As we all know, February is Black History Month. For the record, I’m not one of those people who complain that somehow Black history coincides with the shortest month of the year. Frankly, I don’t give a damn. It’s not like we (and by we, I mean those Black folks who complain that Black History Month is the shortest month of the year) really commemorate Black achievements all day everyday anyway. Besides, it used to be Black History WEEK, so I look at it like this…
…we got 21 more days to complain that America doesn’t do enough to celebrate Black achievements and accomplishments!
BAZINGA!
Anyway, being as its Black people month, and being as that I’m Black, I see it only fitting that I dedicate some posts in February to Black topics. Its gonna be on and poppin’. As well it should be since Black folks often get it on and poppin’ with things such as the bottle formerly known as Cristal, thongs, pills, and basketball. One could say we are a poppalicious people, though I prefer the bootylicious nature of Black women. And I don’t care how much you hate Beyonce, “Bootylicious†(written and produced/co-produced/conceived by Beyonce) was a great moment in Black history. Honestly…with lyrics like, “I don’t think you’re ready/for this jellyâ€, how could it not progress Black society. Kids everywhere were running around embarassing the sh*t out of us folks that can read talking about being bootylicious. Hell, even WHITE girls got into the act, further making me want to kill myself.
Okay, I swear that there is a point in there somewhere.
Ah yes, Black America’s secret shame. There are different kinds of Black folks out there. I know, shocker. Many have tried to paint Black people with one brush and say that we are all one and the burdens of my brother are my burdens. And I used to believe that until a strange thing happened one day. Can you guess what it was? Go ahead, take a gander.
*singing “I’m sexy and I know itâ€*
Done guessing?? Good. What happened to me was that I learned how to read.
*gasp*
That might sound messed up, but fret not, it gets worse. When I learned to read, a whole new world opened up to me. Butterfly’s in the sky, hell, I could fly twice as high like Aladdin and Jasmine! The older I’ve gotten and the more I’ve read, the more things have changed. Over time, I learned to not be afraid of information and actually seek it out causing me to do things that other Black men didn’t do like…go to college. Or even graduate. No Kanye.
So it was in this new world with new knowledge I obtained from reading new sh*t that I started to notice the differences between Black people. And just to be purposefully offensive, I’ll state some of the differences I noticed:
Some Black folks worked, some didn’t.
Some lived in suburbs, some lived in projects.
Some tried to assimilate into white society, some acted like assholes in public…almost seeming to be on purpose.
Some were reserved, some are just loud.
These are just a few of the differences. But that last one is the one that stands out to me. It brought to my attention and epiphanized a strange phenomenon in the Black community. It would seem that Black America’s Secret Shame is…
…hold on…
…it’s coming…
…wait for it…
…Black people.
Yes. Black people. Black American’s are secretly ashamed of other Black people. I know. It’s one of the most fucked up things you’ve ever heard. I hear you looking at me crazy. But it’s true. Black people that can read and write, and have gardens to tend, and garages that actually house cars, and have the OPTION to live amongst white people are ashamed of other Black people.
[***DISCLAIMER: These are fun, I swear. Which Black people am I talking about that are ashamed of other Black people??? You ninja. Yes you, the Black person that is reading this right now instead of in the projects affectionately known as WorldStarHipHop. The Black person who reads and writes. F*ck that, the Black person who ENJOYS reading. Yes, you. Does it sound elitist? Yes it does...but here's the test: if you have at any point in your existence, been somewhere, and an unruly group of Black youth have come into your presence and you cringed and/or uttered the word "n*ggas" under your breath...then this means you. Mmkay pumpkin?***]
Believe you me, it’s true. It’s a sad reality yet one that exists. Take for instance young Black folks on subway systems across America. Now those youth don’t care about being loud and obnoxious. Hell, it’s what kids do. However, you care. You wonder to yourself , why the hell they won’t shut up. Then you do scan the audience the kids have attracted. You scan the white faces for disapproval, and then you scan the Black faces for disgust.
For some reason, both the Black and white people are upset at the ungodly display of the youths. White folks will just have their notions reinforced, and Black folks will be afraid that the white folks are having their notions reinforced. And somewhere shame comes into the picture. Black folks start to think, “dammit, why won’t they just act right, they are making us all look bad. F*ckin’ cockaroaches!â€
You have experienced…honest to goodness…
…shame.
Shame for fear that those Black folks who aren’t like you are setting us normal Black folks back years and years. It is that same shame that occurs when you take a ghetto member of your family out with you who then proceeds to act a damn fool on purpose, proving why they are the ghetto member of your family.
But you know what, they are ashamed of you too.
Sometimes they are trying to prove a point, too. The point may be that you aren’t any better than they are. And they are just as ashamed because they feel like you sold out when they remember when you all used to sleep three to a bed. They are ashamed, and thus shaming your bougie ass into realizing that you aren’t any better than they are. Hmm, ironic isn’t it. The better off we are, the more reminders we get from folks who aren’t so well off that we ain’t sh*t and didn’t come from sh*t.
Differences.
I’m not judging nor looking down on anybody. I’ve done more than my fair share in both worlds. As far as I’m concerned we all came from nothing. Essentially, I love all my Black peoples. EXCEPT those ignant somebodies who feel the need to make me look bad so that they don’t look bad by themselves. Crabs in a barrel are a b*tch. And it is those Black folks who draw my ire time and time again. The ones who are ashamed but secretly jealous of the Black folks who are doing well because those Black folks are sellouts and have no place in the hood. Those Black folks who are ashamed of other Black folks success because they don’t have it.
But it goes the other way too. Those Black folks who are educated and well to do, who are ashamed of their lower income brothers and sisters who may not have had the same opportunities that they’ve had. The ones who turn their noses up at less privileged Blacks with no provocation. The ones who talk about the ghetto without ever having been to the ghetto or lived there. The ones who laugh when some of us drink Kool-Aid. Hell, the ones who don’t realize that “red†is a flavor, and judge Black folks who know that it indeed is a flavor. Basically, Black folks who have the time to castigate other Black folks because they’ve made it and refuse to accept that making it where you’ve made it wasn’t solely on your own merit. Sometimes, folks believed in you enough to not let you fail. And it’s those folks that refuse to recognize or accept that, who are ashamed of lower income Black folks and their lot in life. Those Black folks piss me off too.
And there you have it. Black America’s secret shame is other Black people. From rich to poor, we are all ashamed of one another for reasons that are beyond me that will continue to keep us down. Sometimes we show out for white folks by showing them how comfortable they should be around us. We have a term for that…selling out. And sometimes we show out for white folks to show them that we don’t give a sh*t about them, except what we’re doing is furthering their own beliefs that Black folks have no damn sense anyway and are all useless. We have a term for this too…being a dbag. And they all lead to the same end…shame from some other member of the Black race.
And this is why we won’t make it as a people…and you know what…
…it’s a damn shame.
Ain’t it?
What say you?
-VSB P aka THE ARSONIST aka MR. SUPER B.A.S.S. aka GIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRL HE A 3
For the DC heads, its time again for another edition of REMINISCE! at Liv Nightclub this Saturday, February 4th, 2012 from 930pm til 3am. It’s all 90s everything and anybody who has been will tell you this party is a motherf*cking monster. It’s FREE BEFORE 11PM WITH RSVP ($10 after) (click the link to RSVP), OPEN BAR FROM 930-1030PM (doors open earlier b/c people keep showing up MAD early) and no dress code. Supa Qool DJ Quartermaine on the 1s and 2s. Come on out and we’ll see you on Saturday night! Peep the FB event here!
I’m ashamed of women who have multiple kids with multiple men. Not like two kids by two different men over a ten year time span. That sh*t happens. But, the woman who has 4 or 5 or 6 kids and each of those kids has a different father. There is not any reason for anyone to have that many kids and just as many fathers. Oh…and this isn’t gender biased. I hate those men with just as many mothers to their kids as the number of kids they have.
Is that elitist? Maybe. But I don’t care. It’s hard enough being a two parent household or co-parenting with someone you’re not with any longer. Add 3 or 4 other folks to the mix and it’s disasterous. Don’t think these folks exist. I have former friends and some family members who fit the description, so it’s not like I have a “not in my house, nose-turned-up, outsider” perspective.
Loud, obxious folks don’t bother me too much. I’m sure my friends and I were once that excited about life and loudly proclaiming it to anyone within earshot. The thing I hate is that when a group of “us” is loud and wrong, it’s reflected back on all of us (at least that’s what I’ve been told…by other black folks…I wonder if that is really what white folks think, but I digress…) but let a group of “them” come along doing the same thing, it’s just THEM…not all white folk. I’ll be very happy when we can be looked at less as of a collective and more as individuals.
I’m sure I’ll die before that happens though…
Actually, I do have a “not in my house, nose-turned-up, outsider” perspective.
I don’t care. Not too many things I take a stand on, but multiple kids (more than 2) with multiple partners bothers the hell out of me.
I have to agree with you. One of my pet peeves is a woman or man with multiple children, by multiple partners, and no true means to take care of said offspring.
But I also know that I didn’t become that type of woman because I had a mother who was nosey and made sure she minded my business when I was a teenager. I always had someone there to guide me and to help me. Some people don’t. I’m saying it’s an excuse, because there are some people who didn’t have shit, yet still managed to make it out of their circumstances. However, sometimes we fall victim to what we have witnessed our entire lives. And if all you’ve seen as a child is grown women and men making a substantial amount of children and not caring for them, then the chances of you doing the same are equally as great.
I’m halfway there with you Mo. I don’t feel ashamed though. I feel sad. Sometimes you look at a situation and (it might be wrong of me) I feel like those kids don’t even have a real chance of becoming productive people in life. That’s really the kind of thing that bothers me.
“I feel like those kids don’t even have a real chance of becoming productive people in life.”
I’ve felt this way often. I look at some children’s parents and I am instantly saddened that #1) they choose to have children and #2) they may pass along their mentality to those children who will become adults and possibly continue the cycle of ignorance.
That is my problem right there…the ignorance. I really hope and pray that all children have a positive influence in their life to mentor and guide them….to show them that they can do better and be more. They can break the cycle of ignorance. We don’t get to choose our parents and they didn’t get to choose theirs. Some adults have no business reproducing. Some people grow up to be such a waste of an x or y chromosome….
I agree 100% with the multiple baby mamas/daddys. They are the reason that people look at me in shock when I tell them Im over 30 and don’t have kids.
Plus I feel bad for the children. It has to be hard to deal with.
I know a guy who has 5 kids by 4 women (yes there’s a set of twins) and i think he really believes he’s a good father. I had to tell him there is no way you can be a good father to 5 kids in 2-3 different states. Even if you provide financially you can’t possibly be there for all of them. You can’t be at everyone’s Christmas dinner, basketball game or soccer practice. .
Yes I have a right to be ashamed of behavior I didn’t grow up with. I have a right to be embarrassed by black males calling themselves niggers. I have a right to be emabrrased about rarely meeting a man without kids in his 20′s. Or to be embarrassed about women with 4 kids in tow by themselves and OOW. Or about the prison rates for an already small minority.
Try being a 24 yr old black man with people being amazed i don’t have kids yet. That is what’s so scary nowadays is that its pretty much the accepted norm in the black community to have a kid pretty much right after High school. I can honestly say that i’m one of the last few people out of my graduating class that has not had a kid yet.
Can’t figure out these birds who want treatment like a new born virgin but let every dude in the hood treat her like a bust it baby, with the kids to prove it.
Obviously color has nothing to do with that set up because it happens to many races, but obviously Black people take that ignorance to a whole new level and I can’t ever see it changing.
having multiple kids by multiple baby fathers aka…”Baduism”
tee hee…
Baduism….well seems to me that people like Badu AND Ms. Hill can afford those kids they make without my tax money.
Mo-VSS on 02/03/2012 at 1:14 am said:
I’m ashamed of women who have multiple kids with multiple men. Not like two kids by two different men over a ten year time span. That sh*t happens. But, the woman who has 4 or 5 or 6 kids and each of those kids has a different father. There is not any reason for anyone to have that many kids and just as many fathers. Oh…and this isn’t gender biased. I hate those men with just as many mothers to their kids as the number of kids they have.
I can understand that I dotn think I am ashamed to them but as someone stated above i am sad.. but what makes me upset is that a lot of the things only apply if it happens to people in the hood.. cause Erykah badu got just as many kids as she got baby daddies and people hold her up up to the highest of high.
and I love me some Erykah but.. come on now..
I think having kids with any amount of daddies is terrible when you cannot afford to take care of them, or don’t do the work to be a parent. It’s not “better” to have 3 kids with one dad if he is a bum bitch. If a woman adopted 3 children that were not biological siblings, she’d have three kids who have 3 different daddies, and no one would bat an eyelash.
“It’s not “better†to have 3 kids with one dad if he is a bum bitch.”
A-freaking-men. I approve this message as a mother with 3 with one man who ain’t shyt. I know I couldn’t handle 3 of them mofo’s.
Adopting three kids is something ENTIRELY different. I guess the mindset that goes with having 3-4 kids with 3-4 different men is what I hate. If you plan to adopt, most would agree that they time, effort and money it takes to make that happen is something that is far different from laying down with multiple folks, not taking proper precautions and ending up pregnant or getting someone pregnant.
Let’s not forget the absent black male who only knows not like Bo…..making double even triple-digit-mega kids…..We can’t expect black moraility when we have baby daddies who are not attributes. The black culture must have the father’s presence to nourish, stimulate and empower HIS kids for their spiritual and mental growth. Making child(ren) the biggest investment after God is the the wholeness for a systematic youth, society and world. To have proper perspective amongst the black culture, we have to start with the missing puzzle…fathers manning up to be daddies.
I am not discriminate. Any woman or man, hood-based or not, who falls into this category gets the side eye from me. Race, class, etc, Don’t care. It’s all bothersome as hell to me.
That is my biggest shame of my brothers and sisters within the black community. I understand ish happens but after three kids with 3 different men/women, you have to wonder “what the h-e-double hockeysticks is going on?”.
What kills me the most is that some women think that just because the baby father buys their child the latest Nike sneaker or some Name-brand outfit baby gift set they get at Dr. Jays that what makes them a great father which really shames me the most. It’s the attitudes that I be encountering that just cringes my nerves.
I don’t necessarily hate the women with 6 different kids from 6 different fathers. I only dislike those women who say the most stupid paragraph in spoken language, “I don’t need no man! I’m da mama and the daddy! I can take care of my 6 kids by myself!”
I agree with you to a certain point, folks have to do a better job with knowing who they are in a relationship with before bringing children into the world. I will not even get on the one-night-stand, I don’t know who my baby daddy is chick or the It ain’t mine irresponsible cat. The is a whole separate email. We have to educate next generations on being socially responsible and have some pride in themselves and be accountable for their actions. We need more thinking before humping. Boys need to step up and be a man if your get her pregnant, girls keep your legs closed until you have an education and a plan B.
The thing I hate is that when a group of “us†is loud and wrong, it’s reflected back on all of us (at least that’s what I’ve been told…by other black folks… that why we don’t get along now because of stupid comments like the one above, get a life whok cause white people do it all the time and all we say is oh their white its ok dummy go fuck urself…..
I’m so guilty of being ashamed of the “other” Black people. BUT I am not shamed for being ashamed
*shrug*
**I’m bourgeois and I know it**
+1
+2, 3, 4 and beyond……..
Ditto. I’m bourgeois and I know it. I too get ashamed but mainly ashamed of stupidity and ignorance. I’m not ashamed of loud kids … they are just irritating. I’m sure I was a loud, obnoxious teen. I’m not ashamed of poor blacks. That’s just their circumstances. I’m ashamed by stupid choices like 6 kids, all with different fathers. I’m ashamed that many blacks in the community don’t give a f*** and they like it that way. The last thing they want to be perceived as is “selling out” or being bourgeois. I’m ashamed with that ignorant mindset. And I’m proud to say I’m ashamed because I have higher expectations.
You CAN’T be bourgeois with weave in your hair.
the personal terms bourgeois (masculine) and bourgeoise (feminine) culturally identify the man or woman who is a member of the wealthiest social class of a given society.. please people know what ur talking about before u post thanks dummy…..
mmkay…It’s late and I’m ’bout to head on over 2 da pj’s priviously mentioned… as they are the dang devil…
n Yes I meant privy (or outhouse)
I’m guilty of feeling ashamed. I hate loud as teenagers! I was riding on the bus one day and 4 loud-ass, unruly black teenagers cursed this lady out for looking at them wrong. If they weren’t so damn loud she wouldn’t have been looking at them. But, of course, the rest of the adults on the bus, including me, sat idly by and didnt say anything. Hell, who wants to get beaten up by teenagers after a long days of work.
Loud Black teens do not embarass, but they sure as hell piss me the f*** off when they play their music on the train with no ear phones.
I seriously think all young niggas under the age of 21 are allergic to headphones.
And I cant understand why they wish to recite the lyrics to whatever ratchet ass song they are listening at the top of their lungs.
I usually try to keep my peace, vut once after a long, terrible day of work I did snatch a phone and take their battery out…..
A nigga moment almost popped off, but that 60 hour work-week stress on my face helped me win the stare-off with the young dude lol
Yeah I’m with E.Reed. Loud teenagers don’t embarrass me (I don’t get easily embarrassed) but they definitely piss me off. And deliberately loud adults also piss me off. It’s one thing if you’re just a loud person–you talk loud, laugh loudly, because it’s natural for you. Hell, I’m half Puerto Rican. We talk like we’re singing and we sing loudly. It’s a geographical thing. I’m half Dominican. My dad is college educated and still talks like he’s in the piñita waiting for the town to finally have a phone. But adults who are loud on purpose in order to draw attention to themselves and have people listen to their convos piss me the hell off! Like shut up! We can tell you’re doing it on purpose. You keep looking at us for our reactions.
The comment about your dad made me almost do a green tea spit take! I am right here with you though. It’s like the people are saying “yeah I’m loud and I don’t care about anybody else’s comfort level” which is fine I guess if it were not for the fact that these are also some of the most sensitive people on the planet when the Nike is on the other foot.
“I usually try to keep my peace, vut once after a long, terrible day of work I did snatch a phone and take their battery out…..”
You know, those moments are what I enjoy the most! Someone bold enough to snap up a youngster (of their own race or not) and set em straight. It takes a village. Good job. BTW, I call ‘em types out all the time no matter what color they are. I ain’t one of those old prude white people that just gives you the eye and looks annoyed.
Yesterday, my meek/mild Chinese friend and fellow PhD student was robbed by a group of black guys at his apartment complex located in detroit.
and how did that make you feel? …upon hearing they were black?
*Putsfaceinpalm* ASHAMED!!!!!! (Also, resentful and angry)
hell the white people did it for years but they killed us instead, but i guess that alrite
While you’re not wrong (whenever I see a headline about some stupid shit, my first reaction is “please don’t be black, please don’t be black”), I’m just afraid that the twenty-something white male demographic that makes up the Reddit readership are going to point to this post as evidence that it’s okay to use the word “nigger” to separate the “good” black people from the “bad” black people. Sigh.
Gasp! Another Redditor? Out in the wild? This can’t be.
Those guys over there can be so unintentionally racist it’s depressing.
Ah… the “please don’t be black” prayer. I’ve done that one before. It went unanswered back during the DC sniper emergency. Not a banner moment for Black History. It’s weird how things can be said without being said. I remember when news broke that they had made an arrest, me and another black woman (who I didn’t know) were in a cafeteria watching the news conference, and looked at each other and just shook our heads like, “damn”.
And of course of all of my white bretheren made a point of asking me, “hey did you hear they caught the snipers” with what can only be described as a subtle smirk, like, “yeah mf, y’all some serial killers too”.
It hurt yo. It hurt.
I knew them ninjas were black the minute the asked for some ransom money…..smh
Yeah, that revelation hurt my heart, lol.
That was the LAST time I did the “Please don’t be black” prayer. After finding out it was a Black man and a Black male teenager he abused, I was too through. I retired that prayer.
LOL I have the “please don’t be Latino/a” and the “please don’t be Muslim” prayer.
Right? I think the only people I don’t say “the prayer” for are whites and asians.
I’m ashamed at my racism.
Think again. I think everyone has a “please don’t be…. ” prayer.
Nah, white people have that prayer too. Whenever an incident happens where a black person or other person of color is the victim, white people all over secretly pray that the culprit isn’t white, because then the crime would appear racially motivated, and once again make them look like terrible racists. When Trayvon Martin was shot, for example, I was in the laundromat with my friend watching the news. When the newscaster announced that the shooter was white (which turned out to be debatable), I heard my white friend mutter “God dammit…” This is the same friend that once admitted to me that she thinks that a lot of white people work so hard at not being racist (because of the shame of their ancestors’ racism) that they unintentionally do come across as racist. Yeah, I get ashamed by what black people do at times, but I think white people can be pretty ashamed of their own kind too, even though they don’t like to show it. After all, a least we have a black history month and black organizations, anything like that for white people would, well, just be racist.
” “with what can only be described as a subtle smirk, like, “yeah mf, y’all some serial killers tooâ€.
hahahaha! Awwwww mayun! I laughed really hard for a while off of that one man lolol
That was a hilarious picture you just painted for me lolol. It’s all good, you should make it a point to bring up to them same fools that Tom Brady had/has a baby mama that he was with before he married Gizelle. Ppl r just ppl. Nothing more, nothing less lol.
I still do this prayer sometimes…sighs
+1 I def lol’d that one. But, you can’t take away from white people that whites hold the title for the most serial killers AND child molester’s! We won’t let you take that title! No! Oh, wait, wtf am I saying? Black folks can have it if you like! LOL It is a damn shame really. As for me, I was surprised the DC sniper was black, but knew that it wasn’t a Mujahideen. I figured a recluse white guy like Kaczynski.
I know this prayer all too well. I did it last summer when the Jewish boy in Brooklyn was kidnapped and murdered.
“While you’re not wrong (whenever I see a headline about some stupid shit, my first reaction is “please don’t be black, please don’t be blackâ€), ”
ME TOO!!!! *Dies*
You would think I I hit the damn lottery or something upon my reaction when I see they are of a different race. #I’mRichBeyotch lolllll
“While you’re not wrong (whenever I see a headline about some stupid shit, my first reaction is “please don’t be black, please don’t be blackâ€), â€
ME TOO!!!! *wallslide*
You would think I hit the lottery or something upon my reaction when I see they are of a different race. #Take That. Take That. (diddy’s voice)
please give me FREE.
The “I hope they are black prayer” has been spoken by many….if not All black ppl at ONE point or another. I’m sorry its not embarrassment for me it more along the lines of I know you know better. I’m been there when I knew the stand up Teen that was making all this BS noise and when he saw me he hung his head…pulled him aside and asked why are you acting this way? NO Answer, yes some of them do it on purpose to simply prove a point, but in tooo many lives there is an event horizon that the teen simply CANNOT cross and then this simple rebellion could turn in to, he/she being with the group that just shot someone or mugged someone or worse and then this oh he is just doing it excuse will not fly the rest of your life is ruined.
As a brotha that grew up in the ghetto…seeing cats blasted and dying in my front yard, but knowing the entire time how to act and WHY I should act that way. Yes I ran with a foolish crew sometimes but I ALWAYS had my head about me and got GHOST when fools started to act crazy, pullin guns and ghost riding just to scare ppl. Yep…I knew what was up…just like the majority of the kids today. As Adults we dont need to just SMH at them or give them a disgusted look…we must…WE MUST confront them and force them to explain themselves.
“Add to the Negro intelligentsia who have no firm cultural base in the reality of either the black world or the white (even when they have achieved recognition), a large fluctuating contingent who make up the bulk of new aspirants to integrated cultural achievement. The result: a rootless class of displaced persons who are refugees from the social poverty of the black world. At one time, the black world was rich in the pristine artistic essentials for new forms in music, dance, song, theater and even language; then, the black ethnic identity was seen as a unique advantage. But today the style has become a negation of that identity, in pursuit of cultural integration or assimilation. Today the failure of the black bourgeoisie as a class, to play any social role as patron or sponsor of the arts, is all the more glaring. For now the new Negro cultural aspirants are making vocal and specified demands for integration in cultural fields where the black bourgeoisie has never paid the piper, and therefore can call no tunes.†— excerpt from Harold Cruse’s The Crisis of the Negro Intellectual chapter Role of the Negro Intellectual—Survey of the Dialogue Deferred
Love it!
And this is why you need to be secure in where you come from. So many people think that the second their “Blackness” comes out, they’ll have the police called on them to march them back to the ghetto. Maybe it’s just me in New York, where White people will identify as Italian or Jewish or whatever else first, but having an ethnic identity is definitely a positive good. I’m not saying act a fool or disrespect the cultural norms you live in, but as the quote says, being rootless is worse than being “ghetto” in the long run.
“And this is why you need to be secure in where you come from.”
ESPECIALLY in New York, Todd. I don’t think I would have made it in this city if I wasn’t secure about my background. I would have been eaten alive.
I agree.
Add to the Negro intelligentsia who have no firm cultural base in the reality of either the black world or the white (even when they have achieved recognition), a large fluctuating contingent who make up the bulk of new aspirants to integrated cultural achievement. The result: a rootless class of displaced persons who are refugees from the social poverty of the black world. At one time, the black world was rich in the pristine artistic essentials for new forms in music, dance, song, theater and even language; then, the black ethnic identity was seen as a unique advantage. But today the style has become a negation of that identity, in pursuit of cultural integration or assimilation. Today the failure of the black bourgeoisie as a class, to play any social role as patron or sponsor of the arts, is all the more glaring. For now the new Negro cultural aspirants are making vocal and specified demands for integration in cultural fields where the black bourgeoisie has never paid the piper, and therefore can call no tunes.†— excerpt from Harold Cruse’s The Crisis of the Negro Intellectual chapter Role of the Negro Intellectual—Survey of the Dialogue Deferred
I love this.. I am going to post this as my facebook status
Atta boy Malik.. love me some readin men and women. And after Cruse we come to Fanon. Naming the source of shame helps..but can you do anything withit?
**hardwalk down 125th St with a saxophone case**
Everyone has this moment but you move past it. You eventually realize what is going on in your head is the internalized izms that have you even worrying about what white people think. The ones who are racists were racist before they met a black person and would still be after they met a perfect, Black Superman a.k.a Obama, (see how dirty he gets treated.) Aside; Wayne Brady… universally liked? History’s mysteries.
I don’t have time for shame… righteous anger at injustice takes enough of my energy.
I agree; I’m usually amused when I notice my own stereotypes and preconceptions about about other black people, especially, are proven wrong.
Yeah, I want to get where SweetSass is.
Last 4th of July, these 4 brothers got on the completely packed Metro (#DMV Chillin) and 2 were talking about how the were gonna fight each other as soon as they got off the train all loud. Looking like they wouldn’t bust a grape in a food fight. I knew they were fronting and still I was all embarrassed.
I’m getting better with it though. Progress.
Dope post Snowboard P. I was going to bomb this with Harold Cruse quotes. I’ll just do 3 instead.
The quote below and conversations I’ve had in real life among those within the Black Diaspora are reasons I have been irked or hated Black people. The sneering non-US Blacks to us bothers me to end.
“During the 1950’s in the Greenwich Village interracial scene, it was noted that certain West Indian males formed themselves into a semi-exclusive social club from which camp they competed with American Negro males for the favors of white women (mostly Jewish).The West Indian women on the scene were hardly ever seen at this club’s functions, for the usually consorted with white men, as did most of the American Negro women. Most of the West Indian men were ever alert to emphasize that they were “not American Negroes.†The West Indian women, though fewer in number, reacted similarly, and one remarked, “You Negroes have contributed nothing to the United States but jazz music.†When asked what the West Indians had contributed to the British Empire aside from calypso and labor—both slave and cheap—she replied, “Oh, that’s different.â€
Rite! People from the islands are some of the most racist against american blacks. Africans too. They look down on “african-americans” big time with their arrogant azz attitude.
While I got some cool African and West Indian homies I’m going to have to go ahead and ride with this comment if only in the general sense.
Sadly I have to as well. The funny thing is, in America… a n!gg@ is a n!gg@ when they’re getting pulled over by the cops. Doesn’t matter if you went to law school, or community college, racism will back slap the taste out of every negroid mouth.
Being West Indian and African-American, I get it coming and going. Since both groups assume I identify more with them than the other side, I get to hear the ugliness from both, and it’s a shame.
I’m right there with you… Jamaican father…
Really no matter what side you are on you are going to have something to say about the other.
Don’t get me started on Ethiopians… they are some of the most elitist black people on the face of the earth. Living in Atlanta, which has a sizable Ethiopian/Eritrean(sp?) population(Stone Mt stand up!!), I have dated countless Ethiopian women who took every precaution to make sure that no one in their community found out that they were dating an American.
They weren’t too elitist to date you though…
-From An Ethiopian
” They weren’t too elitist to date you though…”
That’s exactly what I was thinkin lol. I was like oh sh*t, I got a chance if I go to ATL lolol
I think the problem is that we “black” American people do not know our history and personal identity. Not all blacks descended from the same ancesteral tribes/nation-states. Just like all whites are not Germans, or Swedes, or French, or Polish, or Dutch, or British. Many white tribes were mortal enemies. We may have indeed passed down tribal ancesteral animosities over generations that emerged as this sort of behavior. And I definitely disagree with the author’s conclusion. Just because we are outraged and embarrassed by ignorant, boorish behavior does not mean we “sellouts” (I’m a sellout) won’t reach back and try to empower and enlighten as many of our people as I can. In fact, my disgust at ghetto behavior motivates me to do just that. They say that that which irritates you most is your life’s calling. It’s called community activism; and, I endure the insults and disrespect because I feel it is my duty to give back to (even though I never took from) the black community. I think if our black American people would simply master the English language (the only language 99.99% of us know), perceptions and shame would dissapate greatly. And, remember, sounding “black” means you speak Wolof, Fulani, Igbo, or Yoruba; it does not mean you speak street slang and MF every other word. Call me names, insult me if you wish. I have heard it all before.
Africans attitudes towards African Americans is because we who were born in this country have squandered so many opportunities to inprove their environment and they wished they could have had the same chances we take for granted.
True in some cases. However, they forget that they themselves often get a pass because they were not born here (except for AIDS) and you must have some coin along with a support system to make the trip across the pond.
+ 1
And in the school system, West Indian and African children deal with slurs against them by Black American children on their country, ethnic identity, and even immigration insults.
Not every Black person likes blackness and will direct those insults towards Black people who they feel fit the profile of nappiness, African-ness–and all the stereotypes of people from Africa and the West Indies.
Wyclef talks about being a Haitian immigrant, learning English and in school being told by a classmate that he has HBO, Haitian Body Odor.
Kola Boof will go off on Twitter being an African booty scratcher slur aimed at her.
You make a valid point for children being educated here. I’m talking about the adults that come here, come up, and have condensending opinions / attitudes about African Americans. I would like to hear about an American who’s banked some coin, went to Africa, come up, and looked at the African people and say you lazy Africans. There’s plenty of opportunities here if you apply yourself. I don’t want to hear about your wars, poor schools and corrupt politics; they sound like excuses to me.
To be honest Sigma, Sigma,
I feel that poor in America is nothing compared to poor in Zimbabwe during their food supplies being cut off and civil uprising, Haiti post-earthquake. I listened to a Zimbabwean family friend of mine talking about worrying about the elders in her family because their food was cut off during a civil uprising back in the late 1990s.
When someone tells you about soldiers coming to their house and taking everything, killing people, or tells you about children trying to survive in their country with no running water post-earthquake, I can see why the arrogance is there.
Wouldn’t you be arrogant if you survived the worst in your country, made it over here and got to work for better opportunities?
Zimbabwean family friend came to America as an adult, after becoming a single parent as a teenager, so her son could go to school here. He graduated summa cumma laude from Morgan State U. and got a full scholarship to an Ivy League school for grad school. Their family comes from a village that had no electricity, no phone. She told a fascinating story about how her father had to travel for miles to someone’s house to get on a phone to call her after Sept 11 happened, as he didn’t know if she was where the event happened.
She has every right to say “work hard in order to get the opportunities you want” and to be arrogant (though she is not arrogant). She’s not rich, works all the time, doesn’t own expensive things in her house.
So, I get the context to which people might be arrogant.
@ Woman’s Eyes
I get the struggles each group face are subjective. I for once would like for individuals to acknowledge that they get a pass when entering a country (for the most part) because they are not a part of the problem or subject to the socio-political enviornment unless they chose to immerse themselves in the fray.
I believe that Americans would not survive mentally in the bush because of the conditions. However, since many of us can’t link back our heritage, I wouldn’t be considered a Hutu or Tutsi and/or any of the other rival factions. My only use would be that I’m an American.
@SigmaSince93- Exactly. Everyone’s struggle is different. I don’t even know if I would go so far as to say African Americans wouldnt survive in the bush tho. None of us could ever know. I mean, it would be safe to expect someone who was raised in a privileged 1st world country to not survive in such dire conditions, but the difference is, either you grow up with that as a reality and mature and survive with that reality in mind, or you don’t and your challenges in life are of an entirely different nature. Afro-Americans’ concerns were rarely as immediate and grave as food or avoidance of war violence, but they were real and not always immediately obvious. Even if you feel your problems were tougher, there’s no need to denigrate or antagonize anyone else because you have the perspective to be particularly aware of all the privileges they have and could use to their advantage if realized. Vantage point is everything. People who lack empathy only add to the world’s problems imo. You’re either part of the solution or…
@ Justmetheguy
I’m an American. In no way am I trying to slam someone’s opinion. I bristle when I talk with my African brethern about the how African American’s are lazy. After we agree that most conditions in Africa are worse than in America, they still can’t bring themselves to say white america or america in general gives me a pass on certain things because I’m an African; not African American.
they still can’t bring themselves to say white america or america in general gives me a pass on certain things because I’m an African; not African American.
@ Sigma since 93,
*DEAD*….Are you in any way serious?! Puuuuuuuuuuuhleeeeze! Before I open my mouth, I am African American-when I open my mouth I am a BLACK person with an accent! Dude we do NOT in any way get any privileges or passes! We are in the same boat as ya’ll. You think the white man cares about straight from the motherland or born in the states blacks. That is the least of their worries. Aiyayaiyai. That comment was touching to say the least. It has touched my afro and made all the shea butter that makes it smooth like baby’s butt disappear and revert back to its kinky nature!
-I’ve read your comments in detail, and all I have to say is COTTAMN! You need to be given an opportunity to guest post your thoughts, because I’m nearly about to pass out-because some of your thoughts about Africans are DEAD WRONG! Like dead, cannot be resurrected like Lazarus!
+1
Please free my comment.
I would venture to say that every single African country’s Black population has more control over the state of their country than the Black population in America.
Amen, Malik.
” I would venture to say that every single African country’s Black population has more control over the state of their country than the Black population in America.”
+1 Damn, Malik you on it today man. I normally disagree with you on things, but you’re makin awesome points today. And if I remember correctly you aren’t even black American. Great points tho man. I say that all the time.
Thank you. I come from a West Indian family and I am so tired of hearing African Americans complain about how stuck up and elitist we are. Granted, we didn’t have to deal with Jim Crow, but AAs have been in this country for centuries, and though they’ve been given the short end of the stick, there are many opportunities that have been squandered.
Please check the facts: the majority of black people in top colleges are either of west Indian or African descent. What does that tell you? Not that we’re smarter or have more access to money/educational opportunity. We are all niggers in the eyes of white America. They couldn’t tell the difference btw a black American and a Trinidadian. It’s that blk folks of wi/afr descent, I believe, put a greater value on education, and see that as they key to success in this country, not playing basketball, football, or rapping.
Obviously not all African americans are this way. But the fact that west Indians and Africans have an easier time achieving class mobility etc says a lot
And p.s. Black America, you would not have hip hop were it not for us Jamaicans.
Anyhow, west Indian massive stand up (blup blup bup!)
the only reason is that they have more respect for them self and their women and come over to the states and take over
Interesting quote. That whole mindset encapsulated in that was a heavy backdrop in my childhood. It’s amazing how people who are similarly situated in terms of cultural roots not only can develop differently, but turn actively hostile against each other.
I dislike anyone who is loud & extra for no reason, regardless of race/ethnicity. Like, wtf do you have to be so f*cking annoying & asinine when there is no reason to be?? Do I feel some way about black people who act foolish in public w/out giving not a damn or f*ck? Yes, but I don’t reserve those feelings for just them. They apply to anyone who acts douchey, especially if you’re a friend of mine. So while I may feel shame, it’s equal opportunity shame for the masses.
True. Here is my shame story..
When I was in college and went go home to visit, my mom and her friend would drag me all around town and into the hood. My family didn’t live in the ‘hood even though we were poor. We lived in the ‘poor’ white neighborhoods so that we could go to the decent schools. However, my mother had friends all over the place, and when I came home from school I had to visit with ALL of them. I would see Mama Jones, Sister Mary, Uncle Willie..or whoever. I would have to accept their hugs, and eat their fattening food, and swear that I remembered them (when I didn’t).
At first this little ritual embarrassed the hell out of me. I didn’t want to be in those folks house. The neighborhoods were sketchy. They all talked (gossiped) loudly for a loooong time about things I didn’t care about. (I would rather be reading). I couldn’t understand why my mother would even associate herself with those people and why she would drag ME there. In other words, I was big ole snob for no damn reason.
What I didn’t realize was this was my mother’s time to show off her “beautiful, smart daughter who wasn’t pregnant and on welfare”. When I acted like I was too good, I embarrassed HER. She didn’t understand how any daughter of hers would be too good to visit with HER friends. What I didn’t realize was that even if I didn’t remember them, they probably had a hand in my upbringing. They may have given my mother money to help pay rent, or prayed with her over us, or given food, or watched over my brother and I from a distance when she had to work at night.
When I was able to be mature enough to get over myself, those little trips to the hood were not embarrassing, but quite enjoyable. I mean, what smart individual would thumb their nose at free peach cobbler??
I still shake my head over loud teens though. My mother didn’t raise me like that. She said I was to be seen and not heard. So hearing young kids being all loud in public just irks my last nerve. Blame my mother.
Good story. I really like your perspective.
Good point you could have been the example that turned someone in that sketchy neighborhood around or showed them there was a better way to behave. a stuck up attitude would have just proved there stereotypes to be right.
Thanks for sharing your story. It makes me think of my hometown. The project drunk that pulled me aside and said don’t end up like me. I would see him in random spots collecting cans and he would tell me about something I had done (sports, community service) and would say I’m watching you. When I finished school, he came up to me and said I’m glad you made it out.
Your story reminds me of my godmother who was so proud of me. She babysat me in the hood and came to my high school graduation and was so proud when I graduated from college. R.I.P.
That was awesome Tonya. Thanks. My mother still does this to me to this day and I never quite understood the reason. I don’t like being ‘paraded around’ or being a brag about anything. I don’t think what makes me a worthy person is where I work, what I own, how much money I make, or any materialistic thing. But, now, I get her a little better thanks to you.
…And do we make up crazy stories about each other to avoid dealing with the shame?
It is human for people to be adverse to dealing with shame. It takes courage and balls/ovaries to confront shame.
Idk if I’m actually ashamed of things some things Black ppl do, I’m more irritated. This irritation isn’t just at uncouth negros but also those white-is-right assimilating Negros. Yes uncouth/”ghetto” Blacks can be irritating such as have 10 kids they cant afford, loud inarticulate language, or horrible quick-weaves and lacefronts. But those assimilating negros who feel uncomfortable around all black ppl or think everything black is inferior or try their darndest to take on the mannerisms of Whites are just as bad as the ghetto ones.
I agree.
I think I’m more like you. I don’t feel shame I feel annoyance, and it’s usually at teens, and then it’s usually every color of teen.
There is something to be said for the fact that I do worry how some teens behavior will reinforce the stereotypes held by some white people. But for me it’s almost exclusively about behavior, not if you didn’t graduate college, not even if you routinely form sentences with subject verb disagreement. You don’t have to have a college education, or money, or power, or prestige to be wise and/or knowledgeable. It’s often been people who had none of these that have taught me (directly or indirectly) some really valuable life lessons.
Co-sign DQ’s statement. Behavior is everything. I’m also ashamed of black people who have no interest in either starting or supporting black businesses first and foremost. I mean, the only time I stop makin it a point to support black businesses are when their quality of product is particularly inferior (mediocre is ok as long as we’re not talking entertainment) or when their customer service is bad/rude/hositle (see half the Jamaican restaurants in Brooklyn, yeah I said it). Other than that I realize that black businesses will die without black customers patronizing them. Integration really was the gift and the curse wasn’t it?
“But those assimilating negros who feel uncomfortable around all black ppl or think everything black is inferior or try their darndest to take on the mannerisms of Whites are just as bad as the ghetto ones.”. Maybe they weren’t assimilating. Maybe those whites were the only ones that accepted them.
It’s one thing to feel accepted by whites it’s another thing to turn your nose up on everything that’s black. I had tons of friends in college who grew up in a majority white neighborhoods and schools, spoke “white” , and had what some might deem white interests but still were able to have black friends with like minded interest. When you’re older especially when you attend college it’s hard to believe that you cannot find like minded ppl with your race. Heck one of the best things about college is socializing with ppl different than yourself to gain new perspectives. What I mostly talking about are those who actively try to disassociate themselves with anything remotely Black.
Jesus excuse the typos…
I was born in Youngstown, Ohio (one of the poorest and most dangerous cities in the U.S.), where the poverty rate is the highest in the Nation. After being gone for 12 years, I had to return this past October to help take care of an ailing family member.
In the time that I was gone from Youngstown, I lived in three other states, another country, and four different cities. So when I was faced with the sudden and unexpected urgency to return, I was BEYOND pissed.
I can’t tell you how many times I have been out in mundane places here (the grocery store, doctor’s office, post office…) and have silently scrutinized the “other” black people in the vicinity, be it due to how they are dressed, how they refuse (or can’t) travel, or because they don’t have a Passport. But what I have failed to realize is that some of those “other” black people, like my maternal Grandmother and paternal Grandfather, were too busy working 30 plus years in a damn factory so they didn’t have time to live in other countries or take time to find themselves. Or perhaps that some of the younger black people my age haven’t left because, unlike me, they didn’t have someone who made sure that they didn’t spend their entire life here (thanks Mom!).
I’m not saying that collectively as a people that we don’t have a great deal of work to do, because as a whole I think we owe each other and ourselves a tremendous amount of healing. I think we have been void of love for a harrowing amount of time, and our self loathing has only prolonged that much needed healing. Returning home has made me take an honest look at myself, and realize that I am no better than any other black people out there. Just damned lucky and blessed.
well said.
I got a gang of fam in Youngstown.
youngstown,oh!?! not you too! now I must add my opinion.
Anyway yes I can relate to this post and some of the previous comments. Its not so much being “shamed” its finding your identity. I have always drifted somewhere in the middle. I definitely was not as well off as some of my fellow black bourgeois
, but I also could not relate to growing up in the projects. I still do not understand why its so either/or when dealing with Black people, as if you can only be stuck up and rich or poor and cool with everyone. That’s not the case. We all are different, and being Black is not so much a definition of “culture” anymore as it once was in the past. My black friends from HS(which was 90% white) are different from my black friends at my HBCU who are different from my black friends I was in Jack & Jill with who are different from my black friends who aren’t from America who are different from my black friends ….. I’m sure someone is getting the point. Anyway yes, a lot of non-Blacks may continue to see all of us as the same, but a lot do not. And perhaps that begins the problem of the black race, we should be concerned on changing the image on an individual basis and less concerned on the image that is held by those not complex enough to realize that people are different.
My point is that once you are comfortable with yourself a loud group of black people will bother you just as much as a loud group of ______ people. I tend to cringe at all obnoxious-ness while in a sober state, non sober I may be the offending party lol.
“My point is that once you are comfortable with yourself a loud group of black people will bother you just as much as a loud group of ______ people.”
Word, I just get bothered by loud people in general. Even when I’m loud I bother myself loool. good point.
It’s all basic mathematics and science (common sense) and we all know the truth. They don’t acknowledge black people as anything historical before we got to America. They hate our true history. Ask yourself why you can’t go in any library or book store and find a book about history of black people prior to the Atlantic Slave Trade, yet they have a history of Arab and White. It’s a reason for that. It’s called racism folks.
Hear, hear!
I’m from the neighboring city, Warren Ohio. It’s just as bad. SMH, but I feel your sentiment.
Great post, Panama. Very timely. Personally, I try to live a balance life of knowing where you came from (humble roots of eating gov’t cheese, hog head cheese & vienna sausage) and striving to press forward toward the mark of the prize of the high calling (learn how to read, write & think on for yourself; education & being a positive productive person). I just finished reading this book (Sister Citizen: Shame, Stereotypes & Black Women in America) and while reading the post I immediately thought of Chapter 3, “Shame”.
The epigraph for the chapter is a passage from Zora Neale Hurston’s “Dust on a Road”. It painted a similar picture of how loud Negroes would board a train and take off their shoes, stuff themselves w/ bananas and fish and leave garbage. And the well-dressed Negro shrinks back in his seat, shakes his head and sigh, my people, my people
Happy Friday everyone.
I’m reading the book too!
Pretty darn awesome. Especially “The Bridge”
.. “I’m sick of mediating with your worst self, on behalf of your better selves..”
Fitting, huh?
that “Bridge” poem was nice. Had to read it twice and fast-paced in my spoken word mode.
I really do think loudness is an expression of anger at how things are and wanting to be as free as you feel like being in an environment that is uncomfortable with your presence. I get it when I see it happening.
The loud Black people on the train probably were doing their own version of “eff your couch” in a time where the injustices against Black people were segregation, the threat of violence against Blacks by Whites and within the Black community (Black-on-Black crime).
Black teenagers know how society views them with disdain. So they figure they’ll show society how much disdain they can get. I get it.
I have to respectfully disagree. Loud and unruly behavior is a sign of immaturity, self-centeredness, and a lack of proper upbringing. You are being far too charitable to my young brothers and sisters to propose they are making some type of political statement on the negative stereotypes that the larger society holds about them. (this type of foolishness is not unique to just black young people, by the way, but I’ll concern myself with cleaning up my own house first). I do not feel ashamed when I encounter this nonsense, but I must admit I feel somewhat embarrassed, (semantics perhaps). Intellectually I know, obviously, that I am not personally responsible for the actions of all black people and therefore I should feel no particular way about the rude behavior of some random young person. Each person is ultimately responsible for the own actions. But on a visceral level, I do feel as if all blacks are a member of my extended tribe so to speak, and in the same way I would feel embarrassed if I saw my own son behaving like a jack ass, (God help him If I ever did), I have a similar reaction when I observe inappropriate behavior in someone else’s child. It is perhaps not as is should be, but for me, it is how it is. .
* I’m ashamed of athletes who go broke a few years after retiring. How is Allen Iverson broke when he mande Allen Iverson money? NBA, Reebok, Gatorade, $100mil (or more) down the drain
–Part II is T.O. and his cry baby butt. He was complaining about all the money his FOUR baby mamas wanted in child support, but when your 4 baby mamas consist of a one night stand and 3 random chicks who weren’t your girlfriend…um, what do you expect?
*I’m ashamed of Black teenagers acting an azz in public. Mostly I’m ashamed of their parents
*I’m ashamed of Black parents naming their kids things like “Y’all Jealous Jones” (serious) I mean…WHY????
+1
On that note…. I am ashamed of every reality show with a cast of black women….. RHOA, BBW, Love & Hip Hop. Yea I watch (don’t judge) but damn can we get more than one happywithherheadonstraightnonbitterbenefittingfromthatmaritalpeen chick per show !?
You know what, I ain’t even gonna like these shows are purely entertainment for me because we all know CLEARY not every black women is living a ballin baby mama or ballin ex wife lifestyle, I can’t and I don’t relate, so for me to say these shows are an embarassment to me would make me a LIAR.
But I respect your opinion though.
I wonder how white america feels about the RHOC (orange county) the original Real Housewives Show (beverly hills/ new jersey/DC and Mob Wives) I wonder do they carry the same embarassment and resentment? *TurnsandAskmy2520co-worker*
“I wonder how white america feels about the RHOC (orange county) the original Real Housewives Show (beverly hills/ new jersey/DC and Mob Wives) I wonder do they carry the same embarassment and resentment?”
Don’t how your 2520 co-worker responded and I don’t speak for all of ‘white’ America, but I, personally, can’t stand ANY of these shows. Not a damn one. They are fake, stupid, embarrassing, and a poor example of how people should interact and carry themselves with respect. It’s trash. They’re trash. Any self respecting person of any color thinks this because generally ‘good’ people would have more dignity than to parade themselves around like a wh*re getting paid to act out. Done.
+2
+ everything
I’ll see you “Y’all Jealous Jones” and raise you “Darealest Jenkins” SMH
I DESPISE TO with a passion. He said each and every one of those women he had kids with was basically a jump off, which makes him a lame. Because how on earth do you have more than one kid w/someone you barely know and then CONTINUE the trend? he’s the worst type of person: his own worst enemy yet somehow to him it’s everyone else’s fault.
I’ve definitely had these thoughts, in college mostly. My roommate experiences were pretty rough and it was always (and I do mean always) dude to an inconsiderate black girl. So after the school kicked out my 3rd roommate in one semster I remember thinking ‘I hope I get a white roommate, I’m tired of these I-don’t-give-a-f*ck black girls who doesn’t care about anyone but herself’. I did get a white roommate and an outcast black girl (like me). I finished that semester in peace.
*due
I chuckled at this. My roommate experience was similar. And the next year, her new set of Black and Hispanic roommates found out how intolerable she was to live with.
Well this is an excellent post…. and yes there are different types of black people. I have long discussed this with my friends and peers. Because all be it our skin similar in color, we are far from alike. Being a suburban breed and raised child because my parents worked hard put themselves through school and made sure my siblings and I were afforded the same, I received a quality education and upbringing.
But I have had the opportunity to work all up and through inner city and lower income schools for many years. I can comfortably say that socioeconomic status definitely plays a role in your upbringing but whether a child has an active parent in the house hold or not makes a bigger difference for sure.(Well and education of course) The unfortunate part for most blacks is that they don’t have positive examples of how a respectable individual should conduct and carry themselves. Therefore they grow up watching these negative behaviors and then eventually adopt them and end up reciprocating the cycle of foolishness. They then eventually become the “hood” or “black” that I dislike and just can not stand to deal with. I have strong opinions about those that behavior and dress a certain way, I typically refer to these individuals as hoods. But these are just my opinions…I have much more to say on this subject but I’m tired of typing….
Iamnotakata, I really wish you had typed “we” instead of “they”.
” The unfortunate part for most blacks is that they don’t have positive examples of how a respectable individual should conduct and carry themselves.”
This is so loaded.
No I meant they, I was not referring to my self. For me to say we would infer that I grew up under these circumstances, which is not the case. Also I don’t know that this scenario is reflective of everyone on the blog so why woulf I say we.
Agreed.
I agree, “we” would be more appropriate.
Being a college student in Philly, I cosign this times a thousand. I make sure the people on the train see my dress pants in the morning, so they know “I’m going to work BITCHES!” but I’m standing next to my black counter part of the same age blasting his Wocka so loud I’m tempted to bob wit’ it. Anywho, the point is I’m riding the same train as this fool and I KNOW I’m no better than him. By participating in the shame, I’m playing into the mandatory assimilation of Blacks into White culture. And THAT is what’s shameful.
I co-sign and appreciate your comment. If you watch “Dateline” “Lockup” “Intervention” or “Hoarders” you will quickly realize Black people do not have a lock on shameful or embarrassing behavior. I am more saddened by the pathology that consumes our people and equally disturbed by the elitist blacks who don’t give a damn about children being raised in dysfunctional neighborhoods and families. That’s truly shameful.
The reason that I was ashamed of black people was bc from the time I was in 7th grade until I was 22 and in grad school I was always called out for being different. Why was I different? Bc I talked and acted white. Being ostracized by your own race CONSTANTLY will have an effect on you that only a few seem to understand. Being looked down at bc of your achievements will mess up anyone. I was such an easy target. I was nerdy like no other and the black kids could smell whatever “weakness” oozing from my skin a mile away. I used to cringe when I walked by a group of my black peers. Like, i would try to find different paths to take so that i could avoid the laughs and snikers. It didn’t help that I wasn’t the most fashionable since my mother didn’t have any money to get me name brand clothing or shoes. Junior high sucked. A lot. Can you inagine being asked everyday, literaly, and with disgust, “why do you act so white?” being talked about loudly so that you can hear, “there she goes with those white people. I cant stand her.” This was my 7th and 8th grade experience. EVERYDAY.
By the time I reached high school, my defense mechanism was to just be screw you. I decided to do what I loved. Chess team, check. Debate team, double check. My confidence grew and my contempt for my black peers grew with it. Dont talk to me if you can’t form a complete sentence. Why are you so loud in the hallways? Acting just like a n!gga. Pregnant again? Way to live up to the stereotype.
It wasn’t until I got to college that a girl said dead to my face “you think you are better than black people”. This wasn’t a question, it was a flat out statement. But it seemed like the few black people that I did become friends with in undergrad didn’t have the same black experience that I had. They couldn’t relate to the fact that I had been ridiculed during my most vulnerable years. Try explaining that to someone and you would just get a “get over it”.
Then something wonderful happened. I went to grad school and met a whole slew of black people that had the exact same experience as me. I also got over myself. Bc of past events, I treated my black peers differently. A wall went up like no other. I knew that ALL black people were going to treat me like crap. But when I finally brought that wall down, I realized that I was simply projecting. I was still that sensitive 7th grader that wanted to be accepted. And in grad school, I finally found people who looked like me who did accept me.
So yes. I have been the black person that is/has been ashamed of other black people and the one that other blacks were ashamed of bc of my “whiteness” and selling out.
Quite interesting story….I went to all white schools coming up so naturally if you can imagine I don’t exactly talk in slang and I’m extremely proper.I didn’t have any issues with students in school because all the black students spoke proper good English. But it wasn’t until I came to Houston (or Hoodston as I call it) where they have a high population of uneducated blacks, that I got the you think your white, or the ever so popular you talk like a “valley girl comment” or even the hoods laughing and trying to clown me because I speak the English language the way it is meant to be spoken. This has played a big part in my strong dislike for certain black people. So I understand where your coming from.
I do wonder if this happens in the south more so than in the other parts of the US.
I wouldn’t surprised of it occured more down south then up north. There are a lot of things that occur here that aren’t so prevelant up north. That’s why i’m trying to move up there.
Mena,
This happens all over the United States.
You’re talking about socio-economic differences, cultural differences, regional differences.
Although in the South, Black people and White people talk very similarly within the same socio-economic class.
I would assume that it does but sometimes i do wonder.
Side note: I love the way you respond to my responses. I always feel like you are about to drop some knowledge on me.
” Try explaining that to someone and you would just get a “get over itâ€.”
Yeah, that’s everybody’s line when ANYBODY gets in their feelings about anything. Man up, we all got made fun of for something that we felt like was unfair, not our fault, mean/insensitive on the parts of others, and most importantly irrelevant and thus ignorant to make fun of in the first place.
When a dark skinned man starts talking about “you don’t know what it was like being dark growin up, ppl made fun of me for it”, so the f*ck what, we’re grown now and if anything you get added points for it, and women think you’re sexier than the rest of us because of it, save your sob story.
Same with Africans who make it a point to talk about black students doing that to them. “African booty scratchers” etc; I mean, I don’t wanna belittle ANYBODY’s experience and how it made them feel, but at some point you gotta be an objective reasonable adult that realizes that EVERYONE got made fun of for WHATEVER it was about them that stood out or was different. It’s all dumb, immature kids know what to do about differences that they notice but don’t know what to make of. They decide to make fun of them and ridicule others. It’s impulsive, destructive, and insensitive, but most things that teenagers do and say fit at least 2 of those adjectives if not all 3, so ppl do need to get over stuff. This world/country is soooo much bigger than you.
2 more points.
1) What you’re speaking is most likely not “proper” English as much as it is standard American English. People in the UK don’t speak English the same way you do.
2) Sometimes talking white is not about your grammar or subject-verb agreement as much as it is your diction and cadence. Some black people have Caucasian accents and tones of voice infliction. Nothing wrong with this, but it is real. I think nothing less of individuals that speak this way, I just tend to make certain assumptions, just like I do when I hear people speaking in strong African-American vernacular dialects. Stereotyping is part of our brain’s muscle memory at this point…
Yes, I recall when I first came to college and I heard black girls who spoke more “proper” than I did with the valley girl inflections and all. Ironically, I thought “they speak white as hell.”
I agree with all of your points. That was my point of putting that. But, it is so much easier to tell someone to get over it. Man it up. If you weren’t there in that situation, you don’t know how it effected that person. This is why when someone talks to me now about a problem, the last thing I will say is get over it. I will listen and get to the root of why they feel the way that they feel. And, eventually, I realized that I am who I am and can’t change a thing about it.
“2) Sometimes talking white is not about your grammar or subject-verb agreement as much as it is your diction and cadence.” It is definitely my diction and cadence. That is all that talking “white” is. I arrange my words a certain way and stress certain points in the words as well. But anyone that is educated tends to do this. I am not trying to say that my speech is flawless. This is something that I see in most educated people.
Most definitely, Justmetheguy.
It takes a certain change in mindset to go, “wait a minute, those were when we were kids. Kids can be ignorant and immature. Now I’m an adult and I’mma have something smart to say back the next time someone tries to diss me”. lol
I totally get why different segments of American population will get an attitude with somebody. lol
Your middle school experience was exactly like mine to a T. It was a struggle every single day and my mother simply thought I was being too sensitive. I had absolutely no one to talk to, since my entire family also used me as the “white sheep” punching bag. I took a different route in high school and tried to dumb down so I wouldn’t be noticed. My english teacher did notice and placed me in ap english classes where I met other black kids like me. I’m so glad we both got the opportunity to find others with similar experiences, not all of us are so lucky.
I went through the same thing, but my experience was much more balanced. I lived in an almost all white neighborhood while I went to an almost all black K-12 from grade 3/4 on up. At points, I recall acting extra “niggerish” or “whitewashed” to overcompensate for that fact. I could go on about white people too, but this isn’t about them today.
The differences never really became an issue until middle school where my peers took interest in music and fashion. Having a broad spectrum of interests felt almost like living a double life. I never expressed my love for heavy metal with my black friends nor did I attempt to discuss the Origino Gunn Clappaz tell your white friends. I was able to keep music to myself, but my style of dress was a dead giveaway.
By mid grade 9, I quickly picked up unwanted attention and an even more unwanted nickname “Whiteboy or Richman” (short for Richmond Hill, a town I lived near). It’s not like I was just “exposed” to other black people. These were people I went to school with from childhood. At a certain point we could see the differences in each other’s behavior. I became interested in math and computers while others had “different” aspirations. That’s where the unequal treatment started. Long were the days of childhood friendship. In came days of blatant insults and threats. People really started to get mad like “how do you like fucking Whiteboy step to your girl?” Started call me “house nigga” and shit. It was almost overnight.
By then, however, I’ve worked out my acceptance of who I was; the whitest kind in the black school, blackest kid in the white neighborhood. Whatever. I rather be who I am now than ignorant to another way of life.
On a side note: I saw a girl the other day I attend school with drunk fighting a bouncer in the street. I hadn’t seen her since ’97, but was so ashamed I just kept it moving. The difference was I was ashamed of her actions as a human being rather than it looking bad on the black community. I do feel that extra naggerdom has put me at odds in other situations though. I just remember neither them nor I am representative of black people as a whole.
“That’s where the unequal treatment started. Long were the days of childhood friendship. In came days of blatant insults and threats. People really started to get mad like “how do you like fucking Whiteboy step to your girl?†Started call me “house nigga†and shit. It was almost overnight.” Yes. The overnight thing is what took me by surprise. B/c of where i lived, i went to a different jr. high than my friends from elementary school so I had to start all back over. Within the first 2 weeks of the 7th grade, someone asked “why do you talk like that?” I was like huh. The ridiculing happened almost instantly. I was not prepared for it one bit.
OGC…the first album was great, second blah Strarang spit on some verses here and there then poof
I really wouldn’t mind if Starang, Sean Price, Rock and Buckshot put out an album.
Yep, sounds similar to my middle/high school experience too. It even carried over into adulthood. When I was 23, working around a lot of black ppl, they called me Hillary (as in Hillary Banks) because of the way I acted & talked. Didn’t know proper English and complete sentences was such a crime. Smh.
It’s a horrible mindset to have. And it can be so crushing for the kids that have to go through it. Anytime i hear someone comment that they don’t like sellouts i have to wonder why did that person actually “sellout.” Was it b/c they are jerks who don’t want to be around their own people or was it b/c their own, at one point, made them feel completely unwelcomed.
My parents were in the military and so I spent most of my formative years in Japan. When we came back to the US, all of my family in Mississippi were on the “you talk white” bit…I was in the 8th grade and was confused. Talk white? How do white ppl talk exactly? To this day, I can only stand to be around them for 2 days max…then I have to leave. No one should have to put up with constant criticism.
This was my experience as well.
This really resonated with me. What I do remember is being called “Oreo, white girl” being asked “why I talk so proper” and “why I act white.” And somewhere along the way, I’d say 9th grade, I made an effort to have more affected speech, use slang, curse, and sound more “black” to the other kids. It didn’t exactly stick. I was just advised a couple days ago that I sounded like a white woman in my voicemail. LOL.
“And somewhere along the way, I’d say 9th grade, I made an effort to have more affected speech, use slang, curse, and sound more “black†to the other kids.” Dude, even my curse and slang words sound proper.
The affect just isn’t the same.
I went to a HS with 70% black population. College was to at an HBCU. I speak slang. I speak ‘white’. I speak Spanish and Arabic with no accent, so I’ve been told. I slide in and out of different cultures. Mostly I get that I have a southern twang. I hate that word “twang”.
Most black people don’t get me and most ‘white’ people don’t get me. It’s cool though because I get me.
Self actualization. Maslow. “The desire to become more and more what one is, to become everything that one is capable of becoming.”
“It’s cool though because I get me.
Self actualization.” This was one of the greatest moments in my life when i realized all i can be is myself. It takes longer for some than for others.
I’ve been out of the south for a few years now and the longer I’m gone the more I miss you twangy southern young ladies!
Sigh. Take out the grad school part and this is my life.
All of it.
I had a similar experience and this is what irritates me. Regardless of what our ancestral background (whether we were free or enslaved in the states, west indies, or south america, or grew up in africa), most of our ancestors were illiterate. For anyone whose ancestors were slaves, the slaves KNEW the power of literacy! They KNEW how important it was to read and write properly! For our peers now to pull the “You acting white because you speak properly” card, I always think back to a time where people were prohibited from learning how to read. A time where the pursuit of knowledge was granted by a small minority and they withhold this knowledge from the majority to keep them as sheep.
Mena raises a point that most overlook. I am 55 and have 3 college degrees. 2 undergraduate and 1 graduate, and have been active in civic affairs all my adult life. I was raised in a nice, middle class cul-de-sac neightborhood in Flint, Michigan. I now call it “intraracism”. I, too, was harrassed and tormented a child and teenager, and really hated my own people until I went to Howard University and got to meet black kids like me from all over the world. It changed my whole perspective for life. Often the animosity that “sellouts” like me have felt is because of all mistreatment and harrassment we endured at the hands of our own people. Ironically, years later, after we are successful, we are then called to mentor and be role models for the same type of black kid who tormented us our youth. So, there is a reason for everything. Just consider that when you criticize the “sellout”. When I see all this illegitmacy I do not understand it when there are all kinds of inexpensive and reliable contraceptives available. When I see the drug use, I do not understand it when there are plenty of role models of death and destruction that shold dissuade one from engaging. I could not possibly do a better job of scaring someone straight than that. Then my all time favorire, a library card is free and it can open the world to a kid in even the worse ghetto. I suppose the library is intimidating to those very tough, hard ghetto kids. No matter. I think this bog is a very good one. All sides seem to be represented. Oh and by the way, in my experience, Africans never looked down at me; I always received respect from them because I carried myself upright and showed them respect.
Phenomenally written piece every one needs to read it and ponder on the truth contained within it. Finally someone gets it, Im a speaker and workshop presenter, and one of my workshops is about the Willie Lynch Letters and you covered it and to the tee and you challenged our people, Im inspired to do better . #Message.
I’ve had a different path than most of the black people around me and probably on VSB. I started off in the hood and moved to the burbs. My mom was a (HARDNOSED & OLD SCHOOL!!) English and Reading teacher so proper grammar was a must. I started reading at 3 and used to catch hell for it. My mom told me kids would call me bookworm. I would call them dummies and the fight was on. I never fit in anywhere. I lived in a black neighborhood and went to all white schools until high school. Even then I didn’t fit in. A football player in AP classes? Wait…he can read?? That ish made me hostile. I don’t like being bothered and I have NO problems with busting heads open. I think my general disdain for conformity is why my appearance is what it is to this day. Walking contradiction and loving it.
Normally I dont comment, i grew up in what’s known as the “wild hundreds” in chicago, but i went to catholic grade school and a catholic high school (St. Rita) and i used to catch it from both sides…the white kids would ask why i act so white and the black kids would ask why i talk so proper…even the girls would do it….didnt help that my first name is Norman, which isnt a common black name…i never dumbed it down but i was a walking contradiction, starter on the varsity football team, loved the wu tang clan and bone thugs n harmony (this was back in 95-99)…ive always felt i had to straddle the line and be nearly two people most of my life…im tatted over my chest arms and back but at the same time nothing will show if i have on proper business attire…yes i have a mixtape out lol…and ive done live hip hop shows…ive done blue collar work and ive worked in offices downtown with white corporate types, serving in the army reserve and been in trouble with the law in my younger days…im simply saying all this to say this…u really cant let people who havent walked in your shoes define your path…i made that mistake in my younger days and even though it led me to my own path i still regretted some of it
Add some long azz locs and i’m right there with you pimp. And my first name IS NOT a matter of public record!
In my case, I learned to have a smart mouth when it came to negative comments about what I say, how I say it, loving books, getting
A grades in school.
The irony is the most ghetto of folks defended my right to be me. “That’s her being who she is. Step off.”
What chaps my butt is when a Black person spends the whole social event talking negatively about ‘those Black people’ instead of having a good time. Some of us need to be free.
” didnt help that my first name is Norman, which isnt a common black name”
ROTFLMAO! Sorry to laugh at your name dude, but that caught me off guard, and was hilarious! I actually have a white sounding name too, so I feel like I can laugh and not be taken as an *sshole lol
I’m gonna say this. There are some real cool, accepting, open-minded, empathetic, intelligent, perceptive, progressive, and genuinely community-minded people from all races, ethnicities, socio-economic backgrounds, and nationalities. I think one of the many reasons people are so prejudice and even hostile to each other is that they’re mad that there’s no easy description of any demographic of people, no matter what you separate them based on. (see previous sentence with the various distinctions). It would be easier and more convenient for us if we could make generalizations that always held true, so we look at individuals as either the proof or the exceptions to our “rules”. We despise the exceptions because if we meet too many of them it reflects bad on us and our “justified generalizations”. Ego/identity distorts otherwise intelligent people’s logic. And as you mentioned so many of us are caught up in NOT fitting someone’s “justified generalization” that we take our anger out on those who’s life choices have given credence to these theories. It’s not their faults that stereotypes exist and probably always will, they’re just livin their lives. We all need help smh
I can relate to these:
* I started off in the hood and moved to the burbs.
* My mother cared about grammar when I was a child. I was reading at 3.
* I never fit in anywhere. (I am used to it, and okay with it)
* I lived in a black neighborhood and went to all white schools until high school. Even then I didn’t fit in.
(In my case I went to all white schools except for one black school)
“A football player in AP classes?” Clears throat: This is a wonderful combination…just wonderful.
+1
“I never fit in anywhere.”
Co-sign. I believe I am an anomaly.
I found out about your site on Vibe Vixen. I have to say that I went into reading this blog with an “oh I bet this is some bs” type of attitude. But now I must submit and give you brothas props! ALL of these topics have at least one thing I can relate to. Now to tell my shame moment; My sister and I went to Red Lobster to eat with our kids and decided to invite our neice. This girl walks in with some daisy dukes on a tank top and nike sandals (the ones with the “massaging” beads in them) hair looking a hott mess her tracks were showing! She sits down and and orders the SCRIMP SCRAMPI….. My shame was in knowing that she was raised better than this and went to a good school so she knows how to properly read.
glad we aren’t who you think we are but turned out to be who we say we are.
“She sits down and and orders the SCRIMP SCRAMPI…..” No ma’am.
We are the only group of people in this country who are always judged by the least among us.
I think every unfavored minority group at one time in their history feels this way. And there’s a good reason to feel this way since Whites and others do indeed judge us by the few who are seemingly making idiots of themselves.
But those Black people aren’t really our greatest shame. They make us cringe not because we give a hoot what an average White person thinks but because what Whites in general feel about us has a definite impact on our lives.
Whether it’s the White person in the HR department or the White cop on the beat or the White doctor in the ER, what they think of us matters and can be a matter of life and death in some cases.
So the shame isn’t really ours, the shame really belongs to racist Whites.
Word!
I love every bit of what you stated sister.
“We are the only group of people in this country who are always judged by the least among us.”
Untrue. I’m Latino and I’m judged just the same. My Muslim friends are also judged by the least among them. It’s a common phenomenon. Members of the “in-group” will always judge members of the “out-group” based on a few of those members. It’s the brain’s way of making things easier (though, in my opinion, it makes things messy, but that’s why we can’t let our brain do everything).
And then I say, “I think every unfavored minority group at one time in their history feels this way.” So yeah, I get that other groups feel this way as well.
The Muslim hate really bugs me. Due to the industry I’m in I have a large amount of contact with people who practice Islam and I can confidently say I’ve had great experiences dealing with Muslims. The part that’s most offensive is that Muslims treat me with the utmost respect while my fellow Christians have been some of my most bitter adversaries.
1. The idea of Black people being ashamed of other Black people revolves around the idea of not fitting into White Amerika.
2. If the scenario was different, a group of White children acting unruly, which has definetley been seen before. Society sees it as ok. Maybe it’s just our own self hatred that we see children BEING CHILDREN and label them as terrible examples of Black people, theyre kids.
3. It takes a community. Our community is broken PERIOD. The bougie Blacks pretend to be better because they worked hard and CONGRATS on that paper of a degree and lets be honest, it dont mean shit, only in the White man’s world of corporate Amerika. Not trying to sound racially divided, but we are. If Black people can’t accept each other, nobody will accept us.
Common decency is the only accord I see fit to submit to socially. Not focusing on my “blackness” but on my “humanness”. I see this “Blackness” as an area where most Blacks get caught up in the stigmata of being Black. Mental slavery.
We get stuck in a “fish bowl” of thought and no matter how man laps we run around the same old topic, we never leave the “fishbowl”.
Don’t let anybody title you and don’t feel the need to title others.
Focus on the actions and base interaction on that and the consistency of character.
Habits like reading or loud talking aren’t really important unless they are central limitations into how we interact.
If you ever feel the need to take out your insecurities on another person for whatever reason, remember that turnabout is fair play- Don’t be a punk when it’s convenient.
(See, this tone above is serious…and it is clear) It is the ninjata that fail to pay attention to context clues that bother me most. I hate lazy people…guess what…I’m lazy. I’m human. It is what we do.
*
This is similar to the Chris Rock routine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3PJF0YE-x4&feature=player_embedded
Hmmm. To address to the whole “Black History Month is the shortest month” thing, the reason why BHM was set in Feb. was to honor Fredrick Douglas’s birthday, which is set in Feb. It wasn’t an issue of month length.
Now that’s out of the way. I am one of those people who put their head down in shame when loud obnoxious black people act a fool in the middle of Downtown f*cking Chicago. I hate it. The thing is, I hate that behavior no matter who exhibits it, white black, latino, etc. Problem is, the only people stereotyped to behave this way are the general black population, and white, drunk frat boys. The frat boys seemingly get a pass because as Jamie Foxx so eloquently put it, “Blame it on the alcohol”. Black people on the other hand don’t have this luxury. Apparently this is how we act on a day to day basis.
Am I trying to pretend like I’m better than someone. Not at all. But there’s a time and place for everything.
black history month was originally black history week which was originally achievement week. founded by carter goodwin woodson at omega psi phi’s conclave in nashville, tn in 1920. it wasn’t just douglass’ birthday but abraham lincoln’s birthday (their birthdays are 2 days apart).
*this history lesson has been brought to you by tunde*
+ Much appreciated that you put this in the conversation.
lol at you specifying the omega-ness of the history. haha.
you know i had to drop that little gem in there. lol
on the off chance you dont’ think i knew that about black history month, let me be clear, i know its history and know it had nothing to do with length and everything to do with the birthdays of the two men MadScientist mentioned.
I get what you’re saying. It’s not to say you are better than anyone. But it is ok to say you are better than certain behaviors.
I am not a Black American, but as a black African, this post resonates with me.
We intellectual Africans, look down and are embarrassed by our village brothers and sisters. With their village ways and numerous children that they can barely take care of. Their irrational belief in God and their constant talk of “God will find a way” while they languish in poverty year after year, generation after generation. They embarrass us, the young middle class with our fancy education and “white” colonial mannerisms.
Intellectual black people or those who think they are with their degrees are proud to be black/African but at the same time gnash their teeth, shake their heads in mortification every time we see yet another tragic story out of this continent. Its even worse when we are sitting at a cafe in Paris and all our white friends look at us with pity and shake their heads with us.
Happy Black History Month.
i have to disagree…
i honestly feel like…if a person (of any color) sees any black person doing something they perceive to be ignorant, or “the reason we still haven’t made it” and thinks this how justifies racist prejudices (or structural racism itself) then…that person had already bought into racist ideology and was just looking for an excuse. i especially feel this way about black people who feel this “shame” you speak of. and i am speaking specifically about the feeling of shame…not disappointment or fear for the future, but shame that the actions of other black people somehow “make us look bad”.
i think it’s ridiculous and i don’t respect it. if you feel that way, fine. but please don’t voice that to me b/c i WILL judge the fukc out of your self-hating a.s.s.
Preach!
Loud “out of pocket” thugs irk the ish out of me!
Low class idiots who use the N-word in front of “company” make me want to suplux somebody!
But by far, the thing that tears away at my soul….. is being in a majority White/ Hispanic/ Asian area….. and seeing that most of the Homeless people are black.
It kills me. I want to yell out “Stop begging bothas! Have some self respect. Stop begging these women and white folks for their money.” Honestly what type of man begs a woman for change?
Man i swear i could be in the whitest city in America….. most of the homeless people there will be black.
I may be elitist for saying it, but It shames us. It shames us in a way that some loud mouth teens never could.
The Other Jerome,
That’s because they know Black people are not generous with giving money to panhandlers. And also because the whitest cities will get the most funding for soup kitchens, emergency shelters that may be in the area where the homeless people are. And in this economy we are seeing more homeless children, families. I would not be surprised if some of the Black panhandlers have a family somewhere that they are supporting or had to leave in order for their family to qualify for emergency social supports after they became homeless. The foreclosure crisis is leaving families living in cars, tent cities, homeless shelters. I’ve witnessed tent cities in Oahu, Hawaii where whole families live, and they get up, pack up and go work in the service industry on the island.
But I do get your point.
Hmmm.. I beleive there are all degrees and areas of shame and that this is not unique to race. All people attempt to fend off stereotypes in all categoriesor sub-cultures they subscribe to in their life andintheir past. e.g. I am a US diplomat living overseas and this concept is unviersal. Most want to rep their family, co-workers, alma maters, church need I got on? Properly. Trust. I have people of other ethnicities disclaiming all sorts of behavior to me. People are people.
That’s very interesting; I doubt this an anomaly within Black America. I sometimes watch “My Big Redneck [insert random event]” on CMT and the country people they have on there really appear (to me) to go overboard trying to act slow-witted and simple. I wonder how many Southern white people are ashamed when they see that.
I can tell you from experience that educated and middle class southern whites DO NOT claim, allude to, or affiliate themselves with family that is viewed as less than desirable. And when I say family, I mean potentially as close as siblings and parents. I literally know a particular white person who’s parents are alive and well (and trashy as a mofo) and if you don’t know this person’s history, they will look you in the face and tell you their parents are dead. It’s serious business out here for these white folks and they really don’t support inter-family foolishness.
Confirmed. Corey is right. Even in my own family there are no associations whatsoever with other family members that are ‘less than desirable.’ I have a few distant cousins that the only time we ever see them is at funerals. Even then, we keep our distance. And, yes, I think all the time, why y’all wanna go make yourselves look like the redneck dumb asses half of America thinks Southern white folks are? Thank you CMT for giving us Jackass the Southern version.
This is true.
Yeah, I used to feel a bit of shame then I moved to Dublin. It was interesting to see the lower rung of society with white faces. It was even more interesting to see upstanding Irish citizens show shame, indifference and disdain for the ‘travellers’, the ‘knackers’ and other ne’re-do-wells–people who are white just like them.
” People are people.”
pretty much; i peeped a documentary on white folks in appalachian Kentucky, i imagine that would be the equivalent of the ghettoness we get annoyed with
I’m torn on this subject, on the one hand I agree with what you wrote P, on the other having been the source of “shame” by high horse riding, bourgeois, look down the nose and uppity black folks for things such as the amount of children I chose to have, the age I chose to have them and the subsequent assumptions made on the life I provide for my children, the topic of black shame kinds of hits close to home.
I was raised middle class by an extra bourgeouis mother, who grew up black rich. I didn’t live but a few steps from the hood, but I wasn’t hood, I went to white schools, I talk properly, but I never had the mentality that I shouldn’t go to the hood, I shouldn’t make friends with people in the hood. I mean, we were middle class but because I didn’t wear labels, I was still seen as poor by most black folks when I did go to more black schools. I didn’t have that I’m better than these folks mentality and that’s hurt me in some ways and helped me in others. But where I screwed up, was I fell off the chosen path by getting pregnant earlier than expected. And then I really messed up when I did it again, and again and again. Here’s the thing though, I got married, my children have the same father. I’m not a welfare case, I’m not uneducated, very professional, polite, courteous and all the things a “good black person” should be… but I’ve got alot of kids. Black folks see me and automatically lecture, they see me and turn their nose up, they see me and assume I’m a project baby mama, surprisingly most “other” folks don’t do that, they seem to understand that I’m a divorcee raising her children. I have family members who do the same and that shame that they felt, they projected onto me. I spent years ashamed to tell people how many kids I have… til it hit me that I was letting other people’s opinion cause me to be ashamed of the greatest blessings I could ever be given. So I could give two f*cks what people think now, but I also try not to judge or cause anyone to be ashamed of how they live their own life, because until I’ve walked in their shoes I don’t know the whole story. I may feel disappointment or anger when I see someone with so much potential blowing it, especially publicly but I’m not ashamed because that’s on them and I don’t know the whole picture
I am divorced with one child. People have assumed I had my child as a single parent. People have even assumed I was a teen mother. People have been shocked I’ve been married as long as I have. And I will judge people based on how they act towards me due to their assumptions.
Schools are notorious for this one. Teachers, administrators, and even secretaries make all kinds of assumptions about single black moms. The assumption is exactly what you said, but the assumption for white single mothers is that they are divorced and are co-parenting. Hell, I am married but I am typically the one who goes to my son’s school since I’m an educator. Because they never saw my husband, there was an assumption that my son didn’t have a dad. I started to very purposely say, “my husband and I” when I talked to the teachers because i did not want them to get it twisted.
Once I actually heard a teacher ask another black mother,”Well does he have a father?” Needless to say, the sister went off. I wasn’t ashamed. I was glad. They deserved it.
I judge accordingly as well and if I’m caught on a bad day I’m also quick to put someone in their place. I’m cursed with a young face and have children who look alike in features but vary in color, more than a few people have gotten completely out of pocket when it comes to them and have made comments in front of them regarding their paternity and my perceived wrongness
When people ask me questions like they’d ask a teenager, I will ask them the same thing to demonstrate that I do not know them like that.
Example: “How old are you?”
Me: “Why do you ask? How old are you? Do you have a name? ”
Person: “You can call me Miss _____”
Me: “In that case, you can call me Ms.______”
My experience has been that it is how some women try to keep in check a woman she doesn’t know and cannot fit in a box. And I obviously do not let people get away with that.
I’ve had that experience divorced and while married wearing my wedding ring. *shrug*
I have a friend about to graduate from an Ivy League law school who has a young son. Since she is tiny in statute, has a high voice and wears braces, I can imagine how much she throws people off. I kind of love that.
Loving Me, your story made me sad because it just shows how judgmental people can be. I’m not saying I’m never judgmental, but I always distribute a reality check to myself by reminding myself that I ain’t sh*t and that I have no idea about another person’s situation based purely on sensory perception.
I can’t even lie and say I’ve never judged or that I don’t but I’ve made a conscious decision to try not to do so because I know how it feels. And I’m making an effort to raise my children to not just make an opinion on someone’s character based off what they think. So far it’s working but they’re also still young
We all judge. I just keep my judgments to myself because I know better. I have made friends with people, and told them what I judged them to be, and shared a laugh with them about our first impressions.
I’m more so saddened then ashamed. Yeah its annoying when kids are on the DC metro acting a fool, but it only reminds you of how your upbringing must have been different. Saddened that it seems like these children don’t know what a higher education is and what it can do for them, and even more saddened that their parents most likely are oblivious to the idea of a higher education as well. I’ve seen both sides of the track, I’ve lived in the suburbs and when my parents lost everything we had to move to the “WorldStarHipHop” but there was a difference. My mother had begun college after she graduated high school, never finished due to marriage but still knew college was the only option for her children.
To summarize, we may all be ashamed, or annoyed at the other Blacks at some point, and I don’t think that’s wrong. What’s important is that we notice how important it is to not only observe but to be active in the change we want to occur. It’s Black history month, and I’m sure each of us has a story we can tell to inspire a young one somewhere who may need a little inspiration or guidance. So do something positive this month, and share your history and the struggles you endured to become who you are today, with someone you know who needs to hear it.
Tonya on 02/03/2012 at 1:34 am said:
True. Here is my shame story..
Wow! Your Mother did a great job keeping you grounded! So glad you realized what a special village you were raised in! Because in the end …… it will be these folk that you will look back on and be grateful that they were in your life! So little to give but giving it freely! Not to mention the peach cobbler and the unconditional love that they showed you! #youareblessed.com
I’m unashamed of blackness or my fellow black people. I don’t feel the need to hide my blackness however imperfect it may be. When black people act up I do not feel the need explain or feel sorry for or make excuses for them. I have enough imperfections to not need to internalize other peoples.
Man, this is a heavy post for a Friday! But, you touched on something that is very real in the Black community even those outside of America that lives as a minority share the same plight. Man, I lived in Montreal, Qc and I feel the same way whenever I take the subway and happen to see a loud group of young Blacks. Cringe. But I used to be loud too when I was younger too. I guess it’s also a question of maturity.
I’m ashamed of people.
The parents that don’t raise their children with love, respect, self esteem & dreams to be great so they become reckless & vile to drag men out a cab & beat them (happen last week in Philly), that’s what I’m ashamed of.
Racists, religious zealots, sexist smucks, greedy corporation/politicans that tell lies to people & turn them away from the common good of humankind, that makes me ashamed for humanity.
i think i get more ashamed of dumbassery, especially when we commit it.
i still remember a story, probably from 03 or 04, where some 12th grader (at the time) got dragged out of a 7-11, beaten and left for dead on a major road (he did die, a car hit him inadvertently) by a bunch of other kids.
his crime? he asked some girl if he could buy her a Slurpee.
since then, i’ll admit i get a little elitest, and i probably come off as elitest, unconsciously.
i guess i’m an elitist. i don’t care how anglo saxons view young, loud blacks. i just want them to do better for themselves. in fact when anglos view them with looks of disapproval i automatically sympathize with the youth. although i enjoy reading and i’m educated it doesn’t mean i want to assimilate. so i think i may be ashamed of some black people but its for different reasons.
I get what you’re saying and I think I may be in some ways the same. I have absolutely no desire to assimilate, am extremely proud of my blackness, I just wish others could show that same pride and do better for themselves which is the source of the anger.pity I feel towards some
yep. exactly.
I see these types of behaviors as having already been ASSIMILATED. Think about it. Did people act like this before slavery? Before more than a hundred years of discrimination and segregation? No, they did not. Acting like this is a direct result of giving the dominant culture what it expects of us.
i guess i’ll bite. how is that assimilating? i don’t know how black people felt about other black people before slavery. i just want black people to do better. if that’s assimilating then i guess i’m an assimilating s-o-b.
No question there are a lot of insights in your blog today. But the bougie ass ninja in me disagrees about two things.
1. February was choosen for Black History Week that became Black History Month by Carter G. Woodson. The basic rationale for it has something to do with it being the birth month of Lincoln and maybe even Washington but I might be wrong on the GW part. We black folk imply all the time that Febrary was “forced” on us but actually we (Woodson) chose it.
2. Your contention that “we won’t make it as a people” is contradicted by your own personal achievements. We are making it all the time. Progress just does’t travel in a straight line.
regarding 1. i know.
2. its a more generalized all for one stance on the community. personally i think damn near everybody who frequents this blog has an impressive list of personal achievements. but i get your point.
I’m ashamed that Black people, after all this time, still don’t understand their position.
I work in a NYC projects. These people just don’t get they were never supposed to be in a government funded environment for their entire life. They were supposed to live there temporarily and then make the means to move on ahead. Somewhere down the road, they found complacency, due to the many things that hold Black people back in poor areas. So to hear these people brag about living in Brownsville for 30 years or to see 3 generations of a family living in the same PJs….it’s disgusting.
They talk big and act like they deserve the same respect as everyone else but it’s beyond clear they lost the respect they owe to themselves a long time ago. Every day I’m at work, I’m filled with disgust and pity….and it reminds me why Black people who are well off always remove themselves from the picture around poor Blacks.
I see where you’re coming from, but I want to give a partial defense of that mindset. If you go into the wilds of rural PA or West Virginia or Kentucky, you will see people with the same mindset. Heck, if you think about it, the only difference is the last of government housing. The same mindset of people on the come-up leaving and never coming back is the same too. I don’t think it’s a Black thing as it is a poor-and-non-immigrant thing, if that makes sense.
The reason White people in the Tri-State didn’t get caught up like that was the sheer need of the original generations to be around the ethnic community they came from. While that didn’t make them perfect (tune in to Jersey Shore every Thursday for an example), they had to tread water a bit just to hang around their people. Unfortunately, Black people, with their roots deep in America, never had that need to function hanging over their head, especially since the vast majority of the Black cultural institutions are where the poor people are.
I’m not absolving their foolishness. I’m just saying that it goes a lot deeper than that, especially since the generation on the come-up didn’t put down roots once they came up.
+1
Let’s also remember that the “boot strapping” that white folks love tho brag about isn’t all that it seems. White folks lived in the same kinds of “ghettos” black folks lived in until after WWII when the government granted the returning white soldiers access to the G.I. bill and suddenly they could buy homes with damn near no down payment. White folks moved into beautiful suburb in droves while black soldiers and their families were left to languish in tenement buildings in whatever poor a$$ neighborhoods they had been in prior to the war. Generational poverty is real and its not because black folks refused to do better. The government purposely gave white folks a leg up and and helping hand by providing access to housing and education. They purposely refused to extend the same to black folks.
Word. People talk about Jim Crow and Slavery, not realizing how big a deal the FHA was. After all, a lot more White people got caked off on the FHA thing and the GI Bill than ever did off of Jim Crown and Slavery put together. Redlining may still exist, but when it got started, it was a HUGE deal…much bigger than it is now. People don’t realize how the Feds more or less determined who got to live where and how based on their plans.
Then again, a lot of the history of America involved distributing wealth to various groups of White people (WTF you think Manifest Destiny was if you do the knowledge), but that’s a whole ‘nother post.
Boot strapping as a means to an end is a myth, B.
Thank you for this!! I tried explaining this very thing to a white coworker
Here’s a clip you can share with them from the PBS series “Race: the Power of an Illusion”. I use it when I train teachers and school administrators.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mW764dXEI_8
Everybody deserves to be treated with respect. No matter who they are, or what they think about their own circumstances.
I am not ashamed of other Blacks. I am ashamed of N*gger (yes there is a difference) and all those who represent me and seem to do their best to undo everything that Blacks have tried to achieve.
Hmmm, I’ve heard white people say this as well as members of my own family. I’m not sure why it offends me so much. It just sounds so elitist as if there’s a different “breed” of us.
There is a different breed of us. Its that 1% that causes 99% of the troubles we experience today as a race of people. Its not elitist when you reconize a group of people who want nothing and don’t want you to have it either, but want you to “help a brotha/sista out” when they are in need.
Hmmm, is this the true divide and conquer at work?
It is funny, once we crossover into the “other side” how we look down on the other. Even when we’re stuck between two sides. You even mentioned it in the “bougie” post, the ones who say they so ratchet… like bougie ninjas would freely dip their toes in the ratched water but in a way so far removed that they can still say they above it and know better. It aint authentic. And the folks who believe they so down often dabble in the “I’m higher class than you.” ish too. Ninjas poppin bottles of Ciroc and Moscato on Facebook despite it not being authentic either (because the real bougie folks know that ain’t really ish). But it’s about perception. They THINK they are better, often saying “y’all don’t know nothin bout this!!” We always try to one-up the other whether that means competing over who is the most classy or at the other end of the spectrum, who is the most down. Ninjas always tryna show how they differ… how they special. It’s just interesting. The VERY thing that makes us want to differ from each other makes us the same. Black Power, indeed.
Well put. Maybe if we can all get on the same page with each other instead of all the grandstanding we can get something done.
“Ninjas poppin bottles of Ciroc and Moscato on Facebook despite it not being authentic either (because the real bougie folks know that ain’t really ish). ”
*taps mic*
Ciroc is delicious. I drink it because it is delicious. Praise Diddy.
*drops mic and exits through the Bougie back door*
Not Praise Diddy! LMAO!!!!!!!!!
“Ciroc is delicious. I drink it because it is delicious. Praise Diddy”
LMBO…
Me Too.
*RaisesMartiniGlass* Cheers!!!!!!
It shole IS. I am in LUST with the coconut joint. Don’t get it Twizzler twisted, those sentiments weren’t mine. Ciroc IS the ish to me. lol
I knew you would feel me, Belinda!
I am ashamed of LOUD ninjas. Seriously, why can’t you just been seen FIRST and then heard? Why you do you have to insist on ensuring everyone knows how black, loud and proud you are? HUSH for a minute…try entering places/events/rooms/meetings/daycare/Target/the Mall quietly with less pump and circumstance.
Why do you have to be so damn EXTRA all the time!!!!!!!!
I’m ashamed of people who know how to fish but choose not to do so.
Mmmph.
“Some were reserved, some are just loud.”-
This made me LOL because I was watching Project Runway last night and dude, referring to white girl named Kenley, said “Kenley is loud. Now you know if a black person says you’re loud, you are too loud.”
I’m not sure how I fee about this post. I guess shame is the appropriate word to describe how I feel when I see black people acting in a way I find offensive. But stereotypes aside, the number of black I see “cut the fool” is extremely small.
I can’t leave this post without mentioning Hardcore Pawn. I’m always talking about this show but it seems like an embodiment of what this post is talking about. I see the black folks on there acting like straight clowns (p!issing, fighting, arguing), I assume simply so they can get on camera, and I wonder how many people of other races are more apt to believe all black people act like that.
PJack, are we related? damn…
Did our mamas cross paths during their pregnancies with us?
I don’t deal in shame. I deal in anger when it comes to the babies. Such as Black people who cuss out their babies, their hair and skin color and threaten to beat the black off them. Babies.
Adults who tell children they ain’t shit. Adults who treat children as if they are not shit.
*relax! relate! release!*
Oh wow…..you got me with the whitley Gilbert r.r.r. loved that episode!
And yes, I agree that the parents are to blame for what is going on today. They aren’t showing them better so how can they expect them to do better. I tell my child all the time that i expect greatness from her. And i get nothing less from her. I also try to show her the elitist and hood mentalities. I teach her not to judge but to observe and understand. I want her to learn from my mistakes – and the mistakes of others – so that she does not repeat them. Parents need to teach their kids to want to do better. To upgrade to a newer, better model. Parents that treat their kids like sh!t piss me off.
Even if someone lacks the resources to send their child to a great school, they can still sit down at the kitchen table and do their homework with them. Some kids don’t know how to read or write but they know how to sing every song on the radio and do every dance on the music videos. But they will have the nerve to blame the teacher for the child’s performance in school. Makes my blood boil that some parents are not investing in their children.
And yeah, relax relate release. Whooo
That infuriates me. I was out and heard a mother of a toddler tell her son to “shut the eff up and stop asking dumba33 questions!” And I and another black woman looked at each other and rolled our eyes. I won’t try and shame somebody in public but it hurt me to think that she either didn’t know or didn’t care that that was a disgraceful way to speak to a child and it’s the silencing of our children being children that has so many of us trapped. It would have made me angry regardless of the race but because it was a POC it also made me sad.
* Free my comment, please. *
I feel ashamed when I’m out in public and hear Black people using words incorrectly in an effort to sound intelligent or pronouncing words the wrong way. Example, a sign in the mall says “Sale on Faux Fur”…they say, “there’s a sale of FOX fur”…it makes me cringe. :-/
I am ashamed we retracted from the Black is Beautiful mentality of the 1970s. Bounced right back to worshipping white features… long straight hair, ‘redbone’ this and that. It’s out of control. We are putting cancer-causing poison on our scalps to project ‘professionalism’ or to be what men want… that needs to DIE… IMMEDIATELY. There is no good argument to keep doing this to our daughters, what matters more? Approval or your life? But you can’t even broach this topic with some people who are addicted to the creamy crack. They say it’s just self-expression or that women are entitled to wear their hair anyway they want… yes… you have the right, but should you? Really? If this product was used widely by white people the FDA would be all over it… banning it.
Our natural looks will never be appreciated until they predominate.
The great hair debate on a Friday huh?
Not interested in debating it… Those who will, will. That is the nature of having choices. People will be bound to make bad ones.
Just saying, I am ashamed of where I see us losing ground adn this is just one example of it. Taking three steps forward and two steps back.
Really? Natural hair is in style like gourmet cupcakes from what I see and hear. I think that’s an area where black women are gaining ground.
I noticed that the media doesn’t reflect this. In the media, you will see many types of weaves on a Black woman’s head. I am seeing hair that looks identical to dolls hair now. It is a huge difference compared to 10 years ago, 20 years ago.
I spent a good part of yesterday evening watching Soul Train line dances from the 70′s and the afros and general look of acceptance of our natural state made me almost cry. Not saying everyone should have to wear their hair natural. It’s YOUR business, not mine. But when Al Sharpton (of all people) said we wear our oppression on our head he was def on to something.
I thought this as well.
The part of DMV I live in now, natural look still hasn’t caught on. Majority still relax. I also see it as a class thing, my friends who have Afro style hair in college all went natural with braids, or twists, or afro puffs. But I live in a gradually gentrifying Black working class neighborhood and most of the women still relax the shit out of their hair around here.
I don’t want to sound rude b/c it is truly not my intention at all but seriously…
I am so TIRED of everyone who has natural hair trying to push that on those of us who don’t want it and certainly don’t NEED it to feel anymore black. My skin color does that all alone by its doggone self – thank ya! I have ridiculously corse – extremely thick – not easy to manage hair. I relax it – not often mind you – because I would like to style it in whatever way I see fit without it taking all of next week to get it done.
My mother started relaxing my hair when I was in my early teens for this very reason and she has natural hair. Sometimes she straightens it (her hair) because she likes the way it lays. Some of us do not prefer the styles of twists or locks or braids all the time. When I do wear these styles it because its a choice that I can make, just as its a choice to wear my hair in Farrah Fawcett flips or Shirley Temple curls. I can try whatever I want for a minute but I am limited to do ANY of that if this ‘do isn’t relaxed first!
I was in denial up until this line:
“if you have at any point in your existence, been somewhere, and an unruly group of Black youth have come into your presence and you cringed and/or uttered the word “n*ggas” under your breath…then this means you. Mmkay pumpkin?”
(-_-) Alright, I confess, lol… (goes back to finish reading)
welcome to the dark side. no pun intended.
I have so many feelings about this post. I HATE SHAME. It’s a useless emotion.
I went to get some takeout breakfast and the obese black woman with the gold tooth asked me “do you want some cheese on those grits, honey?”. I wanted to hug her and take the day off and sit in the kitchen and listen to her talk.
I have some hoodrat cousins. Some of them are gangsters. Even have one on death row. I love my cousins. They are cool and they don’t age and they are wise and they can party like nobody’s business. And they make lots and lots of little cousins for me to ooh and ahh over.
I LOVE black people. I should say, I’m in love with black people. All of them. Because we are the most beautiful, brilliant, talented, strong, wise, forgiving people on earth.
Didn’t come to this conclusion easily. I grew up neither rich nor poor, in neither the projects nor the suburbs. I grew up on the black side of a working class town where most people had both parents who worked hard to get by. Sure people talked slang and some girls got pregnant early. Some kids did drugs and some played around like wannabe gangsters.
My mom comes from southern landowning blacks so she raised us to be snobbish. I used to be ashamed. Then I went to all white college and law school and realized that white people are very very very overrated. They are no better than anyone and in a way, they are disabled because they only see the perspective. Their opinions only count for one. That’s it.
” I went to all white college and law school and realized that white people are very very very overrated. ”
I chortled when I read this.
“I went to get some takeout breakfast and the obese black woman with the gold tooth asked me “do you want some cheese on those grits, honey?â€. I wanted to hug her and take the day off and sit in the kitchen and listen to her talk.”
LOL, now that made me smile. Simple pleasures- gold teeth and cheese grits.
Still laughing
*their perspective.
Shame is self hate. Period. No other explanation or definition. I feel sad for us when we hate us and don’t see how incredibly beautiful we are. How we are a lot of what makes this country great. Everything that we export culturally comes from us. Just take sports, music and fashion. Look at how we excel.
Dealing with immigrants showed me that every nation, tribe, ethnicity has its rich and poor, classy and classes, educated and ignorant. Every one. Just because someone shares your skin doesn’t make them your burden. They are who they are. Just accept them and see the beauty of the wild colors, the creative language, the in your face bravado, the unbreakable self image, the entrepreneurial brilliance of the hustle, the rhythm of rap……
The cheese in the writs, honey
my phone doesn’t recognize *grits, lol.
And you’re a lawyer. Hehe
ITA!!!!
I love being black and I love black folks. I love things that are uniquely black.
I am not ashamed of people who don’t speak the queens english.
Like I love to hear old people talk and what some call broken english but I understand perfectly what they are saying. I love slang, I love my twang, and it doesn’t mean that anyone is ignorant if they choose to color the vocab.
I am not ashamed of living in the hood, or people from the hood.
The young girls with the colorful weave and long nails with designs that others are just now discovering, but we have been doing for decades etc etc etc
+100
You should write books, Wild Cougar.
“Shame is self hate.” I dont know about self hate. Maybe a reflection. But i guess if you are looking at yourself when you see someone acting like a nut and you are ashamed, then you are self-hating.
I am definitely embarrassed when i see a group of us acting a dang fool. This is the one time that I just want to say, “please stop.” It does make us look bad as a whole b/c we are in the minority and when the stereotype is on tv and then you see this out in the streets, you do believe that everyone in that group is like that.
“I HATE SHAME. It’s a useless emotion.”
#CatholicSwag
I used to be ashamed. Then I went to all white college and law school and realized that white people are very very very overrated. They are no better than anyone and in a way, they are disabled because they only see the perspective. Their opinions only count for one. That’s it.
Not to go too off on a tangent, but I think you nailed something that’s behind our shame. So few Black people, even Black people of means, know White people on any meaningful level that they tend to believe the hype. Just like White people think all Black people can dance and play basketball because of what they see on TV, a lot of Black people look at White people as these affluent people who have all of this control and must have it made because, well, that’s all they ever see.
I did go to a private high school with a lot of White kids, and I was involved with a Little League that was mostly White as well. Once you deal with them on that level, a lot of mystery disappears, and you don’t think you have to represent at all times, let’s the phone The Man to take away some Black people’s jobs. People fear what they don’t understand, and the same goes for Black folk. Losing that mystery makes life easier. Some White people are doing great, some are OK, some are struggling. The moment that a Black person gets that perspective on a fundamental level is the moment you can be proud to be Black around them. No amount of Black History Month events can teach you that.
“I cringe because our village idiots’ PR machine is stronger than that of the rest of us”
THAT IS TRUTH!! with all our degrees not keeping us warm at night, we still can’t seem to drown out the foolishness. Our voices are still so divided that we can’t form a collective sound that empowers. We all so easily identify with this post because its easier to shake our heads than try to mentor the cats we think need our help most.
Also, it ain’t only black kids that act a skip damn fool in public. This generation of young people these days are all on that dust! black, yellow, puerto rican, and haitian…I see all of em out there wildin’ out. White kids is having sex in the hallway of the H.S., asian kids cussing out their parents in target, suburban black kid with two parents in the house (both driving BMW’s) and he actin like Pac reincarnated. The shannagins have no bounds, but the white kids are just young and stupid, the asian kids are being assertive and rebelling against a submissive culture, but the black kid is being a nigger.
SMH
Did you hang out around my high school while I was growing up? LOL
Chriscogmta,
I feel you on everything you said except this:
” We all so easily identify with this post because its easier to shake our heads than try to mentor the cats we think need our help most.”
Yesterday I fussed at a 16 year old godchild who was acting too grown and a cat damn fool at home. I love her to pieces but I do not play.
Some of us identify AND mentor.
So few Black people, even Black people of means, know White people on any meaningful level that they tend to believe the hype. Just like White people think all Black people can dance and play basketball because of what they see on TV, a lot of Black people look at White people as these affluent people who have all of this control and must have it made because, well, that’s all they ever see.
This is the TRUTH!!!!!!!!!! We all believe the hype about one another because we don’t have any REAL information. Those of us who believe the white man’s ice is colder really only think so because we’ve never really tasted it.
+100
“Then I went to all white college and law school and realized that white people are very very very overrated.”
Hear hear! That right there is what increased my love for my own people and made me love other minority groups. They ain’t the icing on the cake.
Wow. If most of you were in a room together, the room would be full of people looking down their noses at each other.
I disagree. I feel like it is more of an open discussion about things that should be talked about more in our community. I don’t think that anyone here is attempting to sit on a pedestal and look down on anyone. I know that i don’t think I am better than anyone. I doubt that anyone here is feeling extra uppity or above others.
For those that grew up different or rose above their circumstance, we are in a position to help others, especially the children. It doesn’t mean adopting them or funding their education. It does mean giving back and helping out in any way that u can. It takes nothing but some time to volunteer. Join an organization that helps youth. Mentoring, tutoring, coaching….there are so many ways to touch a child’s life. It doesn’t mean that it will solve the problem but at the same time doing nothing won’t do isht either.
Again, I don’t think anyone is taking the better than thou stance. But i also believe that if everyone is passionate about it (shame, anger, frustration, etc) then we should all find ways on an individual level to take action.
This is not a perspective limited to Black People.
White people PERFECTED the art of being ashamed of their ‘lesser’ “urban poor’ or more ‘country’ counterparts. Go to Great Britain and see people talk about ‘Chavs’.. you’ll see the rabid classism is not limited to any one culture.
It’s not just a Black thing, honestly. I’m Latina and I go through these motions myself…but I’ll be damned if some White person tells ME to control MY people. That’s when I become the loud Latina I was ashamed of a couple of seconds ago. grrr.
Now that I’ve finished reading…
I didn’t grow up in the ghetto but I didn’t grow up in high society either. I’ve gone to both black and white schools. I have no issues with black culture. I want my food seasoned…like, I wanna taste it, lol. I enjoy slang. I laugh loud. I love hoop earrings and I’ve enjoyed penny candy in my adult life, lol. I’m not too good to watch Martin…or laugh at Madea’s ridiculous self, lol.
HOWEVER, I can’t stand unadulterated ignorance from anyone. But, since I’m black, the unadulterated ignorance of my folk effects me more. Plus, I think we have a call that’s higher than ourselves…living out in the world. Like my Mom used to tell me, “Don’t embarrass me out in public.” Whether we like it or not, we are a representation of black culture/our families everywhere we go. We should represent us well. Not that we can’t be who we are, but we should be who we are while being respectful, law abiding citizens. That’s all I want. That’s all I ask. That’s my prayer. That’s not asking too much, is it?!
Do you, boo-boo…but do it while acting like you have some sense.
I haven’t read all of the comments yet so please forgive me if this was already addressed but I think there is a mindset that doesn’t necessarily involve shame that we can feel as well: burden. For ‘ninjas that read’ and have had the opportunity to step outside of our backyards and broaden how we view the world it can feel disheartening to see our people with such a myopic view point. I believe at one point or another we all feel this burden of having to be perfect to “pick up the slack”—- which is a bad term, I know. I was raised by a mother and father who were hippie musicians and had working class to middle class struggles. While they successfully raised me and my siblings to be well-rounded individuals we were always aware of how lucky we were to learn those lessons and that a lot of our classmates were not being raised that way. One of the biggest lessons my African American mother taught me about my black-american culture was that we are only as strong as our weakest link so while I feel the burden of seeing young black youth (and their sometimes equally as ignorant parents and grandparents) “act out” in public I don’t assume they are cognizant of why they are acting that way and it stirs my soul too much for me to sit their complacent about it. Not saying I am above it annoying me but I agree with what someone posted above about it being a symptom of the internalized anger we feel in a society that regardless of our actions doesn’t want to recognize us as equals.
What really bothers me though is that all of this in-fighting; bougies vs ghetto, african american vs african latina/caribbean, african immigrants vs everyone… it doesn’t further our battle which is a damn uphill one. Personally I feel that we fell off the track in the late 70′s. And while the Fox Mulder in me refuses to assume that was all by accident or our own lacking, I know that it is going to be our struggle to fight (mostly) alone to get our country past institutionalized white supremacy. I’m more concerned with what proactive points of action we as a culture are going to take to make sure that even if the system doesn’t want to educate us and would rather fast-track us into the prison system that our kids still get educated, prepared and supported. That even though most of the people in this country do not want to have an open dialogue about race (because remember kids, talking about race makes you a racist. it’s much better to ‘not see color’
) we are still educating our youth on the struggles they must overcome and giving them them the tools to do so, all the while building a culture we can be proud of. I believe this was how we (were forced to) operate pre-segregation. While I don’t believe in self-segregation of any people I believe the true burden is going to be on all of us to figure out how we are going to uplift our people. That is a burden I am honored to bear any day.
Here’s 20 for the collection plate, Sis.
I think the biggie is the unknown unknowns. People self-segregate so much that they don’t know how ignorant (in the broad sense) they are. The more they see that there is life outside the hood, the better they’ll be.
….or even that there is life outside the burbs or the farm or the base. I don’t sleep on how a person can be exposed to everything, but be sheltered or exposed to very little and be sheltered.
I’m ashamed of my students who have parents that are my age and I’m 26…(point of clarification: I’m a 7th grade teacher.) It unnerves me to know that my 14, 15 year old 7th graders, yeah that old, have parents that are my age. Bad decisions, nurturing bad decisions Seriously, at 12 was anybody really concerned with sex? I mean actually doing it…Hell, I was hell bent on being the best Ping Pong Player in the 7th grade. I may just need to find a new profession.
I was a first year middle school teacher back when you were in the 7th or 8th grade and kids were having so much sex it was crazy. Many of my kids were unsupervised after school because their parents were working. They were emulating all of the sexual stuff they saw on videos and heard in the music. One year a group of my kids had a “Pass the Courvoisier” themed hooky party and it was WILD! Thank God someone’s mom came home early and caught them, but there were many more times that they din’t get caught. this was also when camera phones and video phones were first coming onto the scene and some of my young ladies were caught in some very compromising positions. Every year there wer a few girls who got pregnant because they were not practicing safe sex. they were too young to truly believe that anything would happen to them. So it’s not a surprise to me that some of your parents are the same age as you. Middle school kids have been having sex for years now. It’s not new.
Hmmm those are some old 7th graders. lol! I actually have a 7th grade son (12) and I am not much older than you. Guess you are ashamed of me.
lol!
But seriously why are you ashamed? It happens everywhere. If anything I would feel sorry for the person (woman) that became a parent so early. Sounds more like abuse if both parents are not 26. Instead of feeling ashamed… feel relieved that they made it through.
I was born with a silver (fuggin platinum) spoon in my mouth and I don’t turn my nose up at Black ppl who didn’t share my life. As a matter of fact, I don’t care for rich ppl and their ways. My parents came from one of the roughest ghettos in the WORLD that trumps any American ghetto. They made it their mission to make sure I was humble and knowledgable about my people. The early part of my life, most all my friends were white so my mother did what she could like send me to AA Women’s on Tour (every year) where I met Susan Taylor, etc. AA dance groups, conventions, meet ups, etc I thought she was obsessed but it made me have a STRONG pride in being black and being around Black people.
With that being said…
Yes I am ashamed of some of what we do. I completely understand why some of us do what they do and I’m not ignorant. I spent enough time in the “hood” and have majority Black friends to know what I’m talking about. There’s a certain type of Black person that I never get along with, simply because they don’t like me because I embody what they hate…and I understand.
To me, there is a big difference between being poor and being hood. There’s nothing wrong with being born poor and cannot control that. Most of my family grew up poor and are good people. HOWEVER I cannot stand the “hood mentality” ppl who make it a point to glorify their hood sh*t…any and EVERYWHERE. Don’t get me wrong, I make jokes, I love being ratchet, I love my hood music and hood food. Ricky Rozay is my bawse. But it’s all in good fun and I know when to turn it off to get sh*t done and live my life to the fullest. I am embarrassed by Black people who are so hood and ignorant with so much anger that I can’t do anything but stay away from them. I do a lot of philanthropy work with children/teens because they can be reached but some adults harbor too much hate to learn anything. Again, I understand and know where it comes from but I still don’t like it.
First, don’t call me pumpkin, that’s messed up. Second, W.E.B. said that this very issue would be the problem of generations to come. THe dichotomy of African-Americans struggle to validate their worth by attaining status on White America’s scale and the plight of the African-Americans that don’t have the means to do so has always been an issue. I used to feel shame, even when I was in the jects,then I felt pity, then I felt disgust toward myself. Disgust because if not for a few key people in my life, I would be that ignorant cat on the L that you rolled your eyes at and wanted to punch for the sake of black folk everywhere.
Shame is the embarassment we feel when our shortcomings are exposed and its often the last resort of grace. So whether our shortcomings are being exposed by us losing our temper or young urban youth “being loud and obnoxious”, it’s all the same. Those cats need the key people in their lives to help shape them like we 10%’s had in our lives. I’m just sayin.
Institutional racism is a beast, my friends. All of this that we are talking about comes as a result of the negative effects of living in a society that favors the success of one group and the subjugation of another. My work is all about achieving equity in schools and closing the racial achievement gap. The thing that plagues our community most is low expectations. Our children hear the silent messages of low expectations every single day that we send them to school. It doesn’t matter where they go to school either. They hear it regardless. Here’s what I mean. If you walk into a suburban school with a “diverse” population on any given day you will still see segregated classrooms. The advanced classes will be filled with white and asian kids along with a sprinkle of black and brown kids. The on level classrooms are SIGNIFICANTLY darker. I won’t even go into disproportionate number of black males filling the special education classrooms. This scenario is at the root of the reason why kids begin to think that being smart and scholarly is not for them. Eff what Dr. Ogbu says about involuntary minorities and all that. The bottom line is this. When schools all over this country, in every community, only provide access to rigorous courses to a select few black kids there is a very clear message being sent to the black kids in those classes, the white kids in those classes, and the black kids outside of the classes. The message is that these classes are for white and asian kids and a few black people who have been deemed “more worthy” than the rest of the lowly black kids. We send kids these messages from Kindergarten through grade 12. We don’t bother to offer rigorous courses in the around the way schools because clearly no one in those schools can handle the rigor. That’s a crock of bullsh*t. Children will rise to your level of expectation but we refuse to have a higher level of expectations for our children. So we continue to crank out cohort after cohort of children who will continue perpetuate this same racism of low expectations. Our kids think academia isn’t for them because they are taught in school everyday that it’s not for them unless they fit a certain mold.
Yes! Then our children ride the subways, trains obnoxiously. Black children know what is expected of them.
White kids act a damn ass too. TRUST me. Their acting an ass is just perceived differently. For one, they don’t do it on public transportation because they don’t ride it en masse. They go into the woods behind their house, they hang out in the parking lot of the 7-ll or the mall, they go downtown and damn near kill people on their skateboards. The difference is that we are not socialized to fear them. A white man will check a white punk kid in a minute because he doesn’t think that kid is a killer. He sees no reason to not approach the kid who reminds him of himself in his youth when he used to do the same thing. These kids are just being angsty teens and blowing off some steam.
For many of our youth, fear and intimidation equals power. Anyone who is made to feel powerless and unworthy is going to seek an outlet in which they are top dog. If I can’t shine academically and I have no intellectual capital, I will show my ass and be the king/queen of my train car every day. Someone somewhere is going to affirm me during the course of my day.
This is not an excuse for poor behavior, but it is certainly one of the reasons why it occurs.
Thank you for mentioning this, because it reminds me of something that happened all the time when I lived in a White town.
There are this chain convenience store a few blocks from my house. All the time you’d see these young White kids posted up just like you’d see young Black kids in the hood. Initially, keeping my instincts about me, I ice-grilled them a bit, but once I saw they were harmless, and that everyone else was treating them as harmless, I just kept it moving. The cops never gave them a second look even though police headquarters was 2 blocks away. On the flip side, I know that if it would have been some Black kids, they would have been busted once a month on some BS.
I think the thing is to White America ™, those Black kids are different and therefore a threat. Before you just scream racism, let’s keep it 100. Let’s say a bunch of White kids are hanging out in a Black neighborhood, and they don’t seem to carry themselves like the locals. What do you think is going to be your first instinct? I’ll say this much; it won’t be friendly.
Hanging out in spaces where you “don’t belong” will always be met by some sort of hostility. That isn’t the point. The point is that when our youth are hanging out and doing what youth do in the places that they do belong, they are still treated like they don’t belong. This phenomena occurs in school hallways everyday. There are crowds of whit kids all over the place, but the they are invisible for some reason. However the hyper-visible crowd of black or brown kids talking and laughing in the hallway needs to be watched because something might jump off. Its a wonder our kids aren’t more hostile. Their behavior is essentially criminalized at every turn.
* APPLAUDS *
I remember my sister’s high school talking about fist fights the White girls and boys got into after school. And this was a private school. The adults treated it as kids being kids.
“When schools all over this country, in every community, only provide access to rigorous courses to a select few black kids there is a very clear message being sent to the black kids in those classes”
?-How does a school bar access to rigorous classes for certain students?
I’m so glad you asked that question. In my school system every kid is assessed for GT services in grade 2. There is a disproportionate number of black students who test “eligible” for GT services and NEVER receive them. Parents are never notified and they are never placed. Then there are the kids who are placed in the classes one year but then the following year they aren’t and no one can ever explain why. When we look at middle and high schools, there is a tendency for teachers to see a black or brown kid with some “potential” and rather than contacting parents to talk to them about getting their kids into advanced courses, they go to the kid to see if they are interested. What kid do you know who’s going to sign up for MORE work? So because the kid says they aren’t interested, that’s the end of the conversation. teachers often do these things with the best intentions because if the black kid is a straight A student, they don’t want to “push the kid too hard” and “ruin their GPA.” There is an assumption that black and brown kids can’t hack it. That they will fold under the pressure.
Teachers are scared of black parents. They are afraid to call us, so often we have no idea what the hell is going on. They will call white parents in a minute to tell them about opportunities because they assume the white parents will be down for it. They don’t extend the same opportunities to black and brown parents because they don’t want to make the call.
I know what I’m saying may sound absurd, but I have seen it time and time again. That’s why I do the work that I do. The more teachers learn about what low expectations look and sound like, the more the share with you about how they have been guilty. I work hard everyday to get schools to change the way they do business because this behavior is so prevalent.
I think the problem is that because it’s an unusual service, recommending for GT services is a bit more personal than the standard work a teacher does. Once you hit that personal level, all of a sudden, every stereotype a person has about Black people comes into play. Unless you have a teacher that grew up around hyper-ambitious Black people (and remember…even the hyper-ambitious types keep to their own kind, so your typical White female teacher knows jack about them), they aren’t going to say a word.
The sad thing is that it is not only the white teachers. It’s us too. We have all been taught the same thing about what “good students” look and sound like and many of us have bought into the hyper. Unfortunately some of us are the children’s worst enemies.
Upthread Corey talked about being an athlete in AP courses. Do you know how many black athletes I have seen drop courses because they were encouraged to do so by a well meaning adult, while their white counterparts on the lacrosse team sit in the same class and flourish? It is disgusting, yo.
” Do you know how many black athletes I have seen drop courses because they were encouraged to do so by a well meaning adult, while their white counterparts on the lacrosse team sit in the same class and flourish? It is disgusting, yo.”
YES!!!!!! And they’re being recruited for basketball, football more than lacrosse though.
The Black children who get into the AP courses are the ones whose parents come to the school and ask questions and say “I want my child in AP classes”. The less informed and/or less pro-active parents won’t know they’re missing stuff that’s available for their child. School is often about politics, who knows whom, how involved are you in the school, whether the teachers know your name and remember who you are.
@NY2VA
That’s real spit there. The only reason I stayed in the enrichment program in elementary and AP in middle and high school is because my school teacher mom knew the deal and also knew that I would NEVER volunteer to do extra work so she MADE me take my azz up in there. I didn’t like it or appreciate it at the time but you better believe I do now.
“Teachers are scared of black parents. ”
Yup. Because at some point those teachers have heard about or seen some parent getting hostile, they just won’t bother to reach out anymore. Stereotyped reinforced. Bridge burnt.
This. All of this. The sad part is that the powers that be don’t need too much help. When you have parents who gladly hold their kids back or don’t support their interests to do better, the only ones who’ll make it as those who don’t give a f*ck for whatever reason.
Remember, not that many people tried to run from the plantations.
As an educator, I can’t be worried about things I can’t control. I am just as responsible for teaching the baby with the ain’t shyt mama at home as I am the one whose parents put them in all kinds of academic programs and such. If a kids mother doesn’t help them at home, it’s my job to do ALL that I can for them when I have them in class. The day one of my colleagues has the balls to call a parent and tell them that they will no longer be teaching their kid because there is nothing else they can do for them is that day I will accept any excuses from them NOT doing the job they are there to do.
“The message is that these classes are for white and asian kids and a few black people who have been deemed “more worthy†than the rest of the lowly black kids.” I was this sprinkle and i wrote up post how I have to get over myself. I will admit that i felt that i was somehow better than my peers (coupled with the fact that i was picked on for acting a certain way) b/c i was deemed worthy to be sitting next to the top white students. MAN oh MAN!!! Talk about a shock when I went to college and was finally dropped on my a$$ freshman year. The best thing that could have happened to me. This “sprinkle system” created a level of arrogance in myself that needed to be corrected and I am glad that it was.
What you described is the truth. Our school tried to place my brother in general classes (lower than college prep which was pretty much tech prep). My mother raised a fit and got him into college prep courses. Can i tell you that my brother graduated in the top 20% of his class with academic scholarships to everywhere in our state? It all starts with education. I mean, it starts at home but if you don’t have teachers and a school system to back a child, that child will have the HARDEST time succeeding if they do so at all.
WOW I agree with all of this.
I clicked post by mistake. I meant to say I agree with all of this except you failed to mention the parents. Part of the reason why many Black children do not place importance on their education is because their parents didn’t…and their parents didn’t…and their parents didn’t, etc. This is the result of being freed from slavery with no reform. The cycle repeats itself to present day. I can’t completely blame the school system. Yes they don’t put proper funding into inner city schools but the other part of the problem is us. I’m not saying it’s all our fault. Like I said, I know our origins in this country. Our values are diff due to our history. However we can change this. My daughter goes to a predominantly white school and she makes good grades because I place the importance, because her peers make good grades, my family is filled with scholars; It’s her environment. The inner city Black child is a product of their environment as well. The problem starts in the home as well.
What you are saying about some parents is the God’s honest truth, but it is not totally true. As a black mother of a black son, I play NO GAMES when it comes to school and learning. But as a teacher, I understand that the children of the disenfranchised have the right to an education just as much as anyone else. There are parents who don’t really care a lot about school, but guess what? There are WAY less of those parents than folks would have you believe. There is this idea of what parental involvement is supposed to look like and when it does not look that way, parents are dismissed and declared not to care. I do not attend PTA meetings, nor do I volunteer in my son’s classroom. But I’m an educator and I know that what he does will have a huge impact on his academic future, so I work with my son at home and he excels in his school. As a first grader he is taking math and reading in a third grade classroom. However, if my son wasn’t blessed with special academic and cognitive gifts and was struggling, some might be tempted to say I don’t care about his education because I don’t come out and do the things that “concerned and involved” parents do.
“Parents don’t give a shyt” is an inflated and overused excuse that we have been made to believe by schools that have run out of ideas on how to teach kids of color. The OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of Black parents want the best for our chilldren – be they from the hood, the burbs, rich, poor, or otherwise. However, we have allowed ourselves to believe that schools can’t do any better for our kids because we don’t want any better for our kids. The devil is a lie. We have to put a stop to this lie ASAP.
+ I agree NY2VA
Damn it Panama “Cosby” Jackson! How you gon’ put us on blast like this…you know you got white folks readin’ this site! You should be ashamed for exposing us like this!
I’m actually curious as to the extent that this phenomenon will be explored in the forthcoming movie “Good Deeds” starring our favorite cross dressing actor gone straight-lace, Tyler Perry.
I’ve often felt the same sense of shame you speak of. The same wayward crap that our young do that elicits shame from us is also done by others, except they get a pass to be seen as, “oh, they’re just young and expressing themselves, finding their way.” We don’t get that same luxury. When we do the same things, it seems to be used as reinforcement to negative stereotypes that are used against the entire race.
In theory, each of us is an individual who will succeed or fail on his own merit. In reality, those who have limited interaction with us but who are in positions of power to determine whether we will be hired or not are prejudicing their decisions on those limited “stand out” observations they’ve made of our kind.
It’s no wonder that Newt singles out black people as being on welfare. The short of it is, he needs more people. Black people. Correction, black people who aren’t on welfare or gaming the system. We’re out here, but we’re not seen to the extent that the PR machine of our less-refined brethren are. If you turn on the news, there they are, but where are we? Where are the images of you and I – those of us who are professionally oriented, we who matriculate well into the society of the majority in order to play the game, their game, and play it well? Where is our PR machine? It’s not there. Therefore, yes, I cringe when I see unflattering images of our people doing things that counter the image of me that I wish to portray. I accept that that is simply my problem because I’m sure that those who play the ghetto role gives not a sh*t about my opinion of them or society’s opinion as a whole for that matter. But, I cringe because I know that the ghettoness of that perpetrator will serve as an ambassador for negative imagery of me to those who I may seek to hire me – which makes my individual attempt to overcome that image and stereotype that much harder. I cringe because our village idiots’ PR machine is stronger than that of the rest of us.
Panama “Cosby†Jackson!
*Flatline!
LOL, I was thinking the same thing after reading this post. Black people need a new publicist.
Excuse me if my comments are redundant (don’t have the energy to scroll through all the comments)
I ain’t even gonna lie, I do get disgusted when I see unruly loud mouth ebonic talking gum popping ninjas and hoodrats whether in passing or while riding the NYC subway … It makes me cringe and hold my head down in shame.
I also get miffed whenever I encounter a sister strolling by with her 3 to 4 kids in toe all different shades/features (different fathers obviously) with NO RING on her finger. I shake my head in embarrassment for her and shame for US AS PEOPLE because she has rendered herself as just another Statistic. *smh*
Although I feel that we are making some progress as people on the whole (education/upward mobility, etc.) we still have a lonnggggg ways to go.
I love Black People — I Hate Ni@@as.. #ChrisRock
this is a state of emergency
the prognosis in one word:
anarchy
it grows stronger by the minute
infectin’ our youth like hiv
running rampid thru their
impressionable minds
like an epidemic disease
metastasis
spread of hatred
and wreckless behaviors
strips them of their antibodies
and ability to hold onto their hopes and dreams
of ever becoming anything
fuck the future
and forward thinking
cause life has no guarantee
and in come the dark shadows of
despair and negativity
so they turn away from self betterment
gravitating toward self destruction
and corruption
cheap thrills
poppin pills
anything to escape reality
pass the time
just tryna get by
living life with no accountability
too blind to see
that these actions extend far beyond
what the eye can see
a single instance can have ongoing consequences
and ramifications
that last far beyond
what their feeble minds can measure
or care to believe
trapped in a prison
with no bars
suffering from mental anguish
and self mutiliation
in the form of self hatred
hate to say it
but stop tryna blame x, y or z
for what they did to hold back
you and me
that victim act won’t cut it anymore
break shackles
tear down walls
defy the odds
rise above those limitations
of what society says is all you’ll ever be
it’s time to take a hold of your own destiny
What I find most interesting about ” Black shame” is that in order for us to have it, we actually have to also ADMIT to having some ties to them and that we actually CARE how they act. I mean, think about it, most of the shame we feel about Black folks who don’t act to our standards is:
1. Because we’re afraid of how it rubs off on us. Well, even being afraid of this fact means you’re sorta admitting they are apart of you in some way. If someone truly thinks they are “above” something, then they close ALL ties. Even figurative.
2. To be ashamed of something, you actually have to have some sort of concern about it. Like, you can’t be ashamed of something you don’t care about. Like, I know there are people who just feel better about looking down on others, but I’m talking about folks who truly become bothered by someone else’s actions, hoping they’ll change. They may not care enough to do something about it (and then again, sometimes… what CAN you do? You can’t change someone really…), but trust… they care. At least a little bit.
I guess my point is we got to get to the root of WHY we feel ashamed anyway? Like, why does the actions of others mean SO much to us? I think the answer brings us closer than we’d think… by default.
“I guess my point is we got to get to the root of WHY we feel ashamed anyway? Like, why does the actions of others mean SO much to us?”
Speaking for myself I think the reason why is because deep down I feel like THEY KNOW AND CAN DO BETTER, I refuse to accept that whole “I’m a product of my environment so I’mma just roll with it” nonsense, we all make our own choices and decisions. IMO
“Speaking for myself I think the reason why is because deep down I feel like THEY KNOW AND CAN DO BETTER”
I think a lot of folks feel this way. When I shake my head at some folks, I do it with this in mind. Like, you SEE that potential ain’t being followed through. I just raised those questions because for those who want to be so “above” ish, they certainly have a lot of concern about how other people do what they do. My point is, they care, but don’t wanna admit it because well… they so “above it.”
“I guess my point is we got to get to the root of WHY we feel ashamed anyway?”
Someone mentioned above that it goes back to the acknowledgement of racist stereotypes. People, not just white people, think black people are rude, loud, animals, dumb, etc. I’m not sure what other group of people more heavily carry these stereotypes in America. So when I see those few who cuss loudly, fight, go off on people for no reason anywhere anytime, I feel like that other person is saying “this how black people act.” Maybe I shouldn’t care, but I do.
I recall seeing a YT video of some black girls beating up a white girl in McDonalds. The comments, of course, were incredible. Black people were all kinds of monkeys and savages, etc. I know YT comments are always particularly vile, but it hit me for some reason- there are some people who really think the very worst about all black people- probably the people who are smiling in my face everyday. I guess maybe I feel like we are giving them the satisfaction of being justified in racist thoughts when we show out simply because we are the ones who have been portrayed that way.
“Maybe I shouldn’t care, but I do.”
See, my point ain’t even that you shouldn’t care. We all should. I’m talmbout the people who try SO hard to separate themselves from “other” type of Black folks… yet still feel shame when they see them out and about. My point is the hard part of this “shame” is admitting that the reason you care how bad they’re representing you is because… they DO represent you, despite you trying so hard to separate yourself from them. (I’m using “you” in the general sense here, btw.)
ETA: And add to the “what white folks think”, thing… that’s an interesting discussion in and of itself. For as much as we try to make sure they don’t have this “negative” view of us, we need to focus more on how we view ourselves. Which, as a whole, ain’t that pretty, either. All the in-fighting is what I’m most concerned about at this point, not what “they” think…
” as much as we try to make sure they don’t have this “negative†view of us, we need to focus more on how we view ourselves. Which, as a whole, ain’t that pretty, either.”
Yes! Our view of ourselves is very significant to the trajectory of our life experiences and how we choose to live.
(I too didn’t have the time to read all of the above but…)
I would classify as a loving to read and write, progressed, well-off, only have two kids with two diff dads (that are involved and take care of their children) over a, not 10 but a 6 year span, and can I just say I love loud, “obnoxious” black people? I watch them piss off white people and I don’t feel shame. I just laugh in my head at the uncomfortable pigment-challenged women that clutch their purses.
I guess this categorizes me as AWESOME. This category comes in many colors. Those that live in the suburbs but let the ghettoness come over on Tuesday afternoon for some degrading rap music, cheap beer, and red flovor Kool-Aid.
Nice.
A few years ago I watched this documentary w/ Dr. Henry Louis Gates on the Black migration to Chicago. He said the first wave of Blacks were already “middle class”, coming from Memphis and I’m gonna say Arkansas? They settled in on the Southside. The second wave came from the deeep South – Alabama, Mississippi and were the sharecroppers. They settled in on the same Southside and did uncouth things like sweep their grass away. The first wave of Blacks moved farther away. And so on. And so on. And so it continues. And my fear is that the chasm will only grow because with integration and “freedom” comes opportunity to stay away from “them”. To shun. To ignore. To ridicule. And to never cross paths unless you absolutely have to.
But! I’ll admit. Because I already have two kids with two different men… I REFUSE to have another because of the people that look at me with “SMH” written all over their faces. Even if I get married I don’t want another kid for this reason. Thanks guys for shaming me and crushing my dreams of ever having a daughter!!!!!
Damn.
Don’t cheat yourself out of something you want because of what someone else might think.
you know what, this whole post and comment thread leaves me feeling very uneasy about the state of black america.
i mean seriously dont get me wrong i have had my shame moments and i am sure I have caused some. What I am most ashamed of is that so many of us reading negroes wont stand up for what is right, will take racism, sexism and suck it up to avoid being stereotyped as the angry black person, which to many a fate worse than death. The sad reality is sucking it up turns you into the docile black servant.. the true yessuh person. the original stereotype. yet these are the first ones to label something as cooning.. the cosby affect as i call it but thats a whole other subject.
meanwhile I just wanna say that i hate ninjas vs black people shyt has always been stupid to me.. and anytime i read or over hear a conversation in that vein it embarrasses me cause guess what? we all ninjas to someone.. those arbitrary “you a ninja if” guidelines are based on the person doing the judging..
I’ve always gotten from people I am ‘too militant’ and ‘too angry’ but I ask them, what is the better alternative? Being accomodating, not giving a rip about changing things, thinking ‘I got mine.’ Smh.
Someone up thread mentioned that most comments lean towards “looking down the nose” at Black people. I don’t see it as that…all I am saying is there is a time and a place for being loud and “free” whether you are black, white, yellow or green…my cringe gauge activates for every shades under the rainbow.
No self loathing here. Black is beautiful!
OMG. This happened to me just on Tuesday. Now, I commute to work by car and don’t get out much. I work at a D.C. University and went on a Tech run to campus with two co-workers (Asian and Iranian) We took the university shuttle bus and a group of overly loud, profane and obnoxious “youth” got on the bus that is primarily white. I have to say I’m guilty as charged.
I’m ashamed of those of us that know better and can do better but don’t. Not having options in your situation does not give you license to be lazy and unproductive.
I’m ashamed of those of us who still use phrases like “acting white” and “selling out” to describe others who preferred to grow out of the box/label/hood rather than remaining stagnant.
I’m ashamed there’s still a list of things black people don’t “do”. If I here one more “uh uh, you know *we* don’t do that. You been around them white people too long.”
O_O >_> O_O
I love us and all. You just ain’t gonna just to paint me with your blackness brush.
Also I’m ashamed that I laugh at other black people’s ignorance on the regular. #FlamingYoung will never not be funny.
Oh yeah. I’m ashamed of that “kinging” that took place because I’m pretty sure someone I know still goes to that “worship center”.
LOL! that is on the craving for stupidity list of things that make me ashamed.
I cringe at some of folks behavior however, there is a lot of EGO in being ASHAMED of anyone.
Love this post! And i would actually like to thank those ratchet a** kids on the dc metro system for cutting up. The pics and vids that i get every morning and evening to post on my facebook for hours of mindless banter is great.
Brav-fcuking-O Panama. Brav-fcuking-O. A very good write up and read for a Friday. True, true.
It would be nice to comment at length, but i hate typing via phone. Anyways, good stuff.
To the article, What say I? …I say Hear, Hear.
The only thing I don’t like is a lack of compassion, and a craving for stupidity which can be seen in anyone from any faction or station in life. “High or Low” as it were. Other than that I say Live and Let Live. if we don’t like something and we aren’t going to try to remedy the problem in some way then we should STFU.
Glad I found this site. I love the posts.
I can’t be ashamed of Terrell Owen’s going from $80 million to broke in so few years because I never really identified with T.O. to begin with. I don’t think the black community is monolithic. But that is ok. It doesn’t mean we are ‘divided’ just that we are diverse, like Africa. We can come together on things that affect us all.
When did he go broke?
He is claiming to be broke or whatnot… Idk.
I don’t know why we are surprised when you hear about athletes / artists going broke. Another case of $80 mil not being $80 mil:
Tax man gets half $40 mil left
Agent gets 15% $34 mil left
Accountant charges 5% $32.3 left
Momma, baby’s momma, business ventures, real estate, cars, and ya boys = $32.3 mil
Funds left $0
@Sigma: Nope. If you have 32 million left, you can put 15 of that away and then play with the rest. What happens is that people live WAY outside of their means. Do you really need a 10 million dollar house and 8 cars? If i had 32 mill and put 15 away and then had 17 left over, trust, i would not be poor. There is NO REASON for someone that rich to go bankrupt.
Now *I* know that and YOU know that but you have to understand a few things about people that find themselves in these situations. Typically they are from a deprived background, usually they’re ability to understand the basics of finance (much less all the nuances) is minimal, and when you make the type of coin they do the thought that this IS a finite amount of money never really crosses their mind. What’s even more common is guys being fine until a few years after they retire. Upkeep on expensive ish is a beast that most people have no knowledge about….until its too late that is.
+1 Corey
First and foremost, good post Panama. But, you going deep and on a Friday?! Bad Panama, bad.
I see everything you talk about in there, yet I see it in many races because I have this bad habit of observation. And, the more I observe the more I see that no matter what skin color you are or they are the more people are alike than different.
I was in a taxi the other day talking to the driver. He was (stereotype) Middle Eastern. The more he talked the more I pegged him as Arab. Yup, I’m pretty good at that. Once the cat was out of the bag about my ex being Arab this guy changed his speech completely. It was rather interesting. Once I told him the country my ex was from another change in attitude. It was really fascinating to observe. He automatically put himself ahead at the top of the food chain, so to speak, because he thought his people (Filistin) were better than the ex’s people. Hey, yo, you all Arab dude (& terrorists to many, but we won’t go there)! Then it changed again when he asked what my ex did for a living. When I told him civil engineer he cursed in Arabic. LOL I died laughing (inside of course) because I understood him and he didn’t know it. I have this deceiving interaction with people. I let them ‘stick their foot in their mouth’ while I quietly observe them. Sneaky I know, but you learn a lot about a person if you just let them give it up first.
Now, back to just black folks in particular and my perspective as a white person. Well, as a white person I have seen everything you’ve mentioned in your post, and yeah, I’ll admit there have been moments, like yesterday, when I saw some young people acting stupid and wanted to chastise them for acting in that manner. Yesterday, I was walking out of a McDonalds. As I did so, 4 employees were in the dining room. Mrs. Obama was on Ellen (I think) and apparently did a dance on the show after being introduced. One girl yelled, “Look at the First Lady! She gittin it.” And, then all of a sudden they all got up like they were at a club and started dancing and hollering.
A lot of conflicting emotions collided in me. First I wanted to say, “Sit yo’ arse down. You are not representing yourself correctly.” But, what was correctly? As a McDonalds employee? As a supporter of the First Lady? As a black person? My last thought was “they are just having fun” and I kept it moving.
Other black friends of mine have really surprised me at times. One in particular, she despises lazy, uneducated, multiple baby mama, get a welfare check type of black people. Now, listen, this person also exists in white people *gasp* I know, right? But, if a white person says that a [insert race here] person needs to get off their arse and work on themselves, people that [insert race] get all offended. It’s like you can criticize your own people, but don’t you dare let a white person verbalize their opinions of another race because, well, their white. And, if they do verbalize it, well, now their just racist. They have had all the privileges and things given to them their whole life so what do they know? News flash: all white people ain’t privileged. *gasp* I know right? Who would have ever thunk it?
In the very near future, the ‘white’ population will be the minority in America. I wonder sometimes what will be the mantra for failure then? If ‘whites’ are the minority, will people actually come to terms with what keeps them down is their own ways/ thinking/ do nothing to improve themselves self? Will they take responsibility or find something/someone new to blame and categorize as ‘evil’?
Told ya this was deep, but you went there. I’m here all day.
Agreed. I think the reason non-White people get up in arms is that 1) they don’t know a lot of White people and 2) the White people usually saying some mess like that is someone with an agenda that isn’t in their best interests. Keeping it real, a cat like Newt Gingrich (who says a lot of stuff about Black people from his remarks over the years) is doing a lot better than 98% of White people, but for Black folk, he might be the only White person they see saying more than mere pleasantries. I think that’s where the drama lies. They see White people with power doing well, see some White people that look and talk like them, and think that the White people they see are similarly situated.
Nothing Newt says is in my best interest. I can’t stand that bigot. Of course, I can’t stand most of the GOP or Tea Party ppl either. They all exude overt racism and think for some reason they don’t.
You know what annoys me most about some white people? Is that they will approach me talking smack thinking that I am just like them because I’m white. That’s when I really want to say to them “Ninja, take that shyt somewhere else. You don’t know me.” But, I digress.
This happened about a week ago actually. A white lady and I went to dinner together and the first thing out of her mouth was about the GOP campaign. I shut that shyt down real quick by saying, “Let me tell you that I am not a Republican.” Silence instilled. I told her that I have a (note A) friend that is Republican, but we never talk politics and we left that at that.
Finally, on the political front: my dad is not very vocal, but when he says something it is usually very meaningful. The other day we were talking about the upcoming elections and told him, “If the GOP could actually put a reason out there that folks could actually vote for them based on the needs of the country instead of “we just have to beat Obama” then there might be a race.” My dad said, “I think their platform is based on racisim and nothing more.” Word. Astute observation. Apologies for off topic.
I don’t feel this shame you speak of. Understand, I that I live in a neighborhood that may have a native born black person population percentage of like 3% most of the movies and TV shows I enjoy may not be aimed at my demo but I feel no shame. I don’t like to see loud kids of any shade on the train. I just hate kids unsupervised in public as a rule. Basically tho I think many of the things black people feel shame about are not unique to black people. I don’t understand where the shame comes from. Someone assist me in feeling the shame I should feel so my blackness can be complete.
I may also add that many of the things people speak of that they feel shame about makes me think of stuff I saw on the regular when I was a kid. I enjoyed my childhood very much so I can’t say it comes with a negative feeling. It was just how things were at home and still are for some folks. I’m not saying any of it is good but I can’t say I turn my nose up at it either.
I just saw something..you trying to say red isn’t a flavor?
Red is a color. You conditioning and continued flavor association does not make it otherwise.
I think “red flavored Kool-Aid” is a legit instance of the human creation of human language, or people exercising their will to name things in ways that make sense to them. After all, Kool-Aid is in large part just pigment. There probably isn’t a trace of cherries in it at all. I mean, maybe they have a factory worker chew some cherries and breath into each pack, then call it cherry-flavored…
Can I ask an elephant sized question?…
Why is it so wrong to think you are “better” than someone else?
I can be better educated than some people I meet. More well-read. Faster at puzzles and riddles. (I’d add better athlete but I’d be lying.) So much so that we are shown off like new cars by our elders who take pride in our accomplishments. But if someone says, “You think you’re better than [me, us, he, she ,it]“, any response other than, “No, I don’t” and the fan starts flinging sh*t all over the place. When in truth, in some aspects, we are “better.”
“Why is it so wrong to think you are “better†than someone else?”
Because no human being is ‘better’ than another. We are different, not ‘better’. We are all born naked and we’re all going to die. When someone says, “You think you are better than me.” the response should be “No, I’m not better, I’m different.” They can’t argue that because truth is truth. You are different.
But some people ARE better at some things than others, no? Is it just the semantics of a subjective word like “better” that makes it such a faux pas?
Your level of achievement can be ‘better’ than another, certainly. Does that make you a ‘better’ human being? I was just pointing out as a human being we’re all on the same playing ground. The basics.
So to follow this line of thinking… if I see a gaggle of black teens on the train cussing up a storm and playing their music loud and felt more than annoyance but shame and they noticed this change in my demeanor and called me to carpet on it, my response would be “I’m a better black person than you”? It just doesn’t sound right to me. Me no likey.
No. I didn’t ask if we should go around asserting our “betterness” like d-bags. Comparing one’s 30+ self to a teenager on the train is ridiculous. Going around comparing everyone you comparing everyone you see to yourself is just stupid.
I’m talking about specific instances where someone else questions whether you think you’re better than them and why it’s not acceptable to honestly say “Yes” if you feel that way for whatever reason.
” Why is it so wrong to think you are “better†than someone else?
I can be better educated than some people I meet. More well-read. Faster at puzzles and riddles. ”
Well, do you see your identity as “puzzle solver” “ridder solver” Is that at the core who you are as a person?
It is what you do well. But isn’t who you are. Unless it is all you see yourself as.
Who we are as people is a sum of some very intricate parts. None of us should see ourselves as any one thing.
If I said I was a better person than a murderer or a pedophile, no one would disagree. No one would argue that. They wouldn’t say well, you’re better at not killing people.
Is “betterness” is only acceptable when its shared. Is it only when you single out your individual “betterness” that it becomes a problem?
Deviant,
If you were playing puzzles with someone, and kept winning, I’d say you were better at puzzles than they are. But better as a person because you are faster at puzzles and riddles? No.
When people say “You think you are better than me” they are essentially saying you think your value as a person is more than their value as a person. They may even be saying that you view yourself this way–that you compare yourself to them as more worthy as a person.
I hear you but I’d argue that there are some people who are more valuable to our society than others. Not that those others can’t increase their value but they haven’t and we acknowledge that.
It isn’t a question about one life being more important than the divine plan for the universe. It’s a question about being able to acknowledge one’s evolution as a person without condemnation. Some of us have not evolved to the same end. If I recognize that my point of evolution is beyond yours, it doesn’t mean I think you’re worthless. It means I think you’ve got some growing to do.
” If I recognize that my point of evolution is beyond yours, it doesn’t mean I think you’re worthless. It means I think you’ve got some growing to do.”
As long as you realize that the other person probably thinks the same of you, then I guess you can say exactly what you think about them, and deal with the consequences of doing so.
I just don’t think that because I am better at riddles and puzzles than the next person, that it means they have some growing and evolving to do. I just think they suck at puzzles and riddles.
Deviant,
I definitely like this post in a sense b/c when did it stop being ok to celebrate yourself and your accomplishments? Am I supposed to keep my head down b/c I’ve worked hard to “better” myself? The term when used in this sense isn’t used just in our race but every where. When one “betters” his/herself – it can be a variety of things but it shows that they know they have some place “TO GO” instead of being stagnant – not realizing potential or attempting to capitalize in their situation.
I agree that it has nothing to do with your value as a person in the grand scheme of God’s design but whether you have tried to utilized the tools to reach His maximum plan (not that we actually know what that is so it could be not “bettering” lol). But to end humorously as a Bougie Black Girl would say, “I’mma need you to do better.”
“Why is it so wrong to think you are “better†than someone else?”
i’ve noticed this as well…i don’t know when this started, possibly the 90s, but it seems that folks don’t care to acknowledge when there are people..
“better”..
than others.
maybe it has something to do with an increasing atmosphere of political correctness?
maybe with the news media being so current, we can easily see the flaws of those that are ‘better’…and as such, there really aren’t many that are ‘better’, just good at hiding their flaws?
What.
EVER.
I have no remorse. This is NOT the reason we can’t progress as a people. Why do I have that opinion, you ask?
Jerry Springer.
Admit it, you didn’t know that level of ratchetness existed in people of the caucasian persuasion until they blasted it on TV. But if 60% of the American population is white, and we actually have a pretty equal poverty level amongst races once you get out of urban areas & into the country…
And the “country” part of America is what, 80% of the land….
You would assume there was a LOT of white chocolate ratchetness going on right? Even more than us, correct? But you never hear about it. Why? Because white people are JUST AS ASHAMED, they just hide the rachet in their family MUCH better than we do. We may invite our “extra” family members to our family events, white people will just tell you they’re dead (seriously, I have known people that will just say, “nope, my uncle’s dead”, rather than get him invited to a company function.). Up here in NY, you are hard pressed to find a white person in corporate that was BORN in NY, but I guarantee you Ithey NEVEEERRRR bring their family up to visit, they only fly down to visit THEM. And if their family comes up, you don’t know about it until they have already left. That’s not what’s keeping us down. What’s keeping us down is what happens when Black people get into positions where they could give other Black people a hand up- and then NEVER do, for fear that they would get blamed if that person effs up. they are so terrified of losing what they have to an aint ish black person that thought they can cost b/c a black person hired them. The second reason we can’t progress? because they occasionally DO give someone a chance, and that person lives up to every fear they had, coasting along b/c a black person hired them.
I’m pretty sure Eddie Long being crowned King of the blacks by a fake Jewish guy is our secret shame.
Stereotypes are so pervasive that the actions of the few cast a shadow on the entire community……As a school teacher I am sometimes ashamed of what white teachers have to say about student behavior. Granted, they could do a better job of disciplining, but to hear them describe what kids do in their classrooms and their thoughts about the behavior upsets me. In my mind I’m saying, come on kids…we can do better. Be motivated to learn, stop trying to get into a power struggle with these white teachers when they’re just doing their job of teaching you something valuable.
Take command of your education and stop looking for a way out with sob stories and excuses…Show THEM what we’re CAPABLE of.
“Take command of your education and stop looking for a way out with sob stories and excuses…Show THEM what we’re CAPABLE of.”
I often toe the line of sounding like a boot-strapper, but I whole heartedly agree with this. Furthermore, let’s not even make it about ‘showing them’ anything. Let’s just be capable.
Shame? Yes, I feel ashamed and embarrassed about obnoxious and dysfunctional people in general. It hurts even more deeply when it’s a family member, woman, black person, or American (groups I identify with).
Happy “ghetto” folk being loud, passionate, loving, and expressive? Love it. I think what distinguishes a true “sell out” is a person who feels disgust in response to positive things that happen to have some flava.
I’m DEEPLY ashamed of the deep seated elitist thoughts between African Americans and Africans. They are beyond DUMB as fug! Actually, I’m not ashamed, I’m angry-very angry. We are all in the same boat, but fail to realize this! That in itself, is a dagoone shame! Shoo, the whiteman don’t know the difference between African or one with an American heritage. Let’s kumbaya together and fight supremacy. Peace ya’ll!
I have bi-racial children (half white and Asian). From their earliest I told them that they had to behave in public better than white children. Told them that they wear their ethnicity on their face and that is what people see. I’ve seen children running wild in stores and restaurants while their parents do nothing. That reflects poorly on their parents and shows that the parents neglected teaching their children manners.
I’m ashamed so many American-born Black folks think their history starts at slavery. Smh. Most I’ve met know little or care little about continent. I ask them about why they don’t care to learn more about African history, they say that it’s cus they don’t know which country they come from… but over 90% of all slave trade happened from Nigeria and surrounding West African coastal nations. And before Europeans carved out unnatural borders, there were large nation states that covered that entire area. It’s a pretty good chance that is where you are from. It’s 2012, the excuse that ‘history was stolen’ is a thin one when there is SO MUCH INFORMATION out there now about the ancient kingdoms of West Africa.
Another pet peeve: Too many also think that they have a lock on the Transatlantic trade thing. Nope. Only 5% of the diaspora came to the U.S. 95% of it went to Latin America and the Caribbean.
wow, those facts are fascinating—- I will definitely be doing more research on this
At the same time, even if I took a mouth swab, did my research & paid for a geneaology team to hunt down my african roots, my exact tribe/ or place of origin will always be a guesstimation at best.
If you did a sincere study of the area you would know that that region of Africa has seen no less than a dozen different ‘waves’ of large nation states with smaller tribes. It’s a dynamic thing as well. Nothing has stayed static or the same on the continent. How people have identified and their religion and language has changed over and over and over again. Even if you were able to track down your roots, who is say they would still be practicing the same religion/speaking the same language/having the same culture as before the Transatlantic slave trade and Colonialism of Africa. That is not an excuse to stay ignorant about the African continent both it’s history and it’s current political framework. How many can name even just ONE head of state of an African country?
What do you people have to be “ashamed” of? Especially regarding all the “baby mama” comments. When these women have these babies does it make YOU have babies? Of course, in a perfect world, all babies would be born to two parent households, where the parents love and care for the the child and each other, but, NEWSFLASH: we don’t live in a perfect world.
With that being said, what people ALWAYS leave out when discussing “illegitimacy” or “baby mamas” is the fact that decades ago, there were ‘multiple’ movements going on in this country, The Civil Rights Movement, The Women’s Rights Movement, and The Right To Choose Movement. African Americans participated in ALL Three Movements. Now this came along with prior “movements” or influences as well, not to mention the historical significance of this phenomenon. So, we are talking about at least three philosophical influences on the African American community.
(excerpt):
During slavery, Black women learned that they could raise a child with or without benefit of (or dependence on) marriage. During slavery, the child’s father could be sold off, murdered or deliberated kept from the mother. After slavery, and during “jim crow”, Black males were still being hunted down like animals, ran out of towns, lynched, maimed and mutilated, again, leaving the Black woman alone to raise her child(ren). After ‘jim crow’ and the great migration to the North, a lot of African Americans found themselves without employment and having to receive government assistance, where if the husband was still in the home, the family could not receive any assistance, and during that time social workers spied on and harassed and investigated these families, literally. So, here, another instance of the Black male having to be absent, (actually had to be ABSENT from the family in order to make sure the family could eat and have a place to live). Now, factor in fluctuating economies, where during America’s economic downturns, the Black male is the last one to be hired and the first one to be fired, and you have literally a trend set by now. The trend of Black women taking care of the families with or without a husband/man in the home.
African Americans participated in the Women’s Right Movement coming to believe that Women, not men, or society had rights over their own bodies, their own lives, their own choices.
African Americans participated in the Civil Rights Movement that not only brought about changes in racial discrimination where African American and other minorities where concerned, but also brought about changes where women in general were concerned. Women could no longer be discriminated against where employment and wages were concerned. More women entered the workforce, more women could support themselves and/or their families on their own. Women pushed and gained the “Right To Choose”, however, people now forget that “The Right To Choose” goes both ways, the right to choose to have an abortion AND the right to choose to keep and raise a child she conceives.
This all coincided with the original intent of “Planned Parenthood,” which was to control and diminish the African American population, which, by the late ’60s, had been predicted would reach percentages of at least 50% of the American population they the 20th century. The original “Planned Parenthood” “experiment” was counter by certain African Americans propagandizing, “Black women, have your babies.”
So, when you look at any situation, phenomenon, problem, culture, or way of life, you have to look at how it even came about in the first place, after knowing the how and why’s, then you may BEGIN to be able to change it or to replace it with something better.
“Being ashamed” never changed anything.
Hating another person or group never has and never will change anything.
Being condescending to another person or group of people only makes that group try even harder to be the opposite of the person or group(s) being condescending.
No one is better than anyone else.
No woman is better than any other woman.
Rituals cannot make one person better than another.
Coincidences of which sexually active woman got pregnant and chose to keep the baby, makes her not less of a person, a human being, a women than the woman, who did not get pregnant, or the woman who did not keep the unborn child, or the woman who aborted the unborn child, or the woman who just happened to not be as fertile, or the woman who, by mere coincidence just happened to not get pregnant.
But, at any rate, Why would YOU be the one that is ashamed?
I love this
Hello there, just became aware of your blog through Google, and found that it is really informative. I�m gonna watch out for brussels. I will appreciate if you continue this in future. Numerous people will be benefited from your writing. Cheers!
Wow – so fascinating. I have’nt had time to read all – I wish I did.
I’m a 61 year old white male (of Irish descent).
Sorry I could not help but join in.
My observations: I see how, at least between the historical Black/White shared (qualified – i.e. even though we have a shared polarized history) experience (experience of a racial divide), at least culturally, in some ways we define each other and thereby embody the American experience – along with many other groups.
I see how asymetrical our common Black/White cultural divide is. As a white person – I don’t spend much time thinking that “I’m a white person” or that I’m part of the “white culture”. I don’t think many white people do. I only experience my “white person-ness” when I’m juxtaposed with Black people – directly in the company of Black people – indirectly when I’m juxtaposed with “Black culture”; as when I read this blog and comments, for example. I have no prayer that “I hope he is not-white” – when hearing of a serial killer or any other horrendous crime or crazy stuff breaking out in the news. I know that there is a continuum of human behavior from good – indifferent – bad to worse. And there is plenty of history to show that this is equally true of all races and ethnicities.
By reading these comments, I can see the asyemetry of experiences. Obviously, to some degree, it seems nearly impossible to avoid the identity of being “Black” in some form or another and how strongly this element is present in the experience of Black people. See all comments above. This in some way, in itself, defines the different experience of being Black or White in America – or anywhere else in the world it would seem.
This is why our experience of Obama is differnt. The experience of many Black people, obvously, is tremendous pride and of an unimaginable weight being lifted off “our” shoulders at having our first Black president – a tremendous weight lifted off all our (American) shoulders – as a nation. But this phenomena is not restricted to just America. I saw when Obama was in Brazil that the
people with a marked African heritage felt tremendously uplifted. I also saw a report that Iraqis of a decidely African heritage were dancing and elated ( they reported being treated poorly and marginalized by there non-African Iraqi bretheren) over the election of Obama.
It seems that many Black Americans feel that any criticism of Obama is racist. Where I as a conservative object to the President’s policies and more improtantly to the left’s political perspective. I have an equally polarized opinion of any left wing politician. But here I digress – but it does in someway examplify the perspectives formed by the asymetrical experience of race.
None the less we keep keeping on and the soul searching I see here in these comments continue within all of us and our society – as well it should. We become stronger – slowly we become more unified – our nation continues in it’s American experiment.
LOL!!! True. However I feel that there are 3 types of Black people in our community.
1) The Black People- We know who we are and where we came from and even if we left our heart will always be in it.
2) the African Americans- they left to try to join the white people and forgot who they are and where they came from. Could get them to eat a piece of chicken and a slice of watermelon to save their asses, and
3) you got our cousins, the Niggas! the African Americans leave soon as they walk in! LOL! Black people hang as long as we can, but we gotta go to work in the morning, so… 1 love Niggas! LOL!
The funny thing is: we might be “ashamed” of other Black Folk who act “too black”…but in the eyes of a racist white man, we are ALL n*ggers!
Racist white people don’t see a difference between Obama and Flava Flav…they are both just “N*ggers” to them!
Our community needs more solidarity. Too often, I hear the debate about “Light Skin VS. Dark Skin” and we can all see the difference…but in the eyes of racist white folk, we are ALL “just black”! They can’t see the difference! So we shouldn’t see the difference either! We should support each other!
I am of a West Indian background so I know that people of African descent are a diverse group. I also know we are individuals and should shirk the notion that there is one monolithic black standard. Especially since that standard was largely created by whites. I don’t feel any shame about the antics of other black people because I was raised in an environment that reinforced the fact that people of African descent were fantastic. If folks acted a fool it was because they chose to not because they were black. I also know that there are millions of hidden rural, poor whites that are just as ratchet as the average hood rat. The centuries of white supremacy in this country has mutated what was ethnic pride into black shame.
For example:
“tried to assimilate into white society, some acted like assholes in public” Does this mean if I am not assimilated, I have no ability to conduct myself in a public space? I was taught the difference between home & outside behavior & it had nothing to do with whiteness.
In response to all the baby mama bashing I would challenge posters to start working for better schools & taking the racial bias out of the criminal justice system. If the school to jail pipeline is demolished, this society will produce more men & women who are more financially and emotionally mature enough to take on the burdens of parenting.
Lastly, use this month to really learn how far African Americans have come. Do some research and stop getting suckered by old dead white man history. Black History Month is in February because its founder Carter J. Woodson wanted to honor President Lincoln & Frederick Douglass both of whose birthdays are this month.
The first novel I ever wrote, SCULPTURED NAILS AND NAPPY HAIR, has a story in it called, YELLOW JACKET. The story is about a girl named Crimsonne Redd, who encountered unique problems in personal and professional life because she was light-skinned. Every time a crisis would ensue, the inaginary letters, L-S-N would pop up on her chest; until they eventually became real ( got the idea from Hester Prynne’s letter A). Not black enough for this, too black for that; blah, blah, blah.
All I know is that when you reach a certain age, you realize that however you rolled in life to that point, doesn’t change the nagging fact that your life is finite. Five minutes after you die, some ninja will be wearing his sagging pants in front of a white bigot; and some high-yellow intellectual will be trying to grow dreadlocks for hood points. All we can do is know that ignorance of self is no excuse; and spend our own lives in pursuit of being the black person we would like world to see and experience. Just maybe, someone who is not self-aware may look toward the behavior we project and feel a sense of pride. As they say,’ Each One Teach One, and it Passes to the Masses.’
I can admit to having felt this way at some point. What pains me is that people are still responding with the very way of thinking this post is talking about rather than coming to the realization that their thought process is the reason why we can’t solve the problems that pains them so much to see.
One of your best pieces Panama. Its funny, because I feel myself wrestling with the same thing. One of my things the get me is using the word nigga. I feel very conflicted, because when I was growing up, my mom raised me to not use the word, so I was never comfortable using it. But my friends use it all the time, and I guess it makes me like I’m selling out. Its so crazy, because I feel like I have more respect for myself, that I won’t use a word that was used to put us down for so many years. But to be down with my peoples, I feel like I should say it. Am I crazy for this? So I guess I’m saying that I’m ashamed that we still use that word to acknowledge each other. But I’m ashamed that I’m not comfortable saying it.
Melissa Harris-Perry said it best… http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=blX2YHdqUJA
The downside to false kinship pride = false kinship shame
She brilliantly demonstrates this by pointing our how most of us felt when we found out the race of the DC sniper.
I was born in Guadeloupe (French Caribbean) where I live but I spent about 20 years in PARIS (FRANCE). I read most of the commentaries about “shame”.
Living in a country were people is mostly black, I cannot feel this shame. We are a majority. We don’t have young people acting loudly in the subway ..;etc (We don’t have a subway.)
We laugh, talk loud, young and old when we feel like it !
But In PARIS, we are a minority of black people but I am not ashamed when some of us act loud …
You don’t have to behave like others want you to. You must respect others, black or white. You don’t have to behave bearing in mind stereotypes from biased people from a dominant culture.
Be yourself and help others to be.
The only time I prayed: “let them not be black”", was a long time ago when I was very young and some plane crashed in south America and the passengers survived eating dead passengers !
Every black should read Frantz FANON: Black skin, white mask.
In creole, the language that we speak in Guadeloupe, the word “Neg” (Negro in english) means man and a real man.
there is too much fighting. too much segregation within our own race and beyond. I agree with the author, black, mixed, brown, white, yellow, rich, poor, middle class.. it’s time we cherish everyone and forget about the seperating lines of class race and gender.. there’s not enough time in this life not to LOVE yourself and all others out there in the world..we should be rooting for each other with compassion, justice, respect, and love…celebrating ALL humanity based on the fact that we are ALL human.
Nice! I love the wit and clever word play. And especially the reference to Big Bang Theory…I thought I was the only Black person watching it. But that was a great way to broach a serious topic, one that I’ve been mulling over for some time now. And now I can publicly admit to Black shame! Simply because it can be humorous. Not only that, though, we gotta accept the pluralism amongst Brown folks in this country; in the most absolute sense, we are not one people!
It seems to me that a lot of people are ashamed of someone from their particular race, religion, etc. if they feel that said person(s) is behaving in a manner that will reflect badly on the ‘group’ as a whole. Judgemental? Probably. Normal? Again probably. It’s hard to remember, on both sides of the judgemental fence that we are not responsible for other peoples actions or choices. Only the person behaving poorly is responsible. That being said, there does seem to be a serious lack of values, common human decency and common sense in all parts of society no matter the financial levels or the color of the skin. Slightly off topic – I saw an article the other day. A woman’s boyfriend scalded her 3 year old (to the point of 2nd degree burns on her body) in a hot bathtub because the 3 year old did not know where her other sock was. The mother protected the boyfriend by lying because ‘he’s a good guy and she didn’t want anyone to get the wrong idea about him’. I don’t get it, never have, never will. Aside from moms having multiple babies via multiple dads, why are they not protecting their children.
What I hate about all the multiple children is that it feeds the cycle of poverty for multiple more generations. So we then have multiple children who can’t be supported, and surprise, surpise, with no education, they end up in gangs and crime and eventually arrested. We talk about 25 year olds without children as being a minor miracle. How many of those 5 kids by 5 different fathers will not see a day in jail by their 25th birthday, should they live so long?
Pingback: Open Friday: Do Black People Hate White People or Hate The Institution? « From Ashy to Classy
Ahh . . . I couldn’t have stumbled across this article at a better time. I’ve been fuming about this very idea all morning . . .
What’s wild about this entire idea is the fact that broke n*ggas need bougie n*ggas to bring them up, and until that happens, we’ll never progress as a people. Instead of looking down on muf*ckers, we need to go back to our communities, engage, implement ish, build businesses, teach our youth — but that’s not happening right now — not even remotely. N*ggas get their money and run. It’s a got d*mn travesty.
Our youth lack positive role models in virtually every form of media — our communities are littered with other m*fuckers businesses — we’re killing each other — our homes are broken — the most ignorant ideals our perpetuated on a daily basis —– we’re witnessing the death of black beauty/ black mystic at an ever increasing rate — hot d*mn it’s tight.
The blog entry connects between being able to read with being a snob.
Just 155 years ago our slave forbears were beaten, tortured and killed for attempting to learn to read.
Being literate is a basic need for everyone — regardless of race, class, nationality and economic status. It is not an option, especially in this warp speed digital age. Those who can read are probably more compassionate than those who are illiterate. The author’s entire arguement is off base.
Yes, I’m guilty of being ashamed at times when I see or hear members of my race doing or saying certain things or being loud and obnoxious. And yes, I’m also guilty of being the person who has done or said certain things that would be an embarrassment to my race. I have 3 children (two fathers) and have lacked certain parenting skills as well. I am guilty of being a high school dropout and drug addict. I’ve lived in the ghetto all of my childhood and more of my adult life than I care to admit. I’ve gotten some college & trade school education and I love to read. I would say I cover a wide spectrum of the topic discussed on Black America’s Secret Shame. And while all these things are true (and then some), whenever I feel ashamed I remind myself that there are things we as a people must never forget: the INSTITUTION of White Supremacy plays the major defining role in most of this behavior. It’s called “DIVIDE AND CONQUER†for a reason.
And although I say institution, I recognize that it takes people to put in place said institution. And it takes people to maintain said institution. You know, oil the cogs in the machine (especially having to keep up with the changing times). So, I try not to be mad or ashamed of my people or myself because we are still under attack as long as we pose a threat to white genetic survival. And some might ask how do we “pose a threatâ€? I would say by our very existence. The writer made reference that some black folk would think “dammit, why won’t they just act right, they are making us all look bad. F*ckin’ cockaroachesâ€. The only time I make said reference is when I compare how roaches have been here from the beginning of time and will be here until the end of time. Many an exterminators have tried to take them out, just like many exterminators have tried to take us out. We are a strong people and we will survive. I have faith. I could go on and on. I guess I need to start my own blog. LOL
I applaud the writer for opening the dialog, and if we are honest with ourselves I believe we can all find some truth in what he states.
I’m ashamed of the person who wrote this nonsense.
Pingback: The Celebration of Failure in the Black Community « From Ashy to Classy
I don’t see why anyone would be ashamed of black people. Ashamed for what??? If black people are rich and “good” like whites want us to be they still won’t like is. The Jews are an amazing people, one of the most impressive on the planet, by their numbers, and people still hate them. No matter how good I’ve been, and I’ve been damn good people still hate me. And they don’t hate me because I’m not good enough, they hate me because I don’t look like them. Stupid, I know, but I don’t expect much from humanity anymore. It gives you freedom to do all kinds of crazy shit in public because you’re not part of the social fabric anyways. I’ve gotten an excellent education, and I’m proud of the education I received, but I’m pretty sure a white person will just as easily refer to me as a nigger as they will to any other black person. I don’t like to think we live in a world/country like that, but we do. Eh, that’s all I have to say…
Part of me thinks that instead of saying “Some well-to do blacks are ashamed of other blacks who are left behind” it would be more to say “Some well-to do blacks are ashamed of blacks who have monolithic thinking and won’t assimilate”.