A Vote For Jill Stein Is A Vote In The Trash » VSB

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A Vote For Jill Stein Is A Vote In The Trash

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Cornel West recently continued down his long, winding road to breaking my heart.

He returned to his recurring role as a panelist on Real Time with Bill Maher, where he was even more overbearing than usual. He battled with Barney Frank and barely let my future second wife Alex Wagner get a word in edgewise; even Maher was visibly annoyed.

On top of his interminable – and now played-out – bashing of Barack Obama, West spent a good amount of time castigating Hillary Clinton and bolstering Jill Stein, the Green Party candidate for president.

Listening to West – one of our eminent Black scholars and a man whom I’ve venerated for years – back a horse that could contribute to the election of Donald Trump was like Yoda feeling the disturbance in the Force when Darth Vader slaughtered the Jedi younglings. I wanted to throw one end of his scarf into a wood chipper while still around his neck and force him to change his position.

Michael Eric Dyson authored the definitive (if not petty as hell) ethering of West; that’s not what I’m here for. I plead that you don’t listen to West, or anyone else who would convince you to send your vote to Stein in November.

The Green Party has been bopping around in the U.S. for a little more than three decades now; it gained notoriety when presidential candidate Ralph Nader put a small wedge between Al Gore and George W. Bush in the 2000 presidential election (the first in which I was able to vote).

The oft-touted idea that Nader “stole” the election from Gore has been disproven. But he sure didn’t help matters in an election he couldn’t win. Stein is threatening the same interference for the 2016 election, which has higher stakes.

Folks aren’t riding for Stein or the Green Party and it’s Candy Land-ass platform because they’re impressed with either – they’re planning to throw their vote away on an “anyone-but-Clinton” play, which is misguided at best. Truth is, Stein could walk past my desk, grant me my 40 acres and a mule and I still wouldn’t know who the fuck she was. Put a picture of her alongside one of Clifton Powell, and I bet even White folks would recognize Powell first.

To be clear, I’m not Clinton’s number-one fan; many of her critics’ have valid points, and I certainly believe her presidency would usher in more status-quo bullshit. (My general sentiment on this election hasn’t changed.) But I don’t abide by the hyperbolic sentiment that she would, in any way, leave our country worse off than George W. Bush did, and I don’t give a shellacked shit about emails and servers. Despite protestations, no one really does.

I also recognize that there are scores of sexist troglodytes under the impression that a woman pushing 70 will somehow start World War III because of her “emotions,” leaving us all to walk blindly through the post-apocalyptic wasteland fighting bandits like Denzel in The Book of Eli. Those people should be taken as seriously as Trump voters.  

Truth is, your day-to-day will likely not change under her presidency. Henny will still be in plentiful supply, grown-ass men will still be chasing Pokemon and Kevin Hart will still make the same movie over and over again and you niggas will go see it.

However, as Damon wrote, there’s a crystalline divide between the parties and their two candidates. If you’re placing Clinton and Trump on the same plane of “evil,” you’re probably wrestling with a cognitive dissonance that negates the importance of your opinion for anything outside of which brand of plastic forks to buy for the cookout. And you’re probably also a White male.

Trump is an unfettered demagogue who has made no less than six public statements that, standing alone, render anything he might do positively as president irrelevant and should prohibit him from ever getting within pissing distance of the White House. Unbridled xenophobia, racism and a demonstrated lack of domestic policy and foreign relations should be enough that I shouldn’t even have to write this fucking piece.  

The only reason Trump ascended to become likely the most absurd presidential candidate ever is because he ran against a bunch of contestants from the Real World/Road Rules Challenge who couldn’t manage to beat that guy. Folks already conceding to a country run by President Trump should remember this and not be so hasty.

To that end, I’m surprised to see some Black folks, of all people, adopt the position of privilege by suggesting that a Trump presidency might benefit our community in the long run. “Enh, let’s ride this thing out with The Donald. See what happens,” said no Muslim or Mexican ever.  

I’m guessing at least 90 percent of you considering voting for Stein are doing so because you Felt the Bern. That Doc Brown-looking-ass nigga lost…get the fuck over it.

Better still, think about how diametrically opposed Sanders would be to a Trump presidency. And how he’s really wants you to vote for Clinton now. Go with common sense, folks.  

Like many of you, I’m over our government’s two-party system…not to mention the Electoral College, lack of Congressional term limits and other antiquated aspects of our democratic process that allow us to get stuck in these mires of political malcontent.

That’s why it’s important to rally behind an alternative party a hell of a lot sooner than a few months before the election. While some would argue that a third-party system is futile altogether, I think everyone would agree that the revolution doesn’t happen in the same amount of time it takes you to get off of new employee probation. Obama’s ascendancy to the presidency took several years.

At this point, you’re either #WithHer or you wanna Make America Great Again. Anything else is a waste of everyone’s time. I still don’t think Trump will win the big seat, but if he has any chance at all, it’ll be because of bullshit-ass voters in battleground states like Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania who stay home, vote for Stein, pencil in their Uncle Howie or some other dumb shit.

Jill Stein is merely a nostrum, and I believe Trump is legitimately dangerous for numerous reasons. Vote for Hillary Clinton now – figure out how to create change immediately thereafter. And if you happen to be one of the three conflicted Black Republicans reading Very Smart Brothas, then go-go Gary Johnson 2016!!

Dustin Seibert

Dustin J. Seibert lifts heavy weights and plays all his video games on hard mode to find peace. He has a better ear for hip-hop than anyone else you know. He writes like the English language is going outta style because the steaks in his freezer are dependent on it.

  • King Beauregard

    I don’t believe the connection between Nader and Bush’s victory has been disproven at all; the most that can be said is, there are a dozen different things that could have happened differently to give Gore the victory, and Nader supporters not being tools is just one of them.

    And I say that as someone who supported Nader in 2000. I was wrong to do so. I wasn’t in Florida so I didn’t have any direct hand in Bush’s victory either way, but I do bear some of the collective moral responsibility.

    As for Jill Stein, she’s been dogwhistling to the anti-vaxxers, the homoeopathic medicine fans, and the wi-fi scare people. Now’s a very good time to remind you that she is a medical doctor, pandering to quacks in her fan base. Yeah show us some backbone and some morals Jill — you can’t even face down your own moonbat supporters.

  • Brooklyn_Bruin

    The case against Trump is that black progress will not only be halted but rolled back. Watch body cam usage and Justice Department investigations for police brutality fall off a cliff. He’s already coming for Latinos and Middle Easterners.

    Hillary wants to sign the Pacific trade agreement which will ship more jobs out of the country. Jobs are already scarce for them, much less us. Her friendliness with them Wall Street crooks is not helpful either.

    Not to get too hyperbolic, but the choice is death versus a life of poverty and all that comes with it?

    Bernie at least offered a respite against poverty even though he was tone deaf on race.

    Meanwhile Ghana n’nem fronting on the diaspora passport and citizenship.

    • Did you read any of the DOJ’s report on the Baltimore PD?

      • Brooklyn_Bruin

        Trying to keep my blood pressure down. The highlights were bad enough

    • King Beauregard

      “Hillary wants to sign the Pacific trade agreement which will ship more jobs out of the country.”

      Which jobs exactly? I thought they already got shipped out twenty years ago.

      People have been demonizing the TPP because it’s an easy applause line, but the reality is, very few people have tried to analyze it, and those that have have found it to NOT be the monstrosity social media insists it is. In fact it includes measures to improve labor conditions overseas, which would rather push jobs back towards the US.

      • Jarret Ford

        The TPP has become nothing but a soundbite.

        • mr. steal your costco samples

          yeah, manufacturing jobs been bouncing since the 70s.

      • Brooklyn_Bruin

        I’ve been following it closely on a number of blogs.

        China’s just recently reached our industrial output. America still makes a lot of stuff, but a lot of it is higher end or meant for business.

        Going up the value chain works for a while, until your low priced competitors cannibalize what you offer and sell the essential functions to your customers.

        Do I buy the the Apple charger from Apple, or the cheap knockoff that looks just like it but might not last as long? Never mind the only real difference is that the Apple version was tested before it left the same factory as the knockoff.

        There’s even talk that them and India will be prematurely done with industrialization and have to shift to less productive service based economy.

        Some of the things at stake in the TPP are things like intellectual property and agriculture, places where “we” are strong/world leaders and world suppliers.

        Most people here probably work at a desk, and things like more H1-B visas or better outsourcing will affect our well paying service jobs.

        Manufacturing has been in decline since the seventies, but Nafta hastened it. Work went to Mexico.

        TPP is worse than Nafta. And it will affect all Americans. When they catch a cold, we get pneumonia.

        • King Beauregard

          “I’ve been following it closely on a number of blogs.”

          Have you even looked at the TPP itself? Blogs are full of rumors and misinformation, much like the “death panels” noise the Republicans blindly believed in.

          • Brooklyn_Bruin

            The entire thing? Naw. Chapter 18 is the ip section. That’s 75 pages of dense legal text as it is. Just reading this means you had to not only understand what’s written, but also how it changes the status quo and the accompanying economics. So you need to know more than the text itself. You need to know how current entities set up their businesses. As far as I know, there isn’t text that says destroy American manufacturing. But shifting some of the legal burdens and venues is how that game is played.

            For those who want to tackle it.

            https://ustr.gov/trade-agreements/free-trade-agreements/trans-pacific-partnership/tpp-full-text

            Like most law and policy, one person can’t become an expert on every nook and cranny without devoting a significant part of their professional career to it.

            These big companies, their in house lawyers, outside counsel and lobbyists are all trying to figure out their own angles.

            • Guest

              So what’s the solution to all this? Some of the concerns from the right are accurate, but it comes with the racist, sexist and whatever else baggage. How do we get these things at the forefrunt on the left side?

              • Brooklyn_Bruin

                I said it above. BLM, Bernie-Crats, the VSB Party – whoever needs to start organizing both nationally and locally. Putting Bernie, JIll Klein, Michelle Obama into office doesn’t mean anything unless you have the city, county/parish, state, and national working together.

                In the short term, individuals needs to become global. You need to have another language and some stamps in your passport. As a class/people it’s hard to chart out solutions that haven’t already been stymied by the powers that be.

                • Guest

                  ” As a class/people it’s hard to chart out solutions that haven’t already been stymied by the powers that be.”–Ugh!! We just have so much to do. The first step seems to be building our economic power. That’s the only solution at this point. Ugh!

            • King Beauregard

              Well you’re right that the whole thing is pretty big. But the problem is, most of the people screaming about the TPP — including most of the bloggers you’re following, I would imagine — haven’t tried to verify the horrors they’ve been told the TPP contains.

              Like, the one I keep hearing is that the TPP would allow foreign corporations to sue the US over minimum wages, regulations, and the like if if they compromise expected profits. Except the TPP actually says the exact opposite of that. Even Bernie lied about that:

              http://www.vox.com/2015/11/6/9683852/bernie-sanders-tpp

              “The text is fairly clear on this point: “[T]he mere fact that a Party takes or fails to take an action that may be inconsistent with an investor’s expectations does not constitute a breach of this Article, even if there is loss or damage to the covered investment as a result,” it reads.”

              Imagine if we lived in a world where the TPP were so terrible, people could criticize it for what it actually is rather than the horror they wish it were. Just imagine.

              • Brooklyn_Bruin

                Vox is a bunch of bloggers though. Less authoritative than the trade and economic focused blogs I read

                • King Beauregard

                  Actually going back to the verbiage of the TPP is about as authoritative as one can be, when discussing the TPP. How often do these blogs of yours bother to do that? I’m going to guess, not very often if at all. Unless I miss my guess, your blogs made their mind up about the TPP long before the content was finalized and made public, given how much trouble people have actually substantiating the opinion that the TPP is worse than NAFTA.

                  But feel free to prove me wrong. If your blogs are of a higher caliber, I would not mind being exposed to actual discussions of the actual TPP. But I have no interest in the chain-barking that I’ve been hearing about the TPP for years now, heavy on conclusions and suspiciously light on substantiation.

  • Multi-Hundredaire

    Do you know how absolutely drippin with white privilege gravy you have to be to cast a 3rd party vote, just “to prove a point”? Man FOH with that nonsense.

    • Brandon Allen

      That’s Trump’s whole candidacy. People are tired with the status quo so they’re gonna vote for him and end the world…

      • Multi-Hundredaire

        Bruh, it’s insane.

      • Asiyah

        If they were so tired of the status quo they wouldn’t vote Republican. No. They WANT the status quo where us minorities are nothing and they are everything.

        • Brandon Allen

          Well trump voters want to “go back” to how things “were”. I mean we’re not disagreeing but I don’t think theyre happy with the status quo.

          • Asiyah

            They’re so stupid thinking the status quo has changed. Then again, he appeals to a certain demographic.

    • Asiyah

      And voting for the lesser of two evils isn’t “proving a point?”

      I’m neither White nor priviilged and am casting a 3rd party vote to
      prove a point that OMG one can vote based on one’s ideals/beliefs. What a
      concept.

    • Val

      Meh, just because you say it doesn’t make it so.

      • Kas

        I knew you would be up and down this comment section. Hi Val

        • Val

          Am I? I’ve only made a few comments so far. Like I said in my main comment, all of this is mostly a moot debate. Black folks are going to vote for Clinton en mass. The few of us who are voting for Jill aren’t going to upset the Democratic apple cart.

          • Cheech

            Thank God you live in California, Val. If you lived in Florida or Pennsylvania I’d be ringing you up (on your landline) for some discussion.

            • Val

              So you’re ground team for Hillary?

              • Cheech

                No, actually I’m “I can’t believe I’m actually going to grudgingly vote for her but she’s the only one out here.”

                But since the fate of the Republic and possibly human civilization (and almost certainly the homes of people in low lying areas on islands and coasts around the world) hang in the balance, then I guess, yeah.

    • troubleman

      I don’t see how exercising my constitution right to vote for a 3rd party is white privilege.

  • QueenRaven23

    So it’s crazy to live in Florida at this time. It’s like you have Central Florida, panhandle Florida, and Miami which means that it’s a battle over will and a battle over young ‘s old. Clinton just left Kissimmee and the Dems know how important it is to be in this area because of UCF and is young folks.

    In regards to voting third party, like everyone said, it has to start early and not die after November. I watched Gary Johnson’s town hall a couple of weeks ago and I thought dude was about to fall asleep on Anderson Cooper. He needs a red bull.

    I don’t care for Kevin Hart. I know I’m in the minority here.

    • Kas

      Are there a bunch of Kevin Hart lovers in this comment section?

      • QueenRaven23

        I hope not. But I get bashed for not finding him super funny. I chuckle here and there but that’s it.

        • Kas

          He’s chuckle worthy. Dassit

    • Brandon Allen

      About Kevin Hart? Everyone knows he’s played and running himself dry. Can’t knock the hustle tho.

      • troubleman

        I saw his stand up movie a couple of years ago, I thought it was funny…

        • Brandon Allen

          The one a few years ago maybe 2010 was good. Then they got shorter and more formulaic.

  • If Trump is elected, he is going to try to round up and deport every undocumented immigrant and Muslim in our borders. To do this would require the erection of a police state not seen in this nation- a police state that would trample the constitutional rights of all citizens in the pursuit of the madman’s mandate. Imagine a national police force (which is what he would need to get what he wants; an FBI looking for burritos and naan and other signs of Mexican and Muslim profligacy) pulling people over, searching business documents, conducting audits, searching homes, for the undocumented and the people aiding and abetting them.

    And now imagine how that police force will interact with black people, the favored whipping boy/girl of the United States. Whenever I hear a black person talking about voting Stein, I let them know the potential future they are trying to birth in the name of a wake up call. It’s not. The price people will pay for that type of decision will be the wages of death.

    https://hhharris.wordpress.com/2016/08/09/hearing-angels/

    • brothaskeeper

      “To do this would require the erection of a police state not seen in this nation.”

      Lettuce pray for erectile dysfunction.

      • Kas

        I’m not getting the word play.

        • brothaskeeper

          Wait for iiiiiiiiiit…..

          • Kas

            Wilting?

        • NonyaB

          Slow on the uptake tahday? Unlike you, given the pun genre.

          • Kas

            Dassit. I’m taking my ball and going home.

      • I see what you did there!

      • NonyaB

        LMAO

  • Courtney Wheeler

    Cornel West is still crying salty tears because Barack Obama didn’t invite him to a party or something. I’m over it really. In fact I’m over this whole election. At this point I want to bury my head in the sand and wait for all this nonsense to be over.

    • A.G.

      Wait, THAT’S why he’s mad? Seriously? West, Dyson, and all the so-called Black intelligencia need to chill with the egos.

      • King Beauregard

        That at least seems to be the point at which West’s attitude towards Obama flipped 180 degrees. Interestingly enough, one of West’s snide observations was that the bellhop at the hotel could get a ticket to Obama’s inauguration but West could not. That sounds suspiciously like someone who sees himself as deserving privileges above and beyond the common man, and is furious when the common man gets an “unearned” perk.

        • Kas

          Yup, and yup again

        • A.G.

          So he basically wanted a photo-op. I did read the Dyson piece…he told all that man’s business.

      • Courtney Wheeler

        In the beginning Cornel West was a HUGE Obama supporter. But after Barack was elected, West felt snubbed. And anyone who would listen he began to rail against him…Along with Tavis Smiley. Then Eric Dyson got in the mix..It’s all really silly. But I think people need to understand…politics is a game.

        • A.G.

          Obama played to win obviously. But where is the humility?

          • Courtney Wheeler

            I think there was humility but also advisers who probably told Obama not to associate with certain people because it would look bad. And this is right after the Jeremiah Wright issue…the terrorist fist jab. I could go on about the nonsense 08′ was giving that election. Mind you Cornel West isn’t a bad guy at all but I’m sure he has a funky reputation in the beltway.

        • Amber

          Though I think Tavis was more realistic in his critique of Obama. It seemed less personal and more of we need to press Obama and make sure we hold him accountable to do more policy-wise for so called black interests.

          • Courtney Wheeler

            Tavis critiques of Obama were completely valid

      • -h.h.h.-

        between that and the fact that Obama started his 08 run for the white house the same weekend as Tavis Smiley’s State of the Black Union conference (in Illinois, not at Smiley’s conference) plays a part as well (i distinctly remember switching channels back and forth on that)

        • A.G.

          With egos that big, it no longer remains about the (black) people you’re supposed to represent. This is what bothers me.

          • King Beauregard

            Obama, though, seems to be the real deal. He’s having to endure insult and compromise on an almost daily basis, but in the end he still seems to be motivated to do the right thing for all parties concerned.

      • Brandon Allen

        Like…Aren’t we past that? I really don’t need these dudes to be “thinkers” for me. I’d good.

        • Deeds

          Well hey, there’s gotta be somebody to represent black folk on political talk shows.

        • A.G.

          We’re not past it so long as people continued to be mesmerized by Dyson speaking very fast while rhyming rap lyrics with SAT words.

      • Epsilonicus

        Basically Obama chose to kick it with Sharpton over them and they threw a fit

        • kid video

          Sharpton got that show in exchange for his silence. Watch how they take it early next year.

        • A.G.

          But Sharpton has one of those egos too!!! ?

    • Val

      Or maybe Obama isn’t perfect and Dr. West was willing to call him out?

      • Courtney Wheeler

        You’re right. Obama isn’t perfect. But Cornel’s issues with him didn’t stem from policys..it started on a personal level.

      • Amber

        On some things I heard from West and Smiley I actual agreed with when they talked about Obama. Smiley has been less personal in his issues than West.

    • troubleman

      His criticisms are true, but his tone and disrespect are out of bounds.

  • Glo

    This election makes me look back on former election cycles with fondness. I’m all, “Remember when we thought Mitt Romney was the worst? Or when we couldn’t believe that John McCain and the GOP would actually be okay with Sarah Palin being a heartbeat away from the presidency?”

    *Sigh* Those were the good old days.

    • Courtney Wheeler

      At least McCain and Romney are actual human beings…Not walking tacky bleached squirrel fur like Trump.

  • Jarret Ford

    I’m voting Hillary because I’m not trying to live in the United States of 1850’s Mississippi. Hyperbolic yes, but still….

    These post-Obama republicans are next level bigoted. Next level insane. Next level ignorant. A trump election, empowers all of that bullsh*t.

    • Glo

      Seriously, if you take a look at the way black and brown people are being treated in the UK after Brexit, you know that Trump’s election would have tangible consequences for us here. I know a lot of people who seem to think that Trump is all talk and that he won’t actually be able to implement any of his racist policies (making him, in effect, harmless), but I disagree. At the very least, he is empowering and enabling racists to be overt and violent with their racism, and this is going to get so much worse if he’s elected.

      • Kas

        Not to mention, appointing a conservative to the Supreme would likely end in the dismantling of a lot the regulations in place to protect people of color and LBGT.

  • -h.h.h.-

    i have no problems with people voting for Jill Stein, but just understand that if you consider that the Green Party currently has:

    0 members in the House
    0 members in the Senate
    0 members in the upper state legislatures
    0 members in the lower state legislatures
    0 members as governors

    please explain how Jill Stein is going to get anything done, when Congress has shut down government operations twice on the current president.

    FWIW, the Republican Party actually won seats in the House and Senate prior to Lincoln being elected office. so if you want some diaspora of parties to run, y’all gonna have to start doing more than mayors and town councils.

    *heads back to Republican Party HQ*

    • Courtney Wheeler

      Voting for Jill Stein is a privilege vote honestly.

      • Ess Tee

        But there are Black folks who are contemplating it. It boggles the mind.

        • Courtney Wheeler

          They’re voting with their ideals…which is fine. But when the stakes are this high. You gotta vote with your brain.

          • LMNOP

            Unless you’re in a solid blue state, in which case, honestly it doesn’t matter a whole lot.

        • Asiyah

          Why does it boggle the mind to think that people actually take voting seriously enough to vote WITH THEIR IDEALS? Like come on

          • Val

            Right. Like that has become a foreign concept because for so long so many of us have simply voted for the lesser of two evils.

          • Kas

            Because she panders like all politicians (refer to vaccinations) so not sure how ideal she is. Also she has no chance of winning.

            • Asiyah

              Of course she has no chance at winning. Anybody who dares to question scientific findings (FYI, I’m very very VERY pro-vaccinations) and dares to question the status quo is shamed, ridiculed, maligned, and told how unreasonable they are. Gee, I wonder why she won’t win!

            • Asiyah

              I agree that she’s pandering to Bernie stans.

          • King Beauregard

            Ideals divorced from responsibility for the consequences of one’s actions, are not ideals.

            Letting Trump into office because Hillary isn’t good enough for you doesn’t make you pure, it makes you a jerk.

            • Asiyah

              It’s not about being good enough FOR ME; it’s about her not being good enough FOR US. I won’t vote for Hillary because she’s not good enough for society.

            • Val

              “Letting Trump into office because Hillary isn’t good enough for you doesn’t make you pure, it makes you a jerk.”

              There you go, that’s going to convince me that you are right and to vote for your candidate. Calling someone a jerk always works! Smh.

              • King Beauregard

                If you’re the sort of person who would let Trump into power because someone on the Internet said something the tiniest bit mean about people like you, you are deserving of nothing but my most withering contempt.

                • Val

                  Lol

              • wanderlust

                This whole comment section and article reminds me of that South Park episode: Douche and Turd. And that was for the 2004 election. Ain’t we tired of voting for the ‘lesser’ yet…

                Discounting the votes/voice of those who want to vote for Stein or Johnson because we choose not to vote for Hillary doesn’t make it wrong or meaningless.

                • Val

                  Exactly. Everyone complains about our choices but when it’s time to vote they vote for the candidates they complain about.

                • Negro Libre

                  When you consistently vote the lesser of two evils, it’s inevitable that that’s the only way you see yourself voting, till eternity.

          • Ess Tee

            Is that what I said? But to answer your question, it boggles my mind because this Vote Jill Stein gambit is such a late-in-the-game, my-candidate-didn’t win-the-nomination thing for a number of people.

            Folks who’ve been backing Jill Stein well before Bernie Sanders’ loss are not whom I’m really talking about, to be clear.

            • Asiyah

              Last paragraph: gotcha.

          • Question

            Voting for the lesser of two evils doesn’t necessarily contradict voting with one’s ideals. My ideals focus on legislative and judicial rulings that have the ability to impact my daily life. Therefore, if I work UP the system, I need to cast a vote for a Presidential candidate who will fill upcoming vacancies with someone who aligns with my judicial ideals.

            That is not a toss away vote – its just a vote focused on different priorities.

            One is not better/worse than the other. Just different.

            • Asiyah

              It depends on one’s ideals, I suppose. If your ideal is utilitarian in nature, then voting for the lesser of two evils goes in line with your beliefs. I can respect that.

      • Asiyah

        I am among the unprivileged and would be voting for Jill. So…

        • Courtney Wheeler

          And as an American that’s your choice and right…

          do your thing.

      • Mark

        No. Voting for a corrupt candidate that intends to represent the most wealthy and powerful Americans is privilege. Or, to be more accurate, either an expression of privilege OR ignorance. Voting for Jill Stein is an indication that the voter still has some faith in democracy.

        • Elle Latham

          Yes. And Donald Trump wants to ban Muslims. Hillary Clinton will kill them and profit off of their deaths.

      • Tara Boxman

        Let me ask you a question. Who do you think Hillary is going to draft to fight in her endless Middle East Wars? Here’s another one. Who will be most impacted by global climate change? (Helpful hint: It ain’t privileged white folks)

      • Krasnaja Zvezda

        What “privilege”?

      • Elle Latham

        No white woman more privileged than Hillary Clinton and most of her supporters are pretty damn privileged too.

    • Glo

      ALL OF THIS.

      • NonyaB

        Are you Republican too?

        • Glo

          Lmao, absolutely not. I was Team Bernie until he lost.

          • NonyaB

            Ok, I was clarifying because you said “all of this”, which included the line about heading back to republican party HQ.

    • Kas

      Didn’t realize you were Republican.

    • Ess Tee

      I actually brought that up to a FB friend. Like, OK, say there’s a third-party win for the presidency. How does that change what is, essentially, a two-party system in the House and Senate? Crickets in response.

      • Mark

        Initially? It doesn’t. Remember that American progressives just began uniting in the Green Party last month. Give the Green Party two years and there will be a Green Party Congressional caucus. If the new, more mainstream Green Party resonates with Americans as Bernie Sanders did, the GP will be a significant force in Congress, by 2020.

    • Asiyah

      “please explain how Jill Stein is going to get anything done, when
      Congress has shut down government operations twice on the current
      president.”

      now that’s a valid point that I can respect.

      • wanderlust

        Democracy now had a really good interview recently wit Dyson and Professor Glaude. Eddie Glaude is the one person who has provided a sound argument on why we SHOULD vote for Jill Stein. http://www.democracynow.org/2016/7/28/michael_eric_dyson_vs_eddie_glaude

      • Mark

        The Green Party will not get much done in Congress until it achieves a share of the membership in the House and Senate. The essential difference is that, unlike the Democratic or Republican parties, the Green Party will be representing working Americans, not a list of large corporate contributors.

        What the Green Party eventually accomplishes in Congress will be intended to make America a better nation for all Americans. It won’t be an effort to operate a government that is most profitable for a few Americans.

    • Objection

      please explain how Jill Stein is going to get anything done, . . . .

      It depends on what you mean about getting things done? I doubt very seriously Donald or Hillary will be getting anything done. More like continue making a big mess.

      *heads back to Republican Party HQ*

      While America continues the journey down Dante’s inferno.

      • Asiyah

        But then one could make the same argument about anybody. Look at Obama. He won in 2008 but what ended up happening? A Republican victory in Congress two years later. How much did he get done, then? No president will ever truly get anything done in this country unless all of the branches are to his/her favor. That’s our checks and balances for you.

        ETA: forgot to add that I definitely think we should start out locally then venture to national elections. That’s a valid point.

        • Kas

          We did get the Affordable Healthcare Act.

          • Asiyah

            I’m surprised that even came to fruition, and we know how that turned out. The truth is the government in this country was specifically designed so that hardly anything ever gets done. It really is a great work of fiction if you think about it.

            • Kas

              The 3 branches were put in place to make it hard to change anything. Thus far, it’s been very successful. With regards to how it turned out, if you were a person who couldn’t get healthcare insurance previously, it has turned out extremely well.

              • Deeds

                The three branches also prevent someone from totally destroying the country, if someone like say, Trump gets elected.

                • Asiyah

                  pros and cons

                • Kas

                  Honestly my two concerns with a Trump presidency would be him possibly managing another country to declare war on us, and pick(s) for the supreme Court.

                  • Asiyah

                    I think Hillary is more likely to get us into war than Trump. Domestically, Trump is a bigger liability precisely because of what you said: his pick(s) for the Supreme Court.

                    • Kas

                      Hillary is hawkish, but she can’t declare war on her own, so I’m less concerned about her. I worry that Trump might say something that would lead a country to believe it had no choice but to preemptively declare war on us.

                    • Asiyah

                      Thing is that she’s already expressed her desire to go to war with Iran. Many members in Congress have the same sentiments. She’s also expressed no problem getting us into other conflicts. I worry. She’s pretty much a neoliberal interventionist.

                    • troubleman

                      She can ABSOLUTELY start a war on her own. Presidents have been doing it since the 70’s.

                    • raul

                      Nobody declares war anymore, they claim pre-emptive self defense.

                    • Hugh Akston

                      (It’s as if folks been sleeping for the past decade)

                    • Kas

                      The non-wars we have in/with countries that don’t have the ability to hit us back in force (Middle East), are not the potential wars that concern me.

                    • Amber

                      They should though. At some point which we are seeing with the rise of isis they will have nothing more to lose. We should fear the ramifications of our 10+ years of war more than Russia or even Iran or China. Those countries have plenty to lose but this endless war that against terrorists of color is very dangerous.

                    • Hugh Akston

                      Non wars?
                      The heck was Iraq? Afghan? Non wars? By America’s standard? Too bad for all the soldiers and people that got killed and being killed fortunately it’s a non war for them

                    • Amber

                      They are wars but he’s calling them non wars cause alot of the military operations that we are in haven’t been officially declared by Congress.

                    • kid video

                      Don’t forget the secret wars that are going on in Yemen and Libya.

                    • Hugh Akston

                      Point taken

                    • Cheech

                      5 decades ….

                    • Question

                      Which is so interesting because our military is 100% offensive. It is a core tenet of our military strategy that we have a stronger navy and air force than the rest of the world combined. It is a core tenet of our military strategy that we maintain the ability, at all times, to fight in 2 armed conflicts and still defend our homeland.

                      That’s why I would love people to ask Trump to describe what he means when he talks about our “weak” military.

                      We have 12 aircraft carriers and are building 4 more. Our 12 is more than the rest of the world combined. Like wtf is he talking about?

                    • Congress has turned b-tch made on the War declarations, so there’s that…

                    • I’ll disagree with you on that point. Trump would fall into a war by posturing and realizing he’s not a real goon like many of our enemies or his friend, Vlad.

                      American foreign policy has been trash since ’45 with the exception of Ike keeping us out of the Suez mess in the ’50’s. I think we’re screwed on that front.

                    • Asiyah

                      Oh no I don’t doubt Trump will get us into war; I just think Hillary is more likely to. Both are itching for it. I worry for us domestically and internationally. People forget Hillary started out as a Republican. God knows who she will pick for Supreme Court and for her cabinet.

                    • “God knows who she will pick for Supreme Court and for her cabinet.”

                      Well if nothing changes in the house or senate her nominees won’t even get hearings.

                    • This is silly. Trump has repeatedly communicated a fascination with nuclear weapons. He clearly has stated we should of taken all the oil from Iraq during the war and is roaring to do so again. He has given tepid support to NATO, which only invites Russian aggression. He’s fixated on us negotiation with Iran, despite successfully and diplomatically disarming their nuclear weapons program. He constantly antagonizes China as the West and our allied Asian nations play a delicate game of chess over sovereignty of areas in the South China Sea.

                      You are allowed you have your personal feelings about Hillary. I get that. But to make empty, uninformed statements like the one you just made in an extremely important election cycle is inexcusable. Much of what needs to be known about Trump and Clinton are knowable and documented. Please learn your facts before you say something like that again.

                    • Asiyah

                      It’s really not silly if you think about it because unlike Trump Hillary has actually been a politician for years and has voted for wars and our interventions in foreign disputes/conflicts. THOSE ARE FACTS. Has Trump done that? NO. NOW, would I ever say that Trump is a pacifist or that he won’t ever get us into war? ABSOLUTELY NOT. I can see Trump definitely getting us into conflicts, but looking at Hillary’s HISTORY and FACTS one can argue that she is more likely to get us into war with countries we already have tense relations with.

                    • Cheech

                      Facts:
                      Trump’s ignorance of our nuclear triad
                      Trump’s ignorance of MAD
                      Trump’s ignorance of nonproliferation treaties and principles
                      Trump’s belief that his “negotiation” skills are superior to all the above
                      Trump’s eagerness to know why we can’t use nukes first–what’s the point of having them
                      Trump’s ignorance of Russia’s occupation of Crimea
                      Trump’s ignorance of the strategic importance of Crimea
                      Trump’s ignorance of NATO article 5
                      Trump’s disdain for the Geneva Conventions and the rules of war
                      Trump’s filling his campaign with those favorable to the interests of Russia over U.S. allies like the Ukraine and the Baltic Republics

                      There is no realistic comparison in the dangers posed by the 2 candidates.

                    • Asiyah

                      Ignorance is not what I was debating here. So yes, those are excellent Trump facts. Now let’s talk about Hillary facts. That’s what I specifically asked for. I feel you’re deliberately missing my point where I said both are likely to get us into war, however Hillary more so because of an actual track record, but ok. I’m the biased one!

                    • Cheech

                      The notion that the track record of one who has been Secretary of State makes her more of an international danger than a raving demagogue with no governmental or foreign experience whatsoever but a generous record of unstabilizing lunacy and an open agenda of aiding our revived enemy from the Cold War leaves me at a loss to respond.

                    • Asiyah

                      A track record where she, as a senator, voted to invade Iraq? A track record where she, as secretary of state, is responsible for what’s happening in Libya? A track record of someone who has actually said IN HER OWN WORDS, OUTRIGHT that she will go to war with Iran? Ok.

                    • Question

                      How is she responsible for Libya? What about Libya is she responsible for?

                    • You’re misusing the facts about Hillary to justify your emotional state and are thus getting her history wrong.

                      “Wars and interventions?” Clinton was party to two votes- the wars in Afghanistan (justified, as our attackers were based there) and Iraq (a terrible mistake). If anything, then, that gives her a 50/50 ratio on the decision of war.

                      She then spent her tenure as Secretary of State going out of the way to avoid war. The Libya intervention was Obama’s decision, not Clinton’s. She logged more hours than any other Secretary of State in history to repair rifts caused by our post 9/11 cowboy years. This coalition proved the key ingredient in forcing Iran back to the negotiation table to end their nuclear weapons program, thus defusing a situation in the Middle East that could of resulted in war between a bellicose Israel and an equally trash talking Iran. Her most violent action as Secretary of State was advising Obama to blow Bin Laden’s head off when the opportunity presented itself. I don’t anyone disagrees with that result, most importantly a native New Yorker such as myself whose mother worked at the World Trade Center.

                      So when you say “more likely to get us into conflicts,” it’s not a factual statement. This is where the history portion comes through- an inference on her behavior rooted in facts and not your silly need to hate Hillary because she’s been working in politics for 25 years. Since her poor decision in Iraq, Clinton has become more judicious in the use of force. She will use it, when necessary, and when victory is assured. She has turned down many opportunities to advise Obama into war, and her legacy lives on in John Kerry’s even response to Russia’s predatory behavior in Crimea.

                      And you pit this history and track records against a poorly tanned, thinly skinned madman who has verbally communicated his obsession with raining nuclear fire on nations he dislikes? Grow up, child.

                    • Asiyah

                      AGAIN, did I say that Trump won’t get us into war? I’m using Hillary’s actual experience versus Trump’s rhetoric which, while hateful, scary, and a HUGE concern, actually led to something. I’m not trying to justify my emotional state. I have completely given up on American politics. We’re all screwed either way, but let’s not pretend Hillary is some kumbaya, reasonable woman. She isn’t. She’s just as hungry for conflict as Trump. What makes him more dangerous is his ignorance and lack of experience.

                    • This is the important part of my last post:

                      “Clinton has become more judicious in the use of force. She will use it, when necessary, and when victory is assured. She has turned down many opportunities to advise Obama into war, and her legacy lives on in John Kerry’s even response to Russia’s predatory behavior in Crimea.”

                      I arrived to this conclusion by dealing with your initial claims, refuting them with the facts of her decisions over time, and made an assertion that her behavior has changed over the last decade to the point where your concerns over her “actual experience” are not historically valid. You’re either going to respond with additional facts or history as well. Or you’re not and I’m just gonna wait for Damon or Panama or Agatha to drop some ratchet stuff I can laugh at today.

                    • Asiyah

                      And the problem is her definition of “when necessary” but you’re right. I’m emotional when it comes to human lives.

                    • So you’re just gonna ignore the part where “when necessary” has changed from when she was Senator Clinton to now, where she’s Presidential Nominee Clinton?

                    • Guest

                      Pretty much. She’s debating with emotions at this point, not logic.

                    • Guest

                      “I’m emotional when it comes to human lives.”–Well that’s clear.

                      The thing is, you don’t have to convince us of why you don’t want to vote for Hilary. You have every right not to voter for her, no matter what her position is. The problem is, you feel like you do, and the things you’re using to back it up are highly flawed. That’s why others are able to easily dismamtle them. Hilary has a history with war and politics because she’s a politician, where as Trump is a business man, that’s where your opinion of her being more likely to get us into war in comparison to him is a bit skewed.

                      Think of it this way–A chef who’s made some great dishes as well as some bad ones, goes up against a person who’s never cooked at all, doesn’t know how the oven works, doesn’t know at what temperature water boils, or when the dish is acually complete or if it’s even cooked all the way through because he’s never cooked a day in his life. Now which one would you feel more comfortable hiring to run your restaurant?

                      Hilary is the chef. Trump is the other guy. Now choose. Of course running a restaurant vs. a country are wholly different, but you get the gist.

                      As as I said, you have every right not to vote for Hilary or Trump, and really don’t need to tell us why either. But the reasons you’ve presented here so far are flawed.

                    • Asiyah

                      So basically the fact that I believe Hillary will drag us into (another) war or prolong the existing one, continue to endanger our collective well-being via these wars and/or involving herself in coups (such as in Honduras), continue Obama’s massive deportation, and her preference for corporations over people and that’s why I’m not voting for her is flawed?

                      Ok everyone. You win. I won’t discuss politics here anymore. Not offended or anything but I had no idea my belief in basic decency was flawed.

                    • Guest

                      “So basically the fact that I believe Hillary will drag us into (another) war or prolong the existing one, continue to endanger our collective well-being via these wars and/or involving herself in coups (such as in Honduras), continue Obama’s massive deportation, and her preference for corporations over people and that’s why I’m not voting for her is flawed?”–In comparison to Trump, yes. In comparison to Jill Stein, no.

                      “Ok everyone. You win. I won’t discuss politics here anymore. Not offended or anything but I had no idea my belief in basic decency was flawed.”–Your personal feelings towards Hilary is not flawed. It was the argument you were presenting against her vs Trump that was. That’s what I’m speaking on.

                    • Cheech

                      I don’t want to join lecturing or demeaning, but I cosign all of MM’s facts.

                    • Asiyah

                      Are both of you going to deny the FACTS known as HILLARY’S HISTORY when it comes to war? Hmmm…

                    • My tone is acid because I don’t like uninformed people making silly decisions. If you can come on here and type and debate, then you have the requisite skills to find and assess true factual information on this election cycle. We are Very Smart Brothers and Sisters, after all.

                    • LMNOP

                      Haha, this is such a teacher comment. I like it though.

                    • Was a teacher for 7 years and am in grad school to be a principal. My profession shows in my prose.

                    • Cheech

                      Fair enough. Just not where I wanna be today. Everyone needs persuading (in my humble view).

                    • Guest

                      These types of people (Stein’s) are voting with their feelings, not with their head. So none of her blatant disregard for what’s factually been documented, observed and learned about the two prime candidates and their differences matter. Hillary being bad, but Trump being worse does not matter. They’re going to vote for the one they “like” regardless.

                    • Asiyah

                      I’m not voting with my feelings. If I were to vote with my feelings I wouldn’t vote at all because I think voting in this country is stupid. Makes no sense. It’s futile. I’m voting based on her history. Why is that hard to believe?

                    • Guest

                      “I’m not voting with my feelings. “–Yes you are. Which is fine; Most people do.

                      “If I were to vote with my feelings I wouldn’t vote at all because I think voting in this country is stupid.”–Lol! Based on who you’re planning on voting for, the result will be the same. That’s why others are taking that option.

                      “Makes no sense. It’s futile. I’m voting based on her history. Why is that hard to believe?”–No one is telling you’re wrong for not voting for her, we get not liking her. I don’t care for her much either. But the reasons you were giving for not voting for her in comparison to Trump is what was flawed.

                      As much as I don’t care for her, but based on our two party system and how it operates, you really don’t have much of a choice. Until we can dismantle this two party system and get rid of all the back dealings with politicians and cooperations and ect. this mess will continue.

                      But I personally think this election is going to start that process. But is not the other parties that’s doing it, it’s Trump. I’m starting to think he’s in on this. His rethoric just keeps getting more and more ridiculous–Says Obama and Hillary founded ISIS. So he’s either going insane and wants out or he wants to hand Hillary the WH on a silver platter. I can see her writing him a big fat check after all of this is over.

                    • Question

                      Who is Hillary going to get us into war with? What makes you think Hillary wants war?

                      Oh the Iraq war? A) Hillary has acknowledged that the vote in support for the Iraq war was the wrong decision, B) When she originally offered her support, she suggested war should be considered a last resort. C) Her and her colleagues were fed bad information.

                      There is no reason to believe Hillary wants war.

                    • Asiyah

                      Again, as I mentioned, she specifically said in an interview that she will go to war with Iran. So that infamous deal might go out the window.

                    • Question

                      What was the context of her comment about willingness to go to war with Iran?

                  • Question

                    And his impact on the economy due to his perspectives on trade deals. Yes there is room for improvement, but people act like trade deals are the reason why American manufacturing cratered. It isn’t. If we brought back 100% of the manufacturing jobs we’ve offshored, and adjusted for current FTE (full time equivalent) requirements, we would rehire less than 30% of the people that lost manufacturing jobs over the past 30 years. Manufacturing has changed.

                    And people forget that there are two sides to trade and Americans stopped consuming cars, washing machines, dryers, dishwashers, Cheetos and Pantene in volumes sufficient to sustain growth long ago.

                    Lets face it – you have two options when it comes to company growth: new products for old customers or new customers for old products. America has chosen “new customers for old products” time and time again, and we continue to suffer for it.

                    • Epsilonicus

                      Manufacturing, you also have to throw in automation. Even if we brought many of those jobs back, automation would severely limit the jobs.

        • Objection

          I may sound like a Hotep (maybe I’m) by saying this. But a president has to be willing to die to get something really done. My mother said she cried when Bobby Kennedy announced he was running for president. She knew in her heart they were going to kill him.

          Vote the candidate you like.

          • Asiyah

            Is that Hotep-y? I kind of think the same way lol

          • Ari

            Your mother was right. The president must be ready to start a revolution or be the martyr of one.

        • Cheech

          Look at Obama. How much did he get done?
          GM still alive
          Bin Laden dead
          World economy didn’t crater
          Employment up
          Tens of millions now have health insurance
          World respects us again
          Paris agreement on climate
          Rational judges appointed at all levels
          Science not denied
          No new wars of choice
          Gay folks can marry
          Policing is an awful criminal disaster but at least DOJ is finally calling them on it (a small, late, beginning of a start) instead of actively supporting it
          Supreme Court is gutting voting rights but at least DOJ is still fighting the fight instead of fighting to dismantle
          No crazies have been appointed to Supremes in 8 years
          Women still have right to choose

          True we didnt get everything; true Congress dissed and obstructed at every turn; true they’ll continue to do so. But to say we need a third party (or a revolution) to make things happen ignores the very real chasm between the two parties and candidates who realistically are in the game.

          • Kas

            Boy you went full Occupy Democrat

            • Cheech

              And I supported Bernie for a long time. But in the end he wasn’t qualified for the whole job. Neither is Jill. Neither is Gary. Hillary is (no matter how queasy she makes me).

            • Asiyah

              yes he did I mean the Democrats are directly responsible for Science not being denied LOL ok

              • Cheech

                As opposed to the Republicans? Yes. Yes they are. (This has been going on since the Reagan/HW years. Back then it was only evolution and pregnancy, before we knew the actual fate of the planet’s hospitableness for its population hung in the balance.)

                • Asiyah

                  Plenty of non-Democrats believe in Science. My POINT, should you choose to accept it (which you don’t), is that there’s more than just TWO political parties. WOW. We don’t live in a binary society. Imagine that.

                  • Homer Alonzo La Rue

                    Voting third party in ‘safe states’ seems reasonable.

                    • Asiyah

                      I’m in a safe state, I believe (NY)

                  • Cheech

                    I never said only democrats believe in science. I included non-denial of science as something that happened during the Obama administration (which would not have happened in a Republican administration). In response to your question about what Obama had managed to achieve.

          • Asiyah

            I had no idea that Obama was directly responsible for the Science not being denied. Must have missed that.

            No new wars? Syria isn’t a new war? Libya isn’t a new war? We’re in there, whether you know it or not.

            And I never said we need a third party to make things happen. What I said was that unless the executive branch and the legislative are on the same page, not much will get done, regardless of the president’s political party.

            • Cheech

              And I stand by my list of what got done, even with 6 years of split party obstruction. (As well as my list of what didn’t get done since McCain/Palin and Romney/Ryan didn’t get in. But since that list is necessarily speculative I’m not going to take the time to thumb type it.)

              • Asiyah

                For the opposition he was experiencing, Obama got more done than I thought. That much is true.

            • Question

              No, Syria is not a new war. Libya is not a new war. They are both continuations of the destabilization of Iraq and Afghanistan in new territories. Not considering those conflicts “war” does not mean I’m any less sensitive to the men and women putting their lives on the line for the sake of geopolitical battles, but I don’t consider them wars, nor does the Constitution. If you count all of the places that we are “in” conducting military operations, than America has NEVER not been at war in the past century.

              • Asiyah

                “No, Syria is not a new war. Libya is not a new war. They are both
                continuations of the destabilization of Iraq and Afghanistan in new
                territories.”

                Valid point.

          • troubleman

            Everything you said is true. But what is wrong for wanting more? Me personally, I’d give my left nut to have my student loan debt canceled. The Bible says you have not because you ask not. We have to ask by voting for what we want.

          • Mark

            We didn’t get everything?

            You mean everything like regulations that might prevent another Great Recession? Little things like that?

            Things like single-payer health care rather than the most expensive (and most profitable) health care system on earth that many citizens can’t use do to high premiums and high deductibles?

            Things like affordable college so that talented working class kids might have at least some remote chance of realizing their potential? Stuff like that?

            The reason that Bernie Sanders rose from obscurity to very nearly defeating the establishment democrat’s chosen candidate was that he raised issues that the two major parties refused to discuss. He raised issues that actually mattered to the lives of working people. Those same people had been ignored for eight years by President Obama and by the Republicans in Congress.

    • raul

      This is silly although to be fair the republicans have really been pushing this party line bs for a while. But neither side just blindly votes against whatever the other is proposing. You really think that if she proposes gun control for instance that the Democrats are going to vote against it just because she’s not one of them? If she picks a side that the two parties seriously disagree on then she’s by definition she’s gotta pick up support from one of the two.

      Which is all academic anyways since she’s coming in a distant 4th.

    • Cheech

      I was so with you up to the last sentence.

    • outlyer06

      then we go out and vote 3rd party candidates in when the mid terms roll around…

    • Val

      “please explain how Jill Stein is going to get anything done, when Congress has shut down government operations twice on the current president.”

      You refuted the point you were trying to make.

      • *ponders*

        True. True.

      • -h.h.h.-

        sorta kinda.

        in theory, PBO had 2 years to get stuff done but chose not to (was trying to be a nice guy) and pretty much 6 years working against a Republican-backed congress as a Democratic president.

        my point is…if a Democratic President who spent the majority of his time in office getting little headway vs. a Republican Controlled (essentially) Congress…

        how is someone as a Green Party representative supposed to get anything done with virtually no party support in Congress? wouldn’t both sides literally ignore her for her term in office?

        • Val

          Maybe but then they would face a serious backlash since it would have been both parties causing the gridlock. And that backlash would probably come in the form of more third party candidates being elected.

          • -h.h.h.-

            they would face a serious backlash since it would have been both parties causing the gridlock. And that backlash would probably come in the form of more third party candidates being elected.

            you might be right.

            then again…when the government shutdown happened in 2013, we had midterm elections in 2014. we can say that Republicans caused that shutdown, and in the midterm elections, they actually were able to take control of the Senate, and increased their control of the House.

            so…..it could be that way…but it might be this way. lol.

          • manofmorehouse

            Do you really believe that would happen?? Honestly??

          • manofmorehouse

            Huh??

        • Jack Din

          There are over 400 congressional seats up for election between now and 2018, and they are the object of coordinated, nationwide campaigns to fill them with progressives from a broad variety of backgrounds (see, e.g., brandnewcongress.org).

          Focusing too much on the White House virtually guarantees that no president, ever, will be successful in implementing a liberal-progressive or pro-social agenda. But I’ve been hearing “this election is too important, we’ll work on social justice later” since ’96. At some point, you’ve got to get started. You vote for change by changing your vote.

      • Mark

        What does it matter whether the Democrats or Republicans get anything done? Look at the legislation that actually passed over the last 16 years. MOST legislation was special interest legislation that was written by corporate lawyers to make corporations earn even more, get more subsidies, help corporations avoid taxes, and push a foreign policy that benefited American oil & gas, agricultural, and information technology firms.

        Having “things get done” is only a good thing then when the things getting done are good for the people that live in this country.

    • Mark

      There are two Green Parties. There is the Green Party that existed prior to June, 2016. It had about 250,000 voters nationwide. That Green Party has no elected members of Congress. and just a handful of local elected officials, most of whom are in California. The “old” Green Party was happy to take positions on the environment, disarmament, and a lot of other issues knowing full well that the general public wasn’t going to rally behind them.

      Then there is the Green Party of today. What’s different? Millions of former Bernie Sanders supporters are registering Green. These voters support the issues that Bernie Sanders advocated in the primary. Issues that working Americans care about like single-payer health care, breaking up the big banks and effectively regulating the financial industry. They don’t want the TPP and they oppose the power that corporate American has in our government. Activists are also moving to the Green Party. Since July 2016, about 10,000 seasoned Bernie Sanders campaign activists have volunteered to work in Jill Stein’s presidential campaign. That’s about 9,000 more workers than the Green Party had before. And, these volunteers are scattered across America.

  • Ess Tee

    I know someone who was banging the drum heavily for Bernie Sanders over the past year. He didn’t win the nomination, and now she’s out here backing Jill Stein and talking about the importance of a three-party system. Oh, word? Where yo’ azz was at on three-party systems when you were backing Bernie Sanders, who was running as a (Socialist) Democrat on the the Democrat ticket?

    But I ain’t wanna say all that on her FB post lol.

    (And for the record, I *did* vote Sanders in a June DC primary when I *knew* he wasn’t winning DC or the national nomination. But I’m pragmatic enough to know that I other priorities that do not include voting no Jill Stein in November.)

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