartfoxgirl

        I have to disagree.. temporarily a girl will get a guy with good poon, but I dont know many sexi-in they way into marriage and long term relationships..
        and thats because I dont care how good the s.e.x is at some point it takes a back seat to life and if all you offering is that?
        it wears out. literally

        • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

          Of course I agree with you ;) I was being funny. I do see it but these men are often easily tricked or lacking life knowledge. lol

      • davidruffin83

        You gotta understand that some dudes are just simps and all it takes is some attention and they will wife up whatever random boogerwolf with some good chewing (and possibly good credit) that comes strolling along.

        • keisha brown

          @davidruffin..
          i am so mad you said boogerwolf. LMAO!!!!!

  • miss t-lee

    If you wanna know the size of his jank ask for a pic. Technology has removed the guesswork…lol As far as effing your way into a dude’s heart–good luck with that. Do not get into a FB situation if you know that you’re the kind that can’t handle it. This goes for dudes too. Either way ish can get real ugly, real fast.

    • Beautifuldaidreamer

      Co-sign on the peen pics. Shoe sizes? Thumb to pinkie span? Length of his middle finger? #weoffthat.

      • miss t-lee

        *daps* chica. :-) you already know!

      • TezzyBaby

        I think a reference object needs to be included in the picture as well (like a quarter or a baby giraffe) because I dont know how many times Ive ordered things off the net, that were actually a lot smaller than I thought they would be.

        • legitimate_soul

          @ Teezy,
          Yup! So true! *laughing*

        • miss t-lee

          @ Teezy…lmao!! There was a kat on twitter who was displaying his jank next to a glade can and a comcast remote…bwhaaha Personally, I don’t need any objects to compare, I’m a pretty good judge of “character”. :-)

          • TezzyBaby

            LOL well you are a far better judge of “character” than I . Iimma need to see that glade can becuz I would be trying to do some complex aspect ratio calculations.

            • http://twitter.com/#!/NewYork2VA NY2VA

              I love it when my people understand math!

          • Mo-VSS

            Twitter is straight foolishness for this…wow! LMAO

        • Yeah*yeah*Yeah

          Nothing like having someone say, “take the beast baby” and all you can see is a thumb! Womp-womp!

        • TezzyBaby

          As a side question though….Do all men have a picture of their bald-headed yogurt slinger or are willing to take one?

          • miss t-lee

            I haven’t had anyone refuse to play show & tell. It never hurts to ask.

          • Girl Kanyeshrug

            We know Brett Favre does…

          • MsMelissa!

            “bald-headed yogurt slinger”

            Can somebody come pick me up off the floor !!!!!!!!!!!

          • keisha brown

            bald-headed yogurt slinger
            why. must. i. die.
            tezzybaby… what did i do to youuuuuuu??
            lmaoooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

        • Oye

          LMAO!!!! This was funny!!!

        • Yoles

          @ Tezzy

          so true, i’ve gotten a few pics myself that told one story only to find in real life that the story was something else completely. angles and grease and lightening etc made something look like the actual Eiffel tower when it was actually just a miniature figurine of such… the reference object is the best look, now that really takes the guess work out of it!!!

          • thenameisyonna

            @ Yoles

            *cardiac arrest* @ “angles and grease and lightening etc made something look like the actual Eiffel tower when it was actually just a miniature figurine of such…

        • Deeds

          Another point of reference that is kinda depressing is a baggy condom. Yes, I’ve seen that before.

        • http://thatswhatgemsaid.wordpress.com Gem of the Ocean

          *dead* @ peen reference object

        • Tx10inch

          I think a reference object needs to be included in the picture as well (like a quarter or a baby giraffe)

          I always snap mine standing next to a small Volkswagon.

          • http://thatswhatgemsaid.wordpress.com Gem of the Ocean

            LMAO sometimes i wonder why i e-quit you, ex-e-boo

            *daydreams*

          • keisha brown

            small volkswagon you say…
            *books flight to Houston stat. ;)

          • miss t-lee

            Did this kneegro just say a car??? CTFU!!!! I can imagine you saying this too…lol
            *what up head nod*

    • legitimate_soul

      Hey, Miss T-Lee

      Dang….Brett Farve-ing the “paynus”….LMAO! Agreed on the FB situation.

      • miss t-lee

        Hey Legitimate Soul…long time!! I’m mad @ you using Brett Favre as a verb. LoL!! Yeah the FB situation is all fun & games…until someone starts whylin’ out. :-)

      • http://twitter.com/#!/NewYork2VA NY2VA

        Favre-ing, Favre-esque, Farve-tastic, Favre-appointing…

        These all work.

    • http://thatswhatgemsaid.wordpress.com Gem of the Ocean

      If you wanna know the size of his jank ask for a pic. Technology has removed the guesswork

      LMAO!! girl yes!!!! ask for a Favre/Yeezy or just get to feelin it for your dang self. no need to be disappointed once clothes start coming off *shrugs*

      • sunshyne84

        If he’s holding it with his thumb and finger its small. If he has his whole hand wrapped around it, well you can figure out what’s enough for you by what’s leftover.

    • Medium Meech

      So this is what objectification feels like. Not as bad as you all make it out to be.

      • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

        I Do not know about that. Objectification is dehumanizing. Where as woman can buy natural implants to make themselves more attractive(lips,chest, glutes), guys will never have that 12×5 no matter how much money is in the bank.
        So, it makes even less sense to objectify and humiliate men that have very little to no control over it. If this is seriously how things are weighed given a pleasure by measure ratio, then why not simply be deviant? Even in jest, the truth hurts.

        Conservation is an important part of self worth.

        • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

          and women can reupholster their Gines.
          Women are jerks.

          • CNotes

            @Sage of Silence

            “Women are jerks.”

            My initial reaction is to laugh at your candidness. : )
            But my authentic reaction is “ouch”! : (
            We still like you, though. *pookie face*

          • miss t-lee

            “Women are jerks.”

            Yep we are. :) I’m perfectly fine with that.

          • Medium Meech

            I like the usage of the word jerk. We should bring it back.

        • http://tdlove.wordpress.com Tonya

          You do realize, of course, is the reason why females have to, and CAN augment is because some man decided that it was a necessary thing to do?

          So quit your whining..Don’t start none, there won’t be none.

        • TezzyBaby

          Huh??? Implants are not gender specific. Although I think this is going to be gross… I have dissected many a male cadaver with some help in the nether regions. Guys can and do just as easily go get surgery for length and/or girth or whatever other physical malady burrowing in their mind.

          I think most if not all women agree that it is the operation of the machinery thats most important (although I cant deny the role of size).

          • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

            @CNotes I ain’t mad and I still love women. I’m not even saying that all women are jerks. And I will always have the utmost respect for women who are women. (Not trying to be anything other than a woman, I.e. ho/whore/man/slut ~#I’mjustsayin’)

            @miss t-lee I’m glad you found my thoughts as self-affirming and have the self-respect to OWN it. I respect you for that. Also, I admire your honesty. Kudos.

            @Medium Meech, What? I didn’t know it was retired. I feel left out.

            @Tonya, sure BUTTTTTTT just because you CAN sell your soul to the D’evil doesn’t mean that you should or even endorse others or even Condone others in doing so. :-)

            @TezzyBaby, all I’ve ever heard was that there was “No way to responsibly and actually improve the male zhex organ.” I’m saddened that you’ve seen so much but happy that you are getting your experience in.

            I just don’t know what to think anymore. Tezzy is ruining my perspective on the customizability of our bodies with plastic or the lack thereof. THANK YOU????

            • CNotes

              @Sage of Silence

              I feel what you’re saying. : )

  • Beautifuldaidreamer

    Of course anything’s possible. But how often do once-a-week f**k sessions turn into a long term relationship? I’m more curious about those probablities…

    Aww man Champ. As soon as I read that question from “the nice guy,” I had the same inkling you had. And I agree with your response. I often lurk in the comment section and take in what’s being discussed. This particular “nice guy” never seems too “nice,” based on what I’ve read. Condescending and antagonistic are apropos descriptions. The self-pitying rants aren’t indicative of a gentleman who prides himself on being “the nice guy.” Just be nice for goodness’ sake, not due to some false sense of self- righteousness

    • Miss A

      I agree on your description of the “nice guy” and while I suppose there may be 2 or 3 nice guys in the world that women may not be attracted to, a particular scene in The Social Network comes to mind when Mark Zucherburgh (played by Jesse Eisenberg) was on the date with a girl and he insulted her. She said something along the lines of “for the rest of your life you are going to think women dont like you because you are too much of a nerd or smart, but its really because you’re an a-hole.”With that being said, nice guys are never as nice as they think they are.

      • http://twitter.com/kjnetic Peter Parker

        “and while I suppose there may be 2 or 3 nice guys in the world that women may not be attracted to..”

        and I make 4. *DiddyBops*

        “With that being said, nice guys are never as nice as they think they are.”

        does that mean if i’m a nice guy, should i just say i’m an a**hole so that i got the jedi mind trick thing going on? lol

        • Mo-VSS

          No, you should just be nice. Just don’t be stupid when it comes to women. By stupid I mean don’t be so nice that she’s getting your money and driving your car to ANOTHER man’s house.

          Nice isn’t the catch all that men seem to think it is. It’s just one thing on the scale that helps. Like a beautiful woman…if that’s all she has going for her, while she may be great to look at, she’s not going to fulfill most men’s long term wants in a woman (or she might…but chances are most dudes want more than just a pretty face.) Same thing wth the nice guy….being nice will only get you so far.

        • DanceHallKing

          Rule #1 of being a nice guy is not saying you’re a nice guy.

          • Sula

            Hello! :-) Thank you for saying this…

            Nice Chump.

      • Girl Kanyeshrug

        “With that being said, nice guys are never as nice as they think they are.”

        I agree..some of them are not nice at all…

      • http://thatswhatgemsaid.wordpress.com Gem of the Ocean

        With that being said, nice guys are never as nice as they think they are.

        i definitely agree with this statement. having had my run in with more than a few self-proclaimed “nice guys.” what they meant to say is that theyre “lame guys who cant get a date” but have really good credentials (degrees, pedigree, and good salary). but they often times lack the social aptitude and/or personality to attract women and keep them interested. but because they typically lack any real self awareness, they will never realize that its their stank/awkward attitude that keeps them “finishing last”

        • Quiet Storm

          *waving my church fan* Preach! You pretty much summed it up

    • http://revolutionsdaughter.com MiaChelle

      Hi, everyone… long time lurker, first time commenter. :)

      I have to agree with Dreamer here– I get suspicious when I see men who identify themselves as a “nice guy” because they often turn out to be the opposite. What’s really interesting about this particular letter is the fact that he felt “isolated and misunderstood” after “trying to drive his points home”. It makes me wonder if understanding and togetherness only come if people agree with him– I’d have a hard time thinking that the commenters here didn’t understand the points made, assuming that they were in English and were at least loosely coherent.

      Champ, pardon me if I missed the earlier debate on this, but did you mean that black women don’t buy that black “nice guys” could have dating troubles because of the belief that black men in general have no problem finding someone to be with? If so, not so sure I agree. Can you clarify?

      Mia

      • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

        “Champ, pardon me if I missed the earlier debate on this, but did you mean that black women don’t buy that black “nice guys” could have dating troubles because of the belief that black men in general have no problem finding someone to be with?”

        yeah, that’s exactly what I was saying. i dont think all black (and non-black) women feel this way, but I do believe that many black women assume that all black men have a much easier go of it in regards to dating than they do.

        • Kimmy

          I would say that on average, black men probably do.

        • Medium Meech

          Wow. Not only where you right about the sympathy, but it seems that black women deny than nice black guys even exist in the first place. The pathology runs deep indeed.

          • Mo-VSS

            Naw, we…well I, acknowledge the nice black guy. I’ve dated the self proclaimed “nice black guy” and what I’ve found is that he’s not nice. It’s like a woman saying she can cook just because it’s expected that, as a woman, you should know how to cook. She really can’t cook…but she proclaims her food the second coming of Bobby Flay and the Neelys o_0

            It’s the same thing with self proclaimed “nice guys.” Much like the “cook” wants credit for boiling water, the nice guy wants extra credit for trivial things that any GOOD person would do. Opening doors, treating folks right, not cussing women out, paying bills on time, etc. Most self proclaimed nice guys think that because they are fitting the mold and playing the part that they are due something extra, and instead of developing any other interesting characteristics for themselves, they rely solely on the thier “nice-ness” to advance them to whatever imaginary level of dating success they feel they are entitled to.

            Now, when a man is described as nice by other people, THEN what I find is tha he’s not only nice, but a good catch in other ways as well.

            • Medium Meech

              Yeah, that’s he same thing all the other ladies on the post are saying. But just because you all know of that one black guy that you actually dated doesn’t discount all the no account no game having nice guys working at the pharmacy that you guys didn’t date. I’m just going by the comments and everyone uses that one guy as proof that they don’t exist at all.

              And nice guys probably complain so much because women complain about always dating unemployed dogs and talk about how they want to date a guy that sounds surprisingly like him. Yet, he is overlooked.

              And to be fair, the parallel to the nice guy is the good girl with all the right credentials who doesn’t who can’t find a man becuase of “THE SHORTAGE”.

              But I have no dog in this fight as I never play the nice guy angle, just observations.

              • Mo-VSS

                I see your point. I agree. And I do acknowledge the existence of the nice guy though…the genuine ones and the self-proclaimed ones as well.

              • Jhane Sez

                “It’s the same thing with self proclaimed “nice guys.” Much like the “cook” wants credit for boiling water, the nice guy wants extra credit for trivial things that any GOOD person would do. Opening doors, treating folks right, not cussing women out, paying bills on time, etc. Most self proclaimed nice guys think that because they are fitting the mold and playing the part that they are due something extra, and instead of developing any other interesting characteristics for themselves, they rely solely on the thier “nice-ness” to advance them to whatever imaginary level of dating success they feel they are entitled to.”

                It’s hard to give the self-proclaimed nice guy a shot because they are so socially inexperienced… the reality is that it makes them in many cases incompatible.

                I used to give these “nice guys” a shot when I was in college because I was raised with a you never know who can be the one philosophy and it was never a good experience because so many of them have entitlement issues.

                And no matter how polite or gracefully you tried to back out of it they would try to guilt you or coerce you into seeing them again or giving them a kiss or more.

                And many of these “nice guys” make you fear for your personal safety because the don’t understand social mores… and tend to get angry or over aggressive when they can’t get their way.

                The one who shut it down for me was a guy who told me that he could have raped me if he wanted to but he was a nice guy and didn’t do stuff like that.

                And I have heard various forms of ignorant, offensive and potentially dangerous stuff check listed by these nice guys that they would never do… then why the heck are you bringing it up.

                This discourages you from giving a dude that you know you aren’t going to have a good time with a shot… and running if he tells you that he is a “nice guy”

                The reality is you can’t date every guy that asks you out… you have to have some criteria for thinning the heard. ~JS

              • Sula

                Don’t get me wrong I know REAL NICE guys and I date them… I have never been attracted to the “playboy”, the “bad boy” or the “arrogant” dude… I like my men nice… So nice black men do abound… except they don’t go around calling themselves “nice guys”… They just are.

          • keisha brown

            really?
            black women deny nice dudes exist??
            where?

            • Medium Meech

              Um, most of the comments in this thread? All along the lines of “They ain’t really nice, just a-holes pretending”.

              • Jhane Sez

                “Um, most of the comments in this thread? All along the lines of “They ain’t really nice, just a-holes pretending””

                This only applies to self-professed nice guys… not real nice guys.

                As it was stated upthread it is one thing to hear it from other people that he is a nice guy and it is another thing for the person themselves to tell you.

                The guys we are talking about hold the opinion that they are nice when they are a-holes pretending

                We believe that there are nice black men… a lot of us are in relationships with them. ~JS.

                • keisha brown

                  #whatshesaid

        • whykendra

          do you think black men have it easier in regards to dating?

          • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

            Because they aren’t black men.

            Because some men make it “LOOK” easy

            because everyone likes to be little the efforts that others put in , in order to make themselves feel better

            Because just like women of any color, men of any color can and will be fetishized and it is a potential denigration to the women that a particular man- under the voyeurs observation- may “get” with.

            Because it is always easier to say the grass is greener on the other side rather than accept that everything comes with difficulty that those unfamiliar have no concept of how to deal with.

            Shall I go on? no, the point is beaten to death twice by now, I just desired to be Henry David, YES, “Thoreau”….bwahahahahaha

    • Mo-VSS

      @beautifuldaidreamer–Because I usually go in on said “nice guy” commenter I’m gonna have to completely agree. If it’s who I think it is, it’s not that he’s nice…it’s that he’s a douche masquerading as a nice guy. Maybe his life love lessons have been a bit dicey. I might give him that, but the way in which said individual comes off in this blog….this blog RIGHT HERE…I’m willing to bet my next school refund check that he is a LOT of the problem.

      Sad thing is, when you tell him, he has a defense for it all. So, I say keep complaining, stay single and bitter and let the other men with better dispositions get at the women willing to have them.

      Such is life!

      • whykendra

        “Because I usually go in on said “nice guy” commenter I’m gonna have to completely agree. If it’s who I think it is, it’s not that he’s nice…it’s that he’s a douche masquerading as a nice guy.”

        and its hilarious!!!

    • keisha brown

      LOL.
      i aint eeeeeven gonna say a word.
      *but sho is glad others had said what i dont need to say…

    • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

      I’m clueless…who is Champ talking about? The Realest Leo?

      #whenkeepingitrealgoeswrong lololol

      • simplysope

        Dayum, everyone else is trying to be all clandestine and sly, but we don’t play subtlety here @ VSB. #dead

        I ain’t mad, I was expecting the call out sooner. :p

        “#whenkeepingitrealgoeswrong” <- indeed

        • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

          ;) I don’t know how to be subtle. It’s one of my goals for 2011 though. LOL

          • simplysope

            Pfft subtlety is overrated. I can guarantee if this conversation was taking place in real life/time I would be the one to be like, “WHAT YOU MEAN THEREALESTLEO?!?!” while everyone else shushes me, because he has entered the room behind me. -_-

            Just keep being you, because I have found an e-sister, lol. Just consider it part of your charm, because I consider it a part of mine, lol.

            • http://twitter.com/SmartFoxGirl SmartFoxGirl

              Awww, tanks babeeee *Jamaican accent*…yeah it’s a part of my charm. Real life peeps love my honesty. ;) I figure I haven’t changed yet so this must be me and I’m more comfortable this way. lol

          • tgtaggie

            Ha!! Good goal. But on the real…dude sounds like he is a little bitter. Just a little. lol

      • Kimmy

        LMAOOO @ when keeping ir real goes wrong!

      • http://twitter.com/Phidelity15 Phidelity15

        LMAO really doe the only people who wouldn’t know who sent that question in are people who aren’t here everyday. And if I’m not mistaken dude has two posts pertaining to his situation and yet he still feels misunderstood and alone. No one’s gonna keep giving advice if its not gonna be taken and who has time to be throwing grown arse men pity parties?!? Certainly not me (in my E. Badu sanging voice)

        • PoliBohoGlam

          ” Certainly not me (in my E. Badu sanging voice)”

          This^ had me dreaming of Ms. Badu, herself, singing that to a certain lion from a dimly lit stage.

          Yes, thanks for alla dat!

      • http://twitter.com/#!/NewYork2VA NY2VA

        DEAD… and bout to be late for a meeting messing with y’all!

      • TezzyBaby

        LOL!! His name should just be part of the keyword link at the end.

      • Negrodamus

        I dont usually comment…

        But that was simply uncalled for and just plain mean.

  • tgtaggie

    “Because the idea of a black man having actual dating struggles is the complete antithesis of the prevailing idea that we’re all carefree mandingos with limitless romantic options, I understand why it’s difficult for some — and by “some” I mean “some black women” — to have any type of empathy or sympathy for a black “nice guy” finishing last, especially since their own dating acrimony has been widely publicized, scrutinized, and politicized.”

    @Champ. I completely agree. I think a lot men struggle being game challenged (I’ll be the first to admit. I am one of them. lol). And some bw won’t accept the fact that some men are game challenged. I think publicizing bm dating struggles isn’t as sexy as bw dating struggles.

    • Yeah*yeah*Yeah

      “I think a lot men struggle being game challenged…”

      Personally, when a person is use to hearing/experiencing “game,” spontaneity is refreshing.

      Overall most women want a confident man- period (no innuendo implied).

      • WIP

        Agreed. Be pleasant, break out a smile, and maybe, possibly, even…laugh.
        [s/n: Many guys have the same smiling problem y'all complain about from women.]

    • http://thatswhatgemsaid.wordpress.com Gem of the Ocean

      And some bw won’t accept the fact that some men are game challenged.

      while this might be true, i think the bigger issue is that many black women are looking for a guy who is assertive and direct. having “game” to most of us simply means a man knows how to approach a woman and get her interested in dating him. guys, this doesnt need to include lies, pick up lines (which should only be used for entertainment purposes only) or excessive/rehearsed flattery–it should be genuine convo that lets a woman know in no uncertain terms you’re attracted to her and are interested in getting to know her better.

      theres nothing worse than a man who pussyfoots and bullsh*ts around and doesnt make a move. who has time for mind-reading and guesstimating? many of us want to be pursued and KNOW we’re being pursued. if we feel like we have to make the first move or that you are too passive, we arent likely going to be interested.

      all that to say, its not some of yall black men are “game challenged” thats the problem. the problem is you lack confidence and directness.

      • Medium Meech

        So good game (aka game that you don’t realize is being run). Gotcha. Thing is, only a small percentage of the population will ever posses those skills, and since it is at such a premium in the black community, those guys will always have an abundance of options. Just as the bible says that it is nearly impossible for a wealthy man to get into heaven, the same can be said of the chances of a man with a wealth of options being a nice guy.

        Thus, nice guys do finish last because if they finished first, they wouldn’t be nice by definition.

        • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

          I Agree. This World brings the tough out of you. It is a heck of a lot easier to be rude and tough than to be sensitive emotionally while tough verbally. And creating that balance is something I’ve seen many struggle with and disregard.
          If it wasn’t for meeting my father, I’d still be struggling with it myself.
          I’m not struggling, I’m working towards it like a college course.
          The difference is in direction….but let me not make this about fatherless boys.
          It is about the balance of being progressive. But most get a pass as long as the only hurt the right people.

        • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

          My question has always been: Why does this seem to be only the case with MEN? I have many female friends who have a lot going for them–car, money, good job, nice place, at least pleasant-looking–but they’re not the vile creatures that men often turn into when they have these things. And, as many songs as there are glorifying a woman that “got her own”, BEWARE of the dude who likes that song, because it means that that woman with everything going for her won’t get taken out or treated right because, after all, she “got her own”. Well, pardon me, but I feel just as entitled as the arrogant, male version of myself for relationship success, but I don’t get it because of “male rationalization X, Y or Z”.

          • Medium Meech

            You’re setting up a straw man here. Most “nice dudes” complain because they have all the things you just mentioned but still don’t get play. And as your girls up thread say “feel entitled”

            With women who have those things, they turn into the same bitter incarnation as their male counterparts. Their script is closer to “Why is he dating that lesser chick and ignoring the beautiful chick with the PHD?”

            The difference? We know that females care about that stuff. Always have. We have no idea why you think we want that in a woman. We would be more impressed with you professional degree if it were stuffed in your bra instead hanging on your wall.

            • http://twitter.com/KitKatCuty84 KitKatCuty84

              I didn’t say anything about being “nice” or “bitter”. There are “nice” chicks (legit nice, not saying they’re nice but are actually throwing a pity party for themselves) that go alone, and there are “bitter” chicks that are driving men away with their attitudes the same way the “nice” men are.

              I did not get my job or education for men. I did it so I could be self-sufficient. I’m asking why a man’s self-sufficiency turns him into an arrogant jerk, and a woman’s makes her a pariah. So you don’t care about a woman’s resume unless it’s in her bra? Really? I think that’s simplistic.

              • Medium Meech

                I guess the disconnect is that I don’t see a woman’s degrees making her a pariah. And I don’t really see anyone else making that argument either. The only women that fit that criteria in my eyes were the ones I described. And I explained why those guys become jerks.

                And yeah, I was being flip about the degrees just to make a point. I admire an educated woman. But men are simplistic. Earning potential doesn’t do it for us.

            • CNotes

              *folds degrees and places in cleavage*

              • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                There goes a wise Woman…

                O.

                • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

                  Here is a primary difference that goes back to the Bible of all books(I’m paraphrasing).
                  Men operate based on respect and everything he does in an outlash is related to his perception that respect is lacking.
                  Women operate based on love and everything she does in an outlash is related to her not feeling loved.
                  There is a book called “Love and Respect”, it would help if I wasn’t the only one reading it. Ha. Not my book, btw.

                  Whereas a man looks to find a woman to RESPECT him for what HE DOES FOR HER. A woman simply wants a man who will ALWAYS SHOW HER THE LOVE THAT SHE FEELS SHE DESERVES.
                  This fundamental difference does a lot to separate mindsets in this day and age.

                  It is easier to act out in a rage of petty stuff when feeling disrespected because we feel everything is supposed to respect us when it doesn’t-thats why most men see themselves as a king(I.e. King of their own castles-this is a hint). Where as women tend to already not expect everyone to love them as long as they are getting love from somewhere. It takes so much more to sour a woman. Not saying that they are better but they need less overall work than men do.

                  But the way society views the differences between men and women is so ridiculous that most of you A) won’t believe me and B) won’t do any research to see if I’m just some loud mouthed lunatic spouting ish I may or may not know about.

                  grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

                • CNotes

                  @Obsidian

                  Ha! Thanks! : )

        • Jhane Sez

          “So good game (aka game that you don’t realize is being run). Gotcha”

          No… its more of the intent of a guy using “game” if he is just trying to score no woman wants to be a part of that.

          As in I just want to get the panties from any and every chick I see.

          If he is using “game” because he wants a relationship where I come from we call that courting.

          As in I really like this girl who is beautiful, funny and smart how do I get her to notice me so I can see if there is a possibility there.

          Most women don’t mind if you want to be a better man for love especially for them in particular

          What we don’t like is being hustled ~JS

          • Medium Meech

            I hear you, but we were talking about what attracted women, not what women wanted from a man. Since we can never truly no another person’s intentions then it’s the delivery and presentation that attracts women.

            If it truly were intentions that attracted women then nice guys by definition would stay winning.

            • Jhane Sez

              “I hear you, but we were talking about what attracted women, not what women wanted from a man.”

              This is an excellent point… there is a huge difference in who you are initially attracted to and how the relationship proceeds. ~JS

          • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

            Jhane,
            There is nothing wrong with a Man using Game to procure purely sexual relationships with Women, and why this notion hangs out there that there is something inherently wrong with such a Man, is ridiculous. We say NOTHING if a Woman wants the same thing, indeed she’s touted as the living embodiment of the liberated Woman ideal. But for a guy to want the same thing and to make use of field-tested methods to do it? Oh, he’s a pariah. What a crock.

            Look, the dating market is fierce and not for the faint of heart. Many of the same Women who talk all that jazz you just did above will turn right around and either do, or signoff, on some really foul stuff done to guys. We’ve all seen this happen, many of your ladies have done, right here in this forum. So let’s cut the crap. If a Woman is that determined not to get played, she’d best lock herself up in her crib and call it a day with her cats.

            O.

            • Jhane Sez

              “There is nothing wrong with a Man using Game to procure purely sexual relationships with Women, and why this notion hangs out there that there is something inherently wrong with such a Man, is ridiculous. We say NOTHING if a Woman wants the same thing, indeed she’s touted as the living embodiment of the liberated Woman ideal. But for a guy to want the same thing and to make use of field-tested methods to do it? Oh, he’s a pariah. What a crock.”

              You mad nephew… Obsidian puttin’ the flavor in yo ear… LMAO.

              Look I am a firm believer in grown folks making up their own minds about what they want to do with grown folks.

              But dudes who have to resort to manipulation to get a someone to agree to something they don’t want then they are a bottom feeder… PERIOD.

              There are plenty of chicks who are down for whatever… I just want those dudes to stay out of the monogamy pool.

              And I guess you do have a sense of humor… cause this is the funniest sh*t I’ve read from you ~JS

              • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                Oh BS, Woman, you know not what you are talking about. Women have manipulated Men from time immemorial, so don’t even fix your mouth to attempt to lecture me or any other Man about “manipulation”. Like I said, when you or any other Woman stops manipulating Men in the myriad ways you do, THEN you can come back here on your high horse. Until then, maybe you can kick it with Mr. Ed…

                And actually read the books we talked about earlier, you have a nasty habit of not doing your homework…

                O.

                • Jhane Sez

                  “Like I said, when you or any other Woman stops manipulating Men in the myriad ways you do, THEN you can come back here on your high horse.”

                  Too be clear I don’t like manipulative women either… bottom feeders can be women as well.

                  My disdain is gender neutral for those who can’t get what they want without resorting to manipulative tactics.

                  I think if you can’t get what you really want by being up front then you are asking the wrong person or for the wrong thing. ~JS

                • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                  Jhane,
                  When you go to interview for a job, do you wear what you feel like it? When on the job, do you tell your boos you think he/she is an A1 a**hole and jerk who couldn’t figure out their bunghole from a hole in the ground? How many people do you know do these things? And if they don’t are they too “manipulative”?

                  Like I said, actually read the books we talked about earlier. You truly do not know what you are talking about.

                  O.

                • Jhane Sez

                  “When you go to interview for a job, do you wear what you feel like it? When on the job, do you tell your boos you think he/she is an A1 a**hole and jerk who couldn’t figure out their bunghole from a hole in the ground? How many people do you know do these things? And if they don’t are they too “manipulative”?”

                  When I go on an interview I wear what is appropriate for the culture of the business or client.

                  When I find someone “difficult” in a professional situation I use tact.

                  And not sharing my every thought or acting on every impulse is part of the discipline of self-control with a touch of maturity thrown in to heighten the experience.

                  These behaviors are not considered the devious management of a situation for one’s own advantage… the actual definition of manipulation.

                  Displaying the behavior and an appearance consistent and appropriate for your environment is not only desirable but expected…

                  For adults at least.

                  And there is no inherant dishonesty involved. ~JS

                • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                  Jhane,
                  Not only do you sopund incredibly naive, but in this particular instance, ignorant to boot. You know not what you’re talking about wrt Game, and it would really be nice if you and others who take issue with things you don’t like actually go and read the damn books I bring up here before you go to shooting off outta the side of your neck.

                  SMH…

                  O.

                • UrbanDismay

                  I am astounded and appalled by the arrogance and disrespect in this and many of your comments.

                  Your “game” definitely needs some work, imo.

                • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                  UD,
                  And now here you come with overwrought indignation, not because what I said was true or not, but rather, because you don’t like it and the recipient of my slapdown happened to be a female. “I’m shockd – shocked!”.

                  Cry me a river…

                  O.

                • UrbanDismay

                  I didn’t argue any points with you because:

                  Jhane Sez did just fine in that regard, which is why you had to be dismissive in your responses to her. Your need to be right blinds you to other valid points of view.

                  That’s what you want. See above.

                  There was nothing “overwrought” about my indignation. I shouldn’t have even bothered with you because all I got was more of the same condescension and arrogance that you give everyone, men and women alike.

                  Instead of crying you a river, how about I build you a bridge to get over yourself.

                  Fin.

                • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

                  Ah, Urban Dismay is back for more, I see. I’m an accomodating Man. Shall we?

                  UD: I didn’t argue any points with you because:

                  O: You don’t know what you’re talking about.

                  UD: Jhane Sez did just fine in that regard, which is why you had to be dismissive in your responses to her. Your need to be right blinds you to other valid points of view.

                  O: And her need to spew stuff outta the side of her neck leads her to sounding ridiculous. Look here UD, you sound like a somewhat reasonable person, so I’m going to do you the favor of being blunt. I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me, so long as they have actually demonstrated having studied the materials under discussion. I have consistently found that people cling to their ideology rather than the actual facts of a matter. When it comes to the topic of Game, I have studied the matter, and she clearly has not. Thus, I am fully in my right to casually dismiss with all manner of jeers and rebuke until or unless she goes back and does said homework. Mind you, she is still free to disagree, but at least I can respect said disagreement because it is coming from an informed position. Such as it is, it is not. Hence my dismissal.

                  UD: That’s what you want. See above.

                  O: Indeed; see above.

                  UD: There was nothing “overwrought” about my indignation.

                  O: Yes there was. Outrage is overrated.

                  UD: I shouldn’t have even bothered with you because all I got was more of the same condescension and arrogance that you give everyone, men and women alike.

                  O: When you bring a boy scout’s pinknife to a gunfight, that tends to happen…

                  UD: Instead of crying you a river, how about I build you a bridge to get over yourself.

                  O: Whatever floats your proverbial boat…

                  UD: Fin.

                  O: Hallelujah! I’ll drink to that…

                  O.

      • tgtaggie

        “all that to say, its not some of yall black men are “game challenged” thats the problem. the problem is you lack confidence and directness.”

        I agree with you. I think in the past, I had this fear of rejection/failure which in turn killed the confidence part. Now I just don’t give a f*ck (about fear of rejection and confidence).

        I think I have always been passive when it comes to starting relationships. But once I get comfortable with someone I’m pretty cool. As in the words of Ron Burgundy: “I don’t know how to put this but I’m kind of a big deal….I’m very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.” lmao.

      • Tx10inch

        @Gem

        The problem is you lack confidence and directness.

        Shhhheeeet. Not me.

      • http://obsidianraw.bravejournal.com Obsidian

        Gem,
        I have a question:

        Have you ever read any “pickup material”, such as books like The Game? have you ever attended a “bootcamp”? Ever been to a “lair”? The reason I’m asking is because I’d like to know the basis on which you make the assertions about the Game above the way you do.

        Please explain?

        Thanks.

        O.

  • P.

    “To continue the analogy, contested three pointer = college degree, wide open three pointer = master’s/professional degree, foul shot = PhD, and lay-up = being born into the Bush family.”

    Are we talking a college or NBA three here?

    Either way, grad school is Gary f*cking Payton.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      college three.

      and, um, not sure if i get the reference to the glove there

      • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

        I think the Glove reference is to say that Grad School is “difficult to get beyond”. Because being from the greater Seattle area, if there is only one thing you knew about basketball, it was that Gary Payton is the defensive master of this domain. It doesn’t matter if logically he isn’t the best but he definitely is hyped up around here. People will talk of his basketball prowess for decades, at least around here.

      • WeGottaDoBetter

        I was lost too. GP=wide open 3?

      • P.

        Gary Payton is the person contesting my three. I was gonna go with Olajuwon or something, but it usually doesn’t make sense for a big man to be guarding the perimeter.

        This all made perfect sense at midnight when I typed it.

        • http://jouromeo.blogspot.com/ Sage of Silence

          Thats what I explained. I got what you were saying man. Maybe I over explained it. Scratchin’mh …oh well. :-D

  • Yeah*yeah*Yeah

    Uh you didn’t seem very confident in definitively answering the tool belt qstn- shortcoming?

    …couldn’t resist ;) ***he, hee, heeeee****

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      resist deez

  • Caballeroso

    “I want to know if it’s possible sleep your way into a man’s heart?”

    Yes, it’s possible, but only if he already likes you.

    • AfroRina

      If he really liked her, wouldn’t he want her to be his actual girlfriend or be willing to spend more quality time (talking more, going places, etc) instead of just the weekly booty call?

      • Mo-VSS

        @ AfroRina…It depends on what stage of life he’s in. He may really like her, but he may really want to continue dating and sport f-cking. If he’s of that mindest, he’ll do a lot of “relationship type” stuff with the girl he likes and can see himself with, but he’ll still knock off the club chick at random.

        It’s not until he’s ready to make that move that he will. If she’s there, she’s the one he’ll make the move with. If not, then he’ll continue until he finds one he wants that one-on-one with and make it happen.

        • Yoles

          Mo

          you truly are a VSS

          • Mo-VSS

            *e-daps Yoles*

            ‘preciate it! :D

        • http://www.twitter.com/girlgetalife V.E.G.

          Everything you said was true.

          I continue to say that men don’t necessarily end up with the woman they love the most, they end up with the woman they’re with and like the most when they are ready to make a commitment.

          This is seriously bad advice but, ladies, if there is a guy you have a connection with (and make sure it’s a real, not imagined connection) who isn’t yet ready to settle down, stay in his life as a ‘friend’ (continue to do you but don’t share your exploits as they could bite you in the butt later) and cook him a meal every blue moon. LOL. I’ve seen firsthand how doing this could benefit you. Of course, if Mr. Commitment comes around in the meantime, dump Mr. Commitment Phobe.

        • Girl Kanyeshrug

          That sounds like a great situation for HIM but messed up for her..She is supposed to wait around while he gets ‘ready to make that move’?

          • Deeds

            Naw I don’t think she should wait around. If he’s not ready then live your life and look for a guy that is.

          • Mo-VSS

            It is kinda him getting the best of both worlds, but that’s for the woman in his life to decide. If she wants to stay around and deal with that, while keeping her options open, then she must do so with the knowledge that it’s not fair….but life stopped being fair in kindergarten.

            So, it’s really a choice of what she wants to do. If she chooses to be the friend/f-k buddy in hopes that he’ll come around, then that’s HER CHOICE (choice being the operative word becauae these types of situations are not thrust upon women in the manner they would claim).

            But, yeah like someone else said, if another man, equally engaging comes along and wants to lock it down, then her best move is to make that move with him and give up the waiting game.

        • legitimate_soul

          *said like “Eat the Cake Anna Mae”* Write the book, Mo! Please and Thank you :)

          • Mo-VSS

            LMAO…girl I think that’s gonna be the title of the 36 chapter book! Thanks :)

    • WIP

      Cab setting them up for the okie-doke

  • TezzyBaby

    Dang!!! did you really have to provide a link to the man, maybe he wanted some anonymity. Either way I was thoroughly tickled by that. I like your basketball analogy and I may have to come up with one on a subject I know something about with the kids I mentor. I just cant compete with the “Pretty Boy Swags” of the world. I dont know if I would put a master’s on the same level with a professional degree, but I would def. put a PhD as a foul shot.

    I find the confidence idea to be pretty solid tactic on predicting size but it has to be the quiet, unobtrusive sort of confidence and you have to learn to tell the difference.

    Good luck with the 1st plight.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      “Dang!!! did you really have to provide a link to the man, maybe he wanted some anonymity.”

      i doubt that. he intentionally gave himself away in the question