Theory & Essay

Can Obama Save Marriage, the Economy, AND DIVORCE?

Let’s HOPE HE CAN!

As America and Washington, DC, gear up for the inauguration and the next four years of a Barack Obama presidency, we’re mired in a recession of tremendous proportions.  Blow.er.

Well, the economy is SO BAD, people can’t even afford to get a damn divorce anymore!

To wit:

With nearly one in six homes worth less than the mortgage owed on it, according to Moody’s Economy.com, divorce lawyers and financial advisors throughout the country say the logistics of divorce have been turned around.

“We used to fight about who gets to keep the house,” said Gary Nickelson, president of the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers. “Now we fight about who gets stuck with the dead cow.”

As a result, divorce has become more complicated and often more expensive, with lower prospects for money on the other side. Some divorce lawyers say that business has slowed down, or that clients are deciding to stay together because there are no assets left to help them start over.

If that ain’t a reason to be ready for Bush to get.the.f*ck.on. then I don’t know what is.  It’s so bad, folks are being forced to stay together because they’re essentially not worth crap and nobody wants to not be worth crap.  It’s like, craptastic.

In a normal economy, couples typically build equity in their homes, then divide that equity in a divorce, either after selling the house or with one partner buying out the other’s share. But after the recent boom and bust cycle, more couples own houses that neither spouse can afford to maintain, and that they cannot sell for what they owe on it. For couples already under stress, the family home has become a toxic asset.

You know what must suck?  Paying a $350K mortgage on a home that’s now only worth $280K.  But you know what sucks more than that AND Olivia Fox?  A de-valued home AND marriage and having no way in Hell of getting out of either.  And don’t get it twisted, these couples aren’t going to be forced to “work it out” and continue on with their marriage.  If anything, I’m guessing people will begin to hate eachother even more (assuming its reached non-amicable proportions) because not only is the love and thrill gone, but there’s no real money anymore either.  No lovin’ and no dividends?

Somebody might get OJ’d.

I’m not an advocate for divorce, but I’m also not the biggest advocate for marriage (though I’m all for anybody who’s really ready for it and is committed to staying that way).  Though I recognize the advantages of marriage, there’s a reason so many people end up in divorce:  I don’t think its hard enough to get married.  All you basically have to do is show up somewhere and you can lock yourself into the worst situation of your life.  Word to my brother.  I think if folks really had to prove to one another that they actually wanted to be married for the right reasons, marriages would probably last longer.

But as it is, that’s not the case right now.

And as that is, I do happen to believe that sometimes, two people really don’t belong together and when that time comes, it just may be necessary to sever ties.  If you didn’t try to make it work, well bully on you; however, that’s not my fight.  But imagine that you’ve exhausted all outlets short of BBJ himself coming down and fixing it and you’ve both resolved that its best to go your separate ways…

…but the economy has made it so that you can’t even afford to move on.  Let’s just hope we don’t hear about people flying off of balconies in the near future.

Word to Stanley Reimer.

We thought we needed Obama to forge the road for Black people, and we think he just might do wonders for Black love, but the economy needs him for more than just that.  We need him to help restore order to the marital order of things.

We need Obama to restore our 50 percent divorce rate so people can be happy again.

Obama, are you up for it?

Are you?!?!

-VSB P aka THE ARSONIST aka TANGLE JIG P

Filed Under: ,
Damon Young

Panama Jackson is pretty fly for a light guy. When he's not saving humanity with his words or making music with his mouth, you can find him at your mama's mama's house drinking her fine liquors. He believes the children are our future and is waiting to find out if he is the 2nd most interesting man in the world.

  • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

    I didn’t even read the post yet! I just wanted to be FIRST!! My 2009 is starting RIGHT!! YES!!! Now to read the post…

    • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com blackberry molasses

      @pgh muse,

      Aight, this ‘first’ business is getting a little ri-gatdang-diculous. People aren’t even reading the post and making relevant comments. I swear, the person who does the first “First!!!” post is going have to take up permanent residence in the Sat Down Corner.

      • http://lizburr.com Liz

        @blackberry molasses, i agree.

        • Gem of the Ocean

          awwww Liz, good to see ya!

          • http://lizburr.com Liz

            @Gem of the Ocean, Hahah thanks!!! I be lurkin.

      • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

        @blackberry molasses,

        Bwahahaha… AWWW BB Mo’! I don’t be on here late all the time!! Can i get a pass for tonight?? Please?

        • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

          @pgh muse,

          yes. just one though

        • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

          @ the first commentary,

          I personally think it’s all in good fun and would be crazy flattered if people stayed up to try to comment first on my blog… or got in line… is my comment decreasing bandwidth space or something? this is a BLOG… a very lighthearted, playful blog at times… just my opinion. my .02…

          • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

            @pgh muse,

            I personally think it’s all in good fun and would be crazy flattered if people stayed up to try to comment first on my blog

            i actually agree with you. the “first” sh*t doesnt bother me at all

            • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

              @The Champ,

              thanks and shyt, The Champ. Can I get a free VSB tshirt or something?

              • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

                @pgh muse,

                no

              • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

                @ The Champ,

                lol… say it again!

          • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

            @pgh muse, the champ and i talked about this before and though it ain’t that big a deal, i’m not sure how flattered anybody should be about it.

            for one, it aint like folks are lining up to be the first person to READ and then offer a substantive comment, its just lining up to be first, period. and it has nothing to do specifically with VSB.com. this just so happens to be the blog that you’re frequenting to do it on. it could just as easily be any other blog. being first has nothing to do with the post at hand. so for me, i can’t say i’m flattered by it being as it being first has nothing to do with the posts we even write. being first is just something folks race to do…just because. though it doesnt take anything away from the blog, it doesn’t add anything either.

            it just is.

            you’re right though, the blog is playful and lighthearted, so it aint killing anybody. but i’d be careful to try to attach much deeper meaning to folks attempts to be “first”. its just being “first” for “first’s sake”.

            • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

              @Panama Jackson,

              I’m saying PJ, whoever’s lined up to be first is getting u hits, which increases your blogs popularity, and the potential for ad revenue… I’m not trying to attach a deeper meaning. I’m saying I would be completely flattered by the popularity of my blog… and even more that people make an effort to participate. In whatever respect that they do. Isn’t a “first” post better than no post at all? Someone may come out of lurking (and I think it has happened since I’ve been following this blog) to post first. I think it’s cute. And it’s not like there aren’t plenty of substantive comments. This is once again just my .02.

              • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

                @ pgh muse, i seriously doubt folks lining up to say “first” is doing anything for our ad revenue. look, am i flattered by the popularity of our blog? of course, and i thank everybody for coming thru; without you all our site wouldn’t be squat. and granted, there are much bigger issues in the world to deal with. but since this has come up as a topic of discussion, let me ask you this:

                what exactly IS the point of being first, if all you have to say is “first”?

              • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

                @ Panama,

                There really isn’t much of a point. Personally it’s just shyts and giggles to me… when i’m on VSB honestly i’m usually procrastinating and wasting time. It’s a diversion from working. Doing what I should be doing. Although I find VSB to be a very thought provoking diversion at times, at other times it’s pure sugar… just for fun. That’s the point to me. It was like a little race and I won… nothing more, nothing less.

              • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

                @ Panama,

                I know this is your blog, and everything, but I don’t understand why folks that that so seriously. Like it’s offensive or something…

              • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

                @pgh muse, personally, it annoys me. that doesn’t mean i’m gonna ask folks to stop doing it. it is what it is. it happens on every somewhat popular site at some point. like i said before, there are much bigger fish to fry. i just wanted to understand it b/c i really just don’t see the point. but it is what it is. c’est la vie.

                carry on.

              • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

                @ Panama,

                Now that I know u find it to be annoying I won’t do it anymore. If ever I wait again for a post at 12:00am, i will make sure that I read it thoroughly before I comment. I have been chastened.

      • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

        @blackberry molasses,

        See that is all I been saying all along. But NO! I was being a wet blanket and sh*t!

        just cause you first don’t mean you are saying sh*t

        • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

          @Intellectual Hedonist, now dayumit I call foul yall trippin on saying Im first and not all of the other off topic foolishness that abounds…thats some whos on first ho sh!t if I ever heard it…LMAO……

      • eff yo couch

        @blackberry molasses,

        How about we make a new rule. Say for instance you can’t claim “first” unless you read and comment on the topic at hand. I think that’s fair

        • V Renee

          @eff yo couch

          Or not claiming first at all…….I believe we’re all rather smart around here and can see whose comment was first. ha

          • http://lizburr.com Liz

            @V Renee, right? i guess im more annoyed that the first comment says FIRST and nothing else. Like, at least say something in your comment relevant to something going on–besides the obvious.

            • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

              @Liz,

              I heart you…. that is all I was saying like 2 months ago.

              • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

                ok maybe I exagerate when I say two months I lost all track of time, being on vacation for 3 weeks will do that to a person

        • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

          @eff yo couch,

          hmmm… I’m gonna defer to Liz on this one. What say you, oh mighty site admin?

          • http://lizburr.com Liz

            @blackberry molasses, i secretly plot on the people who come in here screaming first and don’t say anything else. u know, one day u might come by and ur comment’s been moved to last….or it’s edited
            ….hahaha. but the champ won’t let me. punk.

            • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

              @Liz,

              That’s cause Champ is a “Salt Thrower”

              Just throwin mad salt in your game. Punk indeed.

              *sticks out tongue at Champers*

              • http://lizburr.com Liz

                @blackberry molasses, pretty much. lol.

              • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

                @blackberry molasses,

                the champ just has bigger fish to fry, like who the hell has been stealing my sharpened pencils from my desk.

              • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

                @blackberry molasses,

                Champ a salt thrower, hmmm Champie can you come throw some of that on my wlakway and steps they’re a little icy.

                I know nothing of your sharpened pencils whenever Im at your desk there is this other chick lurking though

      • Please Excuse Your Significant Other

        @blackberry molasses, hater

        • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

          @Please Excuse Your Significant Other,

          You know you love me. Smooches!

    • The Queen

      What is the point of saying first? I thought the point of reading the blog is to hmm read the blog?

  • Grace

    Apparently not first. That’s what I get for hesitating. Close though…..very close.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      @Grace,

      well, welcome and sh*t anyway

    • SouthernGirl

      @Grace,

      I’m gonna jump on the champ’s ‘anyway’ bandwagon…welcome! *gold stars* but pipe up and sh!t. comment and join the tomfoolery. lol.

  • http://naturallyalise.blogspot.com Relax, Relate, Alise

    As the semi-famous song goes “It’s Cheaper to Keep Her”…

    But, yes it is just too easy for couples to “tie dat knot”,( read: Vegas, et. al.) the problem is when folks think they are in-lubbb, they ain’t gonna respond to rational suggestions and look at reality to save themselves from themselves. Don’t believe me, try to convince my 23 yr. old little cousin that the ninja blantantly cheating on her with her homegirl ain’t the man for her, she’ll try to cut or tase you, smh…

    • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

      @Relax, Relate, Alise,

      i agree. Hormones can definitely cloud judgement. Hormones mixed with good D* can be lethal!! Lawd… where’s the good D* police when u need them?!?!

      • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com blackberry molasses

        @pgh muse,

        “Lawd… where’s the good D* police when u need them?!?!”

        Hanging out and getting donuts with the Ho Sh*t Police

        • http://naturallyalise.blogspot.com Relax, Relate, Alise

          @blackberry molasses,

          Glazed Hot Sign Ho-Sh*t

          ok, i aint even gonna start….

          • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

            @Relax, Relate, Alise,

            Handcuffed Ho Sh*t
            Krispy Kreme Ho Sh*t
            Brass Badge and Polyester Ho Sh*t
            Dunkin’ Donuts coffee and a stakeout Ho Sh*t
            Paddy Wagon Ho Sh*t… i need to go to bed… lol

            • Gem of the Ocean

              No Sh*t Like Ho-Po-Po Sh*t Ho Sh*t

              • 8th Wonder

                *dead*

    • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

      @Relax, Relate, Alise, I totally agree plus mofos be confusing what love is anyway.. love means you love the pros and cons..you know the crust of a muthaf!@cka..LOL you know the good and bad and accept them.. its the mofos that only know the good..or only choose to believe the good that leads them down the path to marital woe..thinking that the marriage will fix errything that aint perfect.. ..I mean I feel like it need to be a age llimit and minimum required “together time” and six months of counseling before you are even considered for a license….

      • http://fyre08.blogspot.com Ro

        @Shay-d-lady,
        “its the mofos that only know the good..or only choose to believe the good ”

        I agree with this wholeheartedly. You get a pocket full of sunshine for that one!

    • miss t-lee

      @Relax, Relate, Alise,
      “As the semi-famous song goes “It’s Cheaper to Keep Her”…”

      It has to be the Johnnie Taylor version though…lmao

      • http://naturallyalise.blogspot.com Relax, Relate, Alise

        @miss t-lee,

        And that ish has been in my head all day…

  • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

    I am really too tired to comment coherently on this EXCELLENT post as it relates to marriage… i will just offer that the stimulus package that the Obama administration is putting together really has to put some money in the pocket of average, middle income Americans… Mo’ money, mo’ purchases, mo’ jobs, mo’ consumerism. That is the only way to keep America running. Otherwise we the people may have to look at changing our gluttonous (spellcheck?) American lifestyles, which to me is wholistically better, but that is a can of worms to discuss in another forum I think. Good night VSB.

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

      @pgh muse,

      Otherwise we the people may have to look at changing our gluttonous (spellcheck?) American lifestyles

      you know, i was reading some argument somewhere that a recession would actually be the best thing for us, long-term, in that it would force us to change our habits

      • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

        @The Champ,

        I agree with this with all my heart and soul. Let Wall Street crumble… let it all fall down..

        • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

          @pgh muse,

          Everyone should google and watch “The Story of Stuff”… i would post a link but on the site u have to download it. It’s very informative about the hamsterwheel we’re on called life.

      • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

        @The Champ, though i can understand that ideology in theory, it seems rather shortsighted. whereas increasing gas prices has caused people to change their driving habits, which in turn is a plus for the environment, a depleted economy does nothing in the long-run to really stabilize American habits. for one, people losing jobs isn’t a plus for society as it strains our already strained general welfare (not welfare as in welfare mom, but as in safety nets like medicare and social security), which increases crime, etc. there’s no benefit to a sinking ship since at some point, you have to pick up the pieces and rebuild the ship. it’s better if you get to it before its been demolished to 1000 pieces.

        btw, i’m an economist. love me.

        • http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula 2.09. Requirements Gathering Phase.

          @Panama Jackson,

          But instead of putting the money in the pockets of the general population, wouldn’t it have been better if he went ahead with his (alleged)original plan to spend it on Infrastructure? The new bailout program is talking about 300 Billions in Tax rebates for individuals and Tax cuts for corporations. I do think that that approach is rather shortsighted as we’ve seen the “success”(drooling with sarcasm) of the first Bush cosigned rebate package.

          But I’m not an economist. Just an aficionado of all things economics. It’s ok to love me too. :D

      • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

        @The Champ,

        You know, I just read today that Larry Flint and Joe Francis are asking Congress for $5 billion to bail out the pron industry.

        Pretty soon, errything gonna be gumbent controlled. Including our s3xual habits. Feels like 1984 (I love this book).

        • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

          @blackberry molasses, i read that article. i wonder how many people actually think thats real. i spoke with a few people who were outraged and i couldn’t believe they were taking that seriously. lol.

          • Gem of the Ocean

            yeah. BIG publicity stunt. ummm hello, it is Larry Flynt afterall. he just needs to draw attn to himself. not that anyone should have to look at the unfortunate frontal structure of his head.

            • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

              @Gem of the Ocean,

              “unfortunate frontal structure of his head.”

              BBMo flatlines…..

              • Gem of the Ocean

                noooooo BBMoooooo!! *gets defribrillator*

                stand back ppl. i am not a medical doctor and have no idea what i’m doing. but i will save this woman!!!

          • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

            @Panama Jackson,

            I personally thought it was hilarious. I figure if they give money to pron, legalized s3x work and weed can’t be too far behind.

            My only concern would be once they give it money, they will control it. They ain’t gonna give it carte blanche like they did to the banking industry. Because that would be CRAZY! LMAO

  • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A.

    Ok, my previous comment was held for moderation. I don’t know why, so here it is again….

    I definitely agree it is too easy for people to get married and it’s too easy for people to get divorced. The bad economy forcing couples to stay together will either force them to work through whatever problems they thought they had, and restore the marriage, or they will kill each other. Or they could do like this Cambodian couple.
    http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/10/09/house.divided/index.html?eref=rss_topstories

    • RedBeanzNRice

      @N.I.A.,

      Funny stuff. I read about this a few months back and thought “Wow, he’s either super gangsta, or he has an unchecked mental disorder.”

      Either way, his actions were funny as hell.

    • Leila

      @N.I.A., I’m not sure if it’s forcing them to work out their problems. One of my closest friends is in this exact situation. He and his wife bought a home in 2005 and the value dropped by $150K. He wanted to leave her last year, but is staying until the house appreciates. He now really resents his marriage even more and barely acknowledges her and acts like a single man even they’re still married and living together.

      • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

        @Leila,

        I don’t think these bad economic times would really force anyone to want to work things out. Possible, maybe, but highly unlikely. If anything, it will exacerbate the problems already there.

        Thing is, your friend should go ahead and leave that chick. His personal happiness and mental well-being is more important than that house.

        • Please Excuse Your Significant Other

          @N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan…., his happiness and well being might also be shot when he sees how little he gets for that house

          • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

            @Please Excuse Your Significant Other,

            true true….

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

      @N.I.A., i don’t know if its too easy for people to get divorced. it may be too easy for people to decide to get divorced, but state laws are built to keep people married. and the legal process alone + the financial burden of divorce make it a difficult process. word to michael jordan and paul mccartney

      hell you see Shaq decided to stay with Shaunee (sp?) after he realized what divorce would entail.

      • http://verysmartbrothas.com The Champ

        @Panama Jackson,

        hell you see Shaq decided to stay with Shaunee (sp?) after he realized what divorce would entail.

        considering what (supposedly) happened between them, this was one of the most surprising news stories of the year

      • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

        @Panama Jackson, I agree that there are a lot of legalities that make divorce difficult. What I should have said was divorce is too easy of an option for people who would rather bail than work until you can’t work anymore. Marriage takes effort, and some times, people seek divorce too quickly

        • Leila

          @N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan…., It’s not that difficult if you do it in the DR. It takes 3 days…

  • Gem of the Ocean

    I think if folks really had to prove to one another that they actually wanted to be married for the right reasons, marriages would probably last longer.

    my thing is, many ppl think head over heels in love is requirement enough to get married. marriage is a business/economic partnership. so really, ppl shouldn’t be trying to marry anyone who hasn’t “proven they actually wanted to be married for the right reasons” (paraphrasing Peej). so if you understand marriage as the legally binding domestic/economic union that it is, the “right reasons” include the good, bad, and ugly side of finances, mortgages, health benefits, life insurance policies (in case things get REAL rough you might want to consider who you can COLLECT on that), etc…

    in general, i think lots of ppl (this is me speculating given the number of young and old divorced ppl i know) don’t have thorough convos about marriage and ALL that it entails– from raising children (if children are indeed wanted by both ppl) to retirements plans to “negro is your credit score going to impact us refinancing our home?” and so on.

    so though it may not be “hard enough to get married”, a successful marriage is going to take more than putting a ring on it, signing your names on a line, saying “i love you” and “i do”.

    • Gem of the Ocean

      …maybe you should have to add in your “more ppl”. which would include some ho ppl. and an albino midget riding a unicorn galloping through diva dust ™ and glitter. while black squirrels crack open acorns in the background…

    • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

      @Gem of the Ocean,

      U have made great points Gem, I just wanted to say that I loved your commentary on yesterday’s topic.

      • Gem of the Ocean

        awww thanks pookie poo!!

    • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

      @Gem of the Ocean,

      My pastor gave a sermon on this a couple of years ago and I think Gemmy you must of been there or maybe it was Peej because “marriage is a business/economic partnership” were the words he used. Right before he quoted scriture from the bible.

      you are so right though, we focus on the emotional aspect of love without consideration for the reality of the situation

      • Gem of the Ocean

        maybe i was there… maybe i wasn’t… lol i’ve heard some sermons on this too. i’ve also attended a young adult bible study that specifically focused on what makes marriages successful based on biblical principles. good stuff.

        i guess being the daughter of parents who both had previous marriages, i am very encouraged NOT to be a divorcée (inshAllah) and have to get back in the marriage saddle and try again. plus i’ve never seen “love” overcome the true tests and trials that can weigh down on a marriage. ppl would rather (a) stick it out and be miserable for some one they once loved deeply or (b) get a divorce becuz they think love has been lost. either way– the reliance is on love. and to that i say a big WHAT’S LOVE GOT TO DO WITH IT?!?! sure, love is great!! but love clouds judgment and really it’s just an emotional state of being. it cannot substitute rational, logical, purposeful thought or action.

        • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

          @Gem of the Ocean,

          This is an interesting perspective. Which brings us to the question of whether it’s even realistic to expect a marriage to last a life time. Or are people better suited for being serial monogamists? Is the concept of a lifelong marriage outdated?

          • Resident GRitS

            @pgh muse,

            …my heart wants to say ‘no’, but when I think about all the couples I know that were married 20, 30 or 40 years and got divorced…it’s hard not to say ‘yes’.

            ppl don’t keep jobs for a lifetime anymore…cars, houses or anything else that requires any kind of commitment. y should marriage be any different?

      • YGB

        @Intellectual Hedonist,
        “you are so right though, we focus on the emotional aspect of love without consideration for the reality of the situation”

        People seem to focus so much on the wedding and forget that there’s a marriage to maintain thereafter! A divorce lawyer friend of mine once told me that the worst mistake people make is to marry only for love. Now, of course love is essential but people never consider whether they have the same goals (in life and in the marriage) amongst other things.

        Just my 2 cents….

      • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

        @Intellectual Hedonist, i’ve always felt that marriage was more of a business decision than a romantic one. romance can die, but bad business will kill you.

        i’m all for the romanticized love for life and commitment that many people wish marriage was all about, but in truth, it’s so much more than just that. its just a merger of two prior separate business interests in hopes that their stock will do better together than it will do apart.

        • Resident GRitS

          @Panama Jackson,

          …nice metaphor.

        • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

          @Panama Jackson,

          a couple of weeks ago I was having this conversation with my girls and I concluded that I have done the relationship for love thing and honestly believe that the if I marry it will not necessarily be for Love. Do I hope that I am in love. Yes, but at this point in my life I have to look at things honestly and this whole looking at it from a business standpoint is probably going to be a better deal. Love will come.

          • http://insidethemindofadeviant.wordpress.com/ Deviant

            @Intellectual Hedonist,
            thats why people got married for in the first place. This love stuff got inserted into it later on.

    • YGB

      @Gem of the Ocean,

      De-lurking just to co-sign! Your post is the truth!

      • Gem of the Ocean

        well helloooooo there *waving*

      • SouthernGirl

        @YGB, welcome and sh!t *gold stars*

        • YGB

          @SouthernGirl,

          Tenks you – although I’ve posted on here before!

          • SouthernGirl

            @YGB, was this during my two-week break or i am slippin’?

    • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

      @Gem of the Ocean,
      co-sign.

      I know too many people who got married b/c it “felt right” (whatever that means), “he/she is the one”, or they got married b/c they were the only one of the crew who was still single. I think it’s great if people want to get married using love as the end all be all, they just need to be ready for all of the unlovely moments, and be realistic about what marriage really involves. The honeymoon doesn’t last indefinitely….

      p.s. Am I the only one who is completely in favor pre-nups?

      • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

        @N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan…., nope, Kanye love them too.

        • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

          @Panama Jackson,

          LOL!! I thought about Kanye after I wrote that…”we want pre-nup, we want pre-nup”

          Even still, a pre-nup can make things a lot easier if whe marraige dissolves. and it is a good way for women with trust funds or other inheritance to make sure her husband cannot under any circumstances, get near her family jewels after the marriage has ended.

      • Gem of the Ocean

        @N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….,

        yeah girl, ppl see marriage as a sparkly new toy–the wedding, honeymoon, and newly wed stage. dont really think about what happens when the toy ain’t so new anymore when you hafta look into the crust of a muthafugga.

        i think prenups are good for ppl who want to keep what was theres before a marriage happened. protect their prior investments without having to link them to their future spouse’s. i dont see nothin wrong (wrooooong) with a little bump and prenup. but whatever is acquired together in a marriage should be divided appropriately.

        • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

          @Gem of the Ocean, but whatever is acquired together in a marriage should be divided appropriately.

          agree 100%

      • http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula 2.09. Requirements Gathering Phase.

        @N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….,

        I just wish there was the option to keep our assets separated like in most European countries. It actually makes a lot of sense to each remain our separate business units and make business together.

        It would also work great in cases like Mardoff’s where couples invested together and are now broke…

        Better than pre-nup, we, the people, want “full separation of assets as an option upon taking the vows of marriage”.

        *gavel pounding*

  • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A.

    I quit….good night. See ya in the morning…

  • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

    I mentioned this to PBG yesterday when she was on TV blog

    One of my sorors (during a dinner I hosted at my house with 10 of them present) dropped a serious bomb on us, she said, she

    “resented that after I got married, not a single one of you who were present at my wedding ever asked me how my marriage was or how I was doing in my marriage, you were there as witnesses and you (pointed at me) were my maid of honor, and not once did any one of you fulfill your comitment as a witness to my marriage”

    Well, I for one was floored, you could have knocked me over with a feather. She was serious as h3ll.

    You see her marriage ended 2 years after she took her vows, and what she was saying wad BBJ and God’s honest truth. As the witness to said union it was my responsibility to inquire how she was in her marriage and how her marriage was. But as a woman I got all caught up in the wedding, the pomps and circumstance of it all, instead of being caught up in the marriage.

    Now I know and as a result I will not go gently to another wedding ceremony and reception to taste the rubbery chicken and see how fly the bride’s dress is, instead I will think, do I agree with this union. Am I satisfied that I will do my part to ensure that the bride and groom stay true to their marriage vows?

    And their you have it good people of VSB, the responsibility of an on looker in a marriage.

    • Gem of the Ocean

      instead I will think, do I agree with this union. Am I satisfied that I will do my part to ensure that the bride and groom stay true to their marriage vows?

      dang e-prima. that’s deep. and soooo important for friends and loved ones to check up on the status of things. be a support system. marriage isn’t solely about 2 ppl , they are the union of 2 circles, 2 families, 2 worlds.

      great point to bring up, chica. good job.

      • http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula 2.09. Requirements Gathering Phase.

        @Gem of the Ocean,

        marriage isn’t solely about 2 ppl , they are the union of 2 circles, 2 families, 2 worlds.

        And that’s a truth if I’ve ever seen one.

        Marriage is far from being just two people getting together. It’s mostly a joining of years of values, customs, habits, beliefs brought on and built with the people around you: family, friends, neighbors, etc…

        Each spouse brings that tapestry to the marriage. The people around them need to help them make sure those tapestries don’t clash.

        • KingPine

          @Sula 2.09. Requirements Gathering Phase.,

          couldn’t have said it better……go on!

        • Gem of the Ocean

          exactamente!

    • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

      @Intellectual Hedonist, I agree and disagree.. I think that if it is truly your friend you owe it to her to tell her how you feel but after that she has to make her own decisions, it is not up to you to inquire about her marriage but to be her friend and let her know that you are there for her. Now if you knew dude wasnt shyt and you sat up in the wedding never said anything and then cut her off I could understand (sort of) her point but as a grown mofo I aint blaming nobody if my marriage fails and I am not taking the blame for anyone elses…..

      • Gem of the Ocean

        i hear you, oh shay-d one, but what i got from IH’s comment is that sometimes ppl need a voice of reason, a reality check, a support system– in which this person double checks that they are indeed ready to make that big leap of marital one-ness. love can blind, as most of us have experienced once if not 100x. yeah we grown but that doesn’t mean we aren’t sometimes misguided and somewhat betrayed by our own ish. maybe IH’s girly need some one to ask if they’d “proven” themselves to each other that they’re marrying for all the right reasons, and all that. this doesn’t take away from girly’s ownership of her decisions. everybody gotta accept blame for their own sh*t (ho sh*t included). i don’t think IH’s comment was to shift the blame, but that’s just what i took away from it…

        idk. i think of cultures where the whole community is involved in a couple’s union. everybody takes responsibility in making sure things are cool. they care and want to see the union blossom and flourish and are long lived. and we should want that for our loved ones.

      • RedBeanzNRice

        @Shay-d-lady & Intellectual Hedonist
        “but as a grown mofo I aint blaming nobody if my marriage fails and I am not taking the blame for anyone elses…..”

        Gotta co-sign on that, bad credit and all, lol. IH, you know, it coulda really been that she was just very bitter cause of the divorce happening so soon after the marriage.

        If she went into the marriage with eyes wide shut, that’s really on her, not you – even though you were the MOH and ate the rubbery chicken.

        Aside from that, married women talk to their girlfriends about what’s up in their life anyway. Now, if she had dropped some hints, perhaps things would be different. But for her to EXPECT you and the other sorors to pry into how her married life is going is a bit much.

        Don’t let her blame rest on your shoulders, cause it’s not yours to carry. JMO.

      • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

        @Shay-d-lady,

        I think more of what she was saying was that as a guest to the wedding and eapecially if you are in the wedding you are in deed standing up for the bride or groom and as such you have a right to inquire the status of their marriage, which I can agree with to a certain extent. Her resentment came in when none of us did that. She takes full resposibility for her part in the failure of her marriage, however she wanted us to understand our role in her marriage.

        It honestly made me look at things differently.

        • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

          @Intellectual Hedonist,

          I agree with this wholeheartedly. I’m not sure which, i would have to do some source checking, but I know that in some cultures it is customary to marry before a community, in which the entire community is involved in the mediation of household disputes, and in the decision to disolve a union or not. I think we all need that kind of support system. We’re all human, whatever our age and your example of the marriage ceremony is a great example of what our responsibilities are to our loved ones beyond the superficial.

        • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

          @Intellectual Hedonist, I see what you saying I just dont buy that part of it.. your role as her friend is to check on HER… if you talked to her and asked her how she was doing then thats all you were suppose to do. I agree that before she took the big step if you and her were close you should have asked her if she was ready and if she and thought things through but thats it. It is not your responsibility or anyone elses to check on the marriage he.ll did you check on the relationhsip before marriage? and honestly if she went in with her eyes wide shut would it have made a difference? yall must be cool cause on the real that shyt would have made me look at her a whole lot differently.. …..and not in a good way

          • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

            @Shay-d-lady,

            This is true too… she may have threw severe shade if offered good advice prior to jumping the broom. Especially if she and the groom were really unevenly yoked from the start…good points on both sides.

        • Resident GRitS

          @Intellectual Hedonist,

          …she was crying out for help. And, u know, the same way that you got caught up in ceremony of it all, it sounds as if she might have been caught up herself…so she needed (in the literal sense of the word) someone who was close to her to help her think the marriage through instead of focusing on the ceremony.

          …and that’s hard to do, especially as the MOH. U were likely concentrating on your duties leading up to the wedding day and gave little thought to the duties that come after. I think most ppl assume that after a couple gets married, they’d like their space…time to be w/each other, time to acclimate to the situation…and, so, we typically keep our distance. It’s one thing to be invited to the wedding, but your girl was telling you (too late) that you were also invited to the marriage.

          I’m grateful for this post. Just Monday, one of my former best friends (who’s also a former lesbian, however that works) told me that she’s getting married to a man and asked if I’d be in the wedding or help her plan. I declined b/c I felt like she was being rash…and I had mixed feelings that I couldn’t vocalize. I realize now, after reading your post, that I can’t agree with the union…and I’d be uncomfortable being witness for that reason.

          Thanks for being so candid. VSB.com: where real sh*t happens.

          • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

            @Resident GRitS, she was crying out for help. And, u know, the same way that you got caught up in ceremony of it all, it sounds as if she might have been caught up herself…so she needed (in the literal sense of the word) someone who was close to her to help her think the marriage through instead of focusing on the ceremony.
            but shouldnt she have thought it through? at the point of the ceremony shouldnt all that deep thought and discussion have happened before? where was her mother, her aunts, her uncles..was the union a bad idea from the beginning? did you never say anything?
            see in the example you give grits I would hesitate too.. not for the union but because of the friendship having fallen off and me not really being there for the relationship but if we had been girls from the get go..the way I roll we would have already talked about the relationship and pros and cons etc and if you still decided to walk into the wall of marital bliss I would have been there with you because my role as a friend is not to make decisions for you or to prevent your from making mistakes its to tell you the truth (as I see it), give my opinion and to be there with the tissue, a shoulder, bail, or even a couch to crash on when it goes bad and celebrate the loudest when it goes well….

            • Resident GRitS

              @Shay-d-lady,

              yeah…that situation’s just generally fcuked up. we’re not close enough NOW that I would’ve had the opportunity to tell her the truth as I see it before she said yes…apparently, she’s got no other real friends if she asked me…I wish I could be there for her but I can’t condone it…and since I declined, we’re back to not talking. sh*t…what else can I do? I think I’m done here.

            • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

              @Shay-d-lady,

              Ok here is the deal, she was/is my girl, by all accounts what I knew, what she told of the relationship it was good.

              My perspective was that I didnt know I should be asking how y’all doing in your marriage. I assumed he didnt loose him mind after marriage, which is apparantly what happened

    • http://clubshiznit.blogspot.com/ Mme. Editor-in-Chief

      @Intellectual Hedonist,

      Well dang! Thanks for letting this sista know the role of a bridesmaid, because clearly I have been doing it wrong. I have never checked up on any of the persons, whose wedding I was in. Because quite frankly I am of the mind that it won’t last anyway. I thought I was just there to wear the heck out of a dress and mind my own bid’ness!

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=73903598 Dom

        @Mme. Editor-in-Chief,

        “Because quite frankly I am of the mind that it won’t last anyway”

        Dam*. Well, whats the purpose of going and standing up to co-sign what you believe is BS?

      • miss t-lee

        @Mme. Editor-in-Chief,
        Oh snap! I’m in a wedding this summer, I didn’t know I had all those additional responsibilities…I guess I better pay attention (full sarcasm intended…lol)

        @ IH…your friend was trippin’…lol

        • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

          @miss t-lee,

          I don’t know if she was completely trippin, but she was DEFNITELY on some ‘next level sh*t’ with the charge she leveled at her sorors.

          In all honesty, weddings are meant to be ceremonious celebrations of the joining of two lives together. I think the only people who should be invited/included in the wedding party are those people who had a vested interest in the relationship and its success.

          Par example, I had a VERY small wedding (well, small for my culture… my contemporaries generally invite every Ghanaian in a 100 mile radius) I had 77 people, including the wedding party, parents, grand parents and the officiant. The wedding party consisted only of people who were privy to us b*tching, fighting, breaking and making up during our courtship. The ones who were like “girl, i know you’re mad as hell, but he loves you and he’s a good man” and “man, I know she trippin, but that’s a good girl. hang on to her”
          It was a celebration of our union but also a big “Thank you” to everyone who supported our relationship, and a charge to them to continue their support.

          That being said, I don’t accept wedding invitations/ bridal party requests all willy-nilly. Especially if I don’t support the relationship or think it has a snowball’s chance in H3ll of working out. I didn’t even stand up for my bestest friend in the whole world during her first wedding because I knew it wasn’t right… 5 years later it was over. But if her current beau pops the question, I have my MOH dress READY.

          • miss t-lee

            @blackberry molasses,
            I understand completely what you’re saying.

            Myself this will be my 1st wedding since I was the flower girl in my Aintee’s wedding back in ’84…lol

            I completely support my girl cause I know she’s been through it the last 9 years that we’ve been friends and this guy is a keeper.
            Reading your comment made me appreciate the gesture that much more, of her asking me to be involved in her special day.

          • Gem of the Ocean

            @blackberry molasses,

            O.M.frikkin.G!!!!!!! i call my bestie “bestest friend in the whole world” too!!!!!!!! we grew up together from birth, like literally. our parents have lived next door to each other since 3yrs before we were born. still live next to each other. ppl laughed at s for callin each other “bestest” friend in the www but that’s what we are to each other!

            sorry. i had a moment and had to share with you BBMo. i must now call the bfitwww and tell her about this lol.

            • http://lostwomanchild.blogspot.com/ blackberry molasses

              @Gem of the Ocean, LMAO… I just texted mine. Great minds and shyt.
              We’ve been friends since that first day in Kidz Church nearly 22 years ago.

              (The way we wild out, people LAUGH OUT LOUD when they find out we met in church. Just because we are Christian girls doesn’t mean we are boring… sheesh!)

              Though I’m still pissed at her for making me take the ‘Body Works’ class last night. I can barely climb stairs today, and I’m walking like I ‘did something’ last night.

              • Gem of the Ocean

                LOL. i wish me and the bestie lived in the same city–we haven’t since hs. i was in atl for undergrad now she’s there post-bac. but we do make sure we’re keepin to our workout schedules!! she text me the other day like “do you use the stairmaster? i’m scared of it”and i spent many texts convincing her to get her climb on and get that booty right. i love that crazy gal.

          • http://freetherapyorelse.blogspot.com Sula 2.09. Requirements Gathering Phase.

            @blackberry molasses,

            I’ll have to cosign this here post.

            When the officiant says the words “if anybody has any qualms about the wedding they should speak up or hold their piece (or peace?) forever”, it’s not supposed to just be words. It’s the community taking the responsibility to cosign the wedding.

            That’s why some churched have publication of banns a good two months prior to the wedding, so that anybody can contact the pastor privately if they think the marriage is not going to work.

    • http://fyre08.blogspot.com Ro

      @Intellectual Hedonist,

      My initial reaction to reading that was “who said I was responsible for your marriage?” Because truth be told I am not.

      After thinking about it… I’m on the fence about her statements.

      I say that b/c I know from personal experience that if my friends/sisters/ someone I really cared about decided to make such a decision…then I, as your friend…someone you’ve come to rely on to be honest in all things, will tell you how I feel beforehand. If you still wanna do it, then fine. At least I told you. I’ll even go to the wedding, participate in it if invited to do so…but if it comes to an end… keep all ya resentful comments to ya self cuz I done told you.

      I see no reason for me to stand up mid ceremony to state my objections. I will bring them to you in the privacy of a conversation before hand. B/c if you’re going to do it, I will not be the one responsible for ruining your wedding day…regardless of how doomed the wedding is going to be.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=73903598 Dom

        @Ro,

        I agree with this. One of my homegirls was engaged last year. When she told me I just said “uh-huh…well, congratulations.” I love her to death and I knew she was making a big mistake. I told her personally a few months later the reservations I had(He was verbally abusive and a rampant cheater) and eventually she came to her senses.

        I still would have gone to the wedding and supported her regardless. But my conscience wouldn’t let me stay silent for too long.

    • SouthernGirl

      @Intellectual Hedonist, i guess my only question from your comment is to what level she expected you to be involved or how close the two of you are? because it could be in the way you are relaying the story or i might be missing something but it’s coming across as if you stood up and then threw her the deuce and ya’ll never discussed her marriage again.

      because if that’s your girl, don’t you talk to her and know how she’s doing/going through or ask after her husband in ya’lls calling to catch up moments? or was she looking for you to specifically say, hey, how’s your marriage going and get all into the dirty laundry and ask for a play by play?

      i know i have done both-just had general girl talk conversations and specifically asked how married life was. and not necessarily out of some duty based on that fact that i stood up at their wedding (in the cases i’m speaking of i was invited to the wedding, not in it or just an old friend that i’m now catching up with) but because i know and care about this person and am truly concerned about how they are doing in their lives.

      so, without knowing specifically what the details are or what her intentions were, on the surface i agree with her.

      • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

        @SouthernGirl,

        I think she was looking for something that neither I nor the rest of my sorors knew was our responsibility.

        I mean after she got married I would talk to her ask how she was doing and how things were, but I wasnt prying. I figured if things were hard, or he was being physically or emotionally abusive she would say something.

        There are other factors, she moved out of state, was in grad school, her husband in med school. By her being away we didnt hang out at all. Technology then was not what is now, so our communication was limited to when we saw each other at other weddings and a call on her birthday, holidays, and such. So even if she wasnt verbalizing what was going on, I had no hint that something ws stressing her or him for that matter.

        Like I said previously going in to their marriage, I was for it and agreed with it, but I dont think that I realized what she was asking me to do when she asked me to stand up with her, and I dont know that anyone that attended her weding understood what she was asking them to do as witnesses to her nuptuals.

        IDK

        • SouthernGirl

          @Intellectual Hedonist, ok, I see. well, if you were communicating with her and asking after her and her life, etc. and she didn’t communicate anything to you then I would have been surprised at what she said as well.

  • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

    okay what the f!Ck is up with that big a$$ add before the comments..yall know I am sitting here with out my contacts and was confused as he.ll
    I digress Good Topic PJ
    I say people are to afraid of shyt.. let the dayum house go and file bankruptcy.. he.ll you can do a no fault divorce yourself for 250.00 (so I heard on a t.v. commercial)but you can still survive quite well on cash and a checking account…he..ll a savings account if you must…murdering a mutha will give y ou a lot more time and staying in some shyt that has you all f!cked will kill you slowly inside…people use any excuse to condone some bullshyt.. know you trying to keep up appearances let that shyt go and you will be much happier in your rented 2 bedroom than you will be in your 300,00 6 bed 4 bath jail that love built..

    • http://www.museacdonline.com pgh muse

      @Shay-d-lady,

      Word!

    • Resident GRitS

      @Shay-d-lady,

      (snaps profusely)

    • http://verysmartbrothas.com Panama Jackson

      @Shay-d-lady, trust me…when i saw that ad i spit my red kool-aid all over my macbook. and it was red kool-aid cuz my macbook is black.

      like my president.

      hoo-rah.

      that ad was disturbing but apparently it changes.

    • http://nianaturally.blogspot.com N.I.A. thinkingofamasterplan….

      @Shay-d-lady,
      I hereby co-sign the above statement.

  • http://www.myspace.com/circa1908 Intellectual Hedonist

    I was censored and I can’t even go back an make editorial corrections to my typo’s

    • http://www.myspace.com/shay_d_lady79 Shay-d-lady

      @Intellectual Hedonist, LOL dont you hate that? especially when you can picture the typo in your head